England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

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England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:21 am

First topic message reminder :

England 1 Alastair Cook (capt), 2 Alex Hales, 3 Joe Root, 4 James Vince, 5 Gary Ballance, 6 Jonny Bairstow (wk), 7 Moeen Ali, 8 Chris Woakes, 9 Stuart Broad, 10 Steven Finn, 11 James Anderson

Pakistan 1 Mohammad Hafeez, 2 Sami Aslam, 3 Azhar Ali, 4 Younis Khan, 5 Misbah-ul-Haq (capt), 6 Asad Shafiq, 7 Sarfraz Ahmed (wk), 8 Yasir Shah, Sohail Khan, 10 Mohammad Amir, 11 Rahat Ali


Last edited by VTR on Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 3:56 pm

Good point Alfie.

Well if England can even bat an hour into tomorrow they would probably have made it mostly safe.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by GSC on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:00 pm

If Pakistan can't make significant inroads in the next hour it'll start to go Englands way.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:02 pm

alfie wrote:Dyrewolfe : I get that practically speaking its the lead that counts.  Just pointing out that teams that reach 250/3 typically expect to go on to a pretty good score. Of course that is still to be achieved : and if England bats keep getting out when they seem well set it may never be !  We shall see.

Odd though that so many players have made a good start , on what seems a good pitch : and yet none has yet passed seventy...


Agreed. To be fair Pakistan are doing a good containment job and runs are at a bit of a premium. It seems our lads can only maintain their patience for so long...then something just snaps and they prod / waft / swipe at a ball they would have left alone or defended.

Still, we're in a reasonably good position. If we can get a lead of over 250, (which we ought to, barring a calamitous collapse), Pakistan won't find it easy to chase.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:10 pm

Another hundred ,then ?

At current rates they'd struggle to have that by the close - especially if we don't get the overs in again. Of course Pakistan's bowlers may start to tire ; so perhaps scoring will become easier.

Game remains well balanced still.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:16 pm

First day : 297/10. ( 86 overs)
Second : 257/3. ( 89 ? Overs)
Third : 263/7. (81 overs)

And today looks like being under 260 for the day.

Suggests anything over 270 to get on the last day and the chasing team might be thinking of shutting up shop ?

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Gooseberry on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:24 pm

This is proper test cricket ...so rare to get games like this but any thoughts if 4 day games need to be binned.
Cracking stuff

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:58 pm

Not the best batting under pressure.

It seems fairly flat. I suspect Pakistan will look to make a better fist of it.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:58 pm

England continuing to give Pakistan hope as Ballance perishes for 28. England 281-5, the lead 181.

I think I'd like to see Bairstow and Moeen go a bit ODI and just bash a quick 30-40 runs each. That would put us in a pretty good position with the tail still to come.

Better than this slow strangulation.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:59 pm

alfie wrote:Another hundred ,then ?

At current rates they'd struggle to have that by the close - especially if we don't get the overs in again.  Of course Pakistan's bowlers may start to tire ; so perhaps scoring will become easier.

Game remains well balanced still.

Pakistan must be pretty darned big favourites at the moment? I'd think 250+ is essential to give them any challenge.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:59 pm

dyrewolfe wrote:England continuing to give Pakistan hope as Ballance perishes for 28. England 281-5, the lead 181.

I think I'd like to see Bairstow and Moeen go a bit ODI and just bash a quick 30-40 runs each. That would put us in a pretty good position with the tail still to come.

Better than this slow strangulation.

Not good to see England going down this road again is it.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sat Aug 06, 2016 5:24 pm

Nice to see some boundaries at last. Would be ideal if we could get the lead to 250-ish by close of play then we have all day tomorrow to get at Pakistan.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sat Aug 06, 2016 5:44 pm

Another fifty for Jonny B clap

He really has played some wonderful cricket this year. I know the keeping still needs some work ; but his batting has been a revelation.

238 on : and a nominal fifteen more overs today. Hmm. Still a possibility they could push the lead to 300 tonight.

Or at least close to : maybe a declaration early on day five ? I shouldn't try to predict ; this game has ebbed and flowed too much - but it could still be interesting tomorrow.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 5:54 pm

Indeed Alfie.

And credit to you. Your feeling was 250 can bring 400 and that is looking very realistic and looking like a target that Pakistan will have to really think about.

The game might have really changed shape. They put is in, the pressure showed, they got a lead but then.. If we fought back and gave them a genuine target then it might yet have a sting in the tail. Interesting.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sat Aug 06, 2016 5:59 pm

Indeed - a good prediction from alfie.

Looks like England will be looking to set a target of 300 plus. Great innings by Bairstow - just what we needed. clap

I just wonder though whether Pakistan will even try to chase 300? More likely bat for the draw methinks.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sat Aug 06, 2016 6:17 pm

Well to be honest a 300 lead tonight was always likely unless they collapsed...very hard for a bowling team to keep up the " dry" bowling all day ; especially after having bowled for two hours yesterday.
Would have liked them to have got there a bit quicker , so they could have maybe had a couple of overs tonight ; but credit to Pakistan for their persistence.

