Aviva Premiership - Round 13

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Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 18 Feb 2016, 4:31 pm

First topic message reminder :

Fixtures

Fri 19th Feb 16
19:45 Harlequins  v   Leicester Tigers BT Sport

Sat 20th Feb 16
15:00 Saracens  v   Gloucester Rugby
15:00 Worcester Warriors  v   Sale Sharks
15:15 Bath Rugby  v   Wasps BT Sport

Sun 21st Feb 16
15:00 London Irish  v   Exeter Chiefs BT Sport
15:00 Newcastle Falcons Falcons  v   Northampton Saints


Last edited by LondonTiger on Fri 19 Feb 2016, 8:57 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Ozzy3213 on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 5:59 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Huge win for Wuss, big big games for Falcons & Irish coming up.

Wuss - 18
Falcons - 16
Irish - 12
Certainly puts some pressure back on us. What time do Falcons kick off tomorrow?

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 6:05 pm

Just back from the Wuss game which was just what the doctor ordered although Wuss had a mini self-implosion either side of half time which caused my blood pressure to soar. I've got to say that I didn't notice Wuss getting any help from the ref but then I can't see that is ever the case particularly when you take into account the reports that Ryan speaks of. Only questionable thing was the disallowed Wuss try which I'll have a look at on the replay - some sort of foul play in the scrum which meant a lovely try was struck off. Great home support and good bit of banter with the Sale fans. New Wuss signing Hougard looked good as did Heathcote. I just hope that Wuss can take some confidence from this and convert a few more matches to wins.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 6:06 pm

Ozzy3213 wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:Huge win for Wuss, big big games for Falcons & Irish coming up.

Wuss - 18
Falcons - 16
Irish - 12
Certainly puts some pressure back on us.  What time do Falcons kick off tomorrow?

both 3pm kick offs according to OP.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Cowshot on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 6:08 pm

Dr Grey wrote:Wuss finally won a match they had to win. Maybe they are improving?
This is bad juju for LI. We still need to crack the code so Bath gets relegated. LI being relegated punishes a lot of good folk. Bath being relegated punishes Satan.

Most important thing to me as an English Rugby supporter is that no northern club goes down. It's important to Union that there is a good presence there.

I only know one Bath supporter. I won't look at her the same way again...

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Heaf on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 9:00 pm

Heaf wrote:What's happened to Sale?  Wonder if Mr D will have something to say about the ref ...
 Yep he did ...

Sale director of rugby Steve Diamond:
"They've been complaining about referees in the press all week. Dean Ryan has been fantastic in his management of the situation.
"We are the most disciplined team in the league but the referee gave seven penalties against them for bringing down driving mauls, but there were no yellow cards given.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by GeordieFalcon on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 11:11 pm

Ah feckin Worcester!!!

Bad result!

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by GeordieFalcon on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 11:13 pm

Ps I think the refereeing consistency and performance in the league is appalling!!!

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sat 20 Feb 2016, 11:40 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ps I think the refereeing consistency and performance in the league is appalling!!!

Nobody at the bottom seems happy with the refereeing...

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Heaf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 1:56 am

Don't think Mr C was happy with JP Doyle & co either and tbh I think he had a point about a couple of the pens given against Tigers - but generally speaking I don't think perhaps they've suffered as much as some others over the years.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 8:16 am

We've had 3 or 4 poorly reffed games, they haven't always effected the results though - that would be lack of intensity and work at the breakdown.

It was revealed that the reffing panel thought the two tries at home to the Falcons should of been given.

Cockers said he was getting annoyed with the overuse of the TMO and sometimes thought it was the TMO reffing the game and not the man in the middle of the field .

Personally I think the whole reffing of rugby union needs a rethink, I think they should settle on one interpretation of reffing and force all refs to ref in that style. I don't think there's any other sport where we almost have different rules from one week to the next. It's confusing for players, coaches and most importantly the fans.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 8:18 am

"It was revealed that the reffing panel thought the two tries at home to the Falcons should of been given."

Really?

They were clear knock-ons though, how should have they have been given?

