Conservatives and Labour struggling - No one wants to win GE2015 !!

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 20 Nov 2014, 4:57 pm

First topic message reminder :

Labour have died and been buried in Scotland............22 points behind the SNP who could gain 20 seats...all moans and groans about Miliband and down to 31% in the polls and the Lib firewall in tatters..

Tories have lost two safe seats to UKIP with maybe more MPs following their lead..........and stuck on 31% too as the Greens and UKIP are gaining from Labour's fall in England.............

Labour can't unite behind Ed....................and the Tories can't unite over europe !!

Who knows what's going to happen.

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Post by Guest on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 10:06 am

TopHat24/7 wrote:
legendkillarV2 wrote:I have no doubt this will become a point scorer in months to come.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-30397329

Can't say it bothers me. The NHS needs private investment. Just wish more of it existed in acute trusts.

I did read that 71% of NHS staff are admin. I would like to see a government tackle that area.

Yeah, proper political football.  The Tories will say it's sourcing much needed investment and from a source other than taxpayer pockets, Labour will say it's privatisation by the back door which is a very sensitive subject for many (me included, even as someone likely to vote Tory).

Sadly it's a bullet the government can no longer dodge. They don't have the money or resources to keep propping up the services. Yes I know private companies are ruthless and will run a tight service on the most minimal budget available and yes even profit, but I can't see any other way forward.

I don't see Labour trying to re-nationalise services within the NHS that have been privatised if they get in.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 10:24 am

In fairness, this 'privatisation by the backdoor' was actually started under Blair's Labour with all the PPP & PFI contracts.

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Post by Derbymanc on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 11:40 am

The whole of the government needs an overhaul, especially when it comes to administration tasks. you've got an NHS that pays more for administers/managers than actualy doctors and nurses. An armed forces that has far too many top paid personnel compared to lower levels (and all the money they've just paid on redundancies only to continue recruiting???)

Expenses, Pay rises and contracts need all redoing, and anyone that ain't happy should be told to feck off.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 11:57 am

Trade Unions prevent any of that reform happening though, Derby.

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Post by Derbymanc on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 12:28 pm

Don't get me started on the unions either, I get they're supposed to help but it seems these days like they're more of a hindrance (RMT are the biggest tw!ts of the lot)

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 12:31 pm

Derbymanc wrote:Don't get me started on the unions either, I get they're supposed to help but it seems these days like they're more of a hindrance (RMT are the biggest tw!ts of the lot)

Hug

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Post by Guest on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 2:03 pm

The union is all for keeping jobs in the public sector that bear no relevence. So let's spend money for the sake of it and not generate any wealth.

I had a meeting with a rep a couple of weeks ago. I told my superior I want to leap over the desk and stab him with my pen! The arrogant and ignorant c*nt!

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Post by Adam D on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 2:04 pm

legendkillarV2 wrote:The union is all for keeping jobs in the public sector that bear no relevence. So let's spend money for the sake of it and not generate any wealth.

I had a meeting with a rep a couple of weeks ago. I told my superior I want to leap over the desk and stab him with my pen! The arrogant and ignorant c*nt!
I bet you a different rep gave you the pen mind

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 2:48 pm

Where would be without Unions.....Sticking up for workers right....

Greatest invention ever...


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Post by Derbymanc on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 2:58 pm

Whilst a fair few years ago I would have agreed with you Truss, now they're a bloated mass that uses it's workers for what it wants and ignores them when it suits (said from experience (RMT gits)

They make an inordinate amount of money and as it stands are worse than poltiicians when it comes to spin and not really having a clue what the average workers issues are.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 3:07 pm

I've been into an awful lot of Companies to carry out studies and seen the shoddy way the workers get treated..

You'll never convince me that scrapping Unions will be a good idea...

Yep they aren't perfect....


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Post by Derbymanc on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 3:32 pm

Think they need a good slapping down Truss. Don't know how you can fight for workers rights and wages when your taking in a whacking wage yourself and only taking the fights that will make you look good instead of what your workers want.

Whilst the idea in itself is sound the execution of it is not, bit like communism/socialism. You start of saying everyone was equal and deserves the same, but then some are a bit more equal than others, and of course because your the one arguing, your definitely more equal and deserve that bit more. Oh and we can't get you a pay rise this year, but for the joy of us not getting you a pay rise we're gonna rise your rates too. etc etc etc etc

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 3:48 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Where would be without Unions.....Sticking up for workers right....

Greatest invention ever...


Lots of good stuff in the few thousand years of human history.

Doesn't mean there's any 21st century relevance.

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Post by Strongback on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 9:21 pm

I'd say there are a few UKippers on the boxing board.........you know reactionary types.

