England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

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England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 27 May 2015, 2:26 pm

First topic message reminder :

After an England win that for much of the first four days looked unlikely we move up to Leeds for round 2.

England have added Plunkett to the squad either as cover for Wood, who has a poor fitness record, or maybe because the senior seamers may be a touch tired. Very much doubt we will see any changes to the starting XI however. Selectors will be hoping that Adam Lyth can get some runs at his home ground as lord alone knows where they go next. Lyth and Ballance will both be hoping to be in the runs - and England need them to as you cannot keep losing 3 or 4 cheap top order wickets.

New Zealand have their own issues. Anderson and Watling have caused the physios some concern, Craig did not look like an internationalk spinner and with Anderson's issues the 3 main seamers were perhaps overbowled.


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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:21 pm

Don't go jumping the gun there Duty, Compton did at one stage hit back to back centuries against New Zealand before getting ditched so this one innings thus far doesn't mean a thing. There were no encouraging partnerships due in part to Cooks poor form, context is mightily important.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:21 pm

msp83 wrote:So Alastair Cook has become the highest test run maker for England. Good for him, and congratulations. But why do people think it necessary that they have to knock Kevin Pietersen to highlight Cook's achievement? Knock him all you want, but the fact remains that he's one of the very best English batsmen of modern times, and one of the most exciting batsman of his era. All the runs that Cook or anyone else score, cannot take anything away from Pietersen's achievements as a batsman.
Has the ECB appointed moderator taken charge??!

???

Has anyone been knocking Pietersen in the aftermath of Cook's milestone ? Not on here , that I've seen. True I haven't looked at Cricinfo or BBC live yet...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:25 pm

I do like the way Lyth has opened up a bit since reaching 50.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:27 pm

Must say Craig is doing a far better job of keeping the runs down than Moeen managed yesterday.
Of course he isn't bowling to the hitters of the England lineup ; but he is still doing a good job for his skipper. Even Cook getting a bit frustrated just then , played a couple of uncharacteristic shots - unsuccessfully.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by LondonTiger on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:27 pm

Highest opening partnership by England at home since Cook and Strauss put on 186 against India in 2011

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:31 pm

The game is very much running away from New Zealand here. They need some moments of inspiration.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:34 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Don't go jumping the gun there Duty, Compton did at one stage hit back to back centuries against New Zealand before getting ditched so this one innings thus far doesn't mean a thing. There were no encouraging partnerships due in part to Cooks poor form, context is mightily important.

Take your point , Hammers ...but it isn't really the runs - although he needed them , to set a marker - but the way he has made them.

Just looks a much more fluent player than , say , Compton. (Who I do agree got a bit of a rough deal from the selectors. But he was a "limited" player. And his style didn't really complement Cook's , so he was , rather harshly , discarded before an Ashes Series)

Lyth will certainly have the chance to show what he can do against the Aussies ; which won't be easy !

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:40 pm

I agree completely Alfie, he looks a far better player than Compton who was the wrong option from the start and has a good variation of shots which is good to see. Carberry should have been the first man given a chance but was messed around in all forms of the game, by the time he got his chance it had the feel of a last resort.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:40 pm

The New Zealand bowling floundered throughout the series ones the ball lost newness. Tim Soutee has been particularly disappointing, and that has made one of the best opening bowling combinations of these times rather weak. Boult has had his moments, but he too has not quite been at his best. England, the way they are going, would be not too far away from the NZ total by stumps today, and then they would look to bat only ones in the match........ Is the whether expected to be as bad as it was predicted to be earlier?

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 3:51 pm

Perfect session. Run rate picking up; new ball another couple of hours away.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:23 pm

When Cook is leaving well, then that's the clearest sign that he's in for the long stay....... Its the leave that is his shot of assurance

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:26 pm

Lyth into the 90s.......

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:34 pm

alfie wrote:
msp83 wrote:So Alastair Cook has become the highest test run maker for England. Good for him, and congratulations. But why do people think it necessary that they have to knock Kevin Pietersen to highlight Cook's achievement? Knock him all you want, but the fact remains that he's one of the very best English batsmen of modern times, and one of the most exciting batsman of his era. All the runs that Cook or anyone else score, cannot take anything away from Pietersen's achievements as a batsman.
Has the ECB appointed moderator taken charge??!

???

Has anyone been knocking Pietersen in the aftermath of Cook's milestone ?  Not on here , that I've seen. True I haven't looked at Cricinfo or BBC live yet...

