Eng in Lanka

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Eng in Lanka

Post by KP_fan on Fri 21 Nov 2014, 2:36 pm

First topic message reminder :

From not being keen on Moeen's position, Cook now uses him to open the batting and bowling sometimes.
While I am a fan of Moeen's temperament, I dont think he is the saviour that Eng is looking for.

also he won't do well as an opener for too long.

Cook has strong dislikes and it seems now Hales is on that list.


Lanks has been Mauled by India and must be at lowest possible morale.

Eng is not a great ODI side and lagging by the day as Morgan observed.

Should be an even series if not a high quality one. Lanks might still win
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 10:56 am

well if we don't win from here you can't only blame Cook Very Happy

I think Bops will go OK here, required rate under five means he's not under pressure to score quickly, and he usually goes pretty well in such situations.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 10:57 am

VTR wrote:Another thought, Morgan would usually come in ahead of Bopara wouldn't he? So the management are thinking along the same lines? Does this mean I could be up for a job, I won't say what my first recommendation would be Very Happy

Bops has actually come in at 5 in the last two games, I think England want Morgan to play more of a finisher role.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 10:59 am

Mad for Chelsea wrote:well if we don't win from here you can't only blame Cook Very Happy

I think Bops will go OK here, required rate under five means he's not under pressure to score quickly, and he usually goes pretty well in such situations.

True! It will be a close defeat if it is, so you'd be looking at some poor bowling (15 wides was it?) and panic from the middle order. We have to win these sort of games though, they are about the only ones we seem to win as we aren't very good at setting a big total or chasing down large totals.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:02 am

Mad for Chelsea wrote:
VTR wrote:Another thought, Morgan would usually come in ahead of Bopara wouldn't he? So the management are thinking along the same lines? Does this mean I could be up for a job, I won't say what my first recommendation would be Very Happy

Bops has actually come in at 5 in the last two games, I think England want Morgan to play more of a finisher role.

You have to feel for Bops a bit I suppose. He was the number 3 for a while, then the finisher, now he seems to have a new role. I think he can be a very useful ODI player, give him a role and stick to it. Hoping he does it today, I can't see too many other players offering middle order batting and a decent bowling option.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by mystiroakey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:03 am

30 ahead of the DL.

Bops starting of nicely. Working it about.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:03 am

I admit I was a bit surprised when so many commentators yesterday suggested SL had the advantage after posting 240. Sure the pitch is spinning a bit, but 240 in today's terms should really be a fairly straightforward chase.

England's problem isn't (usually) scoring 230-260 or so, it's more kicking on to reach 300+, which is what you need more often than not nowadays.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by mystiroakey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:08 am

Yep we are so behind when setting the total . I want to see us bat first in the next match and as many times as possible going forward before the world cup. The more times we can score 300 plus and defend the better we will be.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:09 am

Mad for Chelsea wrote:I admit I was a bit surprised when so many commentators yesterday suggested SL had the advantage after posting 240. Sure the pitch is spinning a bit, but 240 in today's terms should really be a fairly straightforward chase.

England's problem isn't (usually) scoring 230-260 or so, it's more kicking on to reach 300+, which is what you need more often than not nowadays.

I noticed that on the BBC commentary. Its the TMS dinosaurs I think mainly, who still think 250 is a generally competitive total and would probably choke on the chocolate cake that Mrs Miggins sent in if they ever saw a player make an individual double hundred.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by kingraf on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:21 am

Olly wrote:How can it make you feel if you're a player in this team scrapping for a place in the world cup squad and you have a failure (like hales) and you're dropped, but you alastair cook who hasn't scored a odi century for two and a half years, barely makes 50 anymore, yet he is guaranteed his place in the side.

Get him out the side for crying out loud

Indeed, how dare a player with 34 international centuries be given more rope than one with... well one?
Is this actually how cricketers in England think?
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Duty281 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:39 am

Duty281 wrote:One can get odds of evens for England to win this game.

