Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

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Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by George Carlin on Sun 20 Mar 2016, 6:32 am

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Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby
Friday 25 March 2016
KO 19:35
Scotstoun Stadium

Live on BBC Alba/NI/TG4

Referee: John Lacey (IRFU, 51st competition game)
Assistant Referees: Graeme Wells, Cammy Rudkin (both SRU)
Citing Commissioner: John Montgomery (SRU)
TMO: Neil Paterson (SRU)

A. Head to Head

28 Played 28
13 Wins 14
14 Losses 13
1 Draws 1
518 Points 524

B. Form

12 February 2016
Ulster Rugby 13 - 10 Glasgow Warriors

22 May 2015
Glasgow Warriors 16 - 14 Ulster Rugby

16 May 2015
Glasgow Warriors 32 - 10 Ulster Rugby

C. Teams

Glasgow Warriors 

15. Stuart Hogg
14. Tommy Seymour
13. Mark Bennett
12. Alex Dunbar
11. Sean Lamont
10. Finn Russell
9. Henry Pyrgos

1. Gordon Reid
2. Fraser Brown
3. Sila Puafisi
4. Jonny Gray (Captain)
5. Leone Nakarawa
6. Rob Harley
7. Chris Fusaro
8. Josh Strauss

16. James Malcolm
17. Jerry Yanuyanutawa
18. Zander Fagerson
19. Tim Swinson
20. Ryan Wilson
21. Grayson Hart
22. Duncan Weir
23. Taqele Naiyaravoro

Ulster Rugby

15 S Olding
14 C Gilroy
13 L Marshall
12 S McCloskey
11 R Scholes
10 P Jackson
09 R Pienaar

01 C Black
02 R Herring (C)
03 R Lutton
04 A O'Connor
05 F van der Merwe
06 I Henderson
07 C Henry
08 N Williams

16 J Andrew
17 K McCall
18 A Warwick
19 R Diack
20 S Reidy
21 P Marshall
22 S Windsor
23 D Cave


Last edited by George Carlin on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 8:28 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by neilthom7 on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:22 pm

How we conspired to lose that from ahead i have no idea but still well done glasgow, you guys played a lot of good rugby tonight

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by RDW_Scotland on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:23 pm

What a strange game that was!

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Munchkin on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:23 pm

Well, that's that. Thought we would get the lbp, but denied at the end (thanks to the ref awarding a try of a forward pass). Too many errors cost us. That was a game we really needed to win for any hope of a top 4 finish.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by VinceWLB on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:24 pm

Taking the points to deny Ulster a lbp, i like that! I believe they would have kicked into touch even last season.

Very good win for Glasgow against a spirited Ulster side but Glasgow won this at the breakdown.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by tigertattie on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:24 pm

And to think there's still folk out there that think Leigh halfpenny is a better 15 than Hogg!!!!

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by marty2086 on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:25 pm

tigertattie wrote:And to think there's still folk out there that think Leigh halfpenny is a better 15 than Hogg!!!!

Halfpenny isnt even the best 15 in Wales

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by RDW_Scotland on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:27 pm

OK I take it back, Pieenar was a good 2m in front of the mark!

We'll call it even for the forward pass.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by funnyExiledScot on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:29 pm

Big well done to Glasgow. Ulster missed Williams in the second half.

Russell (goal kicking aside) and Hogg (goal kicking included) were both awesome. I thought Dunbar had a very strong game as well.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by BigGee on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:29 pm

Wow what an end to the game. Who writes Hoggy's scripts, he is just on fire!

Great vision by Finn Russell as well, just changed the game in a second.

The momentum is with us now, it could look very good when we come back from Italy and I am going to the Zebre game!

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by funnyExiledScot on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:31 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:OK I take it back, Pieenar was a good 2m in front of the mark!

We'll call it even for the forward pass.

I was certain the Ulster kick was well in front, but sadly ALBA didn't bother showing a replay. I was less confident about the pass to Hogg being forward, so morally Glasgow merited the win!

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by funnyExiledScot on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:33 pm

BigGee wrote:Wow what an end to the game. Who writes Hoggy's scripts, he is just on fire!

Great vision by Finn Russell as well, just changed the game in a second.

The momentum is with us now, it could look very good when we come back from Italy and I am going to the Zebre game!

Pretty confident you came online just to tell us that!

