England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

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England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by The Loaded Dog on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 10:41 am

First topic message reminder :

England:
A Lyth, AN Cook*, IR Bell, JE Root, JM Bairstow, BA Stokes, JC Buttler†, MM Ali, SCJ Broad, JM Anderson, ST Finn

Australia:
CJL Rogers, DA Warner, SPD Smith, MJ Clarke*, AC Voges, MR Marsh, PM Nevill†, MG Johnson, MA Starc, JR Hazlewood, NM Lyon
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:12 pm

Can everyone agree England are ahead now?!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by liverbnz on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:15 pm

Still pretty even I reckon given England's top order.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:17 pm

Anderson has been terrific today. And I won't mention Olly suggested he perhaps ought to have been "rested" devil

Pleased to see the rain didn't last too long.

Need Broad to get in on the act now and clean up this tail...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Soldier_Of_Fortune on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:20 pm

Olly wrote: Still think Australia are in this......

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:20 pm

liverbnz wrote:Still pretty even I reckon given England's top order.

Doesn't really affect the "now". Certainly Australia might hit back later - they have some handy bowlers ! But at the moment , England are clearly on top.

What happens later ...who knows ? Still need three more anyway.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:22 pm

liverbnz wrote:Still pretty even I reckon given England's top order.

I fully expect us to be 30-3 as usual, but I reckon we can eke out 250 which could be a big lead at this rate

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:27 pm

Eight gone now. And that was Rogers ...great chance to have Australia out cheaply now.
Yes England will still have to do it with the bat : but I'm not sure this is a 110/8 pitch.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:29 pm

Rogers out but what a record hes had .... 9 50+ scores in the last 11 and one of those was 49 retired hurt.

Hes become incredibly consitent at the top for Australia, even in testing conditions. Big wicket for England and it surely means that if it stays dry england themsleves will be two down by the end of the day .

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by liverbnz on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:29 pm

alfie wrote:
liverbnz wrote:Still pretty even I reckon given England's top order.

Doesn't really affect the "now".   Certainly Australia might hit back later - they have some handy bowlers !  But at the moment , England are clearly on top.

What happens later ...who knows ?  Still need three more anyway.

England are on top indeed. I was being sarcastic but my emoiticon mustn't have worked Smile

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:34 pm

alfie wrote:Eight gone now.  And that was Rogers ...great chance to have Australia out cheaply now.
Yes England will still have to do it with the bat : but I'm not sure this is a 110/8 pitch.

As suspected there was a bit of "damn if you do damned if you dont" when it came to batting first. Bit of damp, bit of grass, bit of cloud ...proper english cricket conditions and one that (hopefully) suits Andersons craft better than the Aussie bully boys. The wickets havent come from short balls.
It may get easier for a while for the team batting second, but still , especially the way things have gone this series batting first is always a thing.


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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Hoggy_Bear on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:35 pm

England need another wicket quickly.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by msp83 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:36 pm

At 119-9, the end is near for Australia. As I said, all down to Johnson....... They would be hoping he'll be able to blast through England and turn this into a 1 innings contest.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:37 pm

liverbnz wrote:
alfie wrote:
liverbnz wrote:Still pretty even I reckon given England's top order.

Doesn't really affect the "now".   Certainly Australia might hit back later - they have some handy bowlers !  But at the moment , England are clearly on top.

What happens later ...who knows ?  Still need three more anyway.

England are on top indeed. I was being sarcastic but my emoiticon mustn't have worked Smile

I thought you were , to be honest . But I figured I'd treat it as a genuine post ...to deter others Smile

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:37 pm

Fantastic stuff but I am starting to sweat at the thought of Lyth and Bell having a bat on this track!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:40 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
alfie wrote:Eight gone now.  And that was Rogers ...great chance to have Australia out cheaply now.
Yes England will still have to do it with the bat : but I'm not sure this is a 110/8 pitch.

