CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Go down

CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 6:51 am

He lost. badly. first round defeat.

Mickey Gall shot straight for the takedown and put Punk on his back immediately. Punk wasn't ready for Gall's intensity and took some hard shots before covering up and managing to turn over but allowing Gall to take his back in the process. It was only a matter of time before Gall got the submission, you could see it coming a mile away. Gall got the rear naked choke and Punk tapped. Punk didn't manage any offence in the fight. None. He also showed no real submission defence.

Punk gave a speech after the fight saying he was going to come back and wasn't done, but honestly I'm not sure who UFC would book him against? Gall was 2-0, with only one win in the UFC. This was only Gall's second UFC fight. So, unless they feed Punk to another new-comer into the UFC welterweight division perhaps making their own UFC debut, I don't see who Punk could face. The fight was evidence of the difference in ability even between someone with relatively little professional experience and someone with none at all. The gulf was massive. Punk is now 0-1. Anyone else fighting in the UFC will have had at least one professional fight outside of the UFC, which means Punk will probably always be fighting someone else with more experience than himself.

I don't think this is evidence Punk can't fight. But, coming into the sport in his late thirties and carrying injuries from his wrestling career mean that it was the wrong time of life to start a career in MMA. Two years build up and Punk loses in under 5 minutes. Not sure what this does for Punk's stock in the UFC. Perhaps some fans will respect his spirit? However, I don't think anyone is going to seriously consider him as anything but a novelty fight. UFC used to have a policy that if a fighter lost 3 in a row they were released. Perhaps Punk will come back stronger after this defeat and now with some experience to measure himself against. However, I can't see him putting a winning streak together.

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Samo on Sun Sep 11, 2016 8:34 am

Credit to him for trying atleast. Takes balls to step into the octagon at any age.

If I were Triple H I'd be on the phone right now trying to rebuild some bridges.

Samo

Posts : 4057
Join date : 2011-01-29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 9:50 am

the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced UFC are going to let Punk go.

I think the only reason Mickey Gall was brought into the UFC with only 1 professional fight was to see if he could be a potential opponent against Punk. When he won his UFC debut, they put him in the match. They needed a relatively unexperienced opponent for Punk as no way could they book him against a ranked opponent.

The way Dana White spoke after the PPV it was as if the agreement was only for Punk to get into the octagon and test himself, not a long term deal. Even Punk in the post event press conference sounded unsure he would be able to fight in the UFC again.

The problem for the UFC and Punk is that Punk's lack of experience and naivety have been brutally exposed. He lacks takedown defence, not being able to stuff Gall's takedown, as well as any real jiujitsu defence, as it was clear he didn't really know what to do with Gall in full guard. These are not things you can master in six-eight months, and if Punk is to become a regular fighter then that is about the time he will now have between fights.

Also Punk took a lot of damage, you could see the swelling and abrasions in the press conference afterwards. I doubt Punk's body will be able to take the kind of damage he will likely get from better opponents. Some fighters cut easily. I think Punk could be one of those guys who will suffer from cutting easily.

If the UFC let him go, then I think he has three main options:
1. he quits MMA & pro wrestling and focus on writing comic books full time.
2. he returns to pro wrestling
3. he joins a smaller MMA promotion such as bellator or Invicta.

But, even if Punk does continue his MMA career elsewhere and manages to win a few fights; I very much doubt at his age he would ever manage to work his way back into the UFC.

I respect Punk for doing something I haven't done, nor ever will do and have a professional MMA fight. I respect him for making his MMA debut at the highest level and testing himself in the sport's biggest promotion. However, I just can't see him being successful. When he you look at it, even though Mickey Gall was relatively unexperienced professionally, he had still had two training camps before taking the CM Punk fight, three including the Punk fight. He was 2-0 so had the confidence and self-belief which comes from winning, whereas Punk knew he was untested. Punk still doesn't know if he can win a professional fight so still doesn't have that self-belief. Gall is 24 so probably has been doing MMA for about four or five years, compared to Punk's two. And he's 13 years younger than Punk, meaning he doesn't have 15+ years of pro wrestling experience to unlearn. Once techniques and movements have become part of your muscle memory they are incredibly difficult to unlearn or break, especially at a professional level. Punk had a lot he had to unlearn as well as all the MMA stuff he needed to learn! So everything was going against Punk.

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Fernando on Sun Sep 11, 2016 10:57 am

I can't say im surprised to see he was choked out in 2 mins. I think anyone with a good few years of UFC experience and training would of gone straight for the takedown against someone who's literally just good at kicking. If he had any sense and wanted to do it properly drop down into the amateur divisions out of the spotlight and come back in a few years

I imagine it's off to Bellator next since they take on the UFC Rejects.

