Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x'

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 12 Apr 2014, 4:45 pm

First topic message reminder :

Seriously desperate now, please score Norwich
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 5:59 pm

mystiroakey wrote:If you play the way you did today olly, and they also do. Count yourself having 35 pts

Adams has installed belief into the players, and confidence has returned to the stands. I believe we can do it, a draw wouldn't be the worst result in the world
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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:01 pm

Olly wrote:If Utd could be this rubbish next week I'd very much appreciate it

We play like this every week. Awful.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:02 pm

I hope Norwich win, moyes needs to go- as many defeats as possible would help that.

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Post by mystiroakey on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:04 pm

Well lets not go ott ent.away from home you have been ok.

But this was the last biggie you had.

Could Moyes beat his old 'lesser' side.

Answer = NO

Soloution. Sack him.


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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:09 pm

You know my thoughts on the quality of the league.

Im not impressed by beating terrible sides away from home. We've no good results, lost to city, Chelsea, Everton, Liverpool, drew with arsenal and Tottenham. Don't have a decent win.

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Post by mystiroakey on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:11 pm

Its easter , think of the nice day you have off tomorrow and stop letting your stupid footie team wind you up.




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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:14 pm

12 hour shift tomorrow lol.

Not particularly wound up, not an unexpected result. We've a terrible team.

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Post by mystiroakey on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:15 pm

12 hour shift- jeas!!

Sad

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:17 pm

Yeah its pretty obvious Moyes is out of his depth at Utd

They should probably conduct a proper manager search in the summer
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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:18 pm

Ah I don't mind.

Missed a lot of united games this season working, I'm grateful for that...

Everton weren't great today, they didn't need to be.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:20 pm

Just incredible the side is set up like that and sent out to play that way with 11 days to prepare.

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Post by Bull on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:23 pm

Klopp to United.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:29 pm

Don't know why he would want the job.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:34 pm

Like every other manager; the money.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:36 pm

More to life than money.

Depends what happens to Dortmund, if the only lose lewandkwski I wouldn't go anywhere.

If ghndogan and reus go he might consider his future.

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Post by Stella on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:38 pm

Managing Utd is still a massive deal. He would imo,jump at the chance. Barca may knock on his door though. That could scupper Utd's plans.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:40 pm

Football revolves around money, both players and managers follow it, forget champions league football, that is only sought because historically it means you get paid more.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:45 pm

Dunno, I'm a massive united fan and for the first time ever I think if I was a professional footballer I wouldn't be interested in joining.

Moyes has done so badly I think he has made the playing staff look so bad that other players and managers would think twice about joining.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:48 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Football revolves around money, both players and managers follow it, forget champions league football, that is only sought because historically it means you get paid more.

If dispute that, it's only in the last 5 years we've been competitive on a world stage for wages and we've done alright.

Players joined us for less wages than available elsewhere to play and compete in the cl and compete for other trophies.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:49 pm

Like who?

We've always been able to compete on the world stage, there was only really Madrid before the oil money who spent massively more than us on wages.

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Post by NickisBHAFC on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 6:54 pm

For the 50th time. Moyes deserves time.

Although when he says United played some very good today, i would question if the bloke is drunk or not! They were terrible today and beaten by a very good Everton side, which again makes Palace's win there on Tuesday night even more impressive.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:04 pm

Well you are wrong.

Roy keane was blamed for an increase in season ticket prices in 2001 when he had to fight with the club for 50k a week.

Newcastle were paying Duncan ferguson 55k a week at that time. Italian football was paying Huge wages in the late 90s and early 00s. Recoba and vieri were on 150-200k a week with inter Milan.

There was huge stink in 2006 when Ferdinand was after 100k a week.

Historically we never paid the highest wages, it's a fact- players joined to play for united and compete for trophies.

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Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:07 pm

Rumours doing the rounds that Phil Neville has left Utd.

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Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:08 pm

Keane signed a 90 grand a week deal in 2000.