As suspected there was a bit of "damn if you do damned if you dont" when it came to batting first. Bit of damp, bit of grass, bit of cloud ...proper english cricket conditions and one that (hopefully) suits Andersons craft better than the Aussie bully boys. The wickets havent come from short balls.
It may get easier for a while for the team batting second, but still , especially the way things have gone this series batting first is always a thing.


Absolutely. Lot of cricket left still. But things couldn't have gone much better for England so far.

Reckon overhead conditions have more to do with this than the pitch , frankly. And good bowling. And a few ordinary shots...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:42 pm

Hoggy_Bear wrote:England need another wicket quickly.

So we will credit you for the Starc wicket then , Hoggy ?

Well done clap

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Hoggy_Bear on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:43 pm

alfie wrote:
Hoggy_Bear wrote:England need another wicket quickly.

So we will credit you for the Starc wicket then , Hoggy ?

Well done clap

I do my best, thanks

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:49 pm

This last pair playing their shots...and profiting from the attacking field. Much to Jimmy's annoyance as that one flies over slips...

Added a useful 17 but all over now
Six for Jimmy clap

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:52 pm

Tremendous. Hopefully this will be the innings victory I predicted for England before the series started - not a clone of the first test in 2005!

Anderson wonderful. Australia awful, Rogers apart.

Glorious chance for the English. 350 the minimum target..yes? England might have to bat last, after all...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by liverbnz on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:53 pm

Rogers aside that's a pretty atrocious scorecard for Australia. Hopefully that relieves the pressure on the struggling English top order.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:55 pm

liverbnz wrote:Rogers aside that's a pretty atrocious scorecard for Australia.

Tis a shocker of England second innings at Lord's proportions! Bowlers have shown they can turn it round after a bad match so lets hope the batting does the same!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:55 pm

VTR wrote:
liverbnz wrote:Rogers aside that's a pretty atrocious scorecard for Australia.

Tis a shocker of England second innings at Lord's proportions! Bowlers have shown they can turn it round after a bad match so lets hope the batting does the same!

Australia couldn't even bat 37 overs this time!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by CaledonianCraig on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 3:55 pm

I always prefer to say how things stand after both teams have batted on the same pitch. Obviously, England will be buoyed by that bowling performance but before they start celebrating their batsmen have to deliver. Their first prority must be getting a First Innings lead of 100+. If they manage that (which I think will be hard looking at this pitch) then they will be in the box seat.
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:01 pm

I don't think the pitch is too bad.

England bowled well - right areas, pitched the thing up, good field placings. Anderson found a hell of a lot of movement. Australia played poorly, right into England's hands.

Rogers showed what can be achieved with good shot selection.

Now brace yourselves!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:05 pm

CaledonianCraig wrote:I always prefer to say how things stand after both teams have batted on the same pitch. Obviously, England will be buoyed by that bowling performance but before they start celebrating their batsmen have to deliver. Their first prority must be getting a First Innings lead of 100+. If they manage that (which I think will be hard looking at this pitch) then they will be in the box seat.

Sensible . Depends on the way the conditions develop , of course , but I'd be hoping to get a rather larger lead than that (if they can !) ; assuming batting gets easier over the next couple of days . They may still have to bat last , after all.

I am happy for now ; but not taking anything for granted.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:08 pm

CaledonianCraig wrote:I always prefer to say how things stand after both teams have batted on the same pitch. Obviously, England will be buoyed by that bowling performance but before they start celebrating their batsmen have to deliver. Their first prority must be getting a First Innings lead of 100+. If they manage that (which I think will be hard looking at this pitch) then they will be in the box seat.

I think the pitch will flatten out - 200 lead has to be the target. We want a low or in a dream world no chase situation. England haven't chased down a meaningful score to win a Test for years...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:16 pm

Looking at the wickets that fell : three of them were down to indecisiveness with balls just around off stump - Voges and Starc tried to leave but edged ; Nevill left succesfully but got bowled Smile
Warner and Rogers both trapped by good deliveries that seamed a bit. Smith edged a good one in the channel , Clarke yorked ...and Marsh and Johnson played outside off ...not sure anyone could claim they were done by extravagant misbehavior off the pitch.

