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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 8:44 am


It was announced on RAW last night that the main event of the TLC PPV which will be coming out on DVD is going to be World Heavyweight Champion John Felix Anthony Cena versus WWE Champion Randall Keith Sebastian Bobert Spartacus Orton in a Tables, Ladders & Chairs (Oh my!) match with both titles up for grabs.

Apparently, this is not a match to create a single, undisputed World championship, it just means one man will hold both titles and they will remain separate entities.


Feedback? OK

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Post by SRdean88 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:07 am

since its not a unification match I can see one taking one title and one the other.
Maybe a switch. Orton climbs up and gets the WH title, but cena recovers and claims the WWE title

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Post by x12x on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:13 am

It depends how it works, will they get one at a time or will both be hanging at the same time like when Razor took on Michaels for the Intercontinental title? Will the winner get both titles or like SR says, will it be a way of giving Cena the WWE title and giving Orton the WHC?

I got excited when I thought it was the unification but I can't see that happening until Mania.

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Post by SRdean88 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:23 am

Cant see them unifying the belts at TLC, if its going to happen its got to be at mania.
either one belt each or a screwy finish so it keeps going.
its a long way to mania to keep this feud going though!

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:29 am


The following is from wwe.com:

"With not one, but both World Titles hanging in the balance, World Heavyweight Champion John Cena will face WWE Champion Randy Orton in an historic Tables, Ladders & Chairs Match. The watershed contest will leave one Superstar in possession of both World Titles, a feat that has never been accomplished since the World Heavyweight Title was introduced in September 2002."


So from the sounds of that the intention is to have both titles hanging above the ring, which leaves it wide open for them to do a title switch with Cena walking out WWE Champion and Orton walking out World Heavyweight Champion. It's not like WWE hasn't ever NOT delivered on a promise so they will have no problem disregarding the selling point of this match - one man walking out with both belts.

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Post by JamesLincs on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:41 am

i hate the technicalities of it because really jericho has. wwe became a 2 world titled company when the invasion started. the end of this era will be next year when a unification will mean for the last time there could be 2 champions

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Post by Paul Mac 6CW on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:45 am

The way that is written to me means that one man will win both and there will not be the chance for a switch

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Post by x12x on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:48 am

It's the perfect main event for Mania 30 but with reported plans for Cena to take on Taker who do you guys think will be the two to decide on the undisputed champion? I'd love to say Punk and Bryan but I doubt it. I think if one person does walk away with both it would be a great platform for a Cena heel turn when he joins up with Trips and the Authority BUT I don't that would ever happen due to the fact that Cena is never really likely to turn heel.

Also lets say Cena does walk away with both belts, it could open up some great matches like Cena vs Punk v Bryan with the first fall becoming the WHC and the second becoming the WWE Champ with Cena losing both.

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Post by x12x on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:49 am

Paul Mac 6CW wrote:The way that is written to me means that one man will win both and there will not be the chance for a switch
Both men battle on top of the ladder, they grab a respective title and continue to fight, at the same time they fall taking a title with them each and the titles are switched. Knowing WWE this would be there big "swerve".

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Post by SRdean88 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:51 am

wouldnt mind seeing Cena vs Taker for the title(s) only because for once ou could beleive that the streak could be beaten.
Im not saying for one second I want Cena to break the streak, but I think the match will be better if there is doubt over the undertaker winning

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Post by Paul Mac 6CW on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:52 am

The watershed contest will leave one Superstar in possession of both World Titles, a feat that has never been accomplished since the World Heavyweight Title was introduced in September 2002."


That seems to be pretty clear to me though

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Post by x12x on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:55 am

Wrestling is never clear though, how many times have the WWE and wrestling in general tried to trick us in to thinking one thing and doing the other...it might end up with a double champion but I just have a feeling there will be a twist.

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Post by JamesLincs on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:56 am

doesnt mean it cant happen paul. this is wwe, not a sport. there aren't actual rules as to how it goes

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:00 pm


Paul Mac 6CW wrote:The watershed contest will leave one Superstar in possession of both World Titles, a feat that has never been accomplished since the World Heavyweight Title was introduced in September 2002."