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by formerly known as Sam on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 8:41 am

First TV drops. Second one I think Tait grounds before losing control but I have limited sympathy given the stupid way he chose to cross the try line. Why Agulla only got a yellow in that game was a major failing it's a tip and he drops the player on the head.

I agree with Cockers if the ref and TJs don't refer the TMO should get no say.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:13 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:"It was revealed that the reffing panel thought the two tries at home to the Falcons should of been given."

Really?

They were clear knock-ons though, how should have they have been given?
To be honest, I'm not sure.

As Sam says, TV's try I can't see how that could of been given but Taits looked good to me.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:16 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:First TV drops. Second one I think Tait grounds before losing control but I have limited sympathy given the stupid way he chose to cross the try line. Why Agulla only got a yellow in that game was a major failing it's a tip and he drops the player on the head.

I agree with Cockers if the ref and TJs don't refer the TMO should get no say.
I agree other than foul play And I think once a ref has given a try the TMO can't be allowed to come in before the kick is taken. The ref should be responsible for getting the right decision, he should be the one to ask the question.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:19 am

Does anyone else think they should make these ref reports public? Like Dean Ryan is asking?

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:35 am

I think they should be made public as I think we're all left with the feeling that our team gets the rough end of the deal - it would be good to know for sure. I think dean Ryan feels that he has clear evidence that Wuss have been badly done to which is why he has been gobbing off all week!

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:37 am

nathan wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:First TV drops. Second one I think Tait grounds before losing control but I have limited sympathy given the stupid way he chose to cross the try line. Why Agulla only got a yellow in that game was a major failing it's a tip and he drops the player on the head.

I agree with Cockers if the ref and TJs don't refer the TMO should get no say.
I agree other than foul play And I think once a ref has given a try the TMO can't be allowed to come in before the kick is taken. The ref should be responsible for getting the right decision, he should be the one to ask the question.


Completely agree.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Bathman_in_London on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:38 am

The reports are supposed to be used so the referees panels can improve aren't they? Personally I think Dean Ryan was being unfair last week, Wuss lost due to Heathcote missing two sitters in the last five minutes, they shouldn't have needed what would have been a very generous penalty try.

The other thing is that inevitably coaches will just pick on the one decision that went against them, rather than talk about all the slowing down their back row managed to get away with. In fact does anybody know if the report analysises only the calls made, or also ones missed?

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:47 am

I think that even if the reports were available coaches and us would still argue about certain match changing decisions, particularly if a team is struggling for premiership survival or on the cusp of a champions cup place etc. Bathman, with the potential deliberate knock on in the Wuss Bath match, was advantage played and then expired of was it not deemed a foul at all? (I missed the match.)

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 9:56 am

I see the points raised but Tait didn't ground the ball.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:00 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:I see the points raised but Tait didn't ground the ball.
Well that's not what the refereeing panel thought.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Bathman_in_London on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:08 am

He gave a knock on and then called advantage over shortly after.

I guess in some ways I feel sorry for the referees and think that publishing their failings afterwards is going to make their job harder and will encourage the tmo for everything. That said some degree of consistency is really needed.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:10 am

Have you seen the report? I presumed they though both tries should have been given as the TMO should not have intervened rather than they were tries.

It was clear when the TMO looked into it they were not tries, that's the point I'm trying to get across. The ball was not grounded.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:13 am

Bathman_in_London wrote:He gave a knock on and then called advantage over shortly after.

I guess in some ways I feel sorry for the referees and think that publishing their failings afterwards is going to make their job harder and will encourage the tmo for everything. That said some degree of consistency is really needed.
I think you've hit the nail on the head with that word consistency. I think we need to select a style of reffing a game and make all refs use the exact same style.

At the moment you can watch 1 game where the ref will allow hands to be in the floor making a turnover, you then watch the next game and players are being pinged to death for the same thing. I think it would make things so much clearer for everyone. Coaches and players know what to expect, fans won't get annoyed with inconsistencies.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:15 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Have you seen the report? I presumed they though both tries should have been given as the TMO should not have intervened rather than they were tries.

It was clear when the TMO looked into it they were not tries, that's the point I'm trying to get across. The ball was not grounded.
Haven't seen it, neither have you.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I believe one of them was grounded and the other wasn't. I understand the point you are trying to get across - I just don't agree with it.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:29 am

Bathman_in_London wrote:He gave a knock on and then called advantage over shortly after.