So how long will they bat tomorrow ? No more than a half hour , I hope...

Wonder if Cookie reads this site Smile

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sat Aug 06, 2016 6:25 pm

I hope so too.

Personally I'd like England to declare at the close, whatever the score. We have more than enough on the board now to defend.

Continuing to bat tomorrow is just cementing the draw.

Very handy 50 from Moeen too to get us firmly in the driving seat.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sat Aug 06, 2016 6:27 pm

Like to see Jonny get his hundred ; but not at the cost of too many overs. Not that he'd take long , I think...

Does occur to me that on a fairly placid (still) pitch they'd want a few extra runs so they can risk bowling Moeen a bit if the quicks don't run through them.

Anyway that's about it for today. Well played again England : I think they have a decent shot at winning tomorrow - though they'll have to bowl well .

And hang on to their catches Smile

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 7:02 pm

I also hope so. Let's put pressure on them.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:16 pm

It's a shame Stokes got injured because I really think we could go with the following side and not be any worse off (ie Vince and Finn dropped)

Cook, Hales, Root, Ballance, Bairstow, Stokes, Ali, Woakes, Rashid, Broad, Anderson

You could push Moeen to 5 if you wish to keep Bairstow at 7 - always think Moeen plays better when he has more responsibility over being higher up the order
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by VTR on Sat Aug 06, 2016 10:06 pm

Was out all day and unable to check the score until the close. Thought it might be tough and when Ballance went it must have really looked like defeat being a strong possibility. But a great partnership from Bairstow and Ali and it is now only really England that can win

I say a bash for 10 or so overs tomorrow, looking to add 70 or 80 then get Pakistan in

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sat Aug 06, 2016 10:20 pm

Yeah you'd think they would go for it with 5 wickets in hand now. They can risk it even if they do lose everyone in ten overs. It'd add some runs, use some overs and make the task tougher for Pakistan.


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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:29 am

I'd declare now and get right to it - over a 90 over day, that also means England will get a second new ball to perhaps push over the tail of Pakistan.

Scratch that, I'd have declared forty minutes before stumps on Day 4!

Pakistan aren't interested in winning. It doesn't matter if the chase is 270 or 2,700 - they will defend and seek to bat out time. Their negative tactics today highlighted that.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:02 am

Holy cow corner, Batman! Shocked

Moeen straight into T20 mode with 2 successive sixes. Think he wants to get a hundred as well before Cook declares.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:07 am

Not messing about this morning , eh ?

Moeen monstering Yasir ...but Jonny gone lbw on review.

331 ahead : don't think they'll be batting much longer...

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:22 am

After the first over the runs have rather slowed ...pity Jonny got out .

There's the call off ...342 in front , only four overs used up : about right I think.

Leaves a second new ball option late in the day , and a good cushion.

Work to do to force a win , but you can't fault this mornings work thumbsup

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by guildfordbat on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:23 am

There's the declaration - whoops, wrong thread! Wink Easy mistake to make with two (future) England players batting!

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by guildfordbat on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:26 am

Pleased to see England have followed Surrey's lead and declared! Very Happy


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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:38 am

alfie wrote:After the first over the runs have rather slowed ...pity Jonny got out .

There's the call off ...342 in front , only four overs used up : about right I think.

Leaves a second new ball option late in the day , and a good cushion.

Work to do to force a win  , but you can't fault this mornings work thumbsup


Well at least they got the additional runs quickly but, personally, I can't see the point in batting for just quarter of an hour.

Still at least England have more or less a full day to bowl. We're going to need to be at our best as Pakistan will just try to defend...no way they are going to chase 340. Can't afford much loose bowling...need to put them under pressure, find the edge of the bat etc.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by trebellbobaggins on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:51 am

About right I think. Going to be tough to see anything more other than a draw here though. It's a kind surface.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:54 am

Hafeez gone! England get the early breakthrough.

Broad gets the hosts on their way...
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:56 am

trebellbobaggins wrote:About right I think.  Going to be tough to see anything more other than a draw here though.  It's a kind surface.


Unless you can pull off a few of your famous reverse-jinxes. Wink
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by guildfordbat on Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:01 pm

dyrewolfe wrote:
alfie wrote:After the first over the runs have rather slowed ...pity Jonny got out .

There's the call off ...342 in front , only four overs used up : about right I think.

Leaves a second new ball option late in the day , and a good cushion.

Work to do to force a win  , but you can't fault this mornings work thumbsup


Well at least they got the additional runs quickly but, personally, I can't see the point in batting for just quarter of an hour.


Still at least England have more or less a full day to bowl. We're going to need to be at our best as Pakistan will just try to defend...no way they are going to chase 340. Can't afford much loose bowling...need to put them under pressure, find the edge of the bat etc.

