England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

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England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 27 May 2015, 2:26 pm

First topic message reminder :

After an England win that for much of the first four days looked unlikely we move up to Leeds for round 2.

England have added Plunkett to the squad either as cover for Wood, who has a poor fitness record, or maybe because the senior seamers may be a touch tired. Very much doubt we will see any changes to the starting XI however. Selectors will be hoping that Adam Lyth can get some runs at his home ground as lord alone knows where they go next. Lyth and Ballance will both be hoping to be in the runs - and England need them to as you cannot keep losing 3 or 4 cheap top order wickets.

New Zealand have their own issues. Anderson and Watling have caused the physios some concern, Craig did not look like an internationalk spinner and with Anderson's issues the 3 main seamers were perhaps overbowled.


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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Fri 29 May 2015, 6:53 pm

Bucket Hands Flintoff
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Fri 29 May 2015, 6:55 pm

Ha . Your video won't play on my device. Will check it later...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Fri 29 May 2015, 6:57 pm

Craig trying to keep 'Afridi' off strike so that he wouldn't do anything silly before stumps!

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Fri 29 May 2015, 6:59 pm

End of a good spell from Broad. Wood to finish the work for the day.

England would love one more now.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:00 pm

GSC wrote:Bucket Hands Flintoff

Does seem to be a big help when slip catching. Remember walking past Kallis at the mall once, his girlfriend, who was maybe 5'7ish was holding his pinkie!!
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:00 pm

alfie wrote:End of a good spell from Broad.  Wood to finish the work for the day.

England would love one more now.

And there it is ! Caught Lyth ... Southee gone pulling.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:01 pm

Oh, Southee does it again!. This lad is incredibly stupid when he has a bat in hand!.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:05 pm

Southee has some talent with the bat, there is not enough application. Think they need to work on it a bit, there certainly is some ability....... Can't let be wasted like this.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:07 pm

msp83 wrote:Oh, Southee does it again!. This lad is incredibly stupid when he has a bat in hand!.

His batting has gone off badly . Played one terrific power hitting innings against England when he first came on the scene ; but not much recently.

Don't think NZ care at the moment...they just keep going at the ball at nearly five per over...at least if they can do the business with the ball they will have time to push for a result , so quickly have they moved the game along.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:16 pm

Looks like 300 in the (abbreviated) day. All action cricket.

If England respond in kind when they bat , this match may well not need the Tuesday - for which the weather forecast is disturbingly grim.

Not sure who will be winning it though. And after Lord's , I am reluctant to even make a guess...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:21 pm

Well, NZ will be happy enough. 300 in 60 odd overs.Now it's about making the ball talk... and talk quick.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:23 pm

That's the end of play on a really remarkable day!. New Zealand, being put in to bat and were 2-2, go to stumps at 297-8. They have really taken the game forward. As New Zealand survived the day and with almost 300 on the board, aren't too far behind, what would make England just a head is the assumptionthat tomorrow would be good weatherwise, and could be more of a batting day. When the overhead conditions do not favor swing, this could be a run-filled ground.......

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:26 pm

I think New Zealand will be marginally happier, seeing as how the conditions are most conductive to bowling. It was hardly orthodox, but they have clubbed themselves into a half-decent position - they might still reach 350.

England's still not grasping their chances perfectly. A couple more drops, and slight spells in the game where they seemed incapable to halt the flow of Kiwi runs.

The weather is predicted to clear up, somewhat. Should get a full day in tomorrow.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 29 May 2015, 7:58 pm

I didn't see much of the play but I would suspect both sides might be a tad disappointed. England for not taking all their chances and New Zealand for then not making the most of them.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Fri 29 May 2015, 8:08 pm

New Zealand certainly did fine today. Viewed in isolation, 2-2 to 297-8 on a rainy day is a remarkable recovery. But the issue is that the conditions may not offer as much for bowling tomorrow, so 297, or even for that matter 330-350 that New Zealand might get to in a best case scenario might not be good enough. With 1 up in the series, England needn't a frantic push tomorrow, they can take their time. So New Zealand have to take all the initiative. So for me, England slightly ahead, though New Zealand are pretty much in the running.......