Agreed on Hogg. The man who can do no wrong at the moment. It's a pity he isn't as World Class as Williams, Anscombe and Halfpenny otherwise he'd have a shot a making the Lions squad again.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by George Carlin on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:35 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:OK I take it back, Pieenar was a good 2m in front of the mark!

We'll call it even for the forward pass.

I was certain the Ulster kick was well in front, but sadly ALBA didn't bother showing a replay. I was less confident about the pass to Hogg being forward, so morally Glasgow merited the win!
Careful, let's not get Welsh about this.

The thing was that Lacey was standing absolutely bang on line and he was confident that the pass was fine - something he confirmed immediately.

I agree that Nick Williams having to leave was a major turning point. Scrums were honours even all night, mind you.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by RDW_Scotland on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:36 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:OK I take it back, Pieenar was a good 2m in front of the mark!

We'll call it even for the forward pass.

I was certain the Ulster kick was well in front, but sadly ALBA didn't bother showing a replay. I was less confident about the pass to Hogg being forward, so morally Glasgow merited the win!

There has been a few replays since - he was well in front.

Great thinking from him to take it, but he should have been called back and Glasgow would have been set up properly.

I don't think we would have had a replay that gave definite evidence either way about the Russell pass but it looked very flat at best!

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by VinceWLB on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 9:38 pm

Also Ulster fans, i'm surprised you are converting Warwick to TH, i'm not sure he has enough weight for the position and he did cost you the lbp at that last scrum.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Munchkin on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 10:05 pm

The only reason Warwick is playing TH is Herbst is injured. He did cost us the lbp. Same can be said of Diack .... and the ref.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by VinceWLB on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 10:08 pm

Munchkin wrote:The only reason Warwick is playing TH is Herbst is injured. He did cost us the lbp. Same can be said of Diack.

Bronson Ross injured too? Done ok whenever i watched him, including holding up a defending scrum remarkably well against Oyonnax in the dying minute of the game.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Fri 25 Mar 2016, 10:41 pm

What a match.
Lacey was appalling, just appalling.
Ulster were unlucky in the sense that their game plan almost came off. Glasgow won because they were the more positive, creative side. Russell is a special talent.
Young Pipetto got Favaro's, Clegg 's and Justice's autographs. Favaro was askedin the Q&A what should we fear about Ulster?
"We are Glasgow, we are Warriors, we should fear no-one"
You have to love him.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by The Great Aukster on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 8:46 am

Well done to Glasgow, you're just a few unbeaten games away in a run to defend your title.

Ulster solely rely on Williams to win them games and if he's not there they don't. If he's now injured Ulster could still struggle to make the top 6.

As for those calling for Jackson to make the Ireland squad, they got a clear demonstration tonight why he isn't there. Russell didn't have his best game but still totally outplayed Paddy tactically.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by geoff999rugby on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 8:56 am

Bronson Ross has not been anywhere near good enough to start.
Handy in the lose but a poor scrummager - the odd success doesn't alter that.
I would not be surprised if he is let go this summer.

On the tries lets take the blinkers off lads
Any Ulster fan who doesn't accept Pienaer was in front of the mark is blind
Any Glasgow fan who doesn't think Russell pass to Hogg was forward is also blind

Lacey was terrible but the better team won
Funnily enough our best performance since the New Year - we have to beat Connacht now otherwise Europe next year will be in doubt

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 9:23 am

Well said Geoff. Two questionable tries Ulster were quite cynical for moat ofit but Glasgow deserved te win

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by RDW_Scotland on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 9:38 am

jimbopip wrote:Well said Geoff. Two questionable tries Ulster were quite cynical for moat ofit but Glasgow deserved te win

Still pished?

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 10:16 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:
jimbopip wrote:Well said Geoff. Two questionable tries Ulster were quite cynical for moat ofit but Glasgow deserved te win

Still pished?

Sadly no, just half asleep and using my phone with fat, stubby fingers and bleary eyes. I was with Schiz's carer last night and he drinks at a sensible, pedestrian pace. But then again, compared with Schiz who doesn't?

However, Ulster were offside at every ruck, taking men out off the ball and killing the ball whenever Glasgow got onto their 22. Two or three yellows would not have been harsh. When they had the ball they looked more than capable of causing Glasgow real problems. On another night they might have rode their luck and won.

Dunbar and Bennett were fairly anonymous. There were a lot of missed tackles from Glasgow in the early stages and Fozzie looked totally lost until a head knock caused him to go off. I am concerned that he may not have been fully fit to start with.