Alfie - there was a cheap and unnecessary reference by Gooseberry in his post on this thread at 2:16pm (UK time).

All - for those who wish to comment on Pietersen, let's use the ''Overflow'' thread as I've done today.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:35 pm

Thought that looked out in real time, surprised not given on field. Good and valuable innings.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:41 pm

Alfie and all - a few minutes ago, Lyth survived playing / kicking the ball onto his stumps when the bails didn't come off. In fact, they didn't seem to budge at all. This seems to happen more now in Tests that it did in the past and also more now than it still does today in the County Championship (Surrey's Rory Burns was out this way in the week).

Do you think this is anything to do with microphones making the stumps used in Tests heavier?

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:44 pm

guildfordbat wrote:Thought that looked out in real time, surprised not given on field. Good and valuable innings.

Yeah I thought that too. Even more surprised NZ took a while to decide to review it. They really needed that wicket !

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:45 pm

guildfordbat wrote:Alfie and all - a few minutes ago, Lyth survived playing / kicking the ball onto his stumps when the bails didn't come off. In fact, they didn't seem to budge at all. This seems to happen more now in Tests that it did in the past and also more now than it still does today in the County Championship (Surrey's Rory Burns was out this way in the week).

Do you think this is anything to do with microphones making the stumps used in Tests heavier?

I have wondered that myself. Suppose the camera must anchor the middle stump somewhat ? Not sure what they weigh...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:45 pm

Perhaps crucially, they've given the middle order a platform to accelerate today.

Ballance could use a score
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:52 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
alfie wrote:
msp83 wrote:So Alastair Cook has become the highest test run maker for England. Good for him, and congratulations. But why do people think it necessary that they have to knock Kevin Pietersen to highlight Cook's achievement? Knock him all you want, but the fact remains that he's one of the very best English batsmen of modern times, and one of the most exciting batsman of his era. All the runs that Cook or anyone else score, cannot take anything away from Pietersen's achievements as a batsman.
Has the ECB appointed moderator taken charge??!

???

Has anyone been knocking Pietersen in the aftermath of Cook's milestone ?  Not on here , that I've seen. True I haven't looked at Cricinfo or BBC live yet...

Alfie - there was a cheap and unnecessary reference by Gooseberry in his post on this thread at 2:16pm (UK time).

All - for those who wish to comment on Pietersen, let's use the ''Overflow'' thread as I've done today.

Ah yes : I saw that . Goseberry can speak for himself I guess ; but I took that more as a comment on the way a lot of people ( not necessarily on here ) have been quite critical of Cook - apparently in the belief that he is keeping KP out of the team - to the point where some have openly stated they'd sooner see the back of Cook.
I didn't see it as a "dig " . Perhaps I'm being a bit innocent here...

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 4:54 pm

NZ sensing blood here, Lyth approaching a maiden 100, Ballance new in and not in great nick.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:02 pm

That wicket has changed the mood ...suddenly runs are dried up and formerly harmless bowling has an air of menace.

It is almost never done - at this level - but I've often pondered the question of whether to promote a free scoring type (a Root , or even a Stokes ) over a defensive by nature number three , in a situation where the openers have had a really big partnership. Not often you would do it , for several reasons , but looking at what is happening here I wonder if this is one time where it might have been worth trying - to keep the momentum going.

Never mind. If Ballance gets set he will doubtless do his job and the bowlers will be that much more weary when the hitters get in. Was just an idle thought.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:03 pm

From Englands perspective, they have little reason to force the issue. NZ had to go after England because they have to win what will likely be a rain shortened game.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by LondonTiger on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:06 pm

Somehow Lyth avoids being the 3rd English batsmen to be out in the 90s this series.

Well done lad.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:06 pm

Lyth goes to his maiden century, his place secured for the summer then.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:08 pm

That wicket has changed the mood ...suddenly runs are dried up and formerly harmless bowling has an air of menace.

It is almost never done - at this level - but I've often pondered the question of whether to promote a free scoring type (a Root , or even a Stokes ) over a defensive by nature number three , in a situation where the openers have had a really big partnership. Not often you would do it , for several reasons , but looking at what is happening here I wonder if this is one time where it might have been worth trying - to keep the momentum going.

Never mind. If Ballance gets set he will doubtless do his job and the bowlers will be that much more weary when the hitters get in. Was just an idle thought.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:11 pm

That wicket has changed the mood ...suddenly runs are dried up and formerly harmless bowling has an air of menace.