Rain abbreviated the session.

Wonder how much action will take place after tea ? Rain seems to be hanging around so it might be a bit more on and off...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by kingraf on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:18 pm

Jimmy A is back (as long as conditions are absolutely ideal for him)
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:21 pm

Yep, nobody does it better than James!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:25 pm

kingraf wrote:Jimmy A is back (as long as conditions are absolutely ideal for him)

I know you are looking for a bite , raf. Smile

But you don't get 400 Test wickets by just bowling when conditions suit you. Certainly he is at his best on this sort of track. Most bowlers are at their best on certain surfaces...


And yes : that is what sets Steyn apart - he can turn it on pretty well anywhere.

Fair ?

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by kingraf on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:34 pm

I wasn't particularly looking for a bite, Alfie. Although I had absolutely no doubt that I would get one.

Just that its shades of Shaun Pollock at the tale end of his career. Couldn't buy a wicket, and then popped onto Kingsmead, and took five or six wickets and it bought him six or seven tests of nothingness. Difficult to say that's the case here of course, as Jimmy has taken 72 wickets in his last sixteen matches at 23. But it does help that twelve of those sixteen have been in said ideal conditions.
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:50 pm

Lyth gone.

Out comes Ian Bell - only three tests left in his England career, surely.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by LuvSports! on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:51 pm

LYTH  mad

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:53 pm

Be fair to Lyth, he's outscored five Australian batsmen!

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 4:53 pm

Oh dear ...poor from Lyth. He'd been leaving quite well : and then he goes and chases a really wide ball and is caught at slip...

Exactly what was not wanted ; for his team - or his career. Which is looking a bit iffy , to be honest. They will want to give him time ; but he really needs second innings runs.

At least Bell has got past one Smile

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:00 pm

kingraf wrote:I wasn't particularly looking for a bite, Alfie. Although I had absolutely no doubt that I would get one.

Just that its shades of Shaun Pollock at the tale end of his career. Couldn't buy a wicket, and then popped onto Kingsmead, and took five or six wickets and it bought him six or seven tests of nothingness. Difficult to say that's the case here of course, as Jimmy has taken 72 wickets in his last sixteen matches at 23. But it does help that twelve of those sixteen have been in said ideal conditions.

I see what you are getting at , raf. Reasonable argument ...except I'd question your suggestion that twelve of Jimmy's last sixteen have been in "favourable conditions ".
Surely not including Lord's or Cardiff ? Or any of the West Indies matches ? And last year against Sri Lanka and India I doubt he appreciated several of the pitche , even though they were officially English. Certainly not Trent Bridge where he enjoyed himself more with the bat...

He ain't getting any younger , for sure . But he remains very fit - and since he doesn't rely on pure pace I reckon he has a bit more time yet.
We will see.


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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:04 pm

Two AM here . Think I need some sleep ...working tomorrow - well , today ...

Hope England can survive without my aid for a couple of hours Fingers Crossed

And Warne is back on commentary so a good time to say goodnight...

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by king_carlos on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:07 pm

Duty281 wrote:Lyth gone.

Out comes Ian Bell - only three tests left in his England career, surely.

If he scores runs in a good England performance here then he will last longer than that. The selectors wont want to drop him and I can't imagine Bell being a man to retire at the end of the series with thoughts still lingering that he hasn't achieved quite what he could in the international arena.

If he struggles in this test with England throwing away this position then this could well be his final test. Gary Ballance now has two fifties since being left out and James Taylor has many advocates although I personally think he needs to string together more consistency to demand a recall.

Another problem with dropping Bell is that he will inevitably go back to county cricket and score a huge volume of runs to demand another chance.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:11 pm

king_carlos wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Lyth gone.

