Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

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Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by laverfan on Wed 29 Jun 2016, 11:04 am

First topic message reminder :

Schedule - http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/schedule/index.html

Live Scores - http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/index.html

Good to see new faces - Johnson, Vesley, Pouille, Mahut.

MoTD - Kyrgios v Murray (IMVHO).


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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:19 pm

Oh my oh my! Vesely hits a BH which is called long, but Layani overrules it! Point replayed! What drama!

Looks like a great overrule on the replay...

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:19 pm

and Vesely saves it with a FH down the line! 9-9, onwards we go...

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by temporary21 on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:20 pm

Youre joking me... 9-9

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:20 pm

Lahyani has definitely been eating his carrots.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by temporary21 on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:20 pm

Perfect overrule, chalk went up

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:21 pm

Time for one more set!?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:22 pm

Another fine one-two punch from Vesely, who earns yet another SP.

And he takes it with an inside out drop shot which Berdych can only return into the net! Level at two sets all! What a TB! What a match!

I suspect Layani is firmly off Berdych's Christmas card list.

Berdych asking to continue on Centre...

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by temporary21 on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:22 pm

Haha.. half slice drop shot to win the set for Vesely! Thats it for tonight right? They wont use the roof?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:23 pm

How sacrosanct is the rule about finishing on the same court? Tomas wants to move to CC, but no dice it seems?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:23 pm

Wow, what a TB.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by temporary21 on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:25 pm

ll this is good news for Muzza. Hes got Tsonga whos still leggy from a marathon, and Berdych could be tanked too

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:27 pm

Berdych serves for it - fails to serve it out.
He then gets three MPs at 0-40 on Vesely's serve - fails to convert.
He gets two more MPs in TB (albeit both again on Vesely's serve) - fails to convert again.

I guess it is as the 45th US President says: "once a choker, always a choker".

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:28 pm

temporary21 wrote:ll this is good news for Muzza. Hes got Tsonga whos still leggy from a marathon, and Berdych could be tanked too
I think Tsonga will be physically fine by Wednesday.  Andy should beat him fairly easily anyway, but I do not think Tsonga's long match will play much of a role in it - unless maybe if they go very deep into the 5th again.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:31 pm

Monday has been fairly epic as always. Some damp squibs, but some real tussles also. I will look to recover tomorrow and be fresh for men's quarters on Wednesday.

Definitely more interesting now that we are not heading inexorably for a Murray-Djoko final. Murray-Fed looks most likely, but plenty of other realistic permutations and a first time winner looks more likely than for some time.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:33 pm

Aut0Gr4ph wrote:Monday has been fairly epic as always.
I have loved it. Normally I do not get to see it, but we have a Holiday here today - very entertaining having the full R4 played out on one day.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:35 pm

temporary21 wrote:ll this is good news for Muzza. Hes got Tsonga whos still leggy from a marathon, and Berdych could be tanked too
Why would Jo be leggy? He's barely played today and has a full day's rest tomorrow. Extended servefests like the one against Isner tend to be more mentally demanding than physical anyway.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:40 pm

Jo should be fine by Wednesday. Not sure how well he is playing but he can always turn it on for a one-off match.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:43 pm

Presume you're 100% behind Fed as things currently stand SB, but do you have a fall back option in case he trips up? Cilic has quite an attacking style, but is a bit too robotic for my liking. Got the same problem with Berdych. He can bludgeon on the front foot like the best of them, but there's not a lot of flair to enjoy. Who's your favourite after Federer?