Edit: No you are right Ent.

Interesting piece here:
THE MAXIMUM WAGE AND FOOTBALL'S MONEY TRAIL
1879: Lancashire club Darwen causes a scandal when it is revealed they had been paying two Scots, Fergie Suter and James Love.
1885: Professionalism is legalised.
1901: A £4-a-week wage limit is introduced.
1905: The first £1,000 transfer fee is paid when Middlesbrough sign Sunderland's Alf Common.
1922: The maximum wage grows to £8 a week (£6 in the summer), plus a loyalty bonus of £650 after five years.
1928: The first £10,000 transfer - Arsenal sign David Jack from Bolton.
1947: Jimmy Guthrie takes over as chairman of the Players' Union with the maximum wage still only £12 a week (£10 in the summer).
1961: New PFA new chairman Jimmy Hill finally wins abolition of maximum wage. Johnny Haynes becomes first £100-a-week player.
1962: The first transfer over £100,000 takes place as Manchester United pay £110,000 to sign Denis Law from Torino.
1979: Nottingham Forest pay the first £1million fee, signing Trevor Francis from Birmingham. Peter Shilton becomes the best-paid player in Britain with a new contract at Forest worth £1,200 a week.
1988: First £2million transfer as Paul Gascoigne moves from Newcastle to Tottenham.
1994: Chris Sutton becomes the first £10,000-a-week footballer when Blackburn sign him from Norwich.
1995: The Bosman ruling allows out-of-contract players free transfers and therefore higher wages.
1996: Newcastle smash the transfer record, signing Alan Shearer for £15million from Blackburn.
2000: Roy Keane becomes the first player to top £50,000 a week with a new contract at Manchester United worth £52,000 weekly.
2001: Sol Campbell's free transfer from Tottenham to Arsenal sees the England defender become the first £100,000-a-week player.
2002: The £30million transfer fee barrier is breached when Manchester United sign Rio Ferdinand from Leeds.
2010: Carlos Tevez is the first £1million-a-month player - his weekly wages from Manchester City are claimed to be £286,000 a week.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:13 pm

They were on about 80k a week Ent, not sure where you got this 150k crap from.

You're picking out isolated incidents with context, there was uproar about Ferdinand because it wasn't the norm at that time, you're comparing today to yesteryear.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:14 pm

Don't think he did, his 50k a week deal was announced when the played Valencia in the cl.

His next deal was 90k.

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Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:16 pm

FreekShow wrote:Rumours doing the rounds that Phil Neville has left Utd.

Yeah, just heard that one. Didn't see him on the bench. Moyes should follow his lead, abysmal today in all compartments & Rooney had a mare. Team look completely lost with no direction. I fail to see any positives or progress under Moyes, beating the average sides to get 'the best away record' means nothing, against the top sides United have been trounced. Can only see a summer of hurt & disappointment for United & it's fans with Moyes at the helm.

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Post by Liam on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:17 pm

Moyes just has to go. Completely clueless. There's no game plan there, i can honestly say i have no idea what he's trying to do with utd. Apart from make sure rooney is happy all the time. The guy isn't fit! hernandez came on and made a world of difference. No wonder he wants to leave!

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:21 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/sports_talk/1852205.stm

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:21 pm

Recoba and vieri were on huge money, sure they volunteered for a pay cut when inter hit financial trouble in early 2000s.

Well over 100k a week.

We weren't paying pennies but we weren't paying the biggest wages by a long stretch.

In the mid 00s the Spanish clubs took over as the big payers due to their tax laws.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:23 pm

He was on 80k a week, it's easy to forget that was a huge wage in 2000.

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Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:25 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/sports_talk/1852205.stm

I thought I never dreamt that.

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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:31 pm

Yes keane for his last contract got a lot of money, no one disputes that and he was captain. This is not a new player being given huge wages to join.

His previous contract was a very difficult situation in that he was threatening to leave on a bosman and go to Italy. It's all in his book if you want to read it.