It will be an absolute, bloody doddle to the finish. Cook will be in his element: chasing a score at under five an over for fifty overs. And if it rains a bit and D/L comes into play, then it will be easier, as ever, for the chasing side, and Buttler will be in his element.

A stroll. A chance to print money.

Come on England!

It is an absolute, bloody doddle.

That said, only England can lose it from here!

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by mystiroakey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:46 am

Its like shooting clunge in a barrell.

You have doubled your money.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:56 am

kingraf wrote:
Olly wrote:How can it make you feel if you're a player in this team scrapping for a place in the world cup squad and you have a failure (like hales) and you're dropped, but you alastair cook who hasn't scored a odi century for two and a half years, barely makes 50 anymore, yet he is guaranteed his place in the side.

Get him out the side for crying out loud

Indeed, how dare a player with 34 international centuries be given more rope than one with... well one?
Is this actually how cricketers in England think?

Well he's had two and a half years worth of rope in one day stuff, how much longer does it take?
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by mystiroakey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:57 am

What was I saying!!

Always a wobble.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:57 am

England just putting themselves under pressure here. Root either getting tired or nervous, need a couple of boundaries to ease the tension.

Bops gone, a decent knock from him but again, not setting the world alight...

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Duty281 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:58 am

Oh England what are you doing?!

Fifteen from fourteen now.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:59 am

Oh Ravi! How is this even close? Need more than a run a ball now, should be ok but how has it come to that, the game was won!

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:00 pm

well that was predicatble. No one back on the reverse-sweep and Moggs goes straight to it, picks up a boundary which will just calm the nerves a bit...

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:02 pm

Why you would bring bopara in ahead of Morgan is beyond me
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:02 pm

and that will help some more.

Well played Joe Root, fine knock clap.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by kingraf on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:02 pm

Two years without a century in ODI is hardly a drought of epic proportions. He averaged 35 last year, so he hasn't been woefully out of form, just hasn't quite been converting. By comparison... Hales List A average is roughly the same, slightly more, and his six ODI matches have not exactly been scene stealing performances.
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:03 pm

Brilliant century from Root. Job done now, an efficient performance chasing down a modest total.

Desperately need a bat first and defend win in the next couple of games.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Duty281 on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:04 pm

Well done Root. clap

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:07 pm

Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:13 pm

Olly wrote:Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?


I would say so, though you feel he should be behind Cook in Tests and Morgan in ODI's. Only Ballance (Tests) and Buttler (ODIs) are close at the moment.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by amanuensis on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:14 pm

Olly wrote:Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?


Not in tests. Good form, but failed against Australia (best bowling side he's faced easily).

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:26 pm

amanuensis wrote:
Olly wrote:Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?


Not in tests. Good form, but failed against Australia (best bowling side he's faced easily).

They all did! Can we please ban anymore mentions of that series Very Happy

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by GSC on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:28 pm

Technically speaking shouldn't that be 2 ODI wins
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by KP_fan on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:31 pm

With the start of Aus series, i lost a bit of focus on the Eng-Lanka series....but it does appear Eng have gathered themselves well.
They should win today and then the scoreline would look respectable.

In Limited over format also you need inning builders....who can score big 50s or hundreds at 5RPO.......and others bats around them

--In Root and Taylor they have found two such guys that they should stick to now.

--Bopara ia proving a good finisher.....and Morgan is too good as an accelerator and finisher....to be left out inpsite is form...

--and Cook is in by Default......he must focus on playing his steady gam rather than trying to be what he cannot

so all those positions are locked.

Ali gets in the team....but should bat somewhere in the middle.
Eng's seam bowling is good.....and I am not sure if Anderson and Broad will be back in reckoning...especially Braod will be useful with his style of bowling in Aus and his lower order batting.

--there is no room for Tredwell, the 2nd spinner in Aussie conditions... as Ali gets in for his batting and not too bad bowling.

if they get their act together this Eng side will be a very competitive side.
I would rank them only behind SA,, Aus and Ind but ahead of Pak, NZ , WI and Lanka

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:33 pm

GSC wrote:Technically speaking shouldn't that be 2 ODI wins

Good point, 3-3 and all to play for! On a serious note, it seems quite unusual to have reserve day for an ODI - is that the norm in SL? Certainly if that game was over here it would have been a no result

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by amanuensis on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:35 pm

VTR wrote:
amanuensis wrote:
Olly wrote:Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?


