England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

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England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Fri 01 Aug 2014, 4:21 pm

First topic message reminder :

With the Anderson/Jadeja spat in the rear view mirror, we can all move on.

England name an unchanged squad, I'd be surprised if Plunkett didn't play, whether its at the expense of Jordan or Broad is the biggest question. Imagine they'll have planned on resting Broad at some stage.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by dummy_half on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 3:23 pm

Alfie

One of my colleagues is going to OT tomorrow, and has been keeping an eye on the forecast. Earlier in the week it was suggesting a poor day, but now looks like there's a decent chance of a full day's play, so we should get 100 overs (including making up some lost today) Sunday looks like there might be some stop-start play for the first half of the day and then a washout later on, with Monday probably being stop-start.

So 150-180 overs is certainly reaonable for the last 3 days. Given the state of the game and the likelihood that this rain is going to keep the wicket lively, that should be plenty of time to push on for the victory.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 3:25 pm

Rains stopped apparently but massively waterlogged outfield atm.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 3:43 pm

Looking bleak for any further prospect of play today.

Provided the weather is fine tomorrow, swing the bat in the morning and then declare at lunch, hopefully with the lead past 150.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by msp83 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 4:48 pm

The play isn't called off yet, the rain has stopped and there should be an inspection soon. Lets see.......
Hopefully the conditions would help the Indian bowlers finish off the lower order pretty soon. Around 260 will be great.......

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 4:57 pm

Well they got 2 hours left, the state of the outfield is pretty grim.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 5:00 pm

Play has to start by 18:00, and then it can last until 19:30. The outfield is soaking, but the sun is out and the rain has, seemingly, retreated.

So an outside chance of another twenty overs tonight, which would be graciously received by England in their bid to get this game moving, and the lead towards three figures and beyond.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by msp83 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 5:06 pm

Seems like no inspection as was expected earlier, reports cricinfo.
Looking more and more like that's it for the day.
If India can summon some determination and intent with ball first and then with the bat, weather conditions and all, we can still go to the final test 1 all........

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 5:33 pm

Tomorrow looks good, weatherwise, at least. Monday should be OK. Sunday looks a bit up in the air, though.

Upon resumption, which will probably be tomorrow, England will probably attack and look to bat for no more than one session before declaring. Hopefully that lead can be extended to past 150.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 5:42 pm

Yep play abandoned for the day.

Fingers crossed for a full day tomorrow.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by msp83 on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 6:27 pm

So that's some time taken off from what India will have to survive.......

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by KP_fan on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 6:55 pm

Saturday all day fleeting showers....Eng might escape with a draw here  Very Happy 
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by CaledonianCraig on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 7:37 pm

Hmm sixteen wickets alrweady down in a day and a half's play. The pitch is lively and is bringing four wickets a session so unless another two days of play is lost from here (even taking into account Hurricane Bertha that is very unlikely) then the draw is still the least likely result at the moment. Tomorrow is set fair and it is likely England will declare or be bowled out with a lead in the region of 150. Now that may be around lunch tomorrow or tea if lead is around 200. That gives England a session at India tomorrow and if they cause another collapse then India could still be 100 runs adrift with perhaps four wickets down. Leaves England a day to get middle order and tail-enders out on Monday even if Sunday is washed out.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by mystiroakey on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 8:11 pm

England are 1/2
Draw 3/1
India 15/1

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 10:17 pm

Big morning session tomorrow, hopefully Buttler can get going and if he does England should have a commanding lead. I wouldn't declare, plenty of time left in this game, and England's chances of winning increase more with every passing run added. Get a lead of 200-250 you can bowl em out without batting again
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Liam on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 10:28 pm

Agree, Olly. Hopefully Buttler and Root can see off the first hour and then go on the attack. I'd have Root just do what Dhoni did and just stay at the crease and allow Buttler to play his shots. Hopefully they come off. Bat until bowled out I say, especially with rain forecast. Then go at India. I feel ever a 150 run lead will cause all sorts of bother for India.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 10:29 pm

Jos Buttler currently averaging 107 in test cricket #betterthanbradman
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:00 am

I extolled the virtues of patience at the start of day two, but for the start of day three such ideas are antecedent.

The forecast looks rather threatening, so England need to get a bloody move on. Cook may only have Saturday and Monday to finish this game; Sunday offers little promises.

Swing the bat in the morning - fortunately England have the right players for that task - and get the lead past 150. Declare. Let the bowlers do the rest, and be confident that the batsmen will not have to chase anything greater than 100.

Win the game. Win the series (nearly). Sorted.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:24 am

Bowling masterclass with wasim akram on sky

Stop your life
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by KP_fan on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:37 am

There is little to fault Eng...they have played as well as they could have.

Reading the forecasts...sunday might be wiped out and mon interrupted...but still Eng can win.

Today Eng must bat normally...it's that sorta pitch where 4 wkts can fall for 10 runs if you are not cautious...so Eng should be wary of not collapsing in a heap for nothing, else defeat creeps into the equation for them.

Ind on the other hand should not seek solace in weather...else the intensity / performance level will drop.
Indian batsmen, whenever they bat have to put up 2 good session...like 175 runs for 2 to 3 wickets and they will steer the team to safety.