I guess in some ways I feel sorry for the referees and think that publishing their failings afterwards is going to make their job harder and will encourage the tmo for everything. That said some degree of consistency is really needed.

Thanks Bathman.

I can see that making reports public does add pressure to the refs and I certainly wouldn't want to see more use of the TMO. That said if it forces more consistency and improves the perception of fairness then it's probably worth it IMO.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:29 am

They weren't grounded.

Should this have ever been passed to the ref, probably not.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by nathan on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 10:57 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:They weren't grounded.

Should this have ever been passed to the ref, probably not.
Well that's your opinion, others differ. Let's leave it at that.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by LondonTiger on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 11:05 am

nathan wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:Have you seen the report? I presumed they though both tries should have been given as the TMO should not have intervened rather than they were tries.

It was clear when the TMO looked into it they were not tries, that's the point I'm trying to get across. The ball was not grounded.
Haven't seen it, neither have you.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I believe one of them was grounded and the other wasn't. I understand the point you are trying to get across - I just don't agree with it.

If we are talking about Tigers/Falcons at WR - TV dropped the ball, Tait did not. If Tait is deemed not to have properly grounded the ball - then 90% of one handed touchdowns should be deemed the same. When you watch at full speed looks fine, at slow mo there may be doubts. Far too many decisions are being given on slo mo rather than real time view. (Makes tackles look way worse)

However if there is a report that deems the tries should have been awarded it is based on the process used rather than validity of grounding. Having awarded the try that should have been it.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 11:06 am

Well the TMO didn't on the day but agree, it doesn't really matter. I'm just glad we got some payback at our place Wink

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by LondonTiger on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 11:14 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Well the TMO didn't on the day but agree, it doesn't really matter. I'm just glad we got some payback at our place Wink

Payback for what? You make it sound like we were undeserving winners.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 11:38 am

No, you deserved the win.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by ChequeredJersey on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 1:40 pm

Payback in terms of revenge for the pain of a loss I think, LT

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:12 pm

All Falcons 7-0

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:12 pm

Pretty stodgy first 9 minutes in Reading...

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:13 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:All Falcons 7-0

Probably 7-0 to Irish too now.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:15 pm

So tight at the bottom with the bottom 3 all fighting for their lives. I think the best thing would be to ring fence the Premiership! Whistle

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by formerly known as Sam on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:15 pm

Amazing the transformation in Falcons since the arrival of Goode. Shows that flyhalfs don't have to be pacey and dynamic to be effective. Control of territory and the experience to take the right options whether that's free flowing or pragmatic.

LI looking bright but running into brick walls. Suddenly it opens up and they're over for a seven pointer.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:22 pm

Saints right back in it, Burrell and Gibson looking really good. Waller's breakdown work is really strong.

7-8 Saints Sad

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:24 pm

Long way to go yet pooly!

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Heaf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:24 pm

Not sure about the scrum pen against LI - Chiefs prop going at 90 degrees ...

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Scottrf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:25 pm

Goode's shape is crazy.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:25 pm

Haha....I know Stub....10-8 Falcons!

Don't you start with the ref bashing again Heaf lol

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Heaf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:28 pm

I have to get my jollies somehow Smile

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Scottrf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:29 pm

Good competing from Dickson. p.s. ouch.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:31 pm

Nice stamp on the head...rugby accident? Not sure what I think of that one tbh.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:36 pm

Another try for Falcons!!! Great game.

Hammersely has been superb these last few weeks. Totally outplaying Foden.

17-11

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Scottrf on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:39 pm

Seen that a number of times recently, shoulder to the face is a yellow.

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by stub on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:40 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Another try for Falcons!!! Great game.

Hammersely has been superb these last few weeks. Totally outplaying Foden.

17-11

Are you there Pooly? If not how are you watching it (if it's not a rude question!)

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

Post by Sgt_Pooly on Sun 21 Feb 2016, 3:41 pm

Bet365 mate.

Love that from Barnes to Goode: "Tackling as well Goody?"

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Re: Aviva Premiership - Round 13

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