Russell is just a magician. In the end he made the difference because he wanted to make something happen.

Highlight of the night, meeting Simone.

"We are Glasgow. We are Warriors. We fear no-one."

They love him at Scotstoun.


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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by The Great Aukster on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 11:06 am

jimbopip wrote:However, Ulster were offside at every ruck, taking men out off the ball and killing the ball whenever Glasgow got onto their 22. Two or three yellows would not have been harsh. When they had the ball they looked more than capable of causing Glasgow real problems. On another night they might have rode their luck and won.

Unfortunately Ulster didn't gain any advantage there because Glasgow were doing exactly the same thing and cancelled each other out. Except the Hogg card of course which was so blatantly cynical Lacey couldn't ignore it.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by 21st Century Schizoid Man on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 11:19 am

Ah Mr PiP. Glad you and young Pippoletto enjoyed temp. membership of the North Stand Massif. Best you get your erse up to Brewdog, Kelvingrove today for a few Dead Ponys.

Simone 'Tutti Bene" Favaro was speaking to him post game. This guy is a class act. He loves Glasgow and lives and breathes The Warriors. Talking of Italian and all thing Italy. The Ws are there for 9 days for the back to back games and, did I mention before, so am I . Now that really is tutti bene. Swung it with Signora Schiz using the old "How would you like to spend some time in Venice (and Parma!) for a romantic birthday?" routine. She acceded and said , more reluctantly , that I could come too. Shocked

Last night's game highlights :- Johnny G - just awesome and now grown into captaincy. Al who?
Tommy Seymour - just keeps getting better.
Finn R - the good (very), the bad (sometimes) but he makes things happen

Lowlights:- John Lacey - why? Just why?
Our first 10 mins. Wakey bleedin wakey guys! Hoggy took one for the team that ultimately proved unnecessary.
Tommy Seymour's half -arsed Mohican . Get your money back Tennessee Tam !

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 11:43 am

The Great Aukster wrote:Well done to Glasgow, you're just a few unbeaten games away in a run to defend your title.

Ulster solely rely on Williams to win them games and if he's not there they don't. If he's now injured Ulster could still struggle to make the top 6.

As for those calling for Jackson to make the Ireland squad, they got a clear demonstration tonight why he isn't there. Russell didn't have his best game but still totally outplayed Paddy tactically.

I wonder if it is a coincidence that his sublime run of form started to decline around the same time he returned from the Ireland squad having not been selected for the match-day 23?

Sexton was in poor form leading into the 6 Nations and Madigan has been in poor form for a long time. I don't understand the double standards that have seemingly come from a select few Ulster fans. Maybe some wish to be seen on the same page as Schmidt? Who knows.

Anyway, I actually missed this particular game. Who played well for Ulster? Not Paddy, apparently.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by geoff999rugby on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 11:48 am

Marshall and McCloskey were excellent
Henry had his best game of the season
Herring was very solid
AOC did well for 20 mins

Weakest players were Jackson, Williams (lasted 40 mins), Diack, de Merwe, Black, Lutton

Basically what we all know our forwards are not good enough - bar one or two exceptions

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by George Carlin on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 12:26 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:Marshall and McCloskey were excellent
Henry had his best game of the season
Herring was very solid
AOC did well for 20 mins

Weakest players were Jackson, Williams (lasted 40 mins), Diack, de Merwe, Black, Lutton

Basically what we all know our forwards are not good enough - bar one or two exceptions
Also Gilroy's speed pretty much caused panic every time he got the ball and Scholes did an awful lot right.

Pienaar used all his wiles but there was only so much he could do.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Notch on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 12:32 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote: I don't understand the double standards that have seemingly come from a select few Ulster fans. Maybe some wish to be seen on the same page as Schmidt? Who knows.

Thats not fair. You can't criticise fans for thinking that our players should rise to the standards of the national team, as opposed to the national team dropping to our standards- Leinster have declined, Munster have declined and almost every week Ulster decline the opportunity to step up and fill the gap they've left. We're now behind both in the table. We complain that not enough of our players get selected and then we despair that we can't win anything- maybe its not the selectors, maybe its our own standards that are too low. We have loads of talent, plenty of good players, but we've bottled in big games a number of times. Thats not what the national coaches want to see. That our players have the steel to go with the skill. The mental toughness. The only players left in Ireland with that track record are from Leinster, despite poor current form at provincial level. They'll likely add another trophy to their collection in May, unless Glasgow pip them to it. Those are the two contenders once the playoffs start regardless of the league table. Would love to be wrong about that, of course.