Fernando
Fernando
Fernando

Posts : 35759
Join date : 2011-01-26
Age : 27
Location : buckinghamshire

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:31 am

it is interesting to listen to Mickey Gall's post-fight interviews, in which he admits he wanted to showcase his striking skills more, but when CM Punk rushed in "hot" he went for the takedown. That is a sign of experience; he probably had a game plan, but was able to adapt to the situation as he saw Punk open himself up to a takedown, and capitalise on the opportunity presented to him.  Once it was on the ground there was no doubt as a brown belt to Punk's white belt he was going to win. That is like the jiujitsu equivalent of the proverbial cat playing with the mouse.

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:39 am

It was uncomfortable viewing and quite sad. TP is right in that as soon as he hit the mat it was game over. What that wild lunge was at the start I don't know. 2 years of training and he does that.

I actually think this has ruined his stock in wrestling somewhat too. Not that I think he'll ever return to the WWE.

People can bang on about respect and what not but this was a vanity project in my opinion. His needy ego took a hammering and he'd be daft to try and fight again.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:56 am

I agree, it was uncomfortable. This was worst case scenario. He didn't even land a punch. It will be hard for him to return to wrestling. If he returns without a win in MMA then it will just look like wrestling is for guys who can't fight. The result probably already confirms to UFC fanboys and wrestling haters that any wrestler not named Brock Lesnar can't fight, so I don't think this will help wrestling's image. It will probably give guys like Conor McGregor more ammunition.

Punk made a rookie mistake and it cost him his debut. He may be more cautious in future, but crashing and burning like that probably means he's done in the UFC.

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Ent on Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:12 pm

Best case scenario for punk from the sounds of it. Embarrassed but not badly hurt, he shouldn't fight again.

He had no place in a ring, Lesnar was a world class wrestler and elite athlete with huge physical advantages and when the punches were being thrown he was found wanting- punk never had a prayer and shame on him and the ufc.

Ent

Posts : 7337
Join date : 2011-05-02

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Electric Demon on Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:13 pm

As a wrestling fan, and a CM Punk fan, I'm proud of him for giving it a go and going through with it.

I did find it uncomfortable - but that's because I find UFC uncomfortable viewing anyway.

I don't think it damages Punk's stock in wrestling whatsoever. Wrestling fans are fully aware it's a fantasy world where every Brock Lesnar match would really last about 30 seconds in reality. And the opinion of UFC or real fighting fans, or Conor Macgregor (who I think is angling for a Wrestlemania match anyway...) doesn't matter just as it never has done. He would still return a Johnny-Five because he is CM Punk... The guy who's name still gets chanted every show, the guy who helped modernise WWE.

I can't see him returning to WWE ever so this is a moot point, but the only way in which he is damaged is if he was to be booked into a match with Brock Lesnar. It would stretch the imagination maybe a bit too far to believe Punk had any chance of winning.

Electric Demon

Posts : 2235
Join date : 2016-02-27

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Samo on Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:45 pm

Meanwhile Dana White breathed a sigh of relief with the power of a Cat 4 Hurricane. Can you imagine the image hit UFC would take if Punk had won this soon after Lesnar? Theres an element of UFC fans who pride their sport on the fact its legit competition and real combat. How would they have felt to see two 'Fake' wrestlers come in and win within 3 events of each other?

Samo

Posts : 4057
Join date : 2011-01-29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Ent on Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:56 pm

Well Lesnar isn't a fake wrestler is he? NCAA champion 105/6 record.

Punk was a pr stunt.


Ent

Posts : 7337
Join date : 2011-05-02

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Bull on Sun Sep 11, 2016 12:57 pm

CM PUNK!

Bull

Posts : 17481
Join date : 2011-02-22

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Samo on Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:04 pm

Ent wrote:Well Lesnar isn't a fake wrestler is he? NCAA champion 105/6 record.

Punk was a pr stunt.


Yeah but do they know that? Most just knew about his WWE work.

Samo

Posts : 4057
Join date : 2011-01-29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:06 pm

MMA fans are well aware of Brock's amateur background. They aint stupid. Commentators stated it enough.

His last win should be scratched anyway. He juiced.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sun Sep 11, 2016 2:24 pm

*got caught juicing

Ché Guerrero

Posts : 804
Join date : 2011-05-05
Age : 25
Location : Depends

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 2:38 pm

Cassius Zhi wrote:As a wrestling fan, and a CM Punk fan, I'm proud of him for giving it a go and going through with it.