It's a fact that we didn't pay top top dollar, the players weren't skint but we weren't paying people huge money to join us. That's a new thing.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 7:57 pm

I could see very well why Klopp would leave Dortmund and join United. Hes only ever going to be the bridesmaid in Germany, if you come at Bayern then they just either buy your best players or stockpile some others.

Enjoyed Everton's ability to mix it up today. Some of their best stuff came from going direct.

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Post by GSC on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:11 pm

Klopp will go Barca.

Sacking Moyes this early would be stupid in the extreme. United needed rebuilding. United failed Moyes in that regard during the summer
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:12 pm

Indeed, it doesn't really feel like he's had a fair crack at it yet.

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Post by FootballLight on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:15 pm

It is now Liverpool's to lose. In fact it has been since they have been top and since last week's victory over Man City. A win next weekend and with Man City losing, they will have all but sealed the title. Mathematically not, but they will have done realistically.

But, I only see one problem in the Liverpool side. The way they like to play is that they like to play around at the back, nothing wrong with that I suppose. But they always seem to be 10/15 yards deeper than what they should be. If you want to play around with the ball at the back, do it, but 30-40 yards from goal, not 20-25 yards. Because if they get caught out, which they did today (or losing possession) on a number of occasions, coming up against tougher opposition, they will be punished. Against Norwich, they just got away with, but anyone half decent and they may have lost that game and given a bigger incentive to Chelsea for next week's game. But who can complain, they are top with that formation.

And just another little tweak for Liverpool fans, sign a goalkeeper than is actually good at his job.. I'm not talking about just mistakes, I'm talking about in general. The mistakes, costly ones, his goal kicks or kicks with possession, only just manage to reach the halfway line or go out of play, messes around with the ball too much in his own box with attackers closing down. He's a very dodgy goalkeeper for me, they need a new one for sure.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:18 pm

I'm all for giving someone time, but Moyes has shown nothing to me that suggests he should be given a huge war chest in the summer

I know Utd's squad ain't amazing, but they're 7th after finishing champions last year? They're behind an abysmal Spurs side, they've won one game against the sides ahead of them all season, they're home form is shocking

This job is just too big for Moyes, he doesn't have that ability to compete at the highest of the highest level.
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Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:19 pm

He has been so bad I don't think anyone has faith or wants to take a chance on him rebuilding.

Champions last year, 65 million pounds worth of new players. Going to finish 7th with 11 defeats and counting.

Countless inept performances etc.

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Post by Stella on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:19 pm

Isn't playing it around deep part of the plan, to invite teams to them, which in turn leaves space?

Wouldn't surprise me to see chelsea beat them next weekend. Jose loves a challenge. Though, I can see Everton getting at least a draw against City.
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Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:24 pm

If I was a Utd fan I'd want him put out of his misery.

Moyes and Utd are just a horrible fit.

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Post by Kay Fabe on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:30 pm

I know people say Spurs are abysmal, maybe thats true, last season they finished 5th with their highest ever Premiership points tally, this year they're only 2 points worse off than what they were at this stage last season, thats with all the upheavel of buying a shed load of new players to replace Gareth Bale amd changing the manager.

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Post by FootballLight on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:30 pm

Stella wrote:Isn't playing it around deep part of the plan, to invite teams to them, which in turn leaves space?

Wouldn't surprise me to see chelsea beat them next weekend. Jose loves a challenge. Though, I can see Everton getting at least a draw against City.

How does it leave space? All the coaches and managers will say is you close down from the front. Which then gives the incentive for the whole opposition team to push right up and squeeze Liverpool to a high line. It's just a shame that teams don't try and do that to thwart their attacking threat a little bit more, win the ball back in high areas of the pitch in Liverpool's half and that they can put more pressure on. If you close down from the front against Liverpool, especially when they are away, you have all the chance of beating them. The only problem is, if the attackers push up and close down, and the midfield and the defence don't, then that is when gaps are left for the midfielders to exploit.