It is almost never done - at this level - but I've often pondered the question of whether to promote a free scoring type (a Root , or even a Stokes ) over a defensive by nature number three , in a situation where the openers have had a really big partnership. Not often you would do it , for several reasons , but looking at what is happening here I wonder if this is one time where it might have been worth trying - to keep the momentum going.

Never mind. If Ballance gets set he will doubtless do his job and the bowlers will be that much more weary when the hitters get in. Was just an idle thought.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by banyun on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:14 pm

Fantastic by Lyth. Lucky in the 90s but there are very few hundreds without luck. Should buy him at least 1 test before people talk about dropping him.

There really is no pleasing some people. 200 for 1, looking to make a huge first innings score with ages left in the game and people on the BBC are complaining about the run rate.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:20 pm

My Internet is going crazy...apologies for multiple posting ; all I've been trying to do is get back to read the thread !

Well done Lyth on his maiden hundred. clap

Had some luck with the fielder going the wrong way ; but good luck he deserved for his fine batting today. In front of his home crowd too ; good show.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:29 pm

alfie wrote:My Internet is going crazy...apologies for multiple posting ; all I've been trying to do is get back to read the thread !

Well done Lyth on his maiden hundred. clap

Had some luck with the fielder going the wrong way ; but good luck he deserved for his fine batting today.  In front of his home crowd too ; good show.

No problem, Alfie, although I'm still trying to work out how you appeared to resubmit the same post in GSC's name!!

Very well done to Lyth. Runs dried up for a while but he stayed there and finally they came.

Looking good for England. Switched over now to the FA Cup Final. Cheers for a bit.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by GSC on Sat 30 May 2015, 5:40 pm

Lyth ran out for 107
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Duty281 on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:22 pm

Oof England crumbling. But that is not half as horrendous as some of the comments streaming in on the BBC live text.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:25 pm

Young Joe has failed, for ones. Was looking forward to the innings becoming full of life, just automatically happens when he's out there. Got a real ripper from Southee, did Root. With their rock gone, how would England respond?

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:28 pm

Just about 3 overs remaining in the days play, England would want to go back in without any further damage. NZ would dearly love another wicket.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:31 pm

Southee produced an absolute ripper to get Root, but he's otherswise continuing to be rather poor, either not making the batsman play enough, or a few too many towards the legs....... Boult is bowling pretty well with the new ball, but no support from his senior partner.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:34 pm

Boult gets stokes and we're in a spot of bother now

Boult really is a wonderful bowler
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 30 May 2015, 6:45 pm

Happy we didn't put a night watchman in
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by msp83 on Sat 30 May 2015, 7:24 pm

Olly wrote:Happy we didn't put a night watchman in
That was the extent of England's positivity today though.
They were going along nicely up to tea, then the innings stagnated and lost momentum. Then Lyth got run-out, and New Zealand pushed the door further open with the new ball and did some significant damage by getting England's best batsman in the present side in Root, and then Stokes who could have quickly taken the game away from them. England by no means are out of it, but New Zealand can claim to have edged the day just about. Had England scored another 30 or so runs with only 5 down, it would have been different. Now NZ have a newish ball, and an England lineup under a bit of pressure.
But England do bat deep and that depth did come handy in the last game. Bell's still there and he's due a score, Buttler is there and if he gets going, the 95 run advantage that NZ currently have can quickly become history, and if Ali manages to get through his starting troubles and get in, then he also usually scores quickly. England can still hope of getting a decent first innings lead, but NZ are just ahead in the game at the moment, say 52-48.......

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by KP_fan on Sat 30 May 2015, 10:26 pm

At best an even day...although NZ once again finished with momentum on their side.

Twice Eng has let NZ back in the game.......letting them get 100 runs more at least with the bat.....and now collapsing in a heap.

Eng still has Bell, Butler and Ali who can bat...so you'd expect them to match NZ's score.

and so its most likely to be a single innings shoot-out....
Gut feeling......NZ will win...because they have played positively.....while Cook's played contentedly...which amounts to defensive.
PS*
Cook becomes the highest scorer....good effort.....sheen taken off..because the fair contender to that credit has been unfairly debarred Wink

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:52 pm

Well done to Alastair. Didn't catch any of the day's play, but I'm pleased Alastair got a money off his back, although I'm sure it wasn't a particularly large one, really. He's only 31, given England's schedule, you'd think he has a real shot at ending the game as the leading run scorer in test cricket. Top five English cricket test batsman of all time, and it would be mighty close between him, KP and Boycott for the top nod. Hammond too possibly, given his extraordinary record.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 30 May 2015, 11:59 pm

