Argentina and Quad nations

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Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Yoda on Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:32 pm

Two part question for you tri nation supporters:

How long will it take Argentina not to finish bottom of the Quad nations?
How will their introduction affect finances for the SANZAR?

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by MBTGOG on Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:44 pm

Depends on how tough they can make it for visiting teams to Argentina. There are better technical players coming through in Argentine rugby at the moment but it's going to take them a while to improve.

On the second question, it depends on how much the Argentine public reacts to their national team being in a major competition. They've never had consistent top level rugby on an annual basis so maybe if the country takes to it, SANZAR might do well with the latin ESPN.


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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by emack2 on Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:13 am

A lot depends on the Argentina side,whether they wil have all there NH based players.Also many of the older ones like Contemponi will have retired
certainly.With there forwards and Hernandez fit they will be competetive at least.All the Sanzar Sides will be losing players to NH/Japan/Retirement etc.
so there will be some rebuilding for them too.
Nz alone are losing Tialata,Schwalger,Afoa,DeMalmanche,Thorn,Jack,Jared Payne,Rocokoko,Sivivatu,Berquist,McAlister,Brett,Donald, Delaney.
That is ALL the Carter backups bar Cruden and Slade,that have been capped.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by sirtidychris on Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:29 am

Out of that New Zealand list the only starting all black is thorn none of the other players will be missed as there are many better players in line already, new zealand are always competitive.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by emack2 on Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:34 am

Sir Tidy Chris ,out of that list Thorn indeed is the only starter NOW,but many were first choice in the past.
Hosea Gear,SBW,and Cory Jane all have yet to sign up for AB contracts again.All 3 were making may be moving away noises pre RWC so we wait and see.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Gatts on Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:08 am

stick to the subject ...amazing how any thread can be turned into a NZ love in!


Argentina will struggle as Italy have, i give it 5-7 years at least before they beat another SH team and that dependent on the financing they get for their domestic leagues as the main problem they have as a squad is they all play abroad.

That said those boys can play, especially up front, and if they can prodcue more of the same they might push Aussie in 3-5 yrs

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by nganboy on Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:22 am

My Bro travelled around Argentina a few years ago and reckoned where ever he went people knew about the ABs and loved them. So there is a fair bit of appreciation of rugby and I think the interest will only grow.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by boomeranga on Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:15 am

The Puma's joining is the best thing to happen to Sanzar in years I reckon. Home and Away test series in four quite different rugby cultures will eventually make it more valuable. A real scrummaging nation, apart from oz obviously, will be a great addition.

I could imagine it taking them anywhere up to 5 seasons to get off the bottom, but I'm sure they will get wins in that time as well. The Wallabies could certainly get turned over by them in BA at present.

And some of the worlds best looking women on our screens wont be a burden either.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Full Credit on Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:10 am

boomeranga wrote: A real scrummaging nation, apart from oz obviously
laughing

Not so sure about the level of interest over there, I had cable TV and despite having a hundred odd channels not one of them showed any Trinations last year (although about 5 of them showed the same game of soccer). I'm sure that'll change once they're involved but it will take time.

Oh, and you're not wrong about the good sorts over there. clap

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by boomeranga on Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:43 am

Have you lived over there at some stage FC?

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Full Credit on Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:53 am

I spent a couple of months over there last year and hope to go back soon possibly to live. BA would have to be one of my favourite cities.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Biltong on Thu Oct 20, 2011 7:01 am

In their history Argentina has played 13 tests against SA, although they have never won a match they have come close on two occasions, 2000 and 2003.

In 18 outings agaisnt New Zealand, Argentina had a draw in 1985, but since then have been on the recieving end of some drubbings outside of Argetina, but yet pushed New Zealand close on two other occasions in 2001 and 2006.

Argentina has beaten Australia on four occasions, the last one being in 1997, and also has one draw against them in 17 matches.

Their best results in the last decade are.

Australia 32 - Argentina 25 (2000)
New Zealand 24 - Argentina 20 (2001)
New Zealand 25 - Argentina 19 (2006)
South Africa 37 - Argentina 33 (2000)
South Africa 26 - Argenitna 25 (2003)

I think the biggest hurdle for Argentina to overcome is to get their players who play in europe settled in the SH, be it in the super XV competitions or expanding further form the Vodacom Cup that they have won comprehensivley this year in South Africa.

Perhaps SARU will allow them to get involved in the Currie Cup which would enhace their development significantly as it will be the next step up fro them. I know Australia currently has space at the Melbourne Rebels for overseas players but that reduces every year for the next few years.

But as long as the top Argentina players are plying their trade in the north it will be more challenging for them.

If they are wise and solve these problems, it could be much sooner that they beat a Tri Nation team than we think.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Full Credit on Thu Oct 20, 2011 7:16 am

It wouldn't surprise me at all if they took a scalp next year (at home). Crowds there can be pretty vocal and intimidating and Oz have a tendency to 'forget' to show up.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by disneychilly on Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:28 pm

Yeah I'd think Oz would be their first scalp in the comp, and the Argies will only get better away from home. You'll see the improvement when they play the AIs. Just a question of what comp their blokes play in.