Not in tests. Good form, but failed against Australia (best bowling side he's faced easily).

They all did! Can we please ban anymore mentions of that series Very Happy

I said "against Australia", not "in Australia". I seem to recall superb performances at home from Bell, when they had to contend with Harris, Siddle & Lyon.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:40 pm

amanuensis wrote:
VTR wrote:
amanuensis wrote:
Olly wrote:Is Joe root already England's best batsman in tests and one day games?


Not in tests. Good form, but failed against Australia (best bowling side he's faced easily).

They all did! Can we please ban anymore mentions of that series Very Happy

I said "against Australia", not "in Australia". I seem to recall superb performances at home from Bell, when they had to contend with Harris, Siddle & Lyon.

I see - yes he was poor in that series as well. I think Olly means on form, that home Ashes series was 18 months ago now so doesn't count as form for me, especially given the Ashes now reside in another land. Based on form since the start of the summer, I can't really argue with Olly's point

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Stella on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:44 pm

He was a young not so over eager opener in the last home ashes series. He's matured since then, and has found his place in the middle order. That is till they squeeze Taylor in at four, and ask Root to open again.
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:50 pm

Stella wrote:He was a young not so over eager opener in the last home ashes series. He's matured since then, and has found his place in the middle order. That is till they squeeze Taylor in at four, and ask Root to open again.

Do you think they might go with Taylor at 6, Moeen at 8 in Tests? Moeen has been much better bowling than batting in Tests and is surely the man in possession of the spin bowling berth. Maybe Trott back as an opener?

But agree, if Root moves to open again I will be very unhappy!

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Stella on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:57 pm

VTR wrote:
Stella wrote:He was a young not so over eager opener in the last home ashes series. He's matured since then, and has found his place in the middle order. That is till they squeeze Taylor in at four, and ask Root to open again.

Do you think they might go with Taylor at 6, Moeen at 8 in Tests? Moeen has been much better bowling than batting in Tests and is surely the man in possession of the spin bowling berth. Maybe Trott back as an opener?

But agree, if Root moves to open again I will be very unhappy!

Ali at six, with Buttler at seven works well, at present. Our main issue is with an opener, which is bad news for Root. Despite what I said yesterday, I feel we should move on from Trott. He's not exactly old, but with a possibility of him not touring, I would look towards the future.
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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Mike Selig on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:37 pm

Taylor making the most of his chance which is good to see.

Agree that there's no real point moaning about Cook anymore, it's clear he will lead England at the WC. Doesn't mean we have to like it, but harping on about it every other post is probably no longer necessary or helpful.

Still concerned about Bopara at 5. IMO you'd be better off having Taylor there and using Hales or Vince or someone at top. However that leaves the bowling even lighter...

As for the test conundrum Taylor will have to wait his turn. At the moment Ballance, Bell and Root are rightly in possession in the middle order, with Moeen playing as an all-rounder. Can't realistically see England moving Root up to open anytime soon.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by JDizzle on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 2:06 pm

Missed the second innings. Superb to see Jimmy taking his chance, my years of pining for him are becoming worth it! Good to see he didn't take up being jockey, as he was advised to. He's played two 'anchor' knocks now, it will be interesting to see him when England are trying to get 300+ and see if he can accelerate as well as he does in domestic cricket.

Sounds like a great knock from Root too, real gem.

England are much better at chasing too, is it getting to the point where they should almost ignore conditions and just bat second ever time they win the toss?

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by liverbnz on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 2:08 pm

England are good at chasing 250ish. Push it 20/30 higher and they aren't quite so good. But yeah, they are much better at chasing than setting.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by mystiroakey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 2:17 pm

JDizzle wrote:Missed the second innings. Superb to see Jimmy taking his chance, my years of pining for him are becoming worth it! Good to see he didn't take up being jockey, as he was advised to. He's played two 'anchor' knocks now, it will be interesting to see him when England are trying to get 300+ and see if he can accelerate as well as he does in domestic cricket.

