Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

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Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by beninho on Fri 17 Jun 2016, 2:00 pm

First topic message reminder :

McLaren wrote:
beninho wrote:Having concerns about EU immigration does not make you a far right nutter or xenophobe. Mclaren, what is your knowledge on EU immigration, what dealings do you have with it? Can you see why people may have concerns about it?


Unless your concerns about how we can offer a more humane immigration system then you are xenophobe.  If you are worried about the geographical location of where someone popped out of a uterus then you are not thinking rationally.

And no, I cannot see why anyone would have any issue with the current levels of immigration to/from the UK.  Unless as I said above you are worried about how some people coming here are treated.

Do you not agree that an expanding population due to EU immigration, would lead to an extra burden on the NHS, housing, benefit and other public services aswell as the rise in rents?

Do you think that EU immigration, where people get fake payslips in order to claim benefits, working tax credits child tax credits and housing assistance? Or people that work minimal hours and tdo not pay any tax or nino who then can claim housing and benefit assistance? Or people that illegally overstay in the country, in order to achieve a loophole and gain housing or benefit assistance.

All of these are ongoing issues, though you did not answer my question in the first place.


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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:16 am

Roller_Coaster wrote:It comes to something when an 18 year old with only 120 (ish) days experience of first team football legitimately stakes a claim for man of the match (for England) in a 4 minute appearance during which he made 2 or 3 dribbles that resulted in nothing more than a corner.

Looked at the BBC ratings and was staggered that they all got 4 out of 10, bar Hart who got 3. How they scored so highly is beyond me.

The previous worst performance I'd ever seen by England was the 2-2 draw with Greece, only saved by David Beckham doing (almost literally) everything for England on his own.

Last night plumbed new depths. I genuinely believe that half the teams in the Vanarama Conference would have been able to get a draw or better out of it.

Hart - I can't even gain solace in a pitiful hair washing based gag. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he missed his head with his hands when trying to wash his hair last night. No. Tried and no solace in even that.

Walker - Spent 2 games attacking his t*ts off and all last night bumbling round and then simply stopping when he got the ball.
Rose - Likewise.

Cahill - Was a better centre forward than a defender, and was the worst centre forward in the world.
Smalling - Very scary that he's possibly England's best centre back. Very scary.

Alli - Hugely inexperienced and it showed. Resorted to ineffectual running round and couldn't control the ball or pass to save his granny from an horrific knitting accident.
Dier - Somehow collapsed from a calm, confident, competent DM into someone that Wilshere came on to replace.
Rooney - Couldn't pass, control, run, dribble, see, encourage, inspire, think, shoot, tackle, talk, grow hair, mix a shandy, spark up a fag. Nailed on to be next England Manager. At least he won't earn around £2,000,000 in the few weeks before the season starts again...

Sterling - As effective as the currency over the last 4 days. Enough said.
Sturridge - Ran, got ball, stopped, wafted feet round, didn't pass it, dribbled into a defender, sulked. Rubbish.
Kane - Suffice to say that his dead ball kicks were at one and the same time, the worst I've seen from a professional footballer and yet the best facet of his game last night. Awful.

Subs
Vardy - Ran very quickly. Nowhere. Without the ball. Or a chance of receiving the ball.
Wilshere - I would say he was as good as Rooney in all the aforementioned skills. Except he wasn't.
Rashford - Man of match in 4 minutes by actually achieving nothing. Did look like he tried a bit though.

Hodgson - A nice, polite, well spoken man, utterly lost in his position. Seemingly devoid of ideas, tactics and when people with under 150 minutes of football in a season should be left at home.

Whereas

Sonofsonofson (entire Iceland team) knew what they had to do, how to do it, when to do it, where everyone else would be when they were doing it and when not to do it and shoe it away.
Brilliant! Superb summation. thumbsup
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:23 am

JAS wrote:
super_realist wrote:JAS,
Rangers played in the second tier of one of Europe's WORST nations in terms of football.

England may be a diabolical team in international terms with woefully over-rated players, but even a team that bad and that disjointed doesn't deserve a manager as low rent as Warburton, obviously he couldn't do any worse than one win in two tournaments, but to put him forward for England manager would be hilarious. It wouldn't be a step forward in the slightest.