I can't see Chelsea scoring next week actually. If they do, they will do well and it might be a 0-1. They can do it at Man City, yes, but what the problem is, although City's attack is fantastic, Liverpool's attack has been on another level this season and to a much higher intensity. Chelsea I think will get a 0-0 at best though. With Eto'o leading the line, what chance do they have of finding the net in that game? Some midfielders aren't scoring as often as they used to, especially Hazard and Sunderland found cracks in their defence yesterday. Overall, if Chelsea can find a top class striker in the summer, they might be title challengers. But not with Eto'o, Ba or Torres.

But even still, I don't think they'll win it next year. If they get Falcao, Costa etc. These are strikers that like to play quick football where they can link up with midfielders. Now Chelsea have plenty of supporting attacking midfielders, but, their football is just so boring. There is no intensity, no width and a lack of a finishing touch to kill the opposition. It's all one way paced and they just like to grind teams down. Roman A likes to see goals, not boring football on display. If teams come to Stamford Bridge, make it tight in the middle, stifle the game and have a go when they are in possession, Chelsea may end up with quite a poor home record next season. Only Sunderland have successfully fulfilled all 3 philosophies at Stamford Bridge so far, and guess what, they have come away with a victory.

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Post by Hero on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:31 pm

Agree with DZ on this, the challenge in Germany is slipping away from him when every year Bayern just rob the creme of talent even their own. Come to Utd and with the cash available and his reputation they can easily become a force again, especially if he can influence the likes of Reus, Subotic, Hummels etc to follow.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:32 pm

Stella wrote:Isn't playing it around deep part of the plan, to invite teams to them, which in turn leaves space?

Wouldn't surprise me to see chelsea beat them next weekend. Jose loves a challenge. Though, I can see Everton getting at least a draw against City.

There were plenty of times today we pressed high, they played it round us and were away with 4 on 4 or 5 on 5. Risky but effective
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Post by Stella on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:35 pm

You answered your own question. The opposition push up, which then creates space, as in, in behind. Rodgers doesn't tell them to knock it around deep for no reason.

Yes, I'm sure Liverpool will score, most probably in the first half. I hope they do, tbh.

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Post by Stella on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:37 pm

Olly wrote:
Stella wrote:Isn't playing it around deep part of the plan, to invite teams to them, which in turn leaves space?

Wouldn't surprise me to see chelsea beat them next weekend. Jose loves a challenge. Though, I can see Everton getting at least a draw against City.

There were plenty of times today we pressed high, they played it round us and were away with 4 on 4 or 5 on 5. Risky but effective

I didn't see today's game, only the goals. Will watch MOTD2 later, not that they tell the whole story.
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Post by FootballLight on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:40 pm

Yes, but how are they going to be able to get in behind when the opposition is on top of them because all of they're men are piled in Liverpool's half? They will need to play a quick long ball, which 9 times of out 10, doesn't work as it runs straight through to the goalkeeper, especially if there is a sweeper keeper in goal. But, we found it out today, if they lose the ball easily enough, like they did today, better quality passing sides and finishing sides will pick them off, retain possession and Liverpool will be creating their own chances by giving the opposition the ball. Even Norwich managed to score 2 goals because Liverpool gave up possession in the wrong areas and because of mistakes also.

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Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x' - Page 19 Empty Re: Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x'

Post by Guest on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:41 pm

Can't see Chelsea winning at Anfield, showing no form whatsoever to pull of a result like that. Remember, Jose is not stupid, it's out of their hands now, he will most probably end up rotating his side anyway for the champions league games, which fall either side of the fixture. What's more important to Jose, win the first champions league with Chelsea under him or win the league that's out of his hands? No brainer.

As for Klopp, he'd jump at the chance of managing United in this position.

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Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x' - Page 19 Empty Re: Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x'

Post by Ent on Sun 20 Apr 2014, 8:43 pm

They'll just play long passes wide to Suarez, Sturridge and sterling.

That's why no one plays a high line against them.

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