They do know about the ABs, that's for sure. It actually spreads to Chile too where I saw All Black shirts for sale last year. In Avenida Florida in BA, all the souvenir shops that stocked the national football shirt also stocked the rugby shirt too. Very impressive. Love Argentina too. 5 Euro steaks that make your taste buds have an orgasm, lovely wine, beautiful girls, and a bloody good rugby team.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by clivemcl on Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:45 pm

I believe argentina were the unluckiest team in the RWC. Their performance in their defeat to NZ would have (in my opinion) been enough to beat any of the outher Quarter Finalists that weekend.

For me argentina have the beating of SA and Aus. Not consistantly by any means, but you wouldnt rule it out occassionally.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Biltong on Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:03 pm

I think they have the potential of beating ALL THREE Tri Nation teams.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by D24tress on Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:54 pm

if they can get a wet windy home game in the tri nations with a loud home crowd,

I dont care who you are and what you have done you will have to earn that victory and thats where they might do well.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by disneychilly on Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:54 pm

Damn straight. Isn't it exciting we have another rugby nation in the comp, and potentially another superpower if they can get their players together?

I saw the Argies get dismantled 93-8 in Wellington and it's great seeing them having come so far from that dark day for them.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Gatts on Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:11 pm

biltongbek wrote:I think they have the potential of beating ALL THREE Tri Nation teams.

Got the stats to prove it? Very Happy

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Shifty on Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:30 pm

They will finish bottom for a long time unless a few of their teams join the Super 15.

Face it, how can their players be expected to raise their game unless they are playing against quality opposition week in and week out?

Granted Buenos Aires may of beaten a lot of touring sides in the amateur era, but I don't think that is going to equate in the modern era.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by fa0019 on Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:54 pm

I reckon if AUS continue to get smashed upfront ARG will always have a chance.

They were missing their main playmaker in Hernandez for the entire RWC, their one true world class player... if he played he would have made a real difference.

BA will not be a easy place to go thats for sure.

I just fear for the home nations... with all this 4N action they are destined to get better.. a lot better.

Most of their players already play in Europe so I don't see why they can't compete.. saying as their players don't play S15 that they can't win is baseless.... Ireland don't have a S15 team but they still beat the 3N '11 winners and the core of the team which won the S15. A lot of the ARG players have top14, GP or HC experience. They are no mugs.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by Shifty on Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:14 pm

fa0019 wrote:I reckon if AUS continue to get smashed upfront ARG will always have a chance.

They were missing their main playmaker in Hernandez for the entire RWC, their one true world class player... if he played he would have made a real difference.

BA will not be a easy place to go thats for sure.

I just fear for the home nations... with all this 4N action they are destined to get better.. a lot better.

Most of their players already play in Europe so I don't see why they can't compete.. saying as their players don't play S15 that they can't win is baseless.... Ireland don't have a S15 team but they still beat the 3N '11 winners and the core of the team which won the S15. A lot of the ARG players have top14, GP or HC experience. They are no mugs.

You have a lot of valid points actually. Smile
I still think the week to week intensity of the Tri Nations teams will wear down the Argentinians and the 3 Nations teams wont be forgiving at all, it's not so bad to raise your game for a one off game but 6 weeks solid of these teams! Ouch... censored

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by MBTGOG on Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:31 am

Well they just have to get used to it then. No other option. But I believe they will.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by chewed_mintie on Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:38 am

I think they’ll come on a lot quicker than say Italy has in the 6N. Argentina enjoy some splendid home support, I remember watching NZ’s 2001 test on TV at River Plate Stadium with a sell out crowd being whipped into fever pitch by none other than Diego Maradona jumping up and down in his seat, wearing a Puma’s jersey.

If it hadn’t have been for a late Sam Broomhall try, Argentina would’ve earned their first win v NZ. I agree with Disney, Australia will probably fall to them sooner than either SA or NZ but they will beat those teams one day and that day won’t be far off.

I must say, I haven’t travelled to Sth America as yet but what better reason than seeing NZ play in BA? Might have to look up flight prices etc….

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by disneychilly on Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:48 am

Mintie BA rocks-if you go in the near future I'll give you some tips. I backpacked SA with my missus for 3 months last year. Actually they may also play games in Rosario, Mendoza and Cordoba too. If you like wine and skiing Mendoza is a good time. Plus Spanish is a pretty easy language to learn.

Arg vs SA I love watching as they pummel each other. SA have the edge in the backs but it's always exciting.

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Re: Argentina and Quad nations

Post by pete (buachaill on eirne) on Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:24 pm

I think the Argies will be competitive right away but won't get off the bottom spot for 3-5 years. I think they could take Aus and SA at home myself. They are passionate fellas and on top of that are MASSIVE!

I see good things on the horizon for Los Pumas.

Hope they can get all their players available for the matches.

I know who I will be cheering for in the 3N now for sure!

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