European rugby, the interest just isn't there

First topic message reminder :

I know I will get a bashing off some quarters on here, but sorry it has to be said, looking at the crowds for the two semi-finals on the weekend, it would seem the interest is not there. The aggregate figure for the two games was a paltry 38,968 people, there was more people than that for the Cardiff Blues V Leicester semi final a few years ago 44,212 turned up that day.

This proves that the greedy club owners have ruined a once prestigious competition, admired by thousands and getting better year on year. Where are all these new massive sponsorship deals ? Where is all this money we are supposed to be swimming in ? 

All I saw on the weekend was empty seats, the future of the European club competition for me looks bleak, dwindling crowds, the same teams ALL the time in the knockout stages, lack of interest, the French already consider their own league a priority, for me something drastic needs to be done as it would seem the writing is on the wall for one of our favourite club competitions, it's sad, as it's been well and truly ruined by the greedy club owners.

Take a read of some of these, you might find them interesting:-

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2016/04/25/empty-seats-as-saracens-and-racing-92-won-through-must-be-a-wake/
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/much-better-europe-champions-cup-11238143

To put into context how low the crowds were, both SFs got lower crowds than the recent Spanish Rugby Cup Final (26,500).

always the irish that obsess about crowds at semi final stage as a measure of the success of a competition. thats more than a little self serving dont ya think?

theres a great chance (about 50:50) of england winning 6N grand slam AND the euro club competition. how many times has that been done before? ireland in 2009 and france in 2010. twice.

no mean feat. i suspect the casual fans will tune in as the Champs cup draws closer. Bt didnt pay for the TV rights based on how many fans will travel to Lyon to watch...if anything the opposite...

quinsforever wrote:always the irish that obsess about crowds at semi final stage as a measure of the success of a competition. thats more than a little self serving dont ya think?

Is that why a welshman made this thread? No doubt the EPRC will be embarrassed about how low the crowds were and this will hopefully force them to drop ticket prices in years to come. I wonder if the bump in ticket prices has something to do with not getting as much in sponsorship as they were hoping? Maybe they were trying to make up for a shortfall somewhere?

Indeed, BT paid for empty stadiums. The TV fans love it

...we did it from only three chances

It's a biscuit!!!!

It's a biscuit bar

Traitor Munch! That's offering them a get-out clause.

this whole Poopie show was caused by the numpties at ERC signing a deal with SKY at inferior prices that forced this whole compromise.

until BT or SKY get exclusivity, the commercial revenues outside the TV rights that are already agreed, will be much less than they should be.

once it gets renewed it will be either BT or SKY, or maybe the latest newcomer who wants content, and then the whole commercial setup will become businesslike, rather than a Union-driven cluster fack compromise.

It's still a Union driven clusterfeck???

Well, that explains it! The bar has melted. It's not a biscuit or a bar...it's shyte and it's destroyed the inside of my pocket...the basterde!

SecretFly wrote:Traitor Munch!  That's offering them a get-out clause.

Sorry

quinsforever wrote:this whole Poopie show was caused by the numpties at ERC signing a deal with SKY at inferior prices that forced this whole compromise.

until BT or SKY get exclusivity, the commercial revenues outside the TV rights that are already agreed, will be much less than they should be.

once it gets renewed it will be either BT or SKY, or maybe the latest newcomer who wants content, and then the whole commercial setup will become businesslike, rather than a Union-driven cluster fack compromise.

Hardly inferior IF the ERC were getting a much better sponsorship deal. There's not much hope of a much better deal if BT get the exclusive rights given how pooly their champions league coverage is doing.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/champions-league-could-return-terrestrial-7736565

quinsforever wrote:this whole Poopie show was caused by the numpties at ERC signing a deal with SKY at inferior prices that forced this whole compromise.

until BT or SKY get exclusivity, the commercial revenues outside the TV rights that are already agreed, will be much less than they should be.

once it gets renewed it will be either BT or SKY, or maybe the latest newcomer who wants content, and then the whole commercial setup will become businesslike, rather than a Union-driven cluster fack compromise.

"It's the Unions fault, because it's Union driven"

the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

if somethings worth saying its worth saying twice

quinsforever wrote:the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

What compromise? The the split broadcasting? Maybe you should read up on a bit of history, quins.

Are BT like the young kid with wealthy parents who just got his first big contribution to his bank balance.

He wants this, he buys that, he rides the other (a polo pony... stop being dirty minded)....but he can't really concentrate on anything in particular because simply...................... he doesn't care. He has loadsa money, the freedom excites him, he just has spend, spend, spend jitters but no real commitment to anything......