He's some way behind Barrington, Hammond and Hutton at the moment, in fact he always will be, like Bradman is on the world stage those three are untouchable in England.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:18 am

I'm gonna be honest here. While I don't negatively, mark down Hammond and Co, I'm not convinced about their claims. Fine batsmen they may have been, but the quality of opposition just wasn't there. Pakistan, India and to a large degree in the time of Hammond, South Africa were no where near the powerhouses they would go on to be at various intervals after their time. This isn't meant to be a criticism of the men, or a "cricket sucked before colour TV" type scenario, but a reasonable statement of fact. Even the Windies were only sporadically a producer of good players, and even more sporadically a good team.

I feel the same way about Bradman, but the sheer volume and weight of his numbers make a convincing argument. Can't be bothered about Graeme Pollock either. It's great to average 61, but when not one run came against subcontinent teams, or the Windies... Different scenarios, of course. Hammond et al, had developing countries to feast on, Pollock was denied by a racist cricket board. But the closing argument is the same. Pinch of salt.
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:20 am

Just shows why predicting this game is so tricky. When Cook and Lyth were going strong you'd have thought England were heading for a monster score ...but a careless run out and some good new ball work from NZ (which I missed - had turned in for the night/morning) but must have been good bowling , has put the game back in the melting pot.
Slightly bemused by comments re England being defensive and NZ "positive" . The English openers played quite reasonably - neither are dashes by nature - to set the team up ; and NZ , unlike at Lord's , actually became quite defensive in their field placings and resorted to "dry" bowling for a time - perfectly sensibly ! And of course they have now attacked again with the new ball ...All good cricket , but let us not trot out that tired old cliche about boring England every time Stokes doesn't hit a run a ball hundred. Ballance at three isn't ideal in the situation that prevailed , and the fact that he has hit a flat spot of form isn't helping. But really , they've done exactly what many suggested NZ should have done at Lords ; play to try and build a big score and bat once : that it hasn't worked is down to good NZ bowling.
So where does it leave the game ? Well clearly NZ have roared back into it with the late wickets ; not least because removing Root and Stokes has thwarted England's obvious hopes of attacking weary bowlers after a hour of so on the Sunday with their best stroke makers at the crease. Will now be up to Bell , Buttler and Ali to get the score moving again - and with a still new ball first up this won't be easy.
Long time left in this match (weather allowing) . Still quite possible either for NZ to hold an actual lead - or for England to get back on top and march well past the visitors' total. And with the pitch giving just enough aid to the bowlers that batsmen are never totally secure , anything could happen in the respective second innings.
Incidentally : I see a couple of comments approving England's choice not to use a night watchman. Not so sure . You can argue either way ; but I'd have thought this might have been a time when protecting Stokes from the last few overs of the day was a reasonable aim ? Not a hindsight opinion either ; when I went to bed I was wondering at what point England might have Mark Wood padded up , given there was going to be a short spell with the new ball late in the day. There is positivity , and there is reasonable caution. Neither is necessarily wrong.
Let us hope the weather permits this highly entertaining series to continue to...entertain.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:26 am

kingraf wrote:Well done to Alastair. Didn't catch any of the day's play, but I'm pleased Alastair got a money off his back, although I'm sure it wasn't a particularly large one, really. He's only 31, given England's schedule, you'd think he has a real shot at ending the game as the leading run scorer in test cricket. Top five English cricket test batsman of all time, and it would be mighty close between him, KP and Boycott for the top nod. Hammond too possibly, given his extraordinary record.

Ahem ...Hobbs ; Hutton ; Barrington ... there have been a few before the "modern" era , young raf Smile

Cook will put the run scoring record on ice for a while ; but as he says himself , there have been better players.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:29 am

I actually don't disagree with any of that Raf but suggesting Bradman is anything other than one of the greatest sportsmen of all time is seen as the highest level of blasphemy. For me Kallis and Sobers stand head and shoulders above the rest including Bradman, Tendulkar isn't in the argument. give me Sanga, Lara or Richards any day.

Not meaning to digress too much but whilst Bradman is universally (all of about two countries) accepted as the number one then the English trio will be seen likewise as wrong as it is.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:34 am

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I actually don't disagree with any of that Raf but suggesting Bradman is anything other than one of the greatest sportsmen of all time is seen as the highest level of blasphemy. For me Kallis and Sobers stand head and shoulders above the rest including Bradman, Tendulkar isn't in the argument. give me Sanga, Lara or Richards any day.