So? I did say it would be too early to give him the reigns but unlike the others on the shortlist his stock is actually on the rise, If Rangers start the SPL well, Warburton will be gone to the premiership come Jan.  As for the England job I hope the likes of Southgate or Neville get it. Is there really such a vacuum in English managerial talent that those 2 are even being seriously considered??


I'm sure you could name lots of English managers who's stock is on the rise, but mentioning the manager of a tin pot team in a tin pot league is pushing the boundaries a bit far, even for an International team as bad as England.

Lennon waltzed the SPL, but was absolutely dreadful with Bolton in the Championship, whilst Scottish Cup winning manager Stubbs went to effing Rotherham as a "step up". Someone like Warburton is unlikely to do much better than get a leg up to Charlton, Wigan etc

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Yadsendew on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:33 am

Roller_Coaster wrote:It comes to something when an 18 year old with only 120 (ish) days experience of first team football legitimately stakes a claim for man of the match (for England) in a 4 minute appearance during which he made 2 or 3 dribbles that resulted in nothing more than a corner.

Looked at the BBC ratings and was staggered that they all got 4 out of 10, bar Hart who got 3. How they scored so highly is beyond me.

The previous worst performance I'd ever seen by England was the 2-2 draw with Greece, only saved by David Beckham doing (almost literally) everything for England on his own.

Last night plumbed new depths. I genuinely believe that half the teams in the Vanarama Conference would have been able to get a draw or better out of it.

Hart - I can't even gain solace in a pitiful hair washing based gag. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he missed his head with his hands when trying to wash his hair last night. No. Tried and no solace in even that.

Walker - Spent 2 games attacking his t*ts off and all last night bumbling round and then simply stopping when he got the ball.
Rose - Likewise.

Cahill - Was a better centre forward than a defender, and was the worst centre forward in the world.
Smalling - Very scary that he's possibly England's best centre back. Very scary.

Alli - Hugely inexperienced and it showed. Resorted to ineffectual running round and couldn't control the ball or pass to save his granny from an horrific knitting accident.
Dier - Somehow collapsed from a calm, confident, competent DM into someone that Wilshere came on to replace.
Rooney - Couldn't pass, control, run, dribble, see, encourage, inspire, think, shoot, tackle, talk, grow hair, mix a shandy, spark up a fag. Nailed on to be next England Manager. At least he won't earn around £2,000,000 in the few weeks before the season starts again...

Sterling - As effective as the currency over the last 4 days. Enough said.
Sturridge - Ran, got ball, stopped, wafted feet round, didn't pass it, dribbled into a defender, sulked. Rubbish.
Kane - Suffice to say that his dead ball kicks were at one and the same time, the worst I've seen from a professional footballer and yet the best facet of his game last night. Awful.

Subs
Vardy - Ran very quickly. Nowhere. Without the ball. Or a chance of receiving the ball.
Wilshere - I would say he was as good as Rooney in all the aforementioned skills. Except he wasn't.
Rashford - Man of match in 4 minutes by actually achieving nothing. Did look like he tried a bit though.

Hodgson - A nice, polite, well spoken man, utterly lost in his position. Seemingly devoid of ideas, tactics and when people with under 150 minutes of football in a season should be left at home.

Whereas

Sonofsonofson (entire Iceland team) knew what they had to do, how to do it, when to do it, where everyone else would be when they were doing it and when not to do it and shoe it away.