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

quinsforever wrote:this whole Poopie show was caused by the numpties at ERC signing a deal with SKY at inferior prices that forced this whole compromise.

until BT or SKY get exclusivity, the commercial revenues outside the TV rights that are already agreed, will be much less than they should be.

once it gets renewed it will be either BT or SKY, or maybe the latest newcomer who wants content, and then the whole commercial setup will become businesslike, rather than a Union-driven cluster fack compromise.

Hardly inferior IF the ERC were getting a much better sponsorship deal. There's not much hope of a much better deal if BT get the exclusive rights given how pooly their champions league coverage is doing.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/champions-league-could-return-terrestrial-7736565

Also if BT get exclusive rights it will be the end of European rugby. Their coverage is beyond awful.

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

What compromise? The the split broadcasting? Maybe you should read up on a bit of history, quins.

yes. PRL signed something they had the rights to aka their own games. ERC signed something they didnt have the rights to aka a competition including english AP teams. deny it if you like but that is a legally accurate description of how a dentist and some clueless blazers screwed the commercial potential of the new competition.

quinsforever wrote:if somethings worth saying its worth saying twice

You can say that again.

After the death of Paul Daniels... I hear nostalgia is about to bring back variety TV in a big way....

If BT hears about this tingling in the air......

Pay Five Billion for all Variety show rights on UK soil now!!!! Now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - Nobody else can show a fecking dog sawing a singing cat in half or we sue them!

but not to worry. even failing to fulfil its commercial potential, the new format is vastly improved in terms of fairness, competitiveness and quality.

so to we the consumers it is already much improved.

plus english and french sides are dominating, so the tv rights are proving valuable indeed to the sponsors.

3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

quinsforever wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

What compromise? The the split broadcasting? Maybe you should read up on a bit of history, quins.

yes. PRL signed something they had the rights to aka their own games. ERC signed something they didnt have the rights to aka a competition including english AP teams. deny it if you like but that is a legally accurate description of how a dentist and some clueless blazers screwed the commercial potential of the new competition.

...as distinct from a 1970s used car salesman and Del Boy?

quinsforever wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

What compromise? The the split broadcasting? Maybe you should read up on a bit of history, quins.

yes. PRL signed something they had the rights to aka their own games. ERC signed something they didnt have the rights to aka a competition including english AP teams. deny it if you like but that is a legally accurate description of how a dentist and some clueless blazers screwed the commercial potential of the new competition.

The PRL had no right (morally) to sign BT up to a Euro Competition that didn't exist. ERC had every right to continue their deal with SKY, and why not. It was successful, unlike what we are getting now....

Ultimately the compromise was the end result of the two broadcasters coming to an agreement, after battling it out who should have the rights. Legally, both must have been entitled to sign, otherwise it would have went to court, and one side would have won sole rights.

quinsforever wrote:but not to worry. even failing to fulfil its commercial potential, the new format is vastly improved in terms of fairness, competitiveness and quality.

so to we the consumers it is already much improved.

plus english and french sides are dominating, so the tv rights are proving valuable indeed to the sponsors.

3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

Yeah, it's a great competition for Daz and Iceland finger food.

quinsforever wrote:but not to worry. even failing to fulfil its commercial potential, the new format is vastly improved in terms of fairness, competitiveness and quality.

so to we the consumers it is already much improved.

plus english and french sides are dominating, so the tv rights are proving valuable indeed to the sponsors.

3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

Munchkin wrote:

The PRL had no right (morally) to sign BT up to a Euro Competition that didn't exist.

They had to sign them up, someone had to pay something to keep the photos of the raunchy night before in the hotel room off the front pages of the Mail.  If you're compromised and your lover's under the same sheets.... you have commitments.... or it could get nasty...

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:but not to worry. even failing to fulfil its commercial potential, the new format is vastly improved in terms of fairness, competitiveness and quality.

so to we the consumers it is already much improved.

plus english and french sides are dominating, so the tv rights are proving valuable indeed to the sponsors.

3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

Looks like he speaks for everyone now.

Look I'm delighted for the English that they're on their way to a Heineken...I mean a SwissWatch win. I know the feeling and it's obviously a lovely one, and pretty much all the lads here, be they Welsh, Scottish etc, should have the feeling once or a few times.

So to hell with it, Quinns is in a good mood. Many English lads will be in a good mood. Enjoy the moment boys.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:but not to worry. even failing to fulfil its commercial potential, the new format is vastly improved in terms of fairness, competitiveness and quality.

so to we the consumers it is already much improved.

plus english and french sides are dominating, so the tv rights are proving valuable indeed to the sponsors.

3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

Looks like he speaks for everyone now.