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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:43 pm

Vesely had never been past R3 of a slam before, Pouille not past R2. On Wednesday they may well be playing for a spot in the Wimbledon SF.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:45 pm

Born Slippy wrote:Jo should be fine by Wednesday. Not sure how well he is playing but he can always turn it on for a one-off match.
Would you care to jinx BS? Seems to be working well so far.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:49 pm

Aut0Gr4ph wrote:Presume you're 100% behind Fed as things currently stand SB, but do you have a fall back option in case he trips up? Cilic has quite an attacking style, but is a bit too robotic for my liking. Got the same problem with Berdych. He can bludgeon on the front foot like the best of them, but there's not a lot of flair to enjoy. Who's your favourite after Federer?
Yes, 100% behind Fed Smile, but good question.  From the ones that are still in it?  No one clear standout - I would probably pick Tsonga and Cilic as the next two guys, but I do not feel super strongly about either of them.  Also, while maybe not my favorite players style-wise, I would be ok with Raonic or Vesely just because they represent new blood.

I normally come across as quite anti-Andy here, but I do not actually mind him as much as that.  If he gets his second Wimbledon, I will not feel like there is anything all that wrong with that Smile

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:50 pm

I'm feeling complacent about Tsonga. Reckon Andy will have to have a real off day to lose. He tends to have Tsonga's number. In fact, despite the strength and depth of French tennis, I can't recall the last big match he lost to a French player. Possibly, it was Jo when he had his final run at the Oz open many moons ago. Got a vague recollection he lost to Monfils at the French once, but that might have been even earlier. Any others that I've missed?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by summerblues on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:53 pm

Aut0Gr4ph wrote:I'm feeling complacent about Tsonga.
I would agree, you look at their H2H, and how they have been playing so far, and you would have to say it is Andy for sure.

The only problem with Tsonga is that occasionally - though quite rarely - he brings in a one-off performance a couple of grades better than what he normally produces and if he has one of those days then you don't know - he might well take it.  But those days are rare.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 9:59 pm

summerblues wrote:
Aut0Gr4ph wrote:Presume you're 100% behind Fed as things currently stand SB, but do you have a fall back option in case he trips up? Cilic has quite an attacking style, but is a bit too robotic for my liking. Got the same problem with Berdych. He can bludgeon on the front foot like the best of them, but there's not a lot of flair to enjoy. Who's your favourite after Federer?
Yes, 100% behind Fed Smile, but good question.  From the ones that are still in it?  No one clear standout - I would probably pick Tsonga and Cilic as the next two guys, but I do not feel super strongly about either of them.  Also, while maybe not my favorite players style-wise, I would be ok with Raonic or Vesely just because they represent new blood.

I normally come across as quite anti-Andy here, but I do not actually mind him as much as that.  If he gets his second Wimbledon, I will not feel like there is anything all that wrong with that Smile

Yes, it would be hard to begrudge Murray another slam. On the face of it, his slam final record is pretty woeful, but having had to always face either Roger or Novak over the course of 10 finals is not exactly fortunate.

Agree that it's hard to get greatly excited by the 'new blood' still left in. I think Thiem and Kyrgios are more exciting prospects, although, as Kyrgios showed today, he's still got a way to go to be a genuine threat. Having said that, if Andy and Novak fall off a figurative cliff, then there may be slams to be won without a great leap in performance. I'm hoping that the old guard get knocked off their perch by an explosion of brilliance from the next generation, but a more gradual decline is looking more likely.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:02 pm

Aut0Gr4ph wrote:I'm feeling complacent about Tsonga. Reckon Andy will have to have a real off day to lose. He tends to have Tsonga's number. In fact, despite the strength and depth of French tennis, I can't recall the last big match he lost to a French player. Possibly, it was Jo when he had his final run at the Oz open many moons ago. Got a vague recollection he lost to Monfils at the French once, but that might have been even earlier. Any others that I've missed?

If we're talking slams (or DC or OG I guess) then I think Tsonga at the 08 AO is correct. He lost to Monfils at the French in 07 I think (five sets, and he was injured IIRC). Post Tsonga, he went a long time without losing to any French player, though he's lost the odd match since: Mahut beat him at Queens one year (maybe 2012?), Gasquet beat him in Rome in 2014 or so, and he lost to Simon in Rotterdam last year. None of those are what I'd call big matches though, all at QF level or before. Those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head. Oh and didn't he lose to Arnaud Clement in one of his very early finals (so back in 06 or so)?