That seems to be pretty clear to me though

Of course that could happen, WWE could very well deliver on the stipulation. But we've seen many times in the past where something has been promised only for WWE (or any other wrestling company for that matter) to renege on the stipulation. Not saying that there won't be one man leaving TLC with 2 belts, only that it's entirely plausible that a scenario where Cena pulls down the WWE title and Orton pulls down the WHC at the same time could occur.

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Post by Sara on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:02 pm

FFS - bloody Cena. Its just ridiculous

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:05 pm


I'm just remembering when Cena won the WHC how we were all like "Well at least it keeps him away from the WWE title and the Authority storyline!" Laugh

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Post by SRdean88 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:05 pm

WWE have mentioned Cena's title reigns a few times recently. wont be long before he will have the most reigns ever. (cant wait for that montage......)
swapping the belts would give Cena another reign and take him a step closer

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Post by Hero on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:10 pm

Whilst it's being stipped as 'One Man Will Leave With Both Titles', the WM 28 main event was billed as 'Once In A Lifetime'...


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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 12:54 pm


Hero wrote:Whilst it's being stipped as 'One Man Will Leave With Both Titles', the WM 28 main event was billed as 'Once In A Lifetime'...


So you're saying the Rock is coming back? ZOMG!!!!!1!!! Shocked 

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Post by Ent on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 2:08 pm

Cena will win and we could see a cash in!

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Post by x12x on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 2:37 pm

Nobody to cash in Ent.

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Post by Ent on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 2:59 pm

Did I miss sandows or is he injured?

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Post by Dr Gregory House MD on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 3:12 pm

Ent wrote:Did I miss sandows or is he injured?
Sandow cashed in and lost on the raw after help in a cell

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Post by Ent on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 4:11 pm

Woops, should keep more up to date.

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Post by imprettyfly on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:30 pm

i bet cena will gain the moniker "First Ever Undisputed Champion"...

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Post by Guest on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:43 pm

Borefest


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Post by Jammy31 on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 7:44 pm

Cena to win both, claim he's the first ever undisputed champion, then Chris Jericho returns...
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Post by Mat on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:37 pm

Maybe hope more than expectation speaking, but I can't look past the scenario of Orton climbing the ladder to grab both belts only for one of the Authority(HHH/The Shield/Kane hell even Stephanie) pushing the ladder over, Cena then climbs another ladder, grabs both belts before having his arm raised by HHH, congratulated by Stephanie etc, making Cena kind of the Corporate Champion if you like. We finally get a heel turn and it opens up more avenues for the storyline

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 10:10 pm

I dont really mind a switch result. Not really sure why it would be a poor delivery. I quite like the thought that really this match could go to four different results. Switch, no change, double for Cena, double for Orton.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 10:13 pm

In fact, theres loads more than that. What if Vacant wins?! He deserves another chance

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Post by JJJohnson on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 10:16 pm

I think Cena will win. I didn't watch RAW (I have decided to stop watching the weekly shows as they are dull) and I am just going to try and watch the PPVs every month.

Cena going into Mania with both belts increases the (hopeful) possibility that he will lose them to whoever he faces.

Cena vs Rock vs Hogan for the Undisputed Championship.

Yeah it wouldn't really surprise me.

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Post by Fernando on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:18 pm

WWE listed John Cena as the WWE Champion and Randy Orton as the World Heavyweight Champion in a tweet previewing their match at the TLC pay-per-view.

I think they are getting a bit ahead of themselves...

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Post by JoshSansom on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:35 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:In fact, theres loads more than that. What if Vacant wins?! He deserves another chance
If "OG" can score for Man Utd and "Extras" can be relied upon by the England Cricket Team; then I am sure that "Vacant" can be trusted to draw in the WWE...

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Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 12:09 am

I'm quite pleased with these developments, I must say it does feel a bit rushed though, a lot of people felt it'd be at WrestleMania and that would basically kill off any hope for Daniel Bryan or CM Punk, I think having it now with a re-match at the Royal Rumble then gives us a great chance to see DB or CM Punk win the Rumble then headline WrestleMania.