This is the best post I've read since the debacle - thanks

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by McLaren on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:35 am

It would be pretty good if the FA tempted "the special one" before he even set foot in Old Trafford.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:38 am

Roller, that's eminent.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by JAS on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:40 am

We shall see, he was tapped about the Everton job before Koeman expressed an interest. Tin pot league it may be but where did Ferguson learn his trade? There may well be a lot of English managers whose stock is on the rise, how many will have dealt with the expectations that come with the Rangers (or Celtic job). Those jobs are almost on a par with the England one in terms of being a poison chalice, overladen with expectation, media scrutiny etc.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:41 am

MontysMerkin wrote:It pretty much sums up the national psyche, bunch of over-privileged know-it-alls failing time and time again to realise they are just Poopie, and unworthy of winning an under 12 girls 5-a-side tournament, let alone one played by grown-ups.
unfortunately people with that psyche can vote

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:45 am

navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:Statistically they are correct, but never underestimate the power of pathetic, moronic and easily-led, xenophobic (probably chanting some cowpat about the war - 'no it was the Russians you silly billy') little englanders to think we have any relevancy in the modern world football.
Actually, no it wasn't.
Alright, Russians and Americans.. (and the channel)
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:56 am

JAS wrote:We shall see, he was tapped about the Everton job before Koeman expressed an interest. Tin pot league it may be but where did Ferguson learn his trade? There may well be a lot of English managers whose stock is on the rise, how many will have dealt with the expectations that come with the Rangers (or Celtic job). Those jobs are almost on a par with the England one in terms of being a poison chalice, overladen with expectation, media scrutiny etc.

When Ferguson was there the gulf between Scotland and England was nowhere near as great. Aberdeen and Dundee United were making Euro finals and European Cup semi's. Nowadays you can't even get a Scottish team through the qualifying stages of these events and they get hammered by Swedish teams, so comparing Ferguson of 80's Aberdeen to 2016 dross like Rangers or Celtic is a joke.

There hasn't been a good manager from Celtic or Rangers since Martin O Neill. Neither club can attract truly top players or managers any more, bit like England.
Celtic and Rangers are only big clubs to the fans, no one else thinks they are big. No one cares if you win the SPL, it's a coin toss, a worthless achievement and is thinking very small and is extremely unambitious if you want to go there.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 10:59 am

MontysMerkin wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:Statistically they are correct, but never underestimate the power of pathetic, moronic and easily-led, xenophobic (probably chanting some cowpat about the war - 'no it was the Russians you silly billy') little englanders to think we have any relevancy in the modern world football.
Actually, no it wasn't.
Alright, Russians and Americans.. (and the channel)
Clearly, the members of the British and Commonwealth Armed Forces at the time did nothing and contributed nothing. At all. At any time. My mistake. They had nothing to do with the campaign in Africa, Burma etc, the Atlantic. No prevention of Goering's Luftwaffe softening up of Britain prior to its invasion in 1940. No breaking of Enigma. No pioneering 'tube alloys' (look it up). No involvement in D-Day or its followup. No involvement in the campaigns through Sicily and into Italy. No convoys into the North Atlantic to help keep the U.S.S.R. in the war prior to them getting their feet underneath them. Etc etc. Nothing...
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:04 am

Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:17 am

MontysMerkin wrote:Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.

You are absolutely right Monty. Until England stop thinking they have a right to beat teams, they are always going to fail.

England have to realise they are not a team that has skill, tactics or a track record of success. There is no reason at all that they should beat Iceland, or any other team that was in the Euro's. It's arrogance beyond belief to think that just because they have more money and a bigger population that this equates to guaranteed success over those with less, not least because endeavour and effort costs nothing of which England demonstrably have none.

I was beginning to warm to Ferdinand, but this again just shows that he's not as clever as he looks, and he looks like an idiot.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Roller_Coaster on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:25 am

MontysMerkin wrote:Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.

Well, factually we are were the same as Russia and Slovakia and better than Wales. Iceland were better. Opinially (sic) I agree with you though!

Thank *uck we didn't play Portugal, and oh lordy I'm glad we're not in Paris for the French. Either of those could feasibly have been 6 or 7 nil, if we defended well...

A whole new low, and that's from me, a person that tries to be objective about football but is, nonetheless, afflicted with the incurable disease of being a fan. Of England. Ouch.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:27 am

I share your pain - like I say, 30 odd years of disappointment and I still get worked up.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:30 am

I suppose the question would be, rather than be disappointed, why isn't this what you expect to happen?

Why be disappointed that England consistently reach the level they deserve to be at?

OK, you underperformed in Brazil, but where they got to at Euro 2016 is where they were expected to get to. Losing to Iceland is neither a disgrace, nor is it a surprise given their recent results.

