Heavy duty vs Volume....

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Heavy duty vs Volume.... Empty Heavy duty vs Volume....

Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 8:41 am

Arnie was volume....Mentzer was heavy duty....

Mentzer took from Arthur Jones theory...That the increase in muscle from every workout was so minute once you have stimulated the muscle enough by doing one big set to failure why bother doing lots of sets as this is overkill..

Did Arnie overtrain.....Or did he have it right that you needed to smash your muscle completely into submission..

Yates was a big believer in heavy duty...I am too..

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Post by kingraf on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 9:25 am

Started volume training a day ago - I'll be able to give an informed response in three months. But it also depends on your definition of volume. Higher than average reps of high weights, or Serge Nubret's extremely high repetitions of middling weights?
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 9:30 am

More sets..Is volume

One big drop set rather than Six sets etc..is the duty principle

A few negatives at the end perhaps too and on to the next exercise

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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 10:17 am

I think if you use gear and get ample protein then volume is the way to go. Saying that, Heavy duty really tears down the fibres and is also good for maximum growth.

If your a natural lifter I would recommend less sets and DO NOT train any longer than 45min-1hr. In fact even if juicing an hour is probably all you need but train with more reps and less breaks between sets.


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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 10:31 am

Never train longer than an hour personally...

Chest,Tri Day 1
legs. Day 3

Biceps. Day 4
Shoulders Day 5

Back. Day 7

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Post by kingraf on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 10:54 am

I go
D1
bis and tris
D2
chest, shoulder and back

D3
Leg

D4
Bis and tris

D5
Shoulders, Back, chest


Only difference now is I use lower weight, for more sets, with shorter breaks/supersets
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 11:20 am

Day 2 is a killer Two large and one small muscle group.

Why not do shoulders with legs..

Why do shoulders before chest om day 5..Law of BB states you never do the small group first.

You are a strange one kingy

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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 11:39 am

day 1 squat day

day 2 bench day

day 3 deadlift day

day 4 military press day

sometimes do shoulders and legs together. This is my routine as a powerlifter. I usually do some speed work and bodybuilding sets after each compound movement. Also work my core hard after squats and deadlifts.

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Post by kingraf on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 11:41 am

I don't do shoulders before chest - it wasnt written in chronological order.... I superset my chest and back, and round off with shoulders. Goes for Tuesday as well.

I tend to prefer to do legs on their own, as it really is the hardest day in the gym for me. Unlike others I don't claim to crawl out the gym, but I certainly don't finish a leg day feeling like I've got enough in the tank to work another muscle group.

My spread is a little... odd, but it's what I feel works best.
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 11:44 am

You only do compound work....

No isolation ??..Adam.


Sorry Kingy...Thought it was in order..

Me I need more than four days before doing a big muscle again..

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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 11:48 am

To be honest truss I just do loads of dips and pull ups and main compounds. I do some isolation for shoulders.

To build triceps I just rely on heavy dips and close grip bench.

Want big foreams? Deadlift heavy double overhand without straps.

Nothing builds biceps better than weighted pull ups. Like I say it works for me, but everyone is different.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 1:12 pm

If it ain't broke....

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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 1:18 pm

I switch it up to more bodybuilding style sometimes for a change. I think diet and appropiate rest is more important than the training.

As long as ur pushing yourself, tho not too hard for you to overtrain as that can be counter productive. In bodybulding "no pain, no gain" is correct. Though it is very possible to fry your CNS, especially with compounds.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 1:49 pm

Rest is the one third of the puzzle people forget the most.


You seem focused...Focus is a great asset..

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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 1:53 pm

I am focused this year. I am trying to gain as much knowledge as possible and trying to push myself harder than ever. As Bruce Lee says "there are no limits, only plateus,once you get there, you have to figure how to go beyond them.

Always rememberd that saying and it's good to apply that to every aspect in your life.

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Post by kingraf on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 2:53 pm

How much can you pull up, ADAM? I must admit to being insanely jealous of anyone who has decent numbers on it. I max out at 25... could probably only do 15kg for reps... Know guys (invariably popping gear) doing 50kgs
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Post by AdamT on Wed 02 Apr 2014, 2:57 pm

full reps similar to your self. sometimes do cheat reps way 30kg or so and keep tension in biceps. Not fantastic on pullups to be honest. Much better at dips.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 28 Apr 2014, 1:48 pm

When it comes to weights, due to my weekly routine -  its heavy duty.

I only train weights properly 2 times a week. The rest of the week is circuits, lots of boxing and Thai boxing, plyometrics, Tabata, Olympic lifts at high reps (15-20 Clean and Jerks etc) . I get enough "volume" work from all that so i like to use my weight days for pure strength work. And in those two days its mostly compound stuff...not much isolation training.

I try to keep around the 16 st mark, but its difficult to stay there with so much fitness / endurance work so i fluctuate between 15-16 stone. Currently 15.4

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