Rules of the road here?

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Rules of the road here?

Post by Perfessor Albertus Lion V on Mon 31 Jan 2011, 9:42 am

Aside from the schoolboy format that the beeb used to "upgrade" their message board years back that eventually caused such a train wreck that they are now closing down the mess, another bone through the collective beeb noggin was the blithering incomprehensible incompetence of their moderators, so pitiable that even doing no more than posting a link to a beeb story could warrant a post being removed.

In that vein, a question answered by me from another forum that almost certainly would be knocked down by the beeb, post haste.

No foul language, no "beeb" links, no photo/video links, no threats to life or limb of anyone, just an idea to get the cycling ball rolling after the powers that run and finance the show have just about driven the final stake into the heart of the sport they are running.

Kosher, yea or nay?

""what with all the fuss about LA""

~ HO~HO, the way it was, is, and always shall be for the distant future.

The man has become a inhuman magnet for equal measures of the human condition, love and hate.

However, I would like to include Albertus Contador, indeed, any cyclist who has ever run afoul of the Rube Goldberg designed drug testing apparatus in my response.

Simply and irrefutably put, there is nary a single spokesman or organization who can speak with authority that is respected.

Why these jughaids, who are constantly feuding against each other when not herding up cyclists to be tested, branded, and classified as fit for viewing consumption or put in the holding pen until being put down, how they scratched their way to the top positions of authority is the origin of any crimes.

The closest thing to real experts are the Doc Feelgoods, trainers, and cyclists as to how these some hundred "banned" substances affect performance and they ain’t talkin’ unless they become felons and then hired by WADA. The scientific studies are poor and limited and decades from holding any scientific merit.

Taking the case of Contador, highly promoted as the answer to the Lance dilemma, talk about a cyclist paying a heavy price for a specious test of an exotic substance!

A year is a decade in a pro cyclist’s career, and the judges no better qualified than the witch hunters of the Inquisition.

Use suspensions for the most egregious cases. In Contador’s case, it seems at best a minor infraction that could easily be explained away as accidental. There should be a formula established that deducts seconds from a rider’s time dependent up the nature of the banned substance and the amount over.

Keep in mind most everyone on this board could not pass the typical drug screen of a pro cyclist without a good long cleansing overseen by a reputable trainer because the list of the banned is so long and pervasive, and good luck finding a reputable trainer

By formulaic time deduction, Contador would pay a time penalty which may or may not alter his podium finish. That’s only fair until the science catches up.

~Ho~Ho, so away I go to my favoured predilections, so there’s your immediate answer to the current intractable dilemma.

"That fellow is a menace. He trains on beer and just won the heavyweight championship of the world."------Frank Hugo, crew coach of Syracuse University talking about Max Baer who knocked down giant champion Primo Carnera 11X on the way to an 11th round stoppage and the championship belt.
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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by baldursvoice on Fri 04 Feb 2011, 3:25 pm

OK not sure what you are saying here but if you are saying that a failed test should be punished by time being taken of there time then that is a silly idea all that will do is have people taking more candy not less as they will try to get so big a gap so that when they are tested and fail they will still win and the the UCI and Wada will not be able to do anything as they are still the winner

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by Perfessor Albertus Lion V on Fri 04 Feb 2011, 4:39 pm

baldursvoice wrote:OK not sure what you are saying here but if you are saying that a failed test should be punished by time being taken of there time then that is a silly idea all that will do is have people taking more candy not less as they will try to get so big a gap so that when they are tested and fail they will still win and the the UCI and Wada will not be able to do anything as they are still the winner

~ Why sir, learning the rules of punctuation would most definitely close the gap of understanding what you are attempting to say.

It's quite certain that the current system and all others before has failed so utterly as to render cycling and it's fans no more than potty jokes to be shared in dirty bathrooms. The more they test, the bigger laughing stocks they become.

I am proposing the higher the concentration tested above baseline, the more time is dededededededededucted sir, obviously.