If England were a golfer, this would be them playing to their handicap.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by McLaren on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:37 am

Super

I don't think Rio was saying that the England team as it stands should be beating those teams but that given the wealth and infrastructure of the FA and football in general in the UK England should be producing a team capable of getting to later stages of major finals.

Would you not agree that a properly run England should beat those teams.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:40 am

But it doesn't seem to be about skill, money, fitness, etc. It's bottle, pure n simple. They are the Lee Westwood of the football world.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:46 am

McLaren wrote:Super

I don't think Rio was saying that the England team as it stands should be beating those teams but that given the wealth and infrastructure of the FA and football in general in the UK England should be producing a team capable of getting to later stages of major finals.

Would you not agree that a properly run England should beat those teams.

Mac, it's a terribly antiquated attitude though, don't you think?
The size of a population or the facilities  is no match for individual talent or endeavour. Football has changed since large countries rant rampant over the smaller ones. You only have to look at Wales, Iceland and ever NI to see that.

I don't see England's players as being massively talented (can you name ANY English player in the last 20 years who has been anything other than AVERAGE in their England career?), they perform exactly to their level at almost every tournament. Iceland have improved amazingly over the years, so Ferdinand's assertion they should be beating Iceland shows how much he's living in the past and how little he knows about Iceland and how they've progressed.

England shouldn't be beating anyone at International football. They've won ONCE in the last two tournaments and that win needed a stoppage time goal. Why would you expect to beat anyone on that record?

There are tons of countries like England that have the FA and the facilities, but fail similarly, England are not a special case, and we see regularly that they simply aren't good enough and that they're players are made to look good in the EPL because of those around them.


Last edited by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:50 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Roller_Coaster on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:50 am

super_realist wrote:I suppose the question would be, rather than be disappointed, why isn't this what you expect to happen?

Why be disappointed that England consistently reach the level they deserve to be at?

OK, you underperformed in Brazil, but where they got to at Euro 2016 is where they were expected to get to. Losing to Iceland is neither a disgrace, nor is it a surprise given their recent results.

If England were a golfer, this would be them playing to their handicap.

It's down to being a fan. An intangible something that unwillingly parks rationality in favour of emotive derived possibility.

Where the word "could" drives hope beyond expectation.


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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by JAS on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:52 am

McLaren wrote:Super

I don't think Rio was saying that the England team as it stands should be beating those teams but that given the wealth and infrastructure of the FA and football in general in the UK England should be producing a team capable of getting to later stages of major finals.

Would you not agree that a properly run England should beat those teams.

No because successful football is about commitment, teamwork, hard work, work ethic, skill & tactics NOT money and resources. Didn't you learn anything when Leicester won the premiership?, or an even better example being Denmark winning the '92 Euros?. If it were all so predictable why have 24 teams going to the finals? why not give Germany, Spain, Italy, England and France bye's direct to the Q/Fs and have qualifiers for the other 3 spaces?

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:53 am

I don't see the likes of Russia, Sweden, Switzerland, Hungary etc crying into their collective disappointment.

Where has this unrealistic expectation come from?

If I was playing a pro at golf, would I be disappointed to lose? How could I be.
Similarly, if I was England and I didn't reach the QF, what reason would I have for disappointment? There's 8 better teams there, England have no seeded right to get there, so why be disappointed when you don't?

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Roller_Coaster on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:54 am

JAS wrote:
McLaren wrote:Super

I don't think Rio was saying that the England team as it stands should be beating those teams but that given the wealth and infrastructure of the FA and football in general in the UK England should be producing a team capable of getting to later stages of major finals.

Would you not agree that a properly run England should beat those teams.

No because successful football is about commitment, teamwork, hard work, work ethic, skill & tactics NOT money and resources.  Didn't you learn anything when Leicester won the premiership?, or an even better example being Denmark winning the '92 Euros?. If it were all so predictable why have 24 teams going to the finals? why not give Germany, Spain, Italy, England and France bye's direct to the Q/Fs and have qualifiers for the other 3 4 spaces?

Predictable amendment but I fixed it for you before Super gets there!!!