Hi dyre - in case not seen and just possibly of interest, MfC and I posted about this here on Friday night. It's a game of opinions but I believe batting on briefly is often a sound tactic.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:34 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
dyrewolfe wrote:
alfie wrote:After the first over the runs have rather slowed ...pity Jonny got out .

There's the call off ...342 in front , only four overs used up : about right I think.

Leaves a second new ball option late in the day , and a good cushion.

Work to do to force a win  , but you can't fault this mornings work thumbsup


Well at least they got the additional runs quickly but, personally, I can't see the point in batting for just quarter of an hour.


Still at least England have more or less a full day to bowl. We're going to need to be at our best as Pakistan will just try to defend...no way they are going to chase 340. Can't afford much loose bowling...need to put them under pressure, find the edge of the bat etc.

Hi dyre - in case not seen and just possibly of interest, MfC and I posted about this here on Friday night. It's a game of opinions but I believe batting on briefly is often a sound tactic.

I shall bow to your undoubted superior knowledge...but could you explain why?
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by guildfordbat on Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:59 pm

Dyre - not superior knowledge, just a different viewpoint. Should be explained in the posts above with MfC.

Meanwhile, await advice from Duty on the best available odds for the draw. Wink

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:12 pm

So Pakistan negotiate the twenty overs to lunch with only the one loss...and without too many worries it seems.
It clearly isn't going to be easy to shift these two : Sami in particular is looking wall- like. England haven't found a good way to attack him yet ; though Moeen did beat him with a beauty just before lunch. Maybe Moeen will be the Secret Weapon Smile
Pleased to see Cook using bowlers in short spells : I think this is best.
Just keep probing away ; if a break is made maybe then you can use
your most likely strike weapons in a extended role...

Gut feeling is that this will be drawn : think England needed at least two in that first session. But you never know - couple of quick wickets after lunch and things change ; so I'll be watching with interest on the resumption.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:38 pm

The draw is heavily odds-on!

Think England will still triumph, but they need a minimum of three wickets in this session.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by guildfordbat on Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:42 pm

Duty281 wrote:The draw is heavily odds-on!

Think England will still triumph, but they need a minimum of three wickets in this session.

Duty - I recognise your own record is good but the bookies don't get it wrong too often I'm with them here. Out now.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:50 pm

I don't rate the Pakistani middle or lower order particularly highly.

If Pakistan are 4 down at tea, I would back England to take the last 6 in the evening.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:55 pm

Duty281 wrote:I don't rate the Pakistani middle or lower order particularly highly.

If Pakistan are 4 down at tea, I would back England to take the last 6 in the evening.

Make that 5 down and I'd agree with you Smile

But I'm not sure that's going to happen unless someone has a super spell - or a couple of batsmen get very careless ...

Good over then from Broad ! More like that please...

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:10 pm

There's the wicket - clever field placing, tidy catch.

Now, get the out-of-nick Younis out early and it's on!

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:11 pm

Moeen ! Go the Bearded One. Yahoo

Could see that coming ...he'd been troubling Azhar since lunch.

A sniff...

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:14 pm

And now agonisingly short of Bairstow!

Can Broad profit?

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:28 pm

Anderson barely getting it to 80mph...doesn't look interested today
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:39 pm

There we are! Younis was shielded for a bit, but Anderson removes him with minimal fuss.

This is the crucial, game-defining partnership - the obdurate Aslam allied with the obdurate Misbah.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:39 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Anderson barely getting it to 80mph...doesn't look interested today

You were saying ?

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:43 pm

Duty281 wrote:There we are! Younis was shielded for a bit, but Anderson removes him with minimal fuss.

This is the crucial, game-defining partnership - the obdurate Aslam allied with the obdurate Misbah.

Agreed. Get one of these now and there's a chance Pakistan wil crumble.

Hasn't Aslam played well though ? He really does look like a player : old fashioned opener - though he does have strokes too. Wonder why he wasnt in from the start...

Hour up to tea will be tense.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:54 pm

Misbah very, very unsure.

A re-energised Anderson is all over him.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by dyrewolfe on Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:54 pm

3 down now.

Really only Aslam, Misbah and Sarfraz now who you would fancy to stick around for any time. Get 2 of those 3 out and expose the soft middle and lower order and its England's game.
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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by alfie on Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:03 pm

This is fascinating.

Sami is clearly unhappy with the silly point in there , and is determined to force him out...poor Vince getting battered ! But he's taking a risk playing those shots...

Think removing Sami might be the key : he looks like one who could cheerfully bat for three days. The rest of them tend to like to play their strokes ; and there are a lot of overs left.

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Re: England vs Pakistan 3rd Test, Edgbaston

Post by Duty281 on Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:07 pm

Finn coming in now.

He's due a wicket or two, isn't he?

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