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by KP_fan on Fri 29 May 2015, 8:55 pm

Short Summary: NZ's day
Cricket is the most non_absolute game where scorecard tells half story
Context is important..as is momentum
The fight, the aggression the counter-punching of Ronchi has swung momentum in NZ's favor so far.

Interesting to see how much more thelast two wickets can add......if they get to 330ish it would be a good score.

If Eng have to come in front they have to play positively like T1
Interesting game
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 29 May 2015, 10:16 pm

I'd say that's a pretty even day if you consider the conditions it was played under. England will be disappointed not to have them all out, New Zealand disappointed to give away a few wickets at the end of the day.

If NZ can edge there way towards 330-350 tomorrow morning they'll be slightly ahead on my scorecard
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by JDizzle on Fri 29 May 2015, 11:31 pm

Just catching up on the highlights, so tough to get the full picture, but seems Latham played very nicely and looks like a decent opener until he just lost the plot in the 70s/80s. Fatigue, physically and mentally, seemed to set in, but he is only in his 10th Test Match. Serious problems against spin though.

Wasn't overly impressed with Ronchi tbh. As I said, it is tough to get a decent impression from highlights and there is no doubting his 80 was important in the game but it seemed very airy and he gave plenty of chances. Allied to the fact he seemed to struggle when you didn't bowl in his arc for him to free the arms, I think teams will work him out fairly quickly.

Hard to comment on England's bowling when you are only seeing fours and wickets, but would concur with the feeling that England's bowling balance isn't quite right. Anderson looked to be the only one who Cook could rely to bring control, and you can have all the attacking bowlers in the world but you still need someone who can dry up runs. Michael Clarke has a devastating pace attack, yet he still loves to use Watson going at 1 an over to bore teams out.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:10 am

Another excellent day of Test Cricket - fans who braved the elements got their money's worth despite the late start and interruptions.

Whose day ? Hard to say : I don't really think it was a pitch on which England sent them in expecting to roll them for 150 ; more one of those "let us take advantage of early swinging conditions , try and dismiss them a bit under par , and then bat when it's easier on days two and three" . So eight wickets , on an abbreviated day , is probably about what they hoped/expected. However I don't think they were looking to concede 297 in getting them !
Of course the scoring rate really only redresses the loss of the morning session (and I guess also ensures the NZ tailenders don't have a new ball to worry about in the morning) so the final score is nothing unusual ; all depends on how England are able to respond with the bat.
I suspect this is actually a very good cricket pitch - something there for the bowlers to exploit , but also pretty good for stroke play. So it may be "par" is in the 300-350 range ; which makes it an even day , I suppose.
There is a tendency to judge the situation in the light of the toss winner's choice to bowl first ; but it is actually quite irrelevant . 300 is 300 whichever way the coin came down.

Vaughan suggests better bowling might have seen NZ all out 180 . I think he's overstating it a bit , and also failing to give due credit to the NZ bats - who counterattacked very boldly. England won't be happy about some rather loose bowling later in each session , or about dropping three very catchable chances - which actually didn't cost much , but could have. Think they'd have hoped to be chasing 250 or so , instead of the 300 plus they're looking at now.
In the absence of Craig and his route map , I'd suggest England would like to wrap up this tail quickly and aim to reach parity by the close with several wickets in hand so that they can build a lead on Sunday. NZ of course will want Boult to strike early and hope they can keep their foot on the England middle order this time...

Weather set fair , I understand ? So it should be another fascinating day. I do fancy a result here , unless the rain returns with a vengeance.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:27 am

Individually , Latham was impressive , until he tired and really struggled late in the day , surviving several chances before being put out of his misery. McCullum was quite crazy as usual ( I know he "plays that way" ; but can he not be a little circumspect at times ? )
And Ronchi was quite a revelation ; bit lucky early , but really played well when he got into his stride , and it was a surprise when he got out. Lot of keepers to choose from , NZ !

