South Africa vs England ODI Series

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South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by VTR on Wed 03 Feb 2016, 12:45 pm

First topic message reminder :

Surprised there is no thread for this yet. Fixtures are:

1st ODI: South Africa v England Bloemfontein on Feb 3, 2016

(13:30 local | 11:30 GMT)

2nd ODI: South Africa v England at Port Elizabeth on Feb 6, 2016

(10:00 local | 08:00 GMT)

3rd ODI: South Africa v England at Centurion on Feb 9, 2016

(13:30 local | 11:30 GMT)

4th ODI: South Africa v England at Johannesburg on Feb 12, 2016

(13:30 local | 11:30 GMT)

5th ODI: South Africa v England at Cape Town on Feb 14, 2016

(10:00 local | 08:00 GMT)

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 5:30 pm

My god Duminy is playing one of the worst knocks I've ever seen so far
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 5:53 pm

dyrewolfe wrote:
guildfordbat wrote:Only seen bits and pieces today but - once more showing my appreciation of the supporting actor role - a very valuable contribution from Woakes. Worth a lot more to the team than his own individual score of 33 would suggest. Had he gone early it surely would have been a case of start the car!

Despite that and Root's heroics, it looks as we haven't got enough but it should at least be something of a contest.

As for more general matters here - momentum is no more than this year's buzz word. Confidence and the right amount of it has and always will be important in sport as in most of life. Too little is clearly a weakness but too much causes arrogance and ultimately mistakes. Knowing the right amount is normally only possible when judging after the event.

I've also no great problem with our ODI batsmen. By way of example, Roy has been pretty disappointing in this series but you can't give someone license to tee off from the start and then expect him to deliver all the time. There were moans at the Oval about his t20 form for Surrey early last season. Alec Stewart commented, ''He won't come off every time but if he bats 12 overs, we'll win the game.'' As regulars will know, I like Stewart and have no reason to hide that but do feel he got that nail fairly on the head. I would question whether dyrewolfe is doing the same.

My problem isn't just with Roy...or indeed any batsman in particular. Its the general pattern that is emerging, whereby it falls to 2-3 players (Root and Hales in this case, with support from Woakes & Rashid) to carry the team.

As for the word "momentum" I've been listening to sports people using it for donkey's years, so its far from being "this year's buzzword".

I'm struggling greatly to see what you want or expect from the batsmen. Sure it would be lovely if all the top 7 got a fifty but I can't think of when that ever happened. Even if it did, I guess it wouldn't be long before someone posted having a pop at the top 3 for failing to push on! Whilst we didn't get as many runs today as the team wanted (and it's team runs that really matter), I don't think that has been a regularly occurring problem and am prepared to cut them some slack.

Yes, ''momentum'' has been used for many years but its usage appears to have increased massively in recent times. Certainly seems that way to me. Your post quoting a recent statement of Ebony-Jewel Cora-Lee Camelia Rosamond Rainford-Brent would tend to support my view. You probably intended the words of a former international cricketer to give the term ''momentum'' some credibility. I don't see it that way. I tend to regard it as something typically expected from someone engaged in a marketing capacity by Surrey CCC, a role now being undertaken by Ms Rainford-Brent.

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 6:18 pm

England's fielding has been woeful
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 6:22 pm

Morgan has kept the spinners on for far too long here
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 6:24 pm

Olly wrote:England's fielding has been woeful
Absolutely atrocious
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 6:32 pm

Reece Topley's celebration >>>>>>>>>>>> Imran Tahir's
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:02 pm

We're gonna end up losing this aren't wr
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:06 pm

Will never ever understand why you don't have third man ridiculously fine for tailenders
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:12 pm

Broad has been abysmal
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:14 pm

Half tracker, followed by two half volleys - leave him in the test side only please
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:21 pm

Only England could go from ridiculously out of it, to a position of a near certain win to lose
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:24 pm

SURELY NOT RASHENIUS
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:28 pm

Morgan has had a shocker as captain too - fielding awful, poor captaincy, awful from the most experienced bowler. Should've wrapped that up but for some reason we tried to defend the runs than get the wickets when they went 8 down and it allowed Morris to get in and going

Rashid only bowled 5 and a bit overs despite being threatening throughout, Topley's the best seamer on the night and only bowls 7. Questions to be answered their Eoin
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by KP_fan on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 7:47 pm

a far more engrossing series then the Aus-Ind one.