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 11:55 am

Roller OK

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 12:30 pm

He's not far off

http://bbc.in/29jdIIF

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 12:46 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.
Sheesh. For someone who allegedly teaches, you show a willingness not to actually deal with facts. I was challenging your daft comment re. the U.S.S.R. (note, not Russia) and then them and America. I have never said it was us (and only us) wot won it. You go ahead and paint it that way if you like though.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 12:52 pm

Woy in a nutshell

https://mobile.twitter.com/dannyswfc/status/747524044946345985/video/1

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:11 pm

super_realist wrote:What you have to ask is why the EU would be interested in admitting Scotland as a member. A small country with no tangible benefit to the Union, and no doubt a drain on it.
I can't really see why they'd want them.

True, but you could say the same about Greece and Portugal. I think passing the entry requirements is as easy as getting some GCSEs.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:34 pm

..and Romania, Bulgaria etc. Don't be daft super.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:41 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.
Sheesh. For someone who allegedly teaches, you show a willingness not to actually deal with facts. I was challenging your daft comment re. the U.S.S.R. (note, not Russia) and then them and America. I have never said it was us (and only us) wot won it. You go ahead and paint it that way if you like though.

Your comprehension needs some work my friend. I was talking about the cupid stunts who charge around following the England football team chanting things like "we won the war". And they let you mod? Sheesh. Shocked
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:43 pm

McLaren wrote:Super

I am sure there are some on the right who like the EU because of its positive impact on wealth creation but for a lot of people it is about a social union.  The logic is along the lines of; there is no point in me having workers rights if other in the continent don't.  You can fight for equality at quite a local level but via the institutions of the EU people across a whole continent benefit.

I agree in the UK the "SJW agenda" might not be at the forefront of peoples thoughts on the EU but it is in the rest of Europe.  

The EU is about bringing equality to 500 million people and basking in the diverse range of ideas and cultures across the continent.


Errr.... no it's not. It's about creating a common market to promote trade within and between member nations, and strengthening the collective trading position of EU resident businesses with non-EU counterparties.

Workers' rights is a by-product. If one country in the EU does not provide adequate workers' rights then companies in that country can operate more cheaply so it gives them an unfair advantage compared with other EU countries. Legislation exists to create a level playing field. Social union is irrelevent.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:49 pm

Yadsendew wrote:
1GrumpyGolfer wrote:Are our boots square, the ball oval, or a combination of both?

This lot are making Carlton Palmer look like a footballing genius!

Just seen this Grumpy - how very dare you - Carlton Palmer was a football genius.

Come on you Owls.

I remember going to an England game at Wembley in the early 90s (qualifier v San Marino? 1993?). The England team did a simple passing drill on the pitch as part of their warm up: pass it to your team mate 5 yards in front of you then run to the back of the line, the sort of drill you would get primary school children to do. But then the ball game to Carlton, and first it bounced off his shin and then he shanked the pass off at right angles. Didn't know whether to laugh or cry... last night's team gets close, but Palmer has got to be the worst player ever to play or England.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 1:52 pm

Gary Neville next England manager? Don't think that's likely. Not after his abject failure as manager at Valencia, and his association with Woy's Wonders.

But you never know with the FA...

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 2:00 pm

You have to wonder how Ross Barkley feels (and how bad he must have been in training) to sit on the bench for the whole shambolic 4 match run and not get a single minute on the pitch.

I understand why Stones didn't play, England's central defensive partnership was barely tested, but our midfield continually chopped and changed. Even Milner got a game!

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 2:17 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:Calm down my dear, at no time did I say we did nothing, but the truth of the matter is we would be speaking German now without the intervention of the Allied Axis. But our general attitude is we did it ourselves, due to a bloated sense of self importance, as you have so ably demonstrated.

As Rio demonstrates: Rio Ferdinand told BBC Breakfast: "We failed to beat Slovakia, we failed to beat Russia, we beat Wales with nine seconds to go and then lost to Iceland. With no disrespect, England should be beating those sides."