Egregiously high concentrations moreover would be the cases where a ban would be in order. As it stands, it's a gamble the cyclist takes when using PEDs that not only might he test positive and be banned, but additionally he may be handicapped in performance by a poor dose on a bad physiologic day. If he took no PEDs, it's still possible to test over the established baseline due to physiologic day to day differences of riders as well as poor test results. Many of the tests are experimental in nature hastily slapped with a fig leaf of certification and rushed to market to make money and seize power.

The dear chaps who should be banned from cycling are the louts that run cycling and the alchemy labs where this specious "science" is carried out.

There is no need to ban hardworking cyclists who already get so many needles poked in them daily as to render them eligible for workmans compensation, and then they get a shovel's worth of pills and swill chosen by the team "nutritionist" dumped down their throats to revive them for the next day.

The current system is akin to blaming and then banning the race horse for what his trainers did to him, utterly blithering sir!
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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by skidd1 on Tue 15 Feb 2011, 6:49 pm

I do not blame the race horses themselves since they are caught up in the system
The managers are the role models and with Bjarne and Johan at the helm therein lies the problem
They would argue that they were race horses themselves and are victims of the same system .Johan would argue he isn't a victim anyway and i have some sympathy with that view.

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by Enforcer on Wed 16 Feb 2011, 1:24 pm

In all other sports the person competing is solely responsible for everything that goes into their bodies. Rather than trying to find ways to blame the managers, nutritionists and their life coach perhaps the focus should be even more on the cyclist.

Tell them that if they do not know what is in a pill they do not take it. If they cannot be sure what is in a needle, it shouldn't go in their arm.

Less pussyfooting around, for whatever reason they occur, the constant stream of doping scandals harms the image of the sport.

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by Perfessor Albertus Lion V on Thu 17 Feb 2011, 8:33 am

Enforcer wrote:In all other sports the person competing is solely responsible for everything that goes into their bodies. Rather than trying to find ways to blame the managers, nutritionists and their life coach perhaps the focus should be even more on the cyclist.

Tell them that if they do not know what is in a pill they do not take it. If they cannot be sure what is in a needle, it shouldn't go in their arm.

Less pussyfooting around, for whatever reason they occur, the constant stream of doping scandals harms the image of the sport.

~ Why, sir, I do fear you have failed to come to grips that it is the team providing the nutritional and medical services with only few variations for the big stars who may or may not cart around their own from race to race, depending.

Is the cyclist now to have his food and medications prepared days in advance to be sent out for testing as proof before ingesting?And have a certified and bonded handler to ensure no tampering on the way back from the lab to the tummy?

Really?

Ah, of course, ye olde handy scapegoat that scoundrels keep around to deflect the thieving they do when the need arises. Cycling is financed by big business who break every rule they can squeak by in the quest to come out ahead just assuredly as organizers do the same to make sure their race remains the one to be in.

Let us blame the hired help for rifling Pandora's box, eh? That's worked really well up to now, hasn't it?

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by skidd1 on Thu 17 Feb 2011, 8:12 pm

The latest ruling smells of the same suff that comes from the backside of Contadors ficticious contaminated cow
As said it is a huge damage limitation exercise by the authorities.
This condones and encourages these practices .
Dont blame the guys racing look at the people who manage them or control things
Or just believe that Cancellera is suddenly that much better than Boonen to ride away like he did at Flanders!!
Nice work Johan

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by Azabache on Fri 25 Feb 2011, 4:47 pm

I've long been uneasy about the veracity and reliability of the testing; the arbitrary classification of substances; the emotiveness of "drugs"; the class system that operates against the lower riders; the holier-than-thou nature of what are only self-apponted bodies, usually run by egoists; the dubious standing of laboratories; the sheer fickleness of findings year by year; the posing and pouting of various national bodies.....

There's a great danger of the sport being killed if this persecution of riders is not reined in.

Have you actually seen what the poor devils have to record and submit throughout the year?

Let's have a moritorium for pity's sake.

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Re: Rules of the road here?

Post by SpenB on Sat 26 Feb 2011, 7:08 am

Question really:

Surely other sports persons are subjected to this kind of treatment like athletics and weights etc?

Or how are their "bodies" dealing with it?

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