I'm no fan of Madigan, at all, and Paddy was unlucky to miss out to him. It was a 50/50 call at best. I've been Jacksons biggest supporter and I still am- I think he's a brilliant talent who's having a patch of questionable form. The thing is, when Sexton plays badly for his club you know he will deliver the goods in the big games and he did deliver the goods. When Paddy plays badly he has no trophies to point to, very few big games against really big teams he's dominated to point to- why should he get the benefit of the doubt he hasn't earned? To get into the match day squads, and to challenge Sexton for his place, we need to be going to sides like Glasgow, Leinster, Saracens etc. and seeing him taking games by the scruff of the neck and dominating them and pulling us through them with dogged wins. Sexton did that against the top teams of his day, O'Gara did the same before him. If he can't/doesn't do that we're just waiting for time when Sexton retires and he becomes our 10 by default. I want him to take that shirt off him and I want him to drag us to a title or two on the way. It doesn't look like it's going to happen but he's only 24. He has 4 years really until he should be at the peak of his powers. Let's see. I hope he can do it.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by geoff999rugby on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 12:43 pm

That is only half true - by that logic players in weaker teams should not play International rugby.

What is Henshaw doing in the Ireland side - before this year Connacht have been a lower placed team
What has George Ford done at club level.

You recognise talent and back it.

Jackson continues to play behind a pack that is not good enough - that make decision making tougher week in week out - affecting Pienaer form as well
Of the current pack only Best and Henderson are good enough to win trophies
We have some promise in the likes of McCall, AOC and Herbst but that all have some way to go
The majority of our pack simply aren't good enough - we cant dominate teams up front
Add to that a back up 9 who for all his pace simply is not good enough - not even close

Trouble with Ireland is average Leinster players get selected for more talented players from elsewhere - and yes I do believe that


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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by TJ on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 12:47 pm

Ulster were definitely using the "John Jeffries" offside line

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Notch on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 12:55 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:That is only half true - by that logic players in weaker teams should not play International rugby.

If they have the mentality of winners, they'll get picked. No-one stood in the way of Stephen Ferris or Rory Best even though we were all over the shop as a province and a team and they were often playing in beaten packs, surrounded by players who weren't of the same standard. Similarly Henderson has been given every opportunity. Does Paddy have the mentality? I believe he can have it. He needs to show it for us. He needs to really grasp it with both hands.

No-one is owed a cap for being good at rugby. You have to really seize it. I hope he gets another chance to impress on tour and I hope he takes it, but in his 100 caps for Ulster he hasn't seized the Ireland 10 jersey. Not yet. Sexton was a late bloomer. I still believe Jackson has the potential to surpass him, but we need to wait and see whether he will make good on that potential.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:03 pm

I was responding to a comment directed at those in support of his inclusion in the Ireland team and I stand by my comment that there seems to be double standards going on here. I think that is a perfectly fair statement to make.

Nobody is really claiming that Jackson is ready to displace Sexton. Or that he deserves to. What people are (or were) saying is that he deserves a chance with Ireland. His form going into the Six Nations should have earned him a spot and it didn't. I think you would be hard pressed to find an Irish fan who didn't expect him to feature on the bench for even a couple of games at the very least. I doubt many Leinster fans expected Madigan to feature as much as he did.

Of course Jackson needs to show the mental strength to pull himself together but I have no doubt this has affected his confidence. I think it is naive to assume this is merely coincidental. To miss another season with the Ireland team must be a very hard pill to swallow indeed. Especially when he was the form player in his position in Ireland, if not Europe. Not to mention the fact he was training with the Ireland squad in between his time with Ulster, which would have caused disruption that ultimately served little purpose.

It will be interesting to see if he features at all in the summer tour. Now that his form isn't at the same height previously to the Six Nations, I doubt it.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:14 pm

Notch wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:That is only half true - by that logic players in weaker teams should not play International rugby.

If they have the mentality of winners, they'll get picked. No-one stood in the way of Stephen Ferris or Rory Best even though we were all over the shop as a province and a team and they were often playing in beaten packs, surrounded by players who weren't of the same standard. Similarly Henderson has been given every opportunity. Does Paddy have the mentality? I believe he can have it. He needs to show it for us. He needs to really grasp it with both hands.