Why should we beat them? They are better than we are. Facts.
Sheesh. For someone who allegedly teaches, you show a willingness not to actually deal with facts. I was challenging your daft comment re. the U.S.S.R. (note, not Russia) and then them and America. I have never said it was us (and only us) wot won it. You go ahead and paint it that way if you like though.

Your comprehension needs some work my friend. I was talking about the cupid stunts who charge around following the England football team chanting things like "we won the war". And they let you mod? Sheesh. Shocked
You need to be explicit then, which you're clearly incapable of. Let's both agree to dislike the other's opinion and move on...
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by raycastleunited on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 2:23 pm

Roller_Coaster wrote:It comes to something when an 18 year old with only 120 (ish) days experience of first team football legitimately stakes a claim for man of the match (for England) in a 4 minute appearance during which he made 2 or 3 dribbles that resulted in nothing more than a corner.

Looked at the BBC ratings and was staggered that they all got 4 out of 10, bar Hart who got 3. How they scored so highly is beyond me.

The previous worst performance I'd ever seen by England was the 2-2 draw with Greece, only saved by David Beckham doing (almost literally) everything for England on his own.

Last night plumbed new depths. I genuinely believe that half the teams in the Vanarama Conference would have been able to get a draw or better out of it.

Hart - I can't even gain solace in a pitiful hair washing based gag. Although I wouldn't be surprised if he missed his head with his hands when trying to wash his hair last night. No. Tried and no solace in even that.

Walker - Spent 2 games attacking his t*ts off and all last night bumbling round and then simply stopping when he got the ball.
Rose - Likewise.

Cahill - Was a better centre forward than a defender, and was the worst centre forward in the world.
Smalling - Very scary that he's possibly England's best centre back. Very scary.

Alli - Hugely inexperienced and it showed. Resorted to ineffectual running round and couldn't control the ball or pass to save his granny from an horrific knitting accident.
Dier - Somehow collapsed from a calm, confident, competent DM into someone that Wilshere came on to replace.
Rooney - Couldn't pass, control, run, dribble, see, encourage, inspire, think, shoot, tackle, talk, grow hair, mix a shandy, spark up a fag. Nailed on to be next England Manager. At least he won't earn around £2,000,000 in the few weeks before the season starts again...

Sterling - As effective as the currency over the last 4 days. Enough said.
Sturridge - Ran, got ball, stopped, wafted feet round, didn't pass it, dribbled into a defender, sulked. Rubbish.
Kane - Suffice to say that his dead ball kicks were at one and the same time, the worst I've seen from a professional footballer and yet the best facet of his game last night. Awful.

Subs
Vardy - Ran very quickly. Nowhere. Without the ball. Or a chance of receiving the ball.
Wilshere - I would say he was as good as Rooney in all the aforementioned skills. Except he wasn't.
Rashford - Man of match in 4 minutes by actually achieving nothing. Did look like he tried a bit though.

Hodgson - A nice, polite, well spoken man, utterly lost in his position. Seemingly devoid of ideas, tactics and when people with under 150 minutes of football in a season should be left at home.

Whereas

Sonofsonofson (entire Iceland team) knew what they had to do, how to do it, when to do it, where everyone else would be when they were doing it and when not to do it and shoe it away.

Well done Roller. Pretty much somes it all up. Good shout to recall the Beckham v Greece match.

As bad as the players were, I think Hodgson has to take most of the blame for his failure to set the team up properly, his insistence on continuing with ineffective tactics and playing people out of position.

I thought Sterling started brightly and caused Iceland problems, but he faded badly. I don't think it was entirely his fault: if he'd stayed wide and run at the defence he would have been a handful but it looked like he had been asked to stay central where he was crowded out every time.

Sturridge was also asked to start wide right and cut inside. It was so predictable, after a few attacks the Iceland defenders knew the score and just showed him inside into trouble. If he had been on the left he could have gone outside got round the back and caused trouble because there was space out wide.

Kane looked lost. If Roy was so desperate to bring on Wilshire, he should have brought him on to replace Kane and then pushed Rooney up front where he is more effective and would have brought others in to play. Maybe Rooney would have converted one of the chances presented to Kane.

