PGA Tour: Elementary Bubba Watson: Notes from the Ballwasher

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 14 Sep 2016, 5:37 pm

First topic message reminder :

1).Davis Love made the fairly predictable choices last Monday of Fowler, Holmes and Kuchar as his first three "picks" for Team USA and seemed pretty pleased with himself. But now comes the hard part. You don't have to study too hard to read what's between the lines of his pga.com interview, as he has his Holmes but not his, or anyone else's it seems, Watson:

2)."These are the three guys we want right now." Which translated means: We didn't want Bubba.

3).We're looking for "guys we think are going to handle this stage and fit in with the group, be ready to play under that pressure". Not have a career singles record of 0 - 3, eh Bubba? (The same as Spieth's Pres Cup / Ryder Cup singles record, as it happens, the answer to the age-old trivia question: What do Messrs DeLaet, McDowell and Leishman have in common?) And, with this somewhat cliquey group, perhaps Bubba doesn't "fit in"?

4)."Rickie had a big schedule, with a lot weighing on him and he missed the Tour Championship by half a point," said Davis.
Bubba, on the other hand, played the same number (8) events from July 1st thru last week, outplayed Rickie in the Olympics, has won on Tour this season and is ranked higher in the owgr's. Oh, and Bubba didn't miss the Tour Championship, he made it comfortably.

5).I don't think the Task Force did Love any favours breaking up the timing of his Captain's Picks. He's clearly dissed Bubba and made it very difficult for Love to go back and choose him now.
On the other hand, Bubba could win the Tour Championship - how would he then feel about playing on a Team that has made it obvious that they don't want him?

6).