In his own mind

I haven't watched a euro final since Wasps Toulouse, when a friend had a spare ticket. I don't want Sky.
It's a club competition. If irish or welsh fans want to support a side other than their own because it supports a national flag - that is up to them.
English and French fans are not necessarily of the same mindset in order to buy a ticket. If Saracens beat Racing, good for them, but I will not fret about it.

quinsforever wrote:3m watched the racing stade qf in france for example...

They were not watching BT Sport though, were they ?

Why does that matter?

Because perhaps the channel the French watched it on was free to air. It makes a difference.

So just to recap, the 'new' tournament isn't as good because there's only 1 Italian team, there's games on more than 1 channel, gates for the semis were low, there's lot of French watching free tv (which doesn't count) and the games (particularly the latter stages by reading things here) are a bit boring and lacking quality of the previous years.

Must have missed something I'm sure.

No 7&1/2 wrote:So just to recap, the 'new' tournament isn't as good because there's only 1 Italian team, there's games on more than 1 channel, gates for the semis were low, there's lot of French watching free tv (which doesn't count) and the games (particularly the latter stages by reading things here) are a bit boring and lacking quality of the previous years.

Must have missed something I'm sure.

The IRFU can't buy it any longer. You forgot that key one.

Ah money. Forgot that. Either too much or too little depending on the day.

PhilBB wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:So just to recap, the 'new' tournament isn't as good because there's only 1 Italian team, there's games on more than 1 channel, gates for the semis were low, there's lot of French watching free tv (which doesn't count) and the games (particularly the latter stages by reading things here) are a bit boring and lacking quality of the previous years.

Must have missed something I'm sure.

The IRFU can't buy it any longer. You forgot that key one.

No Toulon and Saracen s aare buying it these days phill, well there very wealthy backers, not hard work though.

carpet baboon wrote:

No Toulon and Saracen s  aare buying it these days phill, well there very wealthy backers, not hard work though.

So tell me how much Mourad put in last year.

Do tell.

Haha phill. They made it all on there own didn't they. No pesky union help.

Just to cut in, people prefer Sky to BT's coverage ?

carpet baboon wrote:Haha phill. They made it all on there own didn't they. No pesky union help.

Well, tell me. The figures are publicly available.

quinsforever wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

quinsforever wrote:the compromise was union driven. bunch of uncommercial blazers who probably in a prior incarnation were responsible for negotiating the construction of the scottish parliament building in holyrood...

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/holyrood-s-world-class-price-overrun-1-662229

a facking dentist was in charge ffs.

What compromise? The the split broadcasting? Maybe you should read up on a bit of history, quins.

yes. PRL signed something they had the rights to aka their own games. ERC signed something they didnt have the rights to aka a competition including english AP teams. deny it if you like but that is a legally accurate description of how a dentist and some clueless blazers screwed the commercial potential of the new competition.

Mark McCafferty was on the commerical board of the ERC, wasn't he? He is a clueless blazer now.

I see Bruce Craig is on the executive board of the new Organisation EPRC! You think he would have got Dyson to sponsor it as it sucks.

Neil Francis: Even Dan Carter can't draw in Champions Cup crowds
Without the enthusiasm of Celtic nations, Europe's main competition is on the wane just two years after being hijacked

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/champions-cup/neil-francis-even-dan-carter-cant-draw-in-champions-cup-crowds-34666764.html

neil francis wrote:Revenue generation from selling out stadiums is good for your bottom line but a big crowd watching a good game needs no further promotion or marketing. Television pictures of vast swathes of empty seats in Nottingham and Reading - you wince at the emptiness of it all.

I prefer BT coverage. By a mile. But I would rather either sky or bt had it. Both is lose-lose for literally everyone

Quoting Neil Francis is like mentioning the nazis...an admission you have lost t'internet...

Quoting Neil Francis is like mentioning the nazis...an admission you have lost t'internet...

If I remember correctly the PRL had to have all the deals agreed to by the rfu. Which is why when the rfu found out about the European deal through a member of another union, the PRL boys got dragged I to HQ and given quite a stern talking too., then again over the salary cap, then again after bts last fishing trip about a new league on behalf of there PRL buddies. Oh and Simon "my mates got me this job to help them out" halidays comments about the PRL running the England national team also brought a heffty rebuke.
All's not as cuddly between the PRL and rfu as they like to make out.

But the main point being the PRL aint whiter than anyone in there selling of things without permission

munkian wrote:Just to cut in, people prefer Sky to BT's coverage ?

Yes. BT's coverage looks amateurish- and Craig Doyle would be better off presenting a travel programme. Sara Elgan is a bit fluffy.

Stuart Barnes has been at it a lot longer than Dallagio & Co.