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Post by TopHat24/7 on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 10:48 am

Article in today's FT made me smile re a certain couple of posters on here, thought I'd share:

Migrants help drive down house prices locally rather than cause them to increase, preliminary findings from new research suggests.


A paper by Dr Nils Braakmann, of Newcastle University, says the reason is that local people move out of an area as immigrants move in and migrants tend to live in more crowded housing conditions, thereby taking up less space. The research suggests London’s new immigrants help to keep housing in the capital more affordable because most migrants opt to come to the city. The findings go against the general perception that migrants have pushed up British house prices.


24/09/13 Financial Times 4

For those that have a sub: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/789a7d40-2467-11e3-8905-00144feab7de.html?ftcamp=crm/email/2013924/nbe/Property/product&siteedition=uk#axzz2figH97jI

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Post by Lumbering_Jack on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 1:06 pm

Without sounding racist, I'm not surprised. The migrants I have come across is some of the more deprived areas tend to drink/fight/break the law an awful lot because the have no prospects. A wide generalisation it would appear but it is backed up by some perhaps circumstantial evidence.

Outside of London their is still a certain level of mis trust of those who are not white British.

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Post by kingraf on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 3:16 pm

Without sounding racist, I too am not suprised... Its the same in South Africa. Once the non-white anglo migrants move in, there goes the property prices.
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Post by jbeadlesbigrighthand on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 4:04 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:Article in today's FT made me smile re a certain couple of posters on here, thought I'd share:

Migrants help drive down house prices locally rather than cause them to increase, preliminary findings from new research suggests.


A paper by Dr Nils Braakmann, of Newcastle University, says the reason is that local people move out of an area as immigrants move in and migrants tend to live in more crowded housing conditions, thereby taking up less space. The research suggests London’s new immigrants help to keep housing in the capital more affordable because most migrants opt to come to the city. The findings go against the general perception that migrants have pushed up British house prices.


24/09/13 Financial Times 4

For those that have a sub: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/789a7d40-2467-11e3-8905-00144feab7de.html?ftcamp=crm/email/2013924/nbe/Property/product&siteedition=uk#axzz2figH97jI
Not having an FT sub, I can only comment on the basis of the excerpt above. On a micro level, it makes sense, and has been pretty well documented for a while. I'm not sure of the validity of this point, however:

"The research suggests London’s new immigrants help to keep housing in the capital more affordable because most migrants opt to come to the city."

Many of the people moving out of ghetto-ised areas will move within London, and will increase the pool of people looking for housing in those areas. This will therefore push up prices in the surrounding areas. This equally applies to the wider British property market.

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Post by rodders on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 4:41 pm

If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
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Post by STC on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 5:29 pm

rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 5:41 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:Article in today's FT made me smile re a certain couple of posters on here, thought I'd share:

Migrants help drive down house prices locally rather than cause them to increase, preliminary findings from new research suggests.


A paper by Dr Nils Braakmann, of Newcastle University, says the reason is that local people move out of an area as immigrants move in and migrants tend to live in more crowded housing conditions, thereby taking up less space. The research suggests London’s new immigrants help to keep housing in the capital more affordable because most migrants opt to come to the city. The findings go against the general perception that migrants have pushed up British house prices.


24/09/13 Financial Times 4

For those that have a sub: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/789a7d40-2467-11e3-8905-00144feab7de.html?ftcamp=crm/email/2013924/nbe/Property/product&siteedition=uk#axzz2figH97jI
Forget about wheter migrants increase house prices because there is conflicting evidence for that but what is worrying is that this evidence highlights that a multi cultural society is failing in the sense that immigration causes local people (local not British) to leave an area because of migration.

The research also highlights the horrid conditions migrants are forced to live in due to overcrowding, lack of income (due to employers paying migrants less due to competition etc).

Migrants are usually the most vulnerable people in society, especially unskilled migrants. It is worrying that you read a piece of research like this and instead of creating a thread to discuss how we can improve social cohesion between migrants and local people and how we can improve living standards for migrants you decided to talk about house prices.


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Post by TopHat24/7 on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 5:51 pm

And we have the bite......... Laugh

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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 5:55 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:And we have the bite......... Laugh
Like I said you as a person should reflect on your priorities. The article you posted is highlighting social inequality and a lack of social mobility. Perhaps you should have spoken about that as that is far more important than house prices.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 6:09 pm

Well, 1) I own property so house prices are on an important issue for me; and 2) I posted it mainly to laugh at you as you spent sevel pages trying (and failing, miserably) to make the opposing point a few months back.

Would also add that I never made a comment about house prices, I merely quoted the article which was about the research piece. I did not opine one jot.