Iceland packed the centre and we just passed the ball in front of them and then tried to run or kick it through that wall, instead of stretching them and trying to go around the outside.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Yadsendew on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 3:05 pm

raycastleunited wrote:
Yadsendew wrote:
1GrumpyGolfer wrote:Are our boots square, the ball oval, or a combination of both?

This lot are making Carlton Palmer look like a footballing genius!

Just seen this Grumpy - how very dare you - Carlton Palmer was a football genius.

Come on you Owls.

I remember going to an England game at Wembley in the early 90s (qualifier v San Marino? 1993?). The England team did a simple passing drill on the pitch as part of their warm up: pass it to your team mate 5 yards in front of you then run to the back of the line, the sort of drill you would get primary school children to do. But then the ball game to Carlton, and first it bounced off his shin and then he shanked the pass off at right angles. Didn't know whether to laugh or cry... last night's team gets close, but Palmer has got to be the worst player ever to play or England.


Maybe, but who scored in that match? Yes the worst player ever to play for England. At least he played with passion and belief.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by JAS on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 3:26 pm

Roller_Coaster wrote:
JAS wrote:
McLaren wrote:Super

I don't think Rio was saying that the England team as it stands should be beating those teams but that given the wealth and infrastructure of the FA and football in general in the UK England should be producing a team capable of getting to later stages of major finals.

Would you not agree that a properly run England should beat those teams.

No because successful football is about commitment, teamwork, hard work, work ethic, skill & tactics NOT money and resources.  Didn't you learn anything when Leicester won the premiership?, or an even better example being Denmark winning the '92 Euros?. If it were all so predictable why have 24 teams going to the finals? why not give Germany, Spain, Italy, England and France bye's direct to the Q/Fs and have qualifiers for the other 3 4 spaces?

Predictable amendment but I fixed it for you before Super gets there!!!

Ha ha I get what you're saying Roller , but in terms of what Mac was trying to say i.e. the wealth and infrastructure of the FA (if not their performances in recent tournaments), they are part of the European "big 5"

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by JAS on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 3:34 pm

So what do our resident Jocks think of Lego hair's assertion that as Scotland voted to stay, the circumstances surrounding the 2014 Indy Ref have fundamentally changed and as such if she can't negotiate a deal with the EU to stay (can't see how that would work) that the logical conclusion would be another Indy ref.

As an aside, much as I don't like her, she's the one political leader that has actually acted and spoken like a leader in the past week.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by McLaren on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 3:53 pm

Jas

Leicester are well funded and properly run (pretty insulting to suggest otherwise is it not?). Don't they prove my point that if the FA used its resources effectively then England might have a better national team?

Or what about if the Leicester coaches and backroom staff run the England set up, do you think they would have been beaten by Iceland?


Jas

Agreed, lego hair seems to know what she is doing. A shame that Ruth Davidson is also on the wrong side because she also seems to be extremely bright. Shame their aren't transfers between political parties as I would pay big bucks to have those two run my party of choice.

As for indyref2 it pretty much has to happen. The SNP just had a pretty big win based on a manifesto that said they would seek to hold another one if things changed significantly, and things have changed significantly.

Not sure what to vote for should there be an indyref2 but right now the anger at being taken out of the EU would probably be enough for me to vote to leave if Scotland has a good to deal to remain part of the EU.

As I have said above being part of the EU is something that means a lot to me.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Tue 28 Jun 2016, 7:07 pm

JAS, The big thing about Scottish INdependence is finance. Oil makes zero money and the North Sea is effectively finished from new production.

Where would Scotland get its income? People will say GDP is higher in Scotland, even without oil, yet it's a misleading stat because it accounts for money made by mostly foreign companies and which doesn't stay in the country. You can't finance a country on whiskey revenue , shortbread and irn bru when so many people are on benefits, so few pay 40% rate tax and whose NHS demands are disproportionate. Scotland would be a wreck, and just because basket cases like Greece are in Europe, you'd think they would learn from that fiasco and not allow a potential begging basket like Scotland to enter and denude its resources and finances even further.

