5th Ashes Test, Sydney

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Post by Pal Joey on Thu 02 Jan 2014, 10:03 am

First topic message reminder :

January 3-7, Sydney Cricket Ground
Start time 1030 (2330 GMT)

Australia:
CJL Rogers, DA Warner, SR Watson, MJ Clarke*, SPD Smith, GJ Bailey, BJ Haddin†, MG Johnson, PM Siddle, RJ Harris, NM Lyon

England:
AN Cook*, MA Carberry, IR Bell, KP Pietersen, GS Ballance, BA Stokes, JM Bairstow†, SG Borthwick, SCJ Broad, JM Anderson, WB Rankin


The grassy SCG pitch should offer some assistance for the pace bowlers early on. Some grip there for the spinners too. It's not going to be too hot and there is the chance of a few showers over the 5 days - but nothing too substantial. Some cloud cover and high humidity though.


Last edited by Linebreaker on Thu 02 Jan 2014, 11:19 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Teams updated)
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 1:34 am

You can always rely on Muppet to give away a good start!

LBW to Watson, ah the memories
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Post by guildfordbat on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 1:35 am

I was just typing ''England's session but not comprehensively so'' when Anderson nipped in to get Watson on the stroke of lunch.

Now certainly England's session and justifying Cook's decision to bowl. Need to drive home the advantage after lunch and make it really count.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 1:35 am

Anderson finally his length right and that is stone dead. England get the fourth wicket just before lunch, and that makes it England's session.

I don't think the pitch has done all that much (probably less than England would have expected), but it feels like one where you're always in the game as a bowler, with the bounce meaning the edges will always carry. For Australia, all the batsmen have made starts, but none has looked particularly comfortable.

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 1:44 am

I think it's the type of pitch on which you're never totally "in".

Warnie thinks there will be uneven bounce later on, so important for England not to let Australia off the hook.

I thought England bowled well TBH. You could moan about them being too short and the like, but in the end 2 wickets out of 4 came from back of a length. It's important also when the ball's swinging not to get tempted to be too full and floaty, but be patient - when England did overpitch Australia generally drove them to the boundary.

Warner (although he played a somewhat loose shot) and Clarke got beauties. Rogers will be disappointed.

I'm interested in seeing whether Smith can be as disciplined here as at Perth; already he's had one slightly airy drive outside off.

Think it's the type of pitch which exposes Haddin's weaknesses as well.

England well on top for now, but there is still a lot of work to do.

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Post by guildfordbat on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 1:57 am

Would just add that Australia have scored at a fair lick this morning. If that continues for them, clearly essential that we continue to take wickets at regular intervals.

So much of our early good work would be undone if we allow Australia to get to tea at, say, 190/5.

Bed now for me. Night, folks.

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Post by alfie on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:07 am

 Good first session for England . Only following on cricinfo (who seemed a little keen to criticise the bowlers ? ) but four in two hours rather justifies the sending in...

Obviously need to keep the pressure on now...Roadblock Haddin just one wicket away  ghost 

Rankin OK ? Maybe his turn to get some wickets after luncheon ?


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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:15 am

Rankin did ok. Understandably nervous and bowled a few off line to both Watson and Rogers, but got steep bounce and looked dangerous when he did it right. Could afford to be a little bit fuller - bounce from a good length is more dangerous than bounce from back of a length as a rule.

Excellent start from Broad. Bailey looking wobbly.

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:22 am

Sure enough Bailey nicks one, against Bairstow leaves it but this time Cook clings on, just! He's standing slightly tighter in this test, England learning their lessons.

Bailey looked woeful during that innings you have to say. Feet going nowhere, stuck on the crease and playing at balls he could easily have left alone.

Now can England finish the job?

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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:23 am

and Broad gets his man, Cook with a little fumble but excellent reactions to take the rebound. I'm almost certain Bairstow has Cook a little tighter here than he did in Melbourne, sensible stuff.

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Post by Hoggy_Bear on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:23 am

Bailey gone

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Post by JDizzle on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:23 am

Bailey gone, can't say it wasn't coming. He'll probably have one more dig to keep his place for SA.

Good grab from Cook eventually, Bairstow's catch maybe? Or am I being too harsh? My rule of thumb generally is that first slip should never have to dive to his inside, but that was pretty borderline.