No-one is owed a cap for being good at rugby. You have to really seize it. I hope he gets another chance to impress on tour and I hope he takes it, but in his 100 caps for Ulster he hasn't seized the Ireland 10 jersey. Not yet. Sexton was a late bloomer. I still believe Jackson has the potential to surpass him, but we need to wait and see whether he will make good on that potential.

Double standards again. Fergus McFadden did not earn his cap this season. He has been abysmal, if you have been watching Leinster this season. Missed tackles, poor decision making and general poor play. Simon Zebo has been dire this season for Munster as well. Both took their opportunities when given the chance.

I agree with you that nobody is owed a cap but you are not applying the same mantra to all selections. That is why I find it strange that some are selectively using this with regards to Paddy Jackson and a few other Ulster players. The difference is that he was actually in fantastic form and challenging the top European teams with his performances, behind an inadequate pack. It is fair enough if you do not think he is ready but the reasons given so far do not quite fit the bill.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Nematode on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:27 pm

I'm going to take some flak here but I didn't think John Lacey was too bad.

Re the tries, it wouldn't send out the right message of how entertaining rugby can be of they had been chalked off. It would be equivalent to giving someone a fine for doing 71mph in a 70 zone...

He was also consistent. He ignored both Glasgow and Ulster complaints on the try and didn't favour one team at the breakdown.

There were some obvious mistakes but I feel other non-consistent refs who make less mistakes are much, much worse.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Nematode on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:28 pm

Also, he was reffing as part of a 4 man team. Surely the others need to take blame for not helping him spot things?

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by geoff999rugby on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:35 pm

No issue with Jackson not replacing Sexton - Sexton remains the best 10 in Ireland.

It is another Leinster Joe average, Madigan, being on the bench that doesn't fit.
Rory mentioned McFadden, if McFadden was wearing Green, Red or White he would not have been selected.
Same goes for Murphy and D. Kearney.

When in doubt Joe picks a mediocre Leinster player before an inexperienced but more talented player from any of the other provinces.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Munchkin on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:41 pm

Completely agree with Rory. There's one Ulster supporter who has seemed to single out Jackson at least a couple of times, for harsh criticism. Completely unfair on Jackson. He was in sparkling form prior to the 6N's, in his game management, and his kicking (he appears to have a longer kicking range than last season).
Jackson was playing for Ulster while training with Ireland. Why on earth do the supporters who criticise him not get that this was having an effect on his games with Ulster?

I don't know if Schmidt not giving Jackson a game has hit his confidence, but I can see how it might have. Schmidt making feeble excuses as to why he didn't play him can't have helped. Mumbling something about the great kicking stats of Madigan and Sexton (Sexton robbed him of that excuse in his next game), and this was while Jackson has been kicking great from the tee. Does Schmidt not watch Jackson play? Schmidt also seemed to criticise McCloskey after the defeat to England. I have lost respect for the man because of this. Not that I would ever want him gone. It just doesn't sit right with me.

Jackson should have been given a game against Italy. I think Schmidt bottled it.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Nematode on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 1:54 pm

I've been impressed by Paddy Jackson and was surprised that he wasn't at least on the bench in 6N. I thought Sexton was pretty average over the 6N and looks like he needs to find his form.

Also amazed Luke Marshall (? Your 13) didn't play and more so Gilroy. They seem to be 2 of the best backs in the Pro 12, better than e.g. D Kearney or McFadden.

(Also thought Ringrose deserved a cap on the subject of bad selection...)

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 2:12 pm

I think Joe Schmidt is an excellent coach and I agree with the majority of the things he has done so far. He is also an international coach while I am an armchair fan, so whether or not I agree with him is rather irrelevant. I also understand why his preference is towards Leinster players - of course that is going to be the case. He has won trophies with these players and he has coached them for years. I think this has led to some dubious calls throughout his reign but I will never agree 100% with any coach (or any person for that matter). That is just the nature of life. There are Ulster players who deserved more of a chance with Ireland but I think they will get their chance eventually. I should also add that I think we should be careful before accusing Schmidt of hanging McCloskey up to dry. We are subjectively interpreting his comments to mean that. He gave a fair assessment of his performance.