Anderson was excellent early , and controlled and slightly unlucky later. Wasn't overbowled by Cook , I'm pleased to see - they may need him fresh for the second innings later. And I thought Stokes was more consistent today , if less spectacular.
The other bowlers were all a bit generous , although Broad took three wickets and Moeen might easily have had the same with a bit of luck. (He bowls far too many bad balls ; but he does induce errors , even when not bowling consistently , and I think England are right to persevere with him)
Wood was disappointing , for mine , after his strong debut. Bit flat and not too accurate early on , when the ball was doing plenty ; too loose later on. But he produced a cracker to get Watling , and reined in the scoring later in his spell , so I'm not too critical of a man in his second Test. He has something.

Major "fail" for the day has to be Jimmy Anderson's haircut Smile

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Gooseberry on Sat 30 May 2015, 7:32 am

Broad needs to curb has aggression and go back to bowling 80mph, Wood is too inconsistent, Ali relies on the opposition getting themselves out and Cook needs a third man except when he as one. Bring back Tredwell. Obviously when we said England nee to be more aggressive what we meant was we need a different reason to slate them because its getting boring calling them boring.

Does that sum it up?

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by LondonTiger on Sat 30 May 2015, 9:51 am

This may sound odd, but I reckon NZ in the end won the day, but England are in the better position.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 10:02 am

alfie wrote:

There is a tendency to judge the situation in the light of the toss winner's choice to bowl first ; but it is actually quite irrelevant . 300 is 300 whichever way the coin came down.
...

You're a wise owl, Alfie - and I don't mean you eat field mice and can swivel your head around![Been waiting to use that line.] Wink

Looking at your score at the end of the first day in the light of whether you won or lost the toss, almost certainly affects your feeling of satisfaction (eg, ''not too bad'', ''we pretty much got away with it'', ''we didn't take proper advantage'') but not ultimately the outcome. I'm assuming here morale isn't overly affected.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 10:23 am

alfie wrote:

... Wood was disappointing , for mine , after his strong debut. Bit flat and not too accurate early on , when the ball was doing plenty ; too loose later on. But he produced a cracker to get Watling , and reined in the scoring later in his spell , so I'm not too critical of a man in his second Test.  He has something.

...

Alfie - yes, and he now also has two wickets. Despite my user name, I was more of a bowler. The benchmark for me was always a couple of wickets each innings. Only one and I was disappointed, none and very so. However, two gave me a decent feeling of satisfaction and I generally bowled better if and when I had a couple to my name. I think there's a tendency for that to apply at all levels of the game and I would guess so as well for someone in only their second Test. Wood currently has figures of 2/62. That's fine and respectable. All the difference in the world to a bowler between that and 1/62. Assuming he has a bowl today, I wouldn't be surprised to see him get a third.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 10:28 am

alfie wrote: ...

In the absence of Craig and his route map , I'd suggest England would like to wrap up this tail quickly and aim to reach parity by the close with several wickets in hand so that they can build a lead on Sunday.  NZ of course will want Boult to strike early and hope they can keep their foot on the England middle order this time...

Laugh clap

And agree with the rest.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:17 am

Broad one wicket away from the worst five for in history
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:32 am

So 350 up for New Zealand!

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:33 am

England will have Boult on strike for the fresh over though.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:34 am

And duely holds out, and Broad gets 5!.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:35 am

That is some of the worst bowling i've ever seen, why is it we always ignore line and length the moment somebody starts attacking, this isn't one day cricket so don't bowl that way.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 12:09 pm

Not much happening for the NZ bowlers, and Cook and Lyth have made a comfortable enough start.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 12:43 pm

Reasonable opening for the England pair. Get the sense that if they can see off the new ball, should be free to cash in. Not much depth in the NZ attack and very little assistance from the pitch
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 1:06 pm

54-0 at lunch. Very good opening for NZ, followed by an equally good finish for England. Little happening at the moment.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 1:40 pm

Didn't see much of that. Watching my local (AFL ) team record a good win. Go Tigers !

But I see NZ prospered this morning with some free hitting tailenders getting them a handy extra fifty runs : one question ; why didn't Anderson bowl ?
Broad seems to getting some flak for his economy rate . He was expensive , true - partly from too many short balls but also partly from pure NZ aggression , which they largely got away with ; but not always , hence the five wickets. Sometimes it just happens that way ; I see Dale Steyn once returned a similar economy rate taking five...