It is an easy point to make for any Scottish "remain" campaign that Scotland would struggle on its own but it's incredibly difficult for Krankie and her amateur party to persuade anyone that Scotland is financially viable. As usual they just blame other people, and try and appeal to their bigotry.
I could never vote for such a xenophobic party whose main agenda is being against Westminster regardless of what that means, so I'm surprised Mac is considering it.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by JAS on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 6:12 am

Aye it would be a whole different scenario if Scotland were to forge a deal to stay. Unlike the UK as a whole they would probably be a net recipient rather than a net contributor. That then in itself begs the question why would the EU want to do it? Then again by the same token why did they fight so hard to keep Greece on board?

I bow to your undoubted knowledge of the oil industry and it's likely contribution or more likely lack of contribution. The whisky, Irn Bru & shortbread argument is amusing, again I understand the basic thrust of that is, all those industries together don't contribute that much. However there is a bit that's missing...finance i.e. banking and insurance. I don't personally believe all the bluster from the remain campaign that if Britain exited, banking jobs would leave London in droves but....in the unlikely event that there is any truth in that then (an In Europe) Edinburgh would surely benefit, would it not? The same would go for other big multinationals in other industries wanting a european base.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by SmithersJones on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 10:20 am

I've heard already of major banks looking to relocate and Edinburgh being one option. Morgan Stanley have already moved 2000 investment banking jobs and HSBC are considering their HO location again.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by McLaren on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 10:29 am

Super

I don't like the SNP but they are petty nationalists/patriots and not xenophobic. From what I can tell they don't object to anyone living in Scotland as long as Scotland governs itself.

I also don't think you can call them an amateur party, as sadly they have been the most effective political party in the UK for quite some time. If only labour or even the lib dems could have replicated some of the SNP's success.

Although it is hard to tell how much they lucked out in tapping into a wave of nationalism in Scotland over the last 5 years or so.
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 11:19 am

JAS wrote:Aye it would be a whole different scenario if Scotland were to forge a deal to stay. Unlike the UK as a whole they would probably be a net recipient rather than a net contributor. That then in itself begs the question why would the EU want to do it? Then again by the same token why did they fight so hard to keep Greece on board?
Don't fool your self by thinking EU is only about money and trade. There's much more to it. Otherwise the Eastern European countries would never have been let in and Greece would never have been bailed out. EU is a peace project with the aim of establishing a political union. Free trade is step in that direction. No need to think Scotland would not be let in regardless of whether they can only contribute with shortbread or inbred.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 11:43 am

Watched Farage posturing in European parliament yesterday. Although a repulsive toad, there were aspects of what he said that I would like answers to. Such as, why if it is a common market, are big businesses allowed to choose which country they pay tax in? See RoI, Luxembourg et al at 12%. Surely there should be some price to pay for having access to said market? This would easily pay for all the public services required to run a successful country. And before anyone says well, they wouldn't do business there - they might not but somebody would - access to one of the largest, wealthiest markets on the planet?

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by Eyetoldyouso on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 12:26 pm

An independent Scotland would be a basket case economically.

http://chokkablog.blogspot.co.uk/2016/03/the-price-of-independence.html

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 12:33 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:Such as, why if it is a common market, are big businesses allowed to choose which country they pay tax in? See RoI, Luxembourg et al at 12%. Surely there should be some price to pay for having access to said market? This would easily pay for all the public services required to run a successful country. And before anyone says well, they wouldn't do business there - they might not but somebody would - access to one of the largest, wealthiest markets on the planet?

Because the likes of Farage don't want tax harmonization. Pretty simple. He's just being polemic and doesn't offer solutions.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 12:38 pm

Still a legitimate question though (whoever asks it)?
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by pedro on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 12:46 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:Still a legitimate question though (whoever asks it)?
Strong powers in favor of a federation. Others of a 'looser' EU. And if you look at corporation tax you also have to look at labour law. That's why we see a 'compromise' on the issue.

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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by MontysMerkin on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 12:54 pm

hmmm not sure that cuts it, smacks of whataboutery.

There may be a point that europe has dishonestly colluded with big business and ignored the will of the elected member states. If so this needs investigation and exposing. Maybe the leavers were actually right?
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Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

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