My main response is to the currently trendy critique of Paddy Jackson (and a few others) to justify Schmidt's selections. Comments such as "another example for the PJ supporters why he wasn't picked" when examined do not stand up to scrutiny. Certain fans seem to think they have insight into Schmidt's selections and the reality is that they don't seem to know what they are talking about. The same criticism is not fairly distributed to the rest of the board. I could be a million miles off the mark but that is how it appears to me. I apologise if that is indeed unfair.

Schmidt will have his reasons and he is the coach. I may not agree with them and I will say when I don't. I think some people were unable to allow themselves to disagree with anything that Schmidt did and had to think of overly complicated reasons to explain why he did what he did. These claims just didn't seem to hold any weight.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Munchkin on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 2:29 pm

I agree, Rory, on all you say, bar the 'hanging out to dry' comment. It's your opinion, and you're entitled to it, but mine is that Schmidt was taking heat off himself, while already giving reasons not to include McCloskey in the next game. I thought that as soon as he said it. This isn't a hindsight call. Then Schmidt made mention Madigans, and Sextons, kicking stats, as a reason why they were both included, at the cost of Jackson getting game time. That's just waffle, Rory. It was an excuse.

I rate Schmidt very highly, but that side of him really disappoints me, and not just because Jackson didn't get game time.

That's my opinion anyway Very Happy

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 3:19 pm

You know.... I quite like the Ulster crowd. At least inasmuch as my misanthropic ild soul can like any group of human beings.

BUT

I find I get rather resentful when they come on here and lower the tone of the place. All they want to do is have endless polemics about which player is better and who should be picked in what position. Is that what a rugby forum is for???

Now, there were a lot of interesting things that occurred last night;
the Uni Café does Gingerbread ice cream, incredibly delicious
Simone Favaro is 5 ft 11 in the programme and Rory Clegg 6ft. Yet when I stood between them Clegg is at least six inches taller than The Man With The Heart Of a Warrior.
And my favourite: it looked as if we would miss the last train from Glasgow Central, so I decided to hail a cab. I was having no luck and spotted two female Ulster fans jumping into one. I asked if they were going my way and they very kindly offered to share with young Pipetto and myself. They were lovely and we indulged in the sort of social chit chat that strangers do. Then it turned out that the daughter had gone to school and been best friends with the daughter of my college room mate from 40 years ago. Her mother said "Sure he's a neighbour of mine."

Now that's what we expect on a Glasgow supporter's thread. laughing

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 3:31 pm

Of course it is what a rugby forum is for. It is a place where we can come and discuss and debate things related to rugby. The question to ask is whether or not this particular debate is relevant to this thread, which it probably isn't. So hopefully if it is continued it will be on the Ulster or Ireland threads.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Munchkin on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 3:40 pm

jimbopip wrote:You know.... I quite like the Ulster crowd. At least inasmuch as my misanthropic ild soul can like any group of human beings.

BUT

I find I get rather resentful when they come on here and lower the tone of the place. All they want to do is have endless polemics about which player is better and who should be picked in what position. Is that what a rugby forum is for???

Now, there were a lot of interesting things that occurred last night;
the Uni Café does Gingerbread ice cream, incredibly delicious
Simone Favaro is 5 ft 11 in the programme and Rory Clegg 6ft. Yet when I stood between them Clegg is at least six inches taller than The Man With The Heart Of a Warrior.
And my favourite: it looked as if we would miss the last train from Glasgow Central, so I decided to hail a cab. I was having no luck and spotted two female Ulster fans jumping into one. I asked if they were going my way and they very kindly offered to share with young Pipetto and myself. They were lovely and we indulged in the sort of social chit chat that strangers do. Then it turned out that the daughter had gone to school and been best friends with the daughter of my college room mate from 40 years ago. Her mother said "Sure he's a neighbour of mine."

Now that's what we expect on a Glasgow supporter's thread. laughing

You do? Why?  Shocked     heart  Hug  Whisky Whisky Whisky

Seems you got to enjoy the game, and the company of two of Ulsters lovely girls. As they say, one man's gain is another man's loss Sad

That's about as much as I can do in trying to meet your thread expectations Very Happy

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Notch on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 3:57 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote:
Notch wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:That is only half true - by that logic players in weaker teams should not play International rugby.

If they have the mentality of winners, they'll get picked. No-one stood in the way of Stephen Ferris or Rory Best even though we were all over the shop as a province and a team and they were often playing in beaten packs, surrounded by players who weren't of the same standard. Similarly Henderson has been given every opportunity. Does Paddy have the mentality? I believe he can have it. He needs to show it for us. He needs to really grasp it with both hands.