Cook and Lyth a careful opening response ; they looked pretty secure the last twenty minutes anyway. Need to start again after lunch ; but with conditions looking good or batting they have a chance to set things up for England.

This is an important innings for Lyth.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 1:55 pm

On another day New Zealand could and should have been out for less than 200 batting the way they did, can't be ignored that they couldn't have rode their luck any more than they did.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Nakatomi Plaza on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:15 pm

Beautiful drive for four means Alistair Cook is now England's leading test match run scorer.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Gooseberry on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:16 pm

Selfish innings. Might be the all time top run scorer for England but how many triple centuries has he scored against Leicestershire? Drop Cook, Bell to open.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:18 pm

Marvellous. Love you skipper. clap

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:26 pm

Cook passing Gooch with a classic cover drive clap

So both the record holders for England have milestones in this match. Cook will never excite the fans like ...well , you know  Smile ...but he has been a wonderful player for England , in his way.  His record as an opener stands comparison with any England opener since Hutton ; and he deserves this record.

Not that the skipper will be too carried away , I think.  He will want to do a lot more batting here.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:33 pm

Yes, very well done to Cook. Achieved in a quiet, understated way.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:35 pm

alfie wrote:

This is an important innings for Lyth.

Yes again. A half century here should be enough to get Lyth the first two Ashes Tests.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:53 pm

Fifty for Lyth; this boy's a keeper, yeah?

And a hundred partnership as well. The prospect of rain seems to be lessening considerably, over the course of the Test, so we can be somewhat optimistic of actually getting a result.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 2:59 pm

Duty - not aware of him keeping - but, if you've put money on it, I'm sure you'll be right! Wink

Anyway, good runs (they all are for a batsman) and an encouraging partnership with the skipper.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:01 pm

Good fifty Lyth. clap

A relief for him : I'd been a little concerned as he'd become stuck on 47 for so long , and appeared to be getting a bit twitchy ; missing out on some "pies".  Brave pull in the end to reach the milestone.

Early yet : this time last year Robson made a hundred ; but that led nowhere.  I do like the look of this fellow more , I confess.  We will know better when he comes up against Harris and Johnson  - not that Boult and co are mugs !

He looks to have a good pair of hands in the field too. And I hear he bowls a bit of spin ? Not sure how seriously.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:04 pm

guildfordbat wrote:Duty - not aware of him keeping - but, if you've put money on it, I'm sure you'll be right! Wink

Anyway, good runs (they all are for a batsman) and an encouraging partnership with the skipper.

Laugh

Though how many encouraging partnerships did Compton/Carberry/Root/Robson all have with Cook, before being jettisoned? We can hope for some measure of consistency this time.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:10 pm

Fifty for Chef ! Bit of a flash over slips but he'll take it...

After his dry run ended last year against India , the skipper has been a model of consistency. And getting him out of the ODI setup seems to have him playing much more soundly these days.

I've thought Henry has looked the most dangerous bowler this afternoon , though he went for a few that over. Trouble for NZ is the lack of a fifth bowler ; which might start to tell as this innings progresses. The three main quicks may be in for a lot of work...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:16 pm

So Alastair Cook has become the highest test run maker for England. Good for him, and congratulations. But why do people think it necessary that they have to knock Kevin Pietersen to highlight Cook's achievement? Knock him all you want, but the fact remains that he's one of the very best English batsmen of modern times, and one of the most exciting batsman of his era. All the runs that Cook or anyone else score, cannot take anything away from Pietersen's achievements as a batsman.
Has the ECB appointed moderator taken charge??!

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:18 pm

Craig bowled much better so far, than he managed in the first test, still New Zealand might miss the additional bowler.......

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:19 pm

There's a thread for discussing a complete irrelevance like Pietersen.

No one has brought him up on this thread for a while.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:20 pm

A valuable innings from Lyth. Thanks to Jonathan Trott sparing the selectors and the team management another stupid decision, he got a chance and after a poor first test, he's showing good signs.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

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