What always surprises me are conservative voters who are gung ho about the party while never gaining any financial reward themselves. The Tory's are all about making very rich people even more wealthy. Why some working class and middle class people are so pro Conservative is quite frankly asinine.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 10:18 pm

Fancy you not liking them Toppy...

I think they are very relevant.....Just as the Autumn statement being taken apart may be...

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Post by Derbymanc on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 8:11 am

Strongback wrote:I'd say there are a few UKippers on the boxing board.........you know reactionary types.

What always surprises me are conservative  voters who are gung ho about the party while never gaining any financial reward themselves.  The Tory's are all about making very rich people even more wealthy.  Why some working class and middle class people are so pro Conservative is quite frankly asinine.

To be honest Strongy, I think anyone that blindly follows any party is a bit mental (when your old enough to vote you'll see a lot of this Wink Look at the party and look at the policies, if you can go off any personal experience you have with them use that too. I've voted for 4 parties at some point and stopped voting for labour due to their reckless spending and how it directly affected myself.

Forgot to say, some people genuinely want whats the best for the country, not just themselves. It tends to be the people that earn enough money that losing out a bit doesn't matter.

For Truss,
They do have a place if run correctly, these days they're not though and with the introduction of the minimum wage, H and S laws they become less relevant.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 9:31 am

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Fancy you not liking them Toppy...

I think they are very relevant.....Just as the Autumn statement being taken apart may be...

It hasn't...?! Other than one widely slated BBC editorial, which showed a disgraceful lack of neutrality.

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Post by Guest on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 9:47 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30417955

I can't wait for this Laugh

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Post by Derbymanc on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 9:53 am

Labour need to come out with a proper plan and stop trying to look like Conservative Lite. Think they're realising too late now that they seem to have completely lost their way and even staunch Labour area's are starting to lose faith.

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Post by Duty281 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:34 am

I hear the great Nigel Farage is on Question Time tonight.

Four against one, five if you include Dimbers, hundreds if one includes the audience, and still Farage will have them wrapped around his little finger.

Russell Brand is on as well - Christmas pantomime, anyone?

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:12 pm

legendkillarV2 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30417955

I can't wait for this Laugh

Pyschological win for the Tories, in the something Labour have never wanted to focus on is now considered to central to voters' minds that Labour have an entire press conference to focus their economic policies around "Reducing the Defecit".

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Post by Guest on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:49 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:
legendkillarV2 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30417955

I can't wait for this Laugh

Pyschological win for the Tories, in the something Labour have never wanted to focus on is now considered to central to voters' minds that Labour have an entire press conference to focus their economic policies around "Reducing the Defecit".

The two things I found interesting in the article was:

1) Miliband more or less admitting Labour have no 'financial' creditibility

2) The voters trust the Tories with finances more than they do Labour

Can't see how Labour can turn this around.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:51 pm

Good news for Labour is that no matter how low unemployment is or how well the economy Is functioning....

Middle class Women just won't trust ..."Call me Dave""....

It's keeping Labour in business..

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:12 pm

legendkillarV2 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:
legendkillarV2 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30417955

I can't wait for this Laugh

Pyschological win for the Tories, in the something Labour have never wanted to focus on is now considered to central to voters' minds that Labour have an entire press conference to focus their economic policies around "Reducing the Defecit".

The two things I found interesting in the article was:

1) Miliband more or less admitting Labour have no 'financial' creditibility

2) The voters trust the Tories with finances more than they do Labour

Can't see how Labour can turn this around.

Yeh, every time surveys come out, they always show people trust DC/GO with the economy miles miles more than EM/EB.

BUT.......Tories image is otherwise so toxic that Labour still take a poll lead.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:17 pm

Couldn't agree more....

Funny thing is If it was up to Men...

The SNP would have won the independent vote and The Tories would be home and hosed...

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:26 pm

Think Tories could do with pushing through the English Mps for English votes legislation quicker.

That way, if they do lose GE15, it'll make Labour's life a lot more difficult once they're in.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:29 pm

How are they going to get it through...

24 short even before the rebels....

Suicide for Labour and the Libs won't support it..

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Post by Derbymanc on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:36 pm

Isn't that half of the problem though Toppy, sometimes the parties are making life difficult for either side, not cause they don't agree with whats being said, just to be childish.

Country needs a massive kick up the arse as we're not doing nearly as well we think (especially, working/middle class) and once the interest rates rise (to help all those people lucky enough to be able to save) those of us that are scraping by are going to be handing our houses back and defaulting on this that and the other.

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Post by TopHat24/7 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:45 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:How are they going to get it through...

24 short even before the rebels....

Suicide for Labour and the Libs won't support it..

I think it's a dificult policy to deny though. It's utterly fair and logical and, by Labour blocking it, will show tht their concern is power not acting in the interests of its people.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:49 pm

Labour become impotent If it goes through...

The Tories push through anything they want..

Won't happen until the Tories win outright.

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