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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 8:46 am


Kay Fabe wrote:I'm quite pleased with these developments, I must say it does feel a bit rushed though, a lot of people felt it'd be at WrestleMania and that would basically kill off any hope for Daniel Bryan or CM Punk, I think having it now with a re-match at the Royal Rumble then gives us a great chance to see DB or CM Punk win the Rumble then headline WrestleMania.

Totally agree mate, it seems a bit strange that they'd have a match of this magnitude at TLC when it could easily be saved for Wrestlemania. It does make it much less likely that we'll see Cena v Orton at Mania though, which leaves the door wide open for Bryan or Punk to take the main event slot.

Looking at it as it stands though, it's difficult to figure out which direction WWE would go in: Cena vs Punk, Cena vs Bryan, Orton vs Punk or Orton vs Bryan. Or maybe it'll be a Fatal Four Way! Laugh 

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Post by CenaNuff on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 9:05 am

Yawn, so Bryan's push is officially over then. He's just conveniently forgot about the months of hurt he has been put through by Orton and the authority. Never mind, Cena will return months early from his career threatening injury, collect both championships and single handidly bring down the authority all in the space of 2 months. Never saw that coming.

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Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 9:32 am

I wouldn't say Bryans push is over in the slightest, I could be wrong but I think it's clear to see that the Wyatt's and the Sheild are being used to keep Punk and Bryan occupied so they don't have time to challenge the authority, they need to keep their focus on those 6 guys, I feel we'll see this develop as we close in on the Royal Rumble.

I still feel Punk/Lesnsr is a nailed on certainty for WrestleMania at the moment so that makes me believe Bryan is probably the favourite for the Rumble.

theundisputedY2D2 wrote: it seems a bit strange that they'd have a match of this magnitude at TLC 
I can see the logic in what you're saying but I've never felt a match like that would happen at WrestleMania, the biggest match for the biggest show makes sense, no arguments there but I just feel that Mania will hit a million buys anyway, those buying it for that match would buy it anyway so pushing it onto a lesser PPV would encourage more people to buy it.

I think its the wrong timing personally, if both guys had been champion for 6 months+ and had beaten every challenger comprehensively then it'd look better as they'd genuinely want to see who is the best, the WWE can gloss over that I suppose due to who is the Chsmpions, both have unbelievable win/loss ratios so kayfabe wise it can work quickly.

On the bright side at least this is a logical way for Cena/Orton to get back in the ring, they had complete overkill by the time they faced off 'for the final time' in 2009, they've been kept apart ever since so World Champ vs World Champ makes perfect sense to have them feud again.


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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 10:40 am


I guess it's similar to back in 2001 when they had the unification tournament at Vengeance instead of saving it for Wrestlemania. Like you say KF Wrestlemania will draw pretty much regardless and by putting on the match at TLC it might bump up the buyrate.

Not so sure about CM Punk/Brock Lesnar being nailed on for Wrestlemania though mate. As things stand I'm leaning towards Brock facing the Undertaker.

I'd say teaming up Punk and Bryan has been a way of keeping CM Punk out of the Authority storyline moreso than Daniel Bryan. I just get the feeling that WWE will feel they gave Bryan his chance and he didn't take it, citing the low Summerslam buyrate as their evidence, even though it shouldn't be attributed to anything he did/didn't do. That one rests squarely on how he was portrayed by others in the run up to the event.

Punk on the other hand has managed to avoid any "he can't draw" jibes and hasn't been involved with the Authority yet, despite this angle being tailor-made for him. That's why I'm more inclined to go with Punk over Bryan as the winner of the Royal Rumble.

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Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 11:10 am

I totally agree that Punk's the guy this is taylor made for, I just can't see past him and Lesnar, the match they had I thought left it open for a big re-match, then the way Punk stalked Heyman until he finally got him, for me that makes no sense if Lesnar isn't willing to defend him, on the otherhand many could see it as just running its course so no need yo go over old ground.