Of course, today means he's still never lost to an Australian on tour.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:08 pm

To be fair, Kyrgios was sensational for a set today. 89% first serves, 14 winners, only 6 errors. That would be good enough to beat virtually anyone. He understandably got a bit down when he lost that set and then didn't manage to take the slight chance he had at the start of the second. 

As for Tsonga, he's a tough match up. If he has a great serving day and Andy is off his game, then he could easily win. Andy always has a bad match a slam (plus the final if he gets there) so it could get tricky.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:10 pm

After Andy, my second preference goes to Roger. However, if Roger is to win, I'm hoping that Andy doesn't even make the final, as another final loss, particularly an eminently winnable one against an aging Fed, would be too much to bear. After that, my vote goes to Jo, although I think his chances of winning are virtually zero.

If I had to guess who might win outside of Roger and Andy, I reckon Raonic looks the most likely. Not a great fan of his tennis, but a new winner would still be welcome. Cilic has also proved he can grasp the nettle, although he's never convinced on grass (think he may have won Queens or at least reached the final, but his Wimbledon record is distinctly unspectacular).

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:14 pm

If Murray doesn't win, I'd like Raonic or Vesely to win. Just think it would be nice if one of the younger guys came through. I'm almost sure Cilic won Queens, and he also lost to Murray in a close final on another occasion. He can definitely play well on grass, and will give us a much better indication of where Federer's at.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:17 pm

In order:

Murray
Pouille 
Tsonga
Vesely
Cilic
Federer
Berdych
Querrey









Raonic

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:18 pm

Cilic won Queens when Nalby decided to kick a linesman.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:21 pm

Born Slippy wrote:To be fair, Kyrgios was sensational for a set today. 89% first serves, 14 winners, only 6 errors. That would be good enough to beat virtually anyone. He understandably got a bit down when he lost that set and then didn't manage to take the slight chance he had at the start of the second. 

As for Tsonga, he's a tough match up. If he has a great serving day and Andy is off his game, then he could easily win. Andy always has a bad match a slam (plus the final if he gets there) so it could get tricky.

12-2 H2H hardly suggests a tough match-up. Also bear in mind that one of those losses was fairly early on in Andy's career, when Jo would have had an age advantage. The other came in 2014 at a time when Andy couldn't beat any top 10 players. Yes, Jo is a dangerous player who can blow hot, but that's got nothing to do with match-up and, yes, Andy could lose if he has an off day, but surely that's the case against any player of genuine top 10 calibre.

Having said that, they have had a couple of closely contested matches on grass, so perhaps I shouldn't be counting chickens too early.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:29 pm

Have to admit I know very little about Pouille and haven't seen him play yet. Looking at his age and ranking, he looks to be an up and comer, but doesn't seem to have garnered much attention on v2. What's his game like? Given his nationality, I'm guessing technically sound, with an efficient, compact style, but lacking any major weapons, perhaps in the Simon mould. Am I close?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:31 pm

Don't know why I think that's a typical French style. There's loads of players that don't fit that mould at all.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Guest on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:33 pm

Can't see Tsonga taking three sets off Murray. Too erratic and that BH is a liability.

Other than Federer, I'd probably want Murray to win because he's better than the rest by a country mile and plays the most varied and interesting tennis.

However, if there had been a real young gun to shout about left in the tourney then I'd have supported them.