Out comes Ian Bell - only three tests left in his England career, surely.

If he scores runs in a good England performance here then he will last longer than that. The selectors wont want to drop him and I can't imagine Bell being a man to retire at the end of the series with thoughts still lingering that he hasn't achieved quite what he could in the international arena.

If he struggles in this test with England throwing away this position then this could well be his final test. Gary Ballance now has two fifties since being left out and James Taylor has many advocates although I personally think he needs to string together more consistency to demand a recall.

Another problem with dropping Bell is that he will inevitably go back to county cricket and score a huge volume of runs to demand another chance.

I don't think Bell will want to carry on after this series. He's had ten years, over 100 tests, and can culminate his career with a fifth Ashes triumph (if everything goes as it should). Will he really want to through with another tour to the U.A.E., particularly given the horrendous and torrid time he had there in 2012? And the testing trip to South Africa that follows?

Retiring after this series would be the perfect time. I hope he doesn't leave his retirement too late - as Strauss did.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by GSC on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:22 pm

Hmm. Fine bowling from Finn and Anderson. Not sure Clarke will put batting first among his best captaincy decisions.

Tricky conditions and some world class bowlers, but cant really be convinced with him at opener.
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by kingraf on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:22 pm

He's only 33!! Form permitting (and judging by his comments and such, both flesh and soul are certainly permitting) he should really have four or five years of left.

Alfie - By 12/16, I meant England's Last sixteen tests have been home fixtures. Although the fact that you've then gone to highlight just how he doesn't perform unless conditions are ideally ideal does illustrate my point a bit?
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by king_carlos on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:22 pm

At 33 he isn't particularly old - especially when you look at how long many batsmen have gone on for in recent years.

I just can't imagine him retiring until he has taken a chance to put the doubters to rest. I imagine that in an ideal world he will want to push that career average back the right side of 45 at least. Plus he will want to prove some people wrong about his ability to score runs in tough conditions against strong attacks. The UAE and SA would be perfect for Bell there. Especially if he can earn himself the chance to do that from number 3.

By all accounts he is a very proud man who takes any set back very hard. Reportedly his removal from the vice captaincy for Joe Root, whilst understandable, was a hard pill to swallow. Similarly his failure to really capitalise on his ODI chances still haunts him.

Of course all the above could be made redundant if he fails to score runs here.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:26 pm

Time for Compton

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by kingraf on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:34 pm

Is Josh Hazlewood still the leading wicket taker for the series? Aus are probably staring down a heavy innings defeat here, so Hazy needs a few this innings for me.
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:40 pm

Adam Voges refusing to catch the ball with his hands and succeeding is exceptional stuff
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by LuvSports! on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:43 pm

Most bizarre catch ever!?

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:47 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Time for Compton

An average of below 40 in the county championship this season - nah.

Hales or Daryl Mitchell far more deserving
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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 5:58 pm

Weather set good for tomorrow. With a softening ball to face during the morning, not to mention the disheartened opposition, Bell and Root will find it imperative that they bat out the rest of today so they can cash in tomorrow.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by king_carlos on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 6:09 pm

Olly wrote:
Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Time for Compton

An average of below 40 in the county championship this season - nah.

Hales or Daryl Mitchell far more deserving

Far more is a bit of a stretch Olly. Compton averages a tad over 40 as well. There is 3 runs separating their current averages.

Compton has 1 century and 5 fifties at 40.47

Hales has 2 centuries and 1 fifty at 43.07

Mitchell has 2 centuries and 1 fifty at 43.56

From that if we wanted a more consistent opener to dull the new ball and prevent our collapses I would argue Compton is the best bet.

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Re: England v Australia: 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by kingraf on Wed 29 Jul 2015, 6:15 pm


The only thing Ian Bell will find imperative will be the term YOLO. Certainly batting like it. The joys of having Brendon McCullum as your psychologist.
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