Most Underrated Manager?

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Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Shot 21 LCFC on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 1:08 am

When talking about the greatest managers in wrestling, the usual names get mentioned: Freddie Blassie, Bobby Heenan, Paul Heyman etc. But someone I never hear mentioned is Sherri Martel. This is s uprising really. Think about it: this girl managed Randy Savage, Shawn Michaels and Ric Flair. That's pretty impressive.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kay Fabe on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 1:59 am

Do you really consider Sherri underrated? Shes one of the true GOAT's, shes top 5 definitely and no other female could touch her


I'd say Sherri is very highly rated but its 2014, its been over 20 years since she was a prominent figure in the WWF, I'd hazard an educated guess and say if the number one pick here Bobby Heenan wasn't a conmentator during the time when  the WWF blew up big in the UK then he probably wouldn't be remembered quite as fondly either.


I think is just a generational thing but I'd be willing to bet good money that anyone who actually watched Sherri at the actual time or even those who watched far more than enough old tapes will rate her very very highly.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Shot 21 LCFC on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 2:42 am

I just hardly hear her mentioned as much as the rest.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by adamk on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 8:29 am

I always liked Mr Fuji... Managed Demolition, Powers of Pain, The Berzerker, The Orient Express, Crush, Owen Hart, British Bulldog and of course Yokozuna. Also managed such Legends like Cowboy Bob Orton, George "the animal" Steele, Kamala, Jim Neidhart and Sika (Roman Reigns Daddy).

I was too young to remember the older ones but remember the first lot I said.

I always boo'd him when he threw salt in peoples faces and was the first heel manager I remember.

Also remember asking my granddad what he was saying as I couldn't understand him as a nipper.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by westisbest on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 8:46 am

Yep Mr Fuji was class.

Loved Jimmy 'mouth of the south' Hart.

Slick might have been Underrated

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by liverbnz on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 10:50 am

Ric Flair? I think he did a great job for HHH during that bury everyone on the roster period he was going through.

As for Sherri, yeah I wouldn't say she was underrated - she was fantastic and a lot of people recognise that. JR mentions her quite often when speaking about Lana, in that she coould learn a lot from watching her footage - and I agree.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Mr H on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 11:16 am

So far this season I'd have to say Gary Monk at Swansea.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 1:12 pm

Is Vicky rated at the right level for everyone? I thought her best work came with Edge and then she pretty much did the same thing (very well) for the next 5 years or so. But she is perhaps considered more as a GM than a manager

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kay Fabe on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 2:16 pm

I thought Vickie was awful and added absolutely zero to the product, I used to skip her segments so for me personally she wasn't worth it at all, spot could have been taken by someone far more talented

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 6:22 pm

Vickie was a waste of space. The only good moment I remember her having was her exit

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Fri 05 Dec 2014, 9:23 pm

Oh please she drew more heat than any of the heel wrestlers at one point.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Samo on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 1:18 pm

She didnt draw the heat, she just got the heat because no one liked her. She didnt do anything to rile the crowd up other than just being there, thats not being a good heel.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by kingraf on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 1:22 pm

Yes it is
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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 3:31 pm

No it isnt. Most people were indifferent towards her, it wasnt enjoyable television. She put poor focus on her wrestlers and made them weaker by the style of character she was. Lana is entertaining, AJ as a valet was always perfect alongside her peers, Vickie had no skill and degraded a lot of angles

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 4:36 pm

Nonsense she was a GM not a manager as i said (she later became a manager hence why i asked if she was even mentionable). Therefore she was meant to be a heel character in her own right. She did a lot of good for the face wrestlers that went up against Edge like Hardy and Batitista. I completely disagree with you in short

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 4:39 pm

I completely disagree with you on her managerial capabilities and how the audience viewed her. She was not disliked as a heel manager as much as people disliked her being on their screens because of how poor she was. Like X-Pac heat

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Samo on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 5:01 pm

And X-Pac heat isnt real heat. She played the GM role well, I'll agree with that, but what did she do as a manager for Dolph Ziggler, Jack Swagger or god forbid Eric Escobar?

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 5:53 pm

The heat she drew as GM was genuine IMO, its a pantomine at the end of the day and she played a good villain abusing her power to help Edge. Just because you werent entertained by her heel work doesnt mean it was X-pac heat (X-pac heat is heat caused by indifference and boredom)

The crowd reactions were not that.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 6:36 pm

Thanks for explaining the term I used, and I think it generally was. Especially the older crowd, she was tiresome and a bit of a caricature. I find the kind of role she plays always draws all intensity out of a villain and ruins their threat as a single wrestler

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 7:29 pm

Ok no need to be snarky it has differing definitions based on who you speak to and some just use it to refer to lazily drawn heat, i was clarifying mine.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 8:20 pm

My apologies, I took it snarky too, damn internet and its lack of tone! I kinda think its both definitions in many ways, my theory on a heel isnt it shouldnt be someone who is just annoying but a character you distrust

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 8:50 pm

No worries, i dont really mind how a heel makes me dislike them as long as i do. I remember when Vickie kept giving Edge arbitrary title shots and doing everything to wreck the chances of his opponents as the GM and i properly hated her, i was in my mid-teens and much newer to the product back then.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by jai.roberts on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 9:36 pm

It's a late reply here .....