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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 6:24 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:Well, 1) I own property so house prices are on an important issue for me; and 2) I posted it mainly to laugh at you as you spent sevel pages trying (and failing, miserably) to make the opposing point a few months back.

Would also add that I never made a comment about house prices, I merely quoted the article which was about the research piece.  I did not opine one jot.
All of these points were brought up last time the debate was had, CONFLICTING evidence, nothing new.

Living with your mum does not mean you own a property.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Tue 24 Sep 2013, 6:39 pm

And telling people on an internet forum you completed the LPC/LLM clearly doesn't mean you have a grasp of the law!! laughing

Ahhhhhhhh, if only N&CA was still around so we could see there wasn't any conflicting evidence from the UK. You were only able to (after circa 5 pages of prompting) come up with studies from other countries. The best bit being when we (I) eventually found the report you were basing your entire argument on it actually contradicted most of what you were saying!! Laugh

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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 12:20 am

TopHat24/7 wrote:And telling people on an internet forum you completed the LPC/LLM clearly doesn't mean you have a grasp of the law!! laughing

Ahhhhhhhh, if only N&CA was still around so we could see there wasn't any conflicting evidence from the UK.  You were only able to (after circa 5 pages of prompting) come up with studies from other countries. The best bit being when we (I) eventually found the report you were basing your entire argument on it actually contradicted most of what you were saying!! Laugh
Don't be jealous that I have a higher level of educaation than you Smile

I don't understand why you are bringing up an old debate that shouldn't even be on this section. This section is not the new N & CA section.

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Post by rodders on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 10:45 am

STC wrote:
rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
Well increasingly that's looking like Mars so I'll give that a miss, that place has even less employment prospects than here.
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Post by Rowley on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 10:53 am

STC wrote:
rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
If in the instances of some of you that could be a place with no internet access that would be much appreciated (not you STC, you're lovely)

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Post by STC on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 10:57 am

Haha. Thanks.
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Post by TopHat24/7 on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 1:44 pm

Champagne_Socialist wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:And telling people on an internet forum you completed the LPC/LLM clearly doesn't mean you have a grasp of the law!! laughing

Ahhhhhhhh, if only N&CA was still around so we could see there wasn't any conflicting evidence from the UK.  You were only able to (after circa 5 pages of prompting) come up with studies from other countries. The best bit being when we (I) eventually found the report you were basing your entire argument on it actually contradicted most of what you were saying!! Laugh
Don't be jealous that I have a higher level of educaation than you Smile

I don't understand why you are bringing up an old debate that shouldn't even be on this section. This section is not the new N & CA section.
Lol unless you've got an imaginary PhD to add to your made up LPC/LLM then I've now't to be jealous of!

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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 1:47 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:
Champagne_Socialist wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:And telling people on an internet forum you completed the LPC/LLM clearly doesn't mean you have a grasp of the law!! laughing

Ahhhhhhhh, if only N&CA was still around so we could see there wasn't any conflicting evidence from the UK.  You were only able to (after circa 5 pages of prompting) come up with studies from other countries. The best bit being when we (I) eventually found the report you were basing your entire argument on it actually contradicted most of what you were saying!! Laugh
Don't be jealous that I have a higher level of educaation than you Smile

I don't understand why you are bringing up an old debate that shouldn't even be on this section. This section is not the new N & CA section.
Lol unless you've got an imaginary PhD to add to your made up LPC/LLM then I've now't to be jealous of!
Stop looking for my attention it is creepy

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Post by Champagne_Socialist on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 1:48 pm

rodders wrote:
STC wrote:
rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
Well increasingly that's looking like Mars so I'll give that a miss, that place has even less employment prospects than here.
I did read a theory that man originally came from mars but left to live on the earth because mar's atmosphere was destroyed.

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Post by SirJohnnyEnglish on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 1:54 pm

I'd say Rodders is referring to this: 
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2013/aug/29/life-earth-originated-mars

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Post by STC on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 2:13 pm

Champagne_Socialist wrote:
rodders wrote:
STC wrote:
rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
Well increasingly that's looking like Mars so I'll give that a miss, that place has even less employment prospects than here.
I did read a theory that man originally came from mars but left to live on the earth because mar's atmosphere was destroyed.
Sounds plausible.
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Post by rodders on Wed 25 Sep 2013, 2:48 pm

Champagne_Socialist wrote:
rodders wrote:
STC wrote:
rodders wrote:If you go back far enough we are all migrants to some degree, except maybe some African tribesmen maybe. Not sure the research stretches back that far though.
We should all bugger off back to where we came from.
Well increasingly that's looking like Mars so I'll give that a miss, that place has even less employment prospects than here.
I did read a theory that man originally came from mars but left to live on the earth because mar's atmosphere was destroyed.
Oh, the story I heard was that they came here for the NHS or maybe I'm thinking of something else....
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