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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:38 pm

As others have said, it's very hard to assess Roger's game, as he's had a total cakewalk so far. The Fed of old would eat big servers like Cilic and Raonic for breakfast, but this year there have been real chinks in his game. The positive signs are that he seems in reasonably good health and not obviously hampered by the back. However, I won't be getting too carried away until he comes through a proper test. The Cilic match should give a good indication of his chances.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:39 pm

Technically sound but much more of a shotmaker than Simon. Decent serve and likes to go forwards. Got some spirit as well - totally dismantled DP after he told him to "shut up". He isn't ready yet but if a youngster is going to win this event, he's the only one really who fits the bill. Vesely wouldn't be a disaster but he's more limited.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:39 pm

Pouille seems like quite a lot of players from his age, bruising FH which can leak a few errors, solid, dependable BH that he doesn't do a huge amount with. Serve can be a bit erratic. Decent hands. Don't think there's anything special there, but I think that of pretty much all the younger generation, so you never know. On a steady rise this year after a difficult year last year (his initial breakthrough was the back end of 2014). Had a good performance in Rome, and now QF here. Good win against Ferrer in Rome, particularly the scoreline (I think it was 6-1 6-4), no stand out wins here, but steady progress.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:46 pm

I wonder when was the last time we had a weaker line-up in the quarter-final of a slam. I'm guessing the average ranking is significantly lower than the norm, which perhaps does suggest the Teutonic plates are shifting. I remember the draw opened up for Murray at Wimbledon in 2013, but think the other side remained reasonably strong. Any suggestions for a weaker QF draw than this one (assuming that Berdych gets through).

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:49 pm

Thanks both for thoughts on Pouille. I will try to catch his QF, so I'm more up to speed.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by whocares on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:54 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:
Aut0Gr4ph wrote:I'm feeling complacent about Tsonga. Reckon Andy will have to have a real off day to lose. He tends to have Tsonga's number. In fact, despite the strength and depth of French tennis, I can't recall the last big match he lost to a French player. Possibly, it was Jo when he had his final run at the Oz open many moons ago. Got a vague recollection he lost to Monfils at the French once, but that might have been even earlier. Any others that I've missed?

If we're talking slams (or DC or OG I guess) then I think Tsonga at the 08 AO is correct. He lost to Monfils at the French in 07 I think (five sets, and he was injured IIRC). Post Tsonga, he went a long time without losing to any French player, though he's lost the odd match since: Mahut beat him at Queens one year (maybe 2012?), Gasquet beat him in Rome in 2014 or so, and he lost to Simon in Rotterdam last year. None of those are what I'd call big matches though, all at QF level or before. Those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head. Oh and didn't he lose to Arnaud Clement in one of his very early finals (so back in 06 or so)?

Of course, today means he's still never lost to an Australian on tour.

Between 2010 and 2012 he also lost to Chardy, Monfils and Gasquet at various masters (Paris , cinci and?) and more recently in the 2014 Canadian master that JWT went to win. Still the record of French players against Murray in recent year is pretty lame to remain polite .

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 10:58 pm

emancipator wrote:Can't see Tsonga taking three sets off Murray. Too erratic and that BH is a liability.

Other than Federer, I'd probably want Murray to win because he's better than the rest by a country mile and plays the most varied and interesting tennis.

However, if there had been a real young gun to shout about left in the tourney then I'd have supported them.


Agree about Jo's BH being a massive liability. It's such an obvious strategy for Murray to box him in to his BH corner that, as long as he executes it reasonably well, I can see only one winner. Of course, grass can be a leveller if Jo serves brilliantly, but, given the courts will be slowing in the 2nd week, I'd always fancy Murray to scrape enough returns back into play and get some close to neutral rallies started. From there, he should be in the box seat.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:00 pm

Quite right, had forgotten the Chardy, Monfils and Tsonga losses. I did mention the Rome loss to Gasquet, not sure if that's the one you're thinking of?