There isn't any excuse for letting SA get away with a win in this game.

Modern limited-over-only captains have forgotten the art of attacking bowling, close-in fielders and working out dismissals.
A Cook or Ponting or Kohli type captain would win such a game 9 out of 10 times
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by The Loaded Dog on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 8:37 pm

I guess it was the gathering momentum from the previous encounter which carried SA through this one. Whistle
Their confidence is also on the rise. Sets it up nicely for the decider.

So kp-f, are you saying Dhoni would have lost such a game 4 out of 5 times? I feel you are being a little harsh on him still.  Wink
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 8:43 pm

LD - can tell someone is happy with his team's day one Test performance! Wink

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by The Loaded Dog on Fri 12 Feb 2016, 9:01 pm

guildfordbat wrote:LD - can tell someone is happy with his team's day one Test performance! Wink

Ha mate, it didn't feel too great at 5/2 but yes, a good recovery from Usman and Smith.

Have a feeling we might see a repeat of sorts this morning (here) with NZ furious about the Voges 'no ball' reprieve late yesterday.


Surely they'll want to maintain their momentum from the ODIs into this Test series. Smile
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 8:26 am

Old Jason Roy hasn't had a good series coming off the good summer
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by alfie on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 8:34 am

Early introduction of Tahir has done for Roy ...whose form has rather tapered off of late.
Hope he can get going again for the t20.

Hales and Root scoring quite fluently though - slightly surprised SA sent England in .

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by alfie on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 8:37 am

Blimey I nearly jinxed Hales then ! Amla doesn't drop many...

And now another "wicket" ....but the review will overturn a real howler .

Thank heaven for drs

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 8:38 am

The standard of umpiring in this series has been quite frankly club standard
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 9:04 am

Olly wrote:The standard of umpiring in this series has been quite frankly club standard

And again. Not seen a more plumb lbw appeal not given.

These guys are just guessing
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by The Loaded Dog on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 9:06 am

Another one! Good review by Tahir.
It's happening too often recently. Just plain wrong calls.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by The Loaded Dog on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 9:12 am

Seems a world wide phenomenon of late. Illingworth's howler yesterday and one from Bowden in an ODI a couple of weeks ago which was so embarrassing. It makes you wonder.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 9:15 am

Bowden has always been an embarrassing umpire - think they tried to drop him a year or two back
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by jimbohammers on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 9:56 am

Jason Roy's updated form for England:

9, 29, 0, 21, 48, 14, 20, 6, 8

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:05 am

Bowden was a good umpire a few years back Olly but I do think the margin of error in DRS has an adverse effect on them and gives them a get out of jail card far too often.

The no ball in the Aus/NZ game was embarrassing, so bad it makes you wonder if it was deliberate.

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:08 am

And here we go again...

Just when England were looking set in a good position, they gift SA more wickets.

Rabada with 2 in 2 balls...Stokes for 29 and Buttler a first ball duck. Eng go from 153-3 to 156-5.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:12 am

jimbohammers wrote:Jason Roy's updated form for England:

9, 29, 0, 21, 48, 14, 20, 6, 8

Not sure where you've got those stats from jumbo jimbo - scored a hundred in the final ODI in the UAE thumbsup
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:18 am

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Bowden was a good umpire a few years back Olly but I do think the margin of error in DRS has an adverse effect on them and gives them a get out of jail card far too often.

The no ball in the Aus/NZ game was embarrassing, so bad it makes you wonder if it was deliberate.

Makes you wonder why they didn't review the no ball - when it's out and a no ball isn't called you can check, but when a no ball is called and it's out you can't? Strange
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:20 am

If we can get upto 270 that's very defendable - pitch is certainly doing something and there is turn
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:35 am

Save us Chris Woakes
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by VTR on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:37 am

Congrats to SA on their series victory!

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:37 am

Olly wrote:If we can get upto 270 that's very defendable - pitch is certainly doing something and there is turn

Thats very questionable. I'd back SA to get that. We really need and ought to be able to get 300+.