I also think Orton has to be the favourite going into this match, while Cena is the poster boy I'd think thatthe McMahons would fancy being heavily iinvolved in a WrestleMania angle since they've took such a prominent role in the storyline, you've got to think anything less than involvement in a WWE World Title main event match would feel like they've been relegated, so in that sense I think Orton might just win theundusputed Title.

Now if that happens that then leaves them with a dilema of what to do with Cena at Mania, if there isn't antitle match then it's a huge marquee match, that for me leaves him with Lesnar or Taker, if Lesnar does get Punk then Cena and Taker finally go at it, Bryan wins the Rumble and finally gets past Randy Orton and the Authority who screwed him out the title and inyentionakly kept him out of the title picture ever since.

That being said, if Orton isn't the Champ then Bryan should be facing HHH at WM.

I think Survivor Series was rotten, the whole guest host gimmick flopped Monday too but I do think the WWE have loads of different options to go with at this point

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Post by Enforcer on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 11:47 am

Bryan v Orton
Cena v Taker
Punk v Lesnar

Isn't a bad top of the card! I thought that HHH would be on the card, but I can't see where he fits with a big enough name, unless it's HBK, Rock or Austin?

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 11:49 am

Looking at that WWE does indeed have a ton of options heading into Wrestlemania season but it seems to me that at the moment it looks like there's going to be an odd man out when it comes to the main matches at Mania.

You've got to fit Cena, Orton, Taker, Lesnar, HHH, Punk and Bryan in somehow and no matter which way you swing it (not taking into consideration a Triple Threat match or the like, which would be a cop out anyway Smile) it seems as if someone is destined to miss out.

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Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 11:54 am

I don't think HHH needs a match to be involved, I do think he does have a match in him though but if his Champ is in the Main Event of WrestleMania then there's every chance he'll be heavily involved in the build up and the match itself through outside interference, I'd expect Shawn Michaels to be involved on the opposite side if thats the case.

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 12:05 pm


Good point KF, hadn't really thought that Triple H wouldn't have a match at Wrestlemania. That would surely make it Orton vs Bryan for title since as you say CM Punk could easily be paired off with Brock Lesnar given their history and Jumpin' John Cena would finally face the Undertaker.

Fits in with Enforcer's card as well which as he said isn't a bad card at all. Assuming those are the top 3 matches, who goes on last? Cena/Taker surely?


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Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 12:15 pm

Thats the thing, Cena/Taker should be a must to go on last but ending the reign of authority you'd imaginr would need to take centre stage, anything less than last on the card basically makes Takers match predictable too tho'

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Post by Jethro on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 12:20 pm

Is there any possibility of a Daniel Bryan-HBK match at Mania? I know Shawn is retired but is there any word whether he would consider it or not. And is the Rock not going to be at Mania this year?

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Post by theundisputedY2D2 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 1:18 pm


Word is that the Rock is going to be shooting people..... I mean a movie around Wrestlemania time. There's also been talk that he might be done as far as in-ring performances go.

As for a Daniel Bryan/Shawn Michaels match, despite their interaction on RAW after Hell in a Cell there is zero intention of them having a match in the future. That could change of course but I reckon that if HBK was going to wrestle again he would have done it by now, and by all accounts he takes the retirement stipulation very seriously and wouldn't want to break it.

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Post by Jammy31 on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 2:31 pm

Michaels has already stated that he has no desire to return to in ring competition even if it is for one more Wrestlemania match. No doubt he'll be around Wrestlemania in some capacity.
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Post by Jethro on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 2:45 pm

Ok, thanks for the information. I didn't think HBK would wrestle again but you never rule anything out in WWE.

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Post by TopoftheChops on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 6:28 pm

this may sound like a crazy idea but i could see hhh winning the titles at tlc. He believes no one is the face of the company and gets the shield and kane to help him. This eventually leads to vince returning after tlc. vince picks orton at royal rumble, hhh wins. vince picks cena at ec. hhh wins by dq. Vince then picks punk to beat hhh at mania. throw in the rumble winner daniel bryan and then bryan wins the titles at wrestlemania and feuds with punk afterwards



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Post by bretmeharty on Wed 27 Nov 2013, 10:02 pm

Punk and Bryan wont main event wm

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