Sounds like a great knock from Root too, real gem.

England are much better at chasing too, is it getting to the point where they should almost ignore conditions and just bat second ever time they win the toss?
I think we need to fix the problem and bat first..

We can't have that  chink in our armour.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by JDizzle on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 2:22 pm

Obviously that'd be ideal, but seen as we're coming up on the World Cup I think we need to try and hide our weaknesses by batting second as much as possible.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 4:50 pm

I think the opposite JDizzle, we should work on our weakness in this series when it doesn't matter. What if we lose the toss and are put in at the WC quarter final. We badly need to practice setting a total

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by JDizzle on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 4:55 pm

Yeah, maybe. I just have very little faith in our batting line up to do that, barring one special innings dragging us there (whether that be a run a ball ton from Root, Taylor, Moeen or even Cook, or a smashed 70 from Bops, Morgan, Buttler). I think we've probably left it too late to truly develop a completely rounded ODI game, which is why and I lean to just trying our best to win every game possible and hope form and momentum would drag us through the WC.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 5:11 pm

Yeah its a fine balance, overall confidence vs confidence in certain scenarios. Whatever happens at the WC we need a new blueprint after which allows us to set totals. I can't ever remember an England team being any good at it

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 5:20 pm

Very decent victory today. Was only able to see about the first 3 overs this morning before going out and wasn't too confident then with Moeen already back in the hutch and Cook fortunate to have survived an lbw shout. Anyway, a fine turnaround with full marks to Root and another big tick for Taylor. The latter is certainly putting himself in serious contention for a WC team place.

A lot of the team names are starting to be inked in now. We still lack consistency but most individuals (well, those who are in for their playing ability - sorry!) have shown at times that they have what it takes.

My main concern remains Bopara. He just never does quite enough for my liking.

Much as I like Moeen and appreciate his all round worth, he could do with another big score before this series ends. If only to silence any doubts that might otherwise grow and to secure his spot.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 6:11 pm

Yes, it was all set up for Ravi to help guide it home, but he got stifled then got out, putting a bit of pressure back on at the end. Not convincing again, just about stays in the side for me though, due to lack of obvious alternatives factoring in his useful bowling option

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 8:24 pm

kingraf wrote:Two years without a century in ODI is hardly a drought of epic proportions. He averaged 35 last year, so he hasn't been woefully out of form, just hasn't quite been converting. By comparison... Hales List A average is roughly the same, slightly more, and his six ODI matches have not exactly been scene stealing performances.

He hasn't scored an ODI Century for two and a half, a century in international cricket for a year and a half, when does a slump in form stop being a slump in form but just the norm?

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Pal Joey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 9:03 pm

Can we please move on? Wink

I was unable to stay up for the finish but I saw Root and Taylor starting to take command of the bowling about 20 overs in. I must say the SL fielding looked pretty sluggish and ordinary. Not pretty to watch.

That was actually an important win for England given the circumstances. Not easy to regather things overnight and after the shaky start and some jitters towards the end, they managed to get there in the end. Makes the next couple of matches more interesting at 3-2 now.

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:36 pm

Why is Cook now a banned topic? I would say it has livened things up on here. The perceived repetitiveness is just argument and counter argument. Isn't that the definition of a debate and what these boards are for?

Maybe a separate thread to discuss it?

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Pal Joey on Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:58 pm

Who says it's a banned topic? It certainly is a sensitive one.

Feel free to start a new thread or perhaps dig up an old one and rekindle it?

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by VTR on Fri 12 Dec 2014, 12:20 am

Will do - just finishing off a poison pen letter to him though, so will have to do it tomorrow!

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Re: Eng in Lanka

Post by Pal Joey on Fri 12 Dec 2014, 1:08 am

VTR wrote:Will do - just finishing off a poison pen letter to him though, so will have to do it tomorrow!

Laugh

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