Our bowling and fielding would need to be spot on...and its been distinctly dodgy of late.


Infuriating that it has yet again been left to one player to hold our innings together... picard


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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:40 am

And the procession continues...Woakes goes for a duck to a ball he really should have left alone...

When will they learn?

Are England really so keen to gift SA the series?
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:40 am

Save us Rashenius
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:41 am

dyrewolfe wrote:And the procession continues...Woakes goes for a duck to a ball he really should have left alone...

When will they learn?

Are England really so keen to gift SA the series?

One sec - he should've left a leg stump half volley alone? Eh?
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:41 am

England were 153-2


they are now 183-7


30 runs for 5 wickets is just unacceptable.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:42 am

Olly wrote:
dyrewolfe wrote:And the procession continues...Woakes goes for a duck to a ball he really should have left alone...

When will they learn?

Are England really so keen to gift SA the series?

One sec - he should've left a leg stump half volley alone? Eh?


If he was going to hit it straight at a fielder...yes! Did he even bother to check the field placings first?

Says it all when the bowler looks embarrassed to have taken the wicket.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by alfie on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:47 am

Olly wrote:If we can get upto 270 that's very defendable - pitch is certainly doing something and there is turn

Not looking too likely Smile

I went out at 46/1 and came back in time to see Moeen and Woakes self destruct...what on earth has been going on ?

Hales seems to have had no trouble.

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:50 am

Congrats SA on your series win. clap

Thoroughly deserved as England have simply capitulated.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by alfie on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 10:51 am

Olly please don't ask Broad to save England

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:03 am

Fantastic knock Alex Hales! clap

You can be proud of yourself, having kept your head when all around you were losing theirs.

The one bright spark in a a calamitous innings.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by alfie on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:06 am

Nice to see Hales reach his century clap He has done really well here - as Roy has faded his star is rising again : I wonder if this will flow into his five day form ? We can hope...

SA bowling when I've been watching hasn't been anything special - in fact rather a lot of loose stuff. Presume this wasn't the case earlier ? Or have England just committed mass suicide ?

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:07 am

Exceptional stuff from Hales - can he now get us up to 250-270 to give us a chance?
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:08 am

alfie wrote:Nice to see Hales reach his century clap    He has done really well here - as Roy has faded his star is rising again  : I wonder if this will flow into his five day form ?  We can hope...

SA bowling when I've been watching hasn't been anything special - in fact rather a lot of loose stuff. Presume this wasn't the case earlier ? Or have England just committed mass suicide ?

Abbott, Rabada and Tahir have bowled well - gifting Wiese three wickets is where we've c0cked up
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:09 am

Lol. Hales given an extra life there. Dropped by de Kock, but the ump didn't think he hit it anyway and gave it as leg byes.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:11 am

Olly wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:Bowden was a good umpire a few years back Olly but I do think the margin of error in DRS has an adverse effect on them and gives them a get out of jail card far too often.

The no ball in the Aus/NZ game was embarrassing, so bad it makes you wonder if it was deliberate.

Makes you wonder why they didn't review the no ball - when it's out and a no ball isn't called you can check, but when a no ball is called and it's out you can't? Strange

It's even odder when it allows the very average Voges to make a bit of history, fear not he and the rest of the Australia team will forget how to bat the moment the ball swings in England.

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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:11 am

alfie wrote:Nice to see Hales reach his century clap    He has done really well here - as Roy has faded his star is rising again  : I wonder if this will flow into his five day form ?  We can hope...

SA bowling when I've been watching hasn't been anything special - in fact rather a lot of loose stuff. Presume this wasn't the case earlier ? Or have England just committed mass suicide ?


Mostly mass suicide. Only Root and Roy really got out to good balls. The rest just played bad shots.

Its one thing playing positive attacking cricket, but you also need some brains to go along with it and know when to rein it in a bit.



Olly wrote:
Exceptional stuff from Hales - can he now get us up to 250-270 to give us a chance?

That depends entirely on how long Broad can hang around.
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Re: South Africa vs England ODI Series

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun 14 Feb 2016, 11:20 am

Ah, I was wrong.

It is in fact Hales who holes out after playing brilliantly for 112. Given how little support he got, you can't really blame him. England innings all but over now.
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