I did find it uncomfortable - but that's because I find UFC uncomfortable viewing anyway.

I don't think it damages Punk's stock in wrestling whatsoever. Wrestling fans are fully aware it's a fantasy world where every Brock Lesnar match would really last about 30 seconds in reality. And the opinion of UFC or real fighting fans, or Conor Macgregor (who I think is angling for a Wrestlemania match anyway...) doesn't matter just as it never has done. He would still return a Johnny-Five because he is CM Punk... The guy who's name still gets chanted every show, the guy who helped modernise WWE.

I can't see him returning to WWE ever so this is a moot point, but the only way in which he is damaged is if he was to be booked into a match with Brock Lesnar. It would stretch the imagination maybe a bit too far to believe Punk had any chance of winning.

perhaps. But, there have been legitimate tough guys in wrestling throughout its history, as well as guys like Angle who was a gold medal olympic wrestler and then ken shamrock who transitioned into wrestling from MMA and now Brock Lesnar who helped boost the strength of wrestling's kayfabe image as a real combat sport. With Punk losing so decisively in a completely one-sided fight, and then returning immediately to pro-wrestling, considering the popularity and reality of MMA, I think it does hurt wrestling's image. Like other forms of entertainment with pro wrestling there is the importance of suspending disbelief. However, like bad casting in a movie if Punk is booked in a feud with other wrestlers and made to look really strong it could stretch that suspension of disbelief to breaking point. Let's say for example Punk was booked in a feud with Samoa Joe and he was in the coquina clutch and refused to tap. Any fan who has watched Punk's UFC fight or at least has heard the result will have it in the back of their minds and will measure the realism of the match against it. Or if Punk was facing Cesaro and he was put in the sharp shooter. Punk is going to have to be booked very carefully if he ever does return, especially if it is a promotion like roh with more of a hard-style/mma gimmick. Wrestling needs wrestlers who look and act like they are real fighters to help fans buy into the product, just like movies do with their casting.

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:15 pm

Punk will never return to WWE so it's really a moot point - but if he were ever to build those bridges again there is absolutely no way this harms the way he is booked or received upon return.

He's got bigger b*lls than most of the WWE roster by actually taking on this challenge and going through with it.

And Zhi is right - McGregor is so obviously angling for a Wrestlemania match - and actually I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was part of the deal allowing Lesnar to have his MMA fight earlier this year.
avatar
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 44554
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 22
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:21 pm

I disagree, Olly. I just think McGregor has an opinion of wrestlers and that's that. Fans seem to want everything to be a work.

Ronda on the other hand....

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:32 pm

Ronda has always loved wrestling, she's taken the nickname from Roddy for a reason.

I think McGregor would die doing a real WWE schedule

Dolphin Ziggler
Dolphin
Dolphin

Posts : 20404
Join date : 2012-03-01
Age : 29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 11, 2016 3:58 pm

He'd die laughing after being asked to sell a Dean Ambrose punch.

He's not gonna play fight for a fraction of what he's earning in the UFC. Not while he's actively fighting anyway.

I don't buy that Dana and Vince done a deal regarding Brock either. Brock just does what he wants.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun Sep 11, 2016 4:51 pm

FreekShow wrote:He'd die laughing after being asked to sell a Dean Ambrose punch.

He's not gonna play fight for a fraction of what he's earning in the UFC. Not while he's actively fighting anyway.

I don't buy that Dana and Vince done a deal regarding Brock either. Brock just does what he wants.

He doesnt work a fraction as hard as a full-time WWE wrestler. Be blowing out his a*se in 5 minutes on his first house show. They'd protect him like a golden egg, so this is hypothetical, but he needs education on the difference between being able to kick someone in the face and being tough

Dolphin Ziggler
Dolphin
Dolphin

Posts : 20404
Join date : 2012-03-01
Age : 29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Samo on Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:08 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:
FreekShow wrote:He'd die laughing after being asked to sell a Dean Ambrose punch.

He's not gonna play fight for a fraction of what he's earning in the UFC. Not while he's actively fighting anyway.

I don't buy that Dana and Vince done a deal regarding Brock either. Brock just does what he wants.

He doesnt work a fraction as hard as a full-time WWE wrestler. Be blowing out his a*se in 5 minutes on his first house show. They'd protect him like a golden egg, so this is hypothetical, but he needs education on the difference between being able to kick someone in the face and being tough

This. This a thousand times. He's got an ego because he can fight and think that wrestling cant compete, but when you're constantly dancing between travel, working out, wrestling, travel, working out, wrestling 300 days a year it would take its toll on anyone. They do crazy hard work that alot of people dont think about.

