Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

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Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by demosthenes on Wed 24 Aug 2016, 11:47 am

From the BBC :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/37173849

This may be specific to the one incident, but it could also be the tip of the iceberg.

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Hazel Sapling on Wed 24 Aug 2016, 12:07 pm

Not sure he will have too much of a case. If he passed a test on the field and he wanted to keep going there is not much they can do. I guess if he failed and they let him continue, that is a dangerous act.

There seems to be a grey area in determining concussions especially in the immediate aftermath. The rules now are much better than they were.

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by No 7&1/2 on Wed 24 Aug 2016, 12:45 pm

Will be pretty interesting to see the outcome of this and reinforce the seriousness of it. We've seen high profile examples at international level which looked to the layman as pretty ugly examples of turning a blind eye to knocks at best, though in general the sport is moving in the right direction. At least its very mcuh in the public eye. I was wincing watching the olympics as a Dutch gymnast knocked himself out falling from the high bar and was allowed to go on without any check whatsoever.

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Griff on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 9:24 am

And so it begins.....

I expect to see a lot more of this. Look at American Football where there's been huge payouts for symptoms developed in later life as a result of collisions, concussions, etc. in pro careers.

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Hazel Sapling on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 9:30 am

Griff wrote:And so it begins.....

I expect to see a lot more of this.  Look at American Football where there's been huge payouts for symptoms developed in later life as a result of collisions, concussions, etc. in pro careers.

With the US though there was evidence the NFL knew the long term effects and intentionally went out of their way to bury them like the tobacco companies did with smoking. Even now they are trying to put favourable academics in charge of studies that they offered to fund as part of the settlement (meant to be independent researchers). The next problem brewing are painkilling injections and whether they have effectively coerced players into taking them whilst hiding the effects this may have on the body.

I would hope that rugby did not bury research and I doubt it could as a relatively poor and fractured series of organisations compared to the NFL (a monopoly).

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by marty2086 on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 9:57 am

Hazel Sapling wrote:
Griff wrote:And so it begins.....

I expect to see a lot more of this.  Look at American Football where there's been huge payouts for symptoms developed in later life as a result of collisions, concussions, etc. in pro careers.

With the US though there was evidence the NFL knew the long term effects and intentionally went out of their way to bury them like the tobacco companies did with smoking. Even now they are trying to put favourable academics in charge of studies that they offered to fund as part of the settlement (meant to be independent researchers). The next problem brewing are painkilling injections and whether they have effectively coerced players into taking them whilst hiding the effects this may have on the body.

I would hope that rugby did not bury research and I doubt it could as a relatively poor and fractured series of organisations compared to the NFL (a monopoly).

More recent injuries could open a can of worms, I seem to remember BODs uncle quitting the IRB or IRFU because his warnings were going unheeded about head injuries

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Griff on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 12:20 pm

marty2086 wrote:
Hazel Sapling wrote:
Griff wrote:And so it begins.....

I expect to see a lot more of this.  Look at American Football where there's been huge payouts for symptoms developed in later life as a result of collisions, concussions, etc. in pro careers.

With the US though there was evidence the NFL knew the long term effects and intentionally went out of their way to bury them like the tobacco companies did with smoking. Even now they are trying to put favourable academics in charge of studies that they offered to fund as part of the settlement (meant to be independent researchers). The next problem brewing are painkilling injections and whether they have effectively coerced players into taking them whilst hiding the effects this may have on the body.

I would hope that rugby did not bury research and I doubt it could as a relatively poor and fractured series of organisations compared to the NFL (a monopoly).

More recent injuries could open a can of worms, I seem to remember BODs uncle quitting the IRB or IRFU because his warnings were going unheeded about head injuries

Exactly. The warnings have been there for a long time. It's the relatively slow response that will catch clubs/unions out further down the road. I forget the saying, but isn't there something about ignorance of the dangers (or lack of scientific understanding) not being a good enough reason to mitigate a lack of sufficient health and safety in relation to court cases for damage and harm? Or am I confusing it with the precautionary principle in heath?!

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by marty2086 on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 12:33 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/24765650

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Griff on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 12:39 pm

This is what I mean. If a player in, say, 2019 can cite reports such as this article from 2013 where warnings were given, or articles showing top surgeons stepping down, or ones with players complaining, then even with a lack of conclusive scientific evidence I believe the unions/world rugby/clubs, etc. would find it hard to defend a lack of intervention. They've had the warnings, we've seen a glut of players retire recently due to concussion, but have they been quick enough to change things to safeguard the players?

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by marty2086 on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 12:43 pm

Griff the spat of retirements could be put down to an increased awareness and threshold for returning to play rather than more risk etc

I'm not sure of the actual relationship but given that one is BODs cousin and the other his uncle could Dr O'Driscoll be part of the case?

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by profitius on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 2:10 pm

marty2086 wrote:Griff the spat of retirements could be put down to an increased awareness and threshold for returning to play rather than more risk etc

I'm not sure of the actual relationship but given that one is BODs cousin and the other his uncle could Dr O'Driscoll be part of the case?


Most likely. Dr O'Driscoll has been talking about it for years in the media.

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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

Post by Griff on Thu 25 Aug 2016, 5:42 pm

marty2086 wrote:Griff the spat of retirements could be put down to an increased awareness and threshold for returning to play rather than more risk etc

I'm not sure of the actual relationship but given that one is BODs cousin and the other his uncle could Dr O'Driscoll be part of the case?

Yes I agree. Probably is to due with awareness and understanding of these symptoms they're getting. I just think that this is one of those things that in 5 or 10 years time we'll see loads of court cases for lack of action now (2016) when the warnings started to surface.


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Re: Sale sued by ex-player over concussions

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