No-one is owed a cap for being good at rugby. You have to really seize it. I hope he gets another chance to impress on tour and I hope he takes it, but in his 100 caps for Ulster he hasn't seized the Ireland 10 jersey. Not yet. Sexton was a late bloomer. I still believe Jackson has the potential to surpass him, but we need to wait and see whether he will make good on that potential.

Double standards again. Fergus McFadden did not earn his cap this season. He has been abysmal, if you have been watching Leinster this season. Missed tackles, poor decision making and general poor play. Simon Zebo has been dire this season for Munster as well. Both took their opportunities when given the chance.

I agree with you that nobody is owed a cap but you are not applying the same mantra to all selections. That is why I find it strange that some are selectively using this with regards to Paddy Jackson and a few other Ulster players. The difference is that he was actually in fantastic form and challenging the top European teams with his performances, behind an inadequate pack. It is fair enough if you do not think he is ready but the reasons given so far do not quite fit the bill.

I'm not a Munster fan and I'm not a Leinster fan so of course I do not care as much about their players when it comes to selection. My interest is in seeing Ireland succeed but also in seeing our own Ulster players succeeding at international level. And the success is not in getting selected and getting capped, but in performing to the very highest level. Having said that, you have a very valid point in that the examples you cite are not knocking down the door either but Schmidt has to take the players he has and mould a team Take McFadden- without Bowe and the Kearneys it was only between him and Gilroy and he can cover more positions. He's played poorly for Leinster but Schmidt knows exactly how to get him to perform and so Schmidt can rely on him regardless of his provincial form. There's not 23 players on the island in good form this season. Schmidt knows he can coax a performance out of him, and he very much did coax two good performances out of him, so I have no issue with it. The performances justify the selection. Similarly with Madigan- i've said he's cost us in the past. But the mistakes he's made which have cost us games are very similar to a few of the errors Paddy made last night. And then Madigan has a better kicking percentage- in fact he's probably the best goal kicker in the country. So again, I have no issues with it. I did at the start of the Six Nations want Jackson on the bench. I want Jackson on the bench in South Africa. But- it's a 50/50 call. It's hard to get worked up about it when our best performances this season in Europe have come with a running game that Madigan is equally good at. It's the kicking game where both players fall down and I haven't really seen Jackson really steer us home with a nerveless display of tactical kicking any more than I've seen Madigan do it.

What I will say is this; I'm not critical to knock our players down, but rather critical because I want them to succeed more than other players. I know how talented Jackson is- he is every bit as talented as any other 10 in these islands. Would he be rated alongside them by neutrals? I doubt it. What he has to prove is he has the desire and mentality to make the most of those talents, which he hasn't done yet in the eyes of the wider rugby world. I want to judge this Ulster team and the players in this team by their own potential, not against others. I'm often wrong about things, I'll say that now but I'm not going to talk up players because we share an accent.

Paddy may well have been disrupted by going back and forth from Ireland to Ulster- well, if he's on the bench he's one twisted ankle away from coming on in a test match in the most important position on the pitch. Thats pretty disruptive too. He needs to show he can adapt and slot in quickly. Fans can make that excuse for him, but coaches won't. They want to see how he reacts when he is told he's not in the team. They want to see him fight! I think if we dropped Sexton from the 23 during the Six Nations and sent him back to Leinster the same week, you'd probably see some fireworks the next time he took to the field. You'd see a player out to play at this best to make a big point to the coach who overlooked him. It's always frustrating when it's our players who are overlooked and you don't get that reaction. I was happy with Gilroy for this reason. He played with some fire in the belly and a lot of confidence.

There's no need to get too animated about this. There's a big world outside rugby and Paddy has been a great player for us. I love watching him play, he's a great talent. Some of the back line moves he's a part of are worth the price of my season ticket. And he comes across as being well-balanced and happy. Who am I to judge him? I don't. Posts on here can come across as being negative or critical, when I'm just trying to be realistic.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 4:17 pm

Munchkin A-, but you're getting the idea.
Rory Gallagher E/F, may I suggest you spend a few hours on the Glasgow Edinburgh ongoing waste of time thread till you see the light.
Notch the Naughty Step for you. Your post reminded me that I'm midway through Vassily Grossman's epic novel of the Soviet Union's suffering in the Second World War, Life And Fate. Except Stalingrad was funnier and shorter.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Notch on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 4:18 pm

Laugh

Apologies jimbo, thats it from me on the subject Hug

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by George Carlin on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 4:33 pm

With my luddite hat at a jaunty angle, I also haven't understood why PJ hasn't been Sextons's understudy this international campaign because I agree that Madigan just hasn't been very good and Hanrahan probably hasn't had enough game time.