Interesting comments from Tsonga. He reckons his biggest challenge will be breaking the Murray serve because he feels he could manage not to be broken. I admire the confidence, but it's not often Murray goes through a match without breaking his opponent.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:02 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:Pouille seems like quite a lot of players from his age, bruising FH which can leak a few errors, solid, dependable BH that he doesn't do a huge amount with. Serve can be a bit erratic. Decent hands. Don't think there's anything special there, but I think that of pretty much all the younger generation, so you never know. On a steady rise this year after a difficult year last year (his initial breakthrough was the back end of 2014). Had a good performance in Rome, and now QF here. Good win against Ferrer in Rome, particularly the scoreline (I think it was 6-1 6-4), no stand out wins here, but steady progress.
2 wins over Goffin and 2 over Ferrer this year. I think he's got a bit more than some other youngsters, although I agree his backhand needs work. Beating both Del Potro and Tomic at Wimbledon having no previous grass results at all suggests he must have something about him.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:05 pm

whocares wrote:
Mad for Chelsea wrote:
Aut0Gr4ph wrote:I'm feeling complacent about Tsonga. Reckon Andy will have to have a real off day to lose. He tends to have Tsonga's number. In fact, despite the strength and depth of French tennis, I can't recall the last big match he lost to a French player. Possibly, it was Jo when he had his final run at the Oz open many moons ago. Got a vague recollection he lost to Monfils at the French once, but that might have been even earlier. Any others that I've missed?

If we're talking slams (or DC or OG I guess) then I think Tsonga at the 08 AO is correct. He lost to Monfils at the French in 07 I think (five sets, and he was injured IIRC). Post Tsonga, he went a long time without losing to any French player, though he's lost the odd match since: Mahut beat him at Queens one year (maybe 2012?), Gasquet beat him in Rome in 2014 or so, and he lost to Simon in Rotterdam last year. None of those are what I'd call big matches though, all at QF level or before. Those are the ones I can remember off the top of my head. Oh and didn't he lose to Arnaud Clement in one of his very early finals (so back in 06 or so)?

Of course, today means he's still never lost to an Australian on tour.

Between 2010 and 2012 he also lost to Chardy, Monfils and Gasquet at various masters (Paris , cinci and?) and more recently in the 2014 Canadian master that JWT went to win.  Still the record of French players against Murray in recent year is pretty lame to remain polite .
Yes, I knew there were a few in Masters. Slightly dodgy definition, but by big matches I meant in slams. I guess Masters finals/semis could also count, but French players don't tend to get that far.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:09 pm

My early predictions for the quarters:

Raonic in 4
Fed in 3
Murray in 3

If Berdych gets through, I'd back him to beat Pouille, but as I know next to nothing about Pouille, that's a stab in the dark.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:11 pm

Aut0Gr4ph wrote:
Yes, I knew there were a few in Masters. Slightly dodgy definition, but by big matches I meant in slams. I guess Masters finals/semis could also count, but French players don't tend to get that far.

#shotsfired Laugh

It's a fair point that if Murray makes the latter stages of a Masters, he's usually dialed in, and only loses to Fedalovic. One of my favourite stats is that, Roddick at Wimbledon in 2009 aside, all his losses at SF or F stage of a slam have been to Fedalovic. I wouldn't be surprised to see a similar record at Masters level...

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by whocares on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:18 pm

Talking about guys who once beaten Murray... Anyone knows what happened to Jerzy Janowycz?

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:24 pm

whocares wrote:Talking about guys who once beaten Murray... Anyone knows what happened to Jerzy Janowycz?

Currently ranked 143 apparently, though I know no more than that.

Checked Murray's Masters record. The only non-Fedalovic player to have beaten him at the SF or F of a Masters is... Gasquet! Albeit in 2006 (Cincinati).

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Born Slippy on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:32 pm

Janowicz has knee issues - hasn't played since Oz (and has had ongoing issues before).

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

Post by Aut0Gr4ph on Mon 04 Jul 2016, 11:37 pm

Andy's Masters final record is pretty godly. If he'd managed to carry that over to slam finals, he'd have a hat full by now.

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Re: Wimbledon 2016 - Day 7

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