Here is the big wicket! Haddin in.

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Post by Hoggy_Bear on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:24 am

Here comes the Haddinator!

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:27 am

JDizzle wrote:
Good grab from Cook eventually, Bairstow's catch maybe? Or am I being too harsh? My rule of thumb generally is that first slip should never have to dive to his inside, but that was pretty borderline.

Not necessarily a good rule of thumb for international cricket where they tend to spread a lot more than you see at other levels. Particularly when the first slip's inside is his strong hand (e.g. Cook to left-handers, Cook actually being right-handed, or Clarke to right handers).

A few things going England's way which hasn't generally been the case this series. Cook a bit lucky with the rebound, and Rogers's dismissal.

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Post by JDizzle on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:30 am

Fair enough, that one was pretty in between and if Bairstow leaving that catch in Melbourne wasn't so fresh in the memory then I doubt we'd even be discussing whose catch it was, which probably shows that it was Cook's.

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:36 am

Smith leaving on length, which could be dicey with the uneven bounce we've seen.

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 2:39 am

A bit of reverse?

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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:11 am

pitch easing up in the last half an hour or so, and these two beginning to look ominous. Rankin unconvincing so far...

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Post by alfie on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:17 am

Blimey- Haddin going to rescue them again ! Man is a run machine...

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Post by Hoggy_Bear on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:21 am

Here we go again picard 

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Post by alfie on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:27 am

Real problem is , after Broad and Anderson , there is a huge drop off in class ...England just haven't been able to cover it on this trip , with Swann tailing off. Pressure has always ended up easing , etc , etc.

Stokes is promising. But need another solid bowler. Which is why they were rushing Bresnan back ...

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:34 am

The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him
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Post by JDizzle on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:37 am

KP_fan wrote:
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

Now England were wrong to drop Bresnan?! Unbelievable.

Rankin now gone off the field, didn't look good. Borthwick might have to do a bit more bowling than expected, which on the basis of his first over can only be good for Australia.

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:38 am

Boyd Rankin...gone with a hamstring probably.
I suspect Eng will dump him after this....can he go back to play for Ireland again ? Shocked 
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Post by Hoggy_Bear on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:38 am

KP_fan wrote:The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

So one over's enough for you to judge Borthwick on?
His first in test cricket?

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:39 am

Hoggy_Bear wrote:
KP_fan wrote:The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

So one over's enough for you to judge Borthwick on?
His first in test cricket?

yeah...it's enough....he lacks zzzippp
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:42 am

JDizzle wrote:
KP_fan wrote:
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

Now England were wrong to drop Bresnan?! Unbelievable.

Rankin now gone off the field, didn't look good. Borthwick might have to do a bit more bowling than expected, which on the basis of his first over can only be good for Australia.

Rankin has been sitting on the bench for months now.......and with the drop in speed it was clear he was lacking match fitness.
Bresnan atleast was match fit and if there is one type opf pitch that helps him is the grassy seaming one like this
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Post by Hoggy_Bear on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:43 am

KP_fan wrote:
Hoggy_Bear wrote:
KP_fan wrote:The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

So one over's enough for you to judge Borthwick on?
His first in test cricket?

yeah...it's enough....he lacks zzzippp

So you're expecting him to be spinning it hugely in his first over on a seam friendly pitch?
Think you should give him a chance.

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:45 am

KP_fan wrote:
Hoggy_Bear wrote:
KP_fan wrote:The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

So one over's enough for you to judge Borthwick on?
His first in test cricket?

yeah...it's enough....he lacks zzzippp

and the second over shows he is unable to get a loop...I won't say yet he is incapabale...this could be a rythm thing.
But Zippp and Fizzz.....naah


Last edited by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:46 am

Hoggy_Bear wrote:
KP_fan wrote:
Hoggy_Bear wrote:
KP_fan wrote:The pitch has seam...and bounce...and uneven bounce....and will spin also.

Cook having dejavu´.........Haddin taking the game away yet again after Aus being 5 down for less than 100

some other highlights

--Root sc.rewed and dumped
--Eng missing Monty...Borthwick a little short of Steve Smith as a leggie on first view
--Eng missing Bresnan on the pitch that was suited for him

So one over's enough for you to judge Borthwick on?
His first in test cricket?

yeah...it's enough....he lacks zzzippp

So you're expecting him to be spinning it hugely in his first over on a seam friendly pitch?
Think you should give him a chance.