If Vickie was that awful and drew natural heat, the night she retired she got a chant oF "Thank You Vickie"

Everyone loved the heel character she played get over it

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 9:55 pm

Disagree that that shows anything. Nostalgia is big in wrestling, she was suddenly painted as a face to have her moment and was up against the head heel in The Authority and hate figure Stephanie. Good way of comparing their impact. Lana and Stephanie contrast perfectly with Vickie.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kay Fabe on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 10:25 pm

jai.roberts wrote:It's a late reply here .....

If Vickie was that awful and drew natural heat, the night she retired she got a chant oF "Thank You Vickie"

Everyone loved the heel character she played get over it
Everyone loved it? You kidding? What age are you?  About 5 years ago when this was happening forums were full of posters who wouldn't stop skipping her segments, not everyone respected her work,  most didn't like her, a good heel is meant to make you want to see them get their comeuppance,  not Vickie though, her character was awful.

as for the "Thank You Vickie" chants, Wrestling fans on the whole are a nostaligic bunch, she lost a lot through the business, I think she was entitled to a good send off given that she worked hard and what she lost, that doesn't mean she was a respected performer though!

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 06 Dec 2014, 10:33 pm

Fully agree with every single one of those sentiments. I respect her hard work and I respect that she has given a lot of herself to WWE, but I didn't think she was very good. I probably respect her as a person somewhat, but not her portfolio of work

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kid Vicious on Mon 08 Dec 2014, 11:25 am

This thread pretty much confirms that Vickie Guerrero is one underrated manager!

Going back to the old school, Sherri Martel was not underrated. As a female wrestler she got air time when the female matches were few and far between. She was a great heel manager, and one that generated little sympathy - tough to pull off as a female. You don't get thrown in with Savage and Michaels if you're underrated.

From that era I'd give it to Oliver Humperdink. He didn't last long in the WWF, and had to pull off playing a face manager during a period of future Hall of Fame heel managers; no easy task.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dr Gregory House MD on Mon 08 Dec 2014, 11:40 pm

Chris in 'I don't rate a Guerrero shocker'

I always thought Guerrero was a great heel manager back in her original run with Edge, she took crazy bumps for a middle aged female non wrestler from Taker and Rey Rey, she drew awesome heat (and IMHO X-Pac heat is a theory invented by smarks who can't admit that some heels get under their skin, poor or boring heels are met with silent indifference or funny chants, not deafening boos as Vickie was) as uninspiring as her stuff with Ziggler and Es(ssssss)cobar was she could only work with what she was given with and as a middle aged widow who got a sympathy job for WWE in lieu of them paying actual pensions to their 'independent contractors' she took the ball and ran with it.

Anyways that said, I think the death of the NWA and that unlike Heyman and Cornette they never really had a run in WWF, Gary Hart and J.J Dillon are very underrated in the fact they are very rarely mentioned, Hart in particular is one of my favourite promos.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Mr H on Tue 09 Dec 2014, 9:47 am

It's simple for me with Vickie.

Nobody really hated her, they just hated her annoying whiney voice. The only thing that drew boos from the crowds was the 'Excuse Me' line, other than that I don't think anyone really cared about the content of her promos.


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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kid Vicious on Tue 09 Dec 2014, 1:58 pm

Gary Hart is a great shout.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 09 Dec 2014, 6:51 pm

I don't think she enhanced anyone she worked with. Thus, not a great manager. And I agree with H and Kay Fabe.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Kay Fabe on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 12:26 am

Top Heels draw in crowds, if anyone thinks people bought tickets/PPV's to see Vickie get her comeuppance then they're living in cloud cuckoo land, thats the measure of a good heel, attracting fans/buy-rates, Vickie created apathy towards the product, thats not a good heel, her "Excuse Me" got majorly boo'ed but in my opinion thats because people used those opportunities to vent their displeasure at the spot she'd been given.

like I said previously, its all well looking at it with hindsight and saying she was a good heel but from what I remember from forums were fans either fast forwarded her segments or switched off altogether, thats not and never has been athe sign of a good heel.

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Ché Guerrero on Wed 10 Dec 2014, 11:58 pm

It was pretty hard to enhance Edge any further than he had got on his own, and that was her best work. Not necessarily her fault it came with someone already at the top Dolphin. I think the whole married to the GM thing really fitted in well with his Ultimate Opportunist gimmick.

Just wanna add that i really miss Edge Crying or Very sad

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 21 Dec 2014, 3:01 am

Yeah but do Tiffany rings sell PPVs?

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Re: Most Underrated Manager?

Post by TopoftheChops on Sun 21 Dec 2014, 8:07 pm

The most underrated manager was abraham Washington. "Look at titus o'neill, he's like kobe bryant in a hotel, he's unstoppable!"

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