The Sexton question is difficult because he casts such a long shadow. He is the most recent choice of Lions test fly half, has won 2 Heineken Cups and a Grand Slam. It's not a problem unique to Schmidt to prefer a player automatically if they come with a blue blood pedigree like that. He's an Unflushable and would probably have to actively be missing a limb to be dropped. It doesn't look like a problem for Ireland but actually it is.

Incidentally I enjoy reading all of the Ulster fans' comments here because I learn something new. If you only spend time on the Scottish threads then all you really learn is that drinking and typing rarely ends well.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by jimbopip on Sat 26 Mar 2016, 5:39 pm

George Carlin wrote:With my luddite hat at a jaunty angle, I also haven't understood why PJ hasn't been Sextons's understudy this international campaign because I agree that Madigan just hasn't been very good and Hanrahan probably hasn't had enough game time.

The Sexton question is difficult because he casts such a long shadow. He is the most recent choice of Lions test fly half, has won 2 Heineken Cups and a Grand Slam. It's not a problem unique to Schmidt to prefer a player automatically if they come with a blue blood pedigree like that. He's an Unflushable and would probably have to actively be missing a limb to be dropped. It doesn't look like a problem for Ireland but actually it is.

Incidentally I enjoy reading all of the Ulster fans' comments here because I learn something new. If you only spend time on the Scottish threads then all you really learn is that drinking and typing rarely ends well.

Which is why I always wear a seat belt.

p.s. Big Naka turned the ball over often enough to make me wonder if there is a point with Fijian players where, at a deep subconscious level, they get bored with rugby because it's too easy and they start playing against themselves just to make it interesting. We could call this the Matawalu Gambit.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by Hazel Sapling on Sun 27 Mar 2016, 9:39 pm

Well probably a fair enough result.
- The ref did a huge amount wrong but Hogg deserved the yellow. Lacey needs to forget about this game because he had a mare
- Kiss only brought on Warwick for the last 5, did not bring on Andrews and I missed when McCall came on. Don't see how on Scotstoun pitch (at the moment) you can leave your front row on longer than 65 minutes (really an hour) unless you do not trust the replacements.
- Jackson struggled a bit and Ulster need a better option than Windsor (or Humphries) on the bench. Anyone signed for next season?
- The Ulster pack did a good job in the loose disrupting ball (legally and illegally) in the first. They struggled to stop Glasgow behind the gainline and turn over the ball in the second once Glasgow adjusted. Really think they need another quality lock or put Henderson there and find another carrier back row to go with Coetzee next season. The pack is what keeps Ulster from being Leinster level (Schmidt's Leinster) scary to play
- It was a game where 7's could not thrive because Lacey was useless. Fusaro was lost early but today was not a game for him/Favaro. More of a game for Holmes.
- Centres for Glasgow were poor but Seymour and Hogg were fantastic. Seymour is a Lion's wing (tourist, maybe starter) at this point in time with North and whoever else people prefer. Hogg may start for the Lions though still not sold on some of his play (brain farts mostly).
- Russell had a good game and want him to spend the summer with Paterson. His kicking is the easiest place to improve to the next level.  
- Naka had an infuriating game. Gray had an excellent one. Still got some work to do but that scrum needs testing against the Edinburgh's of the world before I feel we can expect parity against anyone. Looks good enough against anyone but the best though.

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

Post by TJ on Sun 27 Mar 2016, 10:34 pm

jimbopip wrote:

p.s. Big Naka turned the ball over often enough to make me wonder if there is a point with Fijian players where, at a deep subconscious level, they get bored with rugby because it's too easy and they start playing against themselves just to make it interesting. We could call this the Matawalu Gambit.

Its simply a byproduct of making all those offloads and looking for them all the time. He is more restrained than he used to be tho - we now see him going to ground sometimes rather than offloading or attempting to everytime. When you offload loads in a game then you will also concede turnovers

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Re: Glasgow Warriors v Ulster Rugby, 25 March

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