Zipp/ Fizz.....is diffrent from spinning
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 3:53 am

and Borthwick's  3rd over shows...he doesn't have a googly.
any leggie worth his salt having a googly would have used in 3 overs.

He is like a part-time change bowler quality that every sub continental team has one or two from amongst their batsmen.

is this what Eng wanted from their spin bowler to give one or two hit-me balls...OR rather one who could drop into a line and length and keep things  tight.

a "kerrigansque" experiment so far
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:02 am

Hummm... what do you do now with Borthwick? With England also a man down they can't afford to not bowl him at all. Thought Cook could have given him some protection down the ground, but not sure it would have made that much difference TBH. Understandable nerves, and as I said leg spin is very very difficult. I saw a couple of balls which had a bit of rip and zip, but mostly they seemed rolled out with a lot of overspin. Again understandable, but not ideal.

Haddin moves onto 50 as England are desperate for a breakthrough before tea. Whilst Haddin will deservedly take a lot of credit, at the risk of jinxing him, it's been a good gutsy knock from Smith on a tough pitch. He's worn a couple but again shown good judgement outside off.

I think the pitch is still doing a bit, it's not really been sideways movement so much as bounce and at times uneven bounce which has caused uncertainty. The problem for England is as Alfie has pointed out. Broad and Anderson have been very good, at times excellent, but Stokes is a bit raw (and not yet a 3rd seamer) whilst Rankin bowled some really good balls, but not consistently enough. Whilst there is a long way to go, I do fear that guildford's feelings that 3 debutants might be pushing things is looking alarmingly spot on.

Also, Stokes has a problem with no-balls hitting the stumps. He's been better on the front foot line this game, but I think 4 or 5 no-balls hitting the stumps?

Finally though, although the temptation might be for doom and gloom, England are still very much in this test match. A wicket now before tea, or just after, and they have a very real chance of bowling Australia out for 250 or less. Then, all that's needed is to bat well. "all"...

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:11 am

Cook, KP, Bell, Broad and Anderson are the only 5 certain ones from this English squad of 18( I think now)...to be in the playing 11.

when 6 SLOTS are a guessing game of permutations from available 13 players...then you know the team is in complete disarray.

The game is gone....Cook is looking clueless and thinking "Home Sweet Home...let's go back home"
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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:15 am

useless, why do they think feeding one of Haddin's best shots is a good idea???

funny how the WUMs slip out of the woodwork when England are struggling, having been oddly silent for the first session and a half, pathetic.

Stokes's problem with the stumps is that he's probably learnt how to bowl with a different set of rules where it didn't matter and is used to getting close in. Pollock used to do it quite a bit IIRC. Really don't like the law change, which IMO was brought about simply because SA wanted to get into Finn's head, but since when have the powers that be in cricket showed any common sense??

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:16 am

guildfordbat wrote:
So much of our early good work would be undone if we allow Australia to get to tea at, say, 190/5.

Well, erm, sorry to break this to you...

Broad was easily the pick of the bowlers in that session although Anderson bowled pretty well as well.

Unfortunately Stokes had a poor session, and Rankin didn't improve. This allowed Australia to get back into it, and unfortunately Rankin's injury has further exposed Borthwick. No need for too much doom and gloom just yet, but if Haddin and Smith hang around for much longer this game could slip away from England quickly. Borthwick will have to bowl, and have to improve. Who are the other options? Pietersen? Bell? ...

Having said that Haddin and Smith deserve a lot of credit for gutsing it out and making the most of the scoring opportunities.

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:21 am

Quite hot outside now and apart from Broad you can see the visible wane in this attack as Haddin and Smith score at will.

Stokes hitting the stumps all the time and being scored off more easily (now the sun has come out) doesn't help England's situation either.
I think Borthwick has been thrown in the deep end and Cook's field placements have not been helpful for him. Bad luck about Rankin too.

Not so sure about them being bowled out for less than 250 runs now. More likely they will kick on with it (there's too much at stake and Jimmy provides good motivation for Brad to stand and deliver) and of course Mitch & Sidds will want to take up the fight too as will the local lads - Harris and Lyon.