Not meaning to digress too much but whilst Bradman is universally (all of about two countries) accepted as the number one then the English trio will be seen likewise as wrong as it is.

Given how far we disagree on boxing. It's a little uncomfortable how in sync our cricket is!!
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by alfie on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:37 am

kingraf wrote:I'm gonna be honest here. While I don't negatively, mark down Hammond and Co, I'm not convinced about their claims. Fine batsmen they may have been, but the quality of opposition just wasn't there. Pakistan, India and to a large degree in the time of Hammond, South Africa were no where near the powerhouses they would go on to be at various intervals after their time. This isn't meant to be a criticism of the men, or a "cricket sucked before colour TV" type scenario, but a reasonable statement of fact. Even the Windies were only sporadically a producer of good players, and even more sporadically a good team.

I feel the same way about Bradman, but the sheer volume and weight of his numbers make a convincing argument. Can't be bothered about Graeme Pollock either. It's great to average 61, but when not one run came against subcontinent teams, or the Windies... Different scenarios, of course. Hammond et al, had developing countries to feast on, Pollock was denied by a racist cricket board. But the closing argument is the same. Pinch of salt.

Ah...hadn't seen this when I replied before.  Yes , I see your argument (though not quite why you count Boycott but not , say , Gooch) . Of course comparison between eras is always flawed.  But my own take is that great sportsmen are the product of their times ; and tht the qualities that made them excel would serve to do the same if they were magically transported to the future...
As you say ; pinch of salt.  Makes for fun talking point though Smile

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:46 am

kingraf wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:I actually don't disagree with any of that Raf but suggesting Bradman is anything other than one of the greatest sportsmen of all time is seen as the highest level of blasphemy. For me Kallis and Sobers stand head and shoulders above the rest including Bradman, Tendulkar isn't in the argument. give me Sanga, Lara or Richards any day.

Not meaning to digress too much but whilst Bradman is universally (all of about two countries) accepted as the number one then the English trio will be seen likewise as wrong as it is.

Given how far we disagree on boxing. It's a little uncomfortable how in sync our cricket is!!

I was a far better cricketer than I was boxer, did once upon a time clean bowl a double hundred making test player.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:47 am

alfie wrote:
kingraf wrote:Well done to Alastair. Didn't catch any of the day's play, but I'm pleased Alastair got a money off his back, although I'm sure it wasn't a particularly large one, really. He's only 31, given England's schedule, you'd think he has a real shot at ending the game as the leading run scorer in test cricket. Top five English cricket test batsman of all time, and it would be mighty close between him, KP and Boycott for the top nod. Hammond too possibly, given his extraordinary record.

Ahem ...Hobbs ; Hutton ; Barrington ... there have been a few before the "modern" era , young raf Smile

Cook will put the run scoring record on ice for a while ; but as he says himself , there have been better players.

Possibly better, but I rate Cook as the greater. Combination of added longevity, and the factors I articulated earlier. More reasonable teams you have to face, more chance of you slipping up somewhere. If Warne only faced England and Pakistan, with a few tests sprinkled in against Zimbabwe types, and no India. A remarkable career moves up a notch to disturbingly stratospheric numbers. If I'm honest it's part of the reason I can't understand the reluctance to not allow more test playing nations. Everyone adds something which players can't no matter how hard they try, overcome. It's fantastic progress. And renders the likelihood of another Bradman all but impossible.

I digress though moving away from the test match at this rate
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by kingraf on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:50 am

Hammersmith harrier wrote:
kingraf wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:I actually don't disagree with any of that Raf but suggesting Bradman is anything other than one of the greatest sportsmen of all time is seen as the highest level of blasphemy. For me Kallis and Sobers stand head and shoulders above the rest including Bradman, Tendulkar isn't in the argument. give me Sanga, Lara or Richards any day.

Not meaning to digress too much but whilst Bradman is universally (all of about two countries) accepted as the number one then the English trio will be seen likewise as wrong as it is.

Given how far we disagree on boxing. It's a little uncomfortable how in sync our cricket is!!

I was a far better cricketer than I was boxer, did once upon a time clean bowl a double hundred making test player.

Much the same here. Although my cricketing anecdote is more about how Morne Morkel basically "Brian Closed" me. Can be a vicious old I am a twonk of the highest order our Morne
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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 31 May 2015, 12:51 am

My anecdote is less impressive when you know where I live and the identity of said batsmen becomes obvious.

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Re: England v New Zealand, Headingley 29th May to 2nd June

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