Indian seamers( except Bhuv) are lacking experience......of putting rhe ball in the right place with consistency...
but they are not too diffrent from the new Eng seamers ....not enouhg wicket taking balls.
Shows in test match cricket.....seam bowlers groom and develop over a period of several years
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by KP_fan on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:44 am

can't understand why in Eng they do not start play an hour earlier...given that there is bright daylight at 10am and 10 am is not like early bed-tea-time.
to make up 15 overs...
and then cut the lunch by 20 minutes and tea by 5 minutes to gain anotehr 6 overs or so....if overs have been lost earlier in the game

there is so much lack of commonsense in managing test match cricket...thanks goodness somewhere in the 1990s they ended the rest day in the middle of a test match


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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:47 am

KP_fan wrote:can't understand why in Eng they do not start play an hour earlier...given that there is bright daylight at 10am and 10 am is not like early bed-tea-time.
to make up 15 overs... and cut the lunch by 20 minutes and tea by 5 minutes to gain anotehr 6 overs or so....

there is so much lack of commonsense in managing test match cricket...thanks goodness somewhere in the 1990s they ended the rest day in the middle of a test match
Tell me about it KPF

A half ten start wouldn't be a issue at all, and I don't see why they can't finish at 7 everyday, no light issues

But then common sense and cricket rule makers don't always go hand in hand
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:16 am

The finish will be at seven today to try and squeeze in 98 overs.

Root has brought up his half-century today, so well done to him. I am wondering when England will start to kick on.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:18 am

Gotta get in first Duty

New ball will bring the opportunity to get some quick runs
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:35 am

Two consecutive boundaries for Buttler; my worries shall start to ease!

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:42 am

Any idea what would be considered a decent lead here when batting last? 150?

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by KP_fan on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:46 am

pankaj needs to gte his length up
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:50 am

Expected the new ball to get the runs flowing...but apart from those two drives from Buttler the bowling has been good enough to keep them quiet so far.
...but as I type Pankaj rather loses his radar and Buttler says thanks...


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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:52 am

Much like yesterday you have to play yourself in and see off the opening spell, then it gets easier.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:52 am

A 150 lead would be the golden ticket, I feel, but I would not be surprised if Cook wanted a few more than that.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:53 am

Duty281 wrote:A 150 lead would be the golden ticket, I feel, but I would not be surprised if Cook wanted a few more than that.

Yeah given the possible weather and wanting to avoid batting again much if at all it makes sense.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:56 am

Hundred partnership for these two. clap

Superbly done. Exquisite.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:56 am

You suspect 250 at least to be brutally honest.

Unlikely England declare today I imagine.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:56 am

Depends how quick they're scoring I guess . But I'd think he'd rather lead by a bit more than that. Bat once...

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:58 am

And India will no doubt have other ideas so we shall see what they can get.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 11:59 am

Whichever website it is that I consult, Sunday in Manchester looks a washout. Monday is not exactly shining with promises, either.

Cook should be proactive, and expect that there are only five and a half sessions, at most, left in this match.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by GSC on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:01 pm

They might have an hour or so before close but I'd be surprised before then.

Still got to be batting then also.
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by mystiroakey on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:19 pm

We have to declare at lunch. These two need to pile on the runs now they are in for the morning.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:19 pm

Big run out chance missed then ! Buttler was gone by yards...

In fairness to Dhoni , the (excellent) throw just bounced up a fraction higher than he expected. But that was a big chance missed.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by mystiroakey on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:20 pm

Anyone saying ignore the weather when it's 95% wash out Sunday is crazy

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:24 pm

GSC wrote:They might have an hour or so before close but I'd be surprised before then.

Still got to be batting then also.

Indeed. One goes , the rest might fall quite quickly. Actually fancy they would like to have a half hour to bowl before tea , if all goes well. But whenever they declare some people will be on to denounce Cook for being too negative  Smile 

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by mystiroakey on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:26 pm

Hopefully they will just bowl us out. It's not about cook declaring it's the captain telling the players to go t20 , we might as well get to that comfortable point and hit out with quick runs

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by ChequeredJersey on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:27 pm

Get the 150 lead then slog out. It's win win- we get to bowl India again sooner but we also pile on quick and demoralising runs
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:29 pm

Good fifty Buttler  clap 

Actually more impressed with this innings than his first Test. That time , he was arguably lucky to get off the mark ; had a bit more luck early on and ended up flogging a tired and dispirited attack. This innings has been a tougher test , and he has played it well.

England will hope he can go into overdrive after lunch and really nail down their advantage.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:30 pm

Buttler taking full advantage, and England are marching to that 150 lead.

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by mystiroakey on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:36 pm

Well done pank!! About time.

Top innings rooty clap

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:36 pm

Why would you declare now? Score the runs whilst they're easiest
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Duty281 on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:38 pm

20/20 time, then declare at lunch.

Pleaseeeeee!

Sterling effort by Root. clap


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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:38 pm

Wicket at last for Pankaj  music Bubbly cake 

Not his best delivery ; but at leat he has an average now.

Root did a fine job again ...over to Buttler and Woakes now to push that lead over 200

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:39 pm

Pankaj has bowled all those great balls but its the filthy one down leg side that got the wicket. Fitting really
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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

Post by alfie on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 12:42 pm

Olly wrote:Why would you declare now? Score the runs whilst they're easiest

Exactly. If the last two days are washed out , too bad - but nothing you could do about it. But if they can have India , say , four or five down tonight you'd fancy getting enough play in to finish the job.
Crushing lead before they get back in , as long as they get them quickly , would be ideal.

With Buttler in , they won't be scoring slowly...

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Re: England v India 4th Test, Old Trafford

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