We should be looking at a score of well over 300 runs by the close of play... over 330 would do nicely.
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:23 am

I like KPF cos at least he is so ridiculous you don't have to take him all that seriously (when talking about anything to do with England; it is a shame as he makes some good sense on other topics). Having gone on about how pace and bounce was obviously the solution to all of England's problems, he now decides that on a pacy and bouncy pitch they should have picked Bresnan afterall. No doubt had Panesar or Tredwell been preferred to Borthwick that would have been criticised as a safe and conservative selection, rather than the exciting option of the young talented leg-spinner.

As things are, I am loathe to criticise England's selections too strongly. They have used a complete dead rubber to have a look at a few players, and I can see the reasoning. They are a bit unfortunate in that Rankin's injury has further exposed Borthwick, and Stokes bowled possibly his worse of the tour in that session.

In all this focus and criticism of England we are in danger again of forgetting to credit Australia enough. Plus, this game is far from over still (although there is a bit of a feeling of inevitability about things now).

Also, England's ground fielding has been very good today so far.

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Post by CaledonianCraig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:32 am

Excellent session for Australia and going into the final session of the day they are now in the box seat on 201 for 5. England need a wicket and fast.
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Post by alfie on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:35 am

You have to think the scriptwriter for this series could show a little more imagination...

Some good cricket (mostly from Australia !) but the pattern of all Australia's first innings have been so similar as to invite a feeling of resignation ...especially as the pattern of England's has also been all too consistent  Smile 

Could we at least have a bit more variety , cricket gods ?


You have to hand it to Haddin though   clap   steam 

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:45 am

England looking very ragged now. Haddin sensing the moment and going for it - 23 off the first 3 overs after tea. England need a wicket from somewhere, but where? An over of Pietersen with the field out, test Haddin's ego? Got to try something...

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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:47 am

Stokes does the trick though! Bit of a tame dismissal in the end, but England won't mind.

Now then. 225-6 looks a bit different.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:48 am

gone! wonder if Haddin slightly overdid it there and got carried away, though I suppose with hindsight that's easy to say and another half-hour of that would have been murderous. Lovely innings, now can England run through the lower order?

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:49 am

Was kinda of hoping he'd get that century for Mia... the dear little daughter of his.

Brilliant knock from Haddin. He's probably already changed the course of this Test match.
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 4:55 am

Couple of balls from Broad in that over bounced sharply. Still enough in this pitch. Crucial England don't let Australia get away now. Every run crucial.

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Post by CaledonianCraig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:14 am

Rankin has broken down again. Bet they wished they had started with Finn now as I believe they should have done. Australia 240 for 6 and have wrestled control of this match now.
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:14 am

No good for Rankin, who is on the verge of tears. Feel desperately sorry for the guy.

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:15 am

Diabolical move bringing Rankin back on after a slight hamstring strain. The poor bloke only lasts another ball and is off the field again.
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:28 am

Trouble for England this; Cook understandably doesn't want to have to use Borthwick, but the later he leaves it, the less confidence Borthwick will have, and the more tired the seamers will be if they need to put in a shift right at the end of the day.

Smith sensing blood now; steady on young man, you've got a big score here if you keep your head.

Impressed with Stokes again this session. Ran in hard and stuck to his guns.

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:31 am

Yeah Mike. Also the fact that England are a bowler short... even more pressure to do so. Here he is now.
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Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:35 am

... and bowls a nice over, helped by more cover in the deep. A bit more zip in that over. Smith needs to keep his concentration.

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Post by msp83 on Fri 03 Jan 2014, 5:41 am

Missed out on the first couple of sessions. England did a lot of good work in the first session, but that's all gone, as Australia have recovered from 97-5 to 263-6. Brad Haddin pulverizing the England attack with a blistering 75 with 13 boundaries of only 90 balls. Remarkable really from Haddin, each time he stepped into a pressure situation, he delivered in style. Deserves serious respect.
What a horrendous selection from the England team management. With atrocious move, I am fully convinced that Andy Flower shouldn't stay on as England coach for a day more after this test.
Steven Finn and Joe Root were the most promising tallents to have emerged during Flower's term, he and his management team messed both of them around pretty badly, and they are lost to English cricket, at least for now. Thanks for all that you've done, but its enough now, get lost Mr Flower!.

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