Samo

Posts : 4057
Join date : 2011-01-29

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Guest on Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:09 pm

He's been fighting and training to fight his whole life. Saying he's not as tough as a guy that bumps on a springed mat is laughable. Unless you are talking about the overall (travelling, media commitments etc) schedule?




Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Electric Demon on Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:43 pm

Quite emotional reading all the tweets from the wrestling fraternity - nothing but respect for Punk. Really nice to read.

Electric Demon

Posts : 2235
Join date : 2016-02-27

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by NickisBHAFC on Sun Sep 11, 2016 9:04 pm

Justice.

Should of stayed in the WWE.

NickisBHAFC

Posts : 11645
Join date : 2011-04-24
Age : 24
Location : Sussex

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by talkingpoint on Sun Sep 11, 2016 10:16 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Punk will never return to WWE so it's really a moot point - but if he were ever to build those bridges again there is absolutely no way this harms the way he is booked or received upon return.

He's got bigger b*lls than most of the WWE roster by actually taking on this challenge and going through with it.

And Zhi is right - McGregor is so obviously angling for a Wrestlemania match - and actually I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was part of the deal allowing Lesnar to have his MMA fight earlier this year.

i disagree. If Punk was to return to the WWE now would he just assume his best in the world gimmick after losing his only real professional fight in under 2 minutes? What does that say about pro wrestling when the best wrestler on the WWE roster can't last 2 minutes inside the octagon?! And not against a McGregor or a Nate Dias, but against a relative unknown. They definitely couldn't give him an mma gimmick like Brock as he's still only an amatuer fighter truthfully speaking (Gall wasn't being insulting when he said as much). Besides, this has nothing to do with the rest of the WWE roster not having the balls. And anyway that would just prove my point! So the entire WWE roster are only there because they're too frightened to do MMA and that gives CM Punk licence to come back after being defeated humiliatingly in his only pro fight and demand he becomes universal champion?

talkingpoint

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2011-02-20
Location : Essex Made Punk

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sun Sep 11, 2016 10:59 pm

FreekShow wrote:He's been fighting and training to fight his whole life. Saying he's not as tough as a guy that bumps on a springed mat is laughable. Unless you are talking about the overall (travelling, media commitments etc) schedule?




Yeah i think they meant the full schedule. Also compared to say Foley no he isnt as tough. *i do like Conor btw


Last edited by Ché Guerrero on Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

Ché Guerrero

Posts : 804
Join date : 2011-05-05
Age : 25
Location : Depends

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Ché Guerrero on Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:00 pm

Probably not fair to compare anyone to Foley but oh well

Ché Guerrero

Posts : 804
Join date : 2011-05-05
Age : 25
Location : Depends

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Mr H on Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:35 pm

Everything from him signing at UFC181 to the fight at the weekend, the whole fiasco has been embarrassing. Respect to him for pursuing a dream, but shame on Dana White, Duke Roufus and the Ohio Athletic Commission for evening sanctioning the fight. He shouldn't have been allowed anywhere near the Octagon. The UFC is the elite, the Premier League of MMA, and if anyone thought that with zero experience and zero amateur background that Punk could go in there and perform based solely on 2 years at a training camp then quite frankly you're as naïve as he is. The way he charged in and threw what can at best be described as a jab, it was cringeworthy man, majorly cringeworthy, and how Gall dropped him and threw down those hard shots, it was uncomfortable to watch.

The post fight speech and emotional press conference, I don't buy into all that, none of that is relevant, if he wanted to try MMA then go fight in a smaller promotion, the arrogance of thinking he can do it in the mecca that is the UFC and actually think he'd succeed? It stinks. I'm glad he got his ass whooped.

As a wrestler i loved CM Punk, i was a huge mark, but i hope to god he never steps foot inside an Octagon ever again. Punk, just drink it in man, you're not a mixed martial artist, you stupid idiot.

Mr H

Posts : 2820
Join date : 2011-03-10
Age : 35
Location : Parts Unknown

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by westisbest on Wed Sep 14, 2016 4:29 pm

His age is certainly against him.
Dana said that he shouldn't fight again in the UFC.

Glad Gall won, nothing against CM Punk, but Gall now can have his name out there. Move on with this win and fight super sage Northcut.

Young up and coming guy, with a lot of talent.
Didn't like CM Punk in wwe.

Hope that's the last of CM Punk in the UFC, probably best for him.
Don't think he should have been given a chance anyway.

westisbest

Posts : 6917
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Bournemouth

Back to top Go down

Re: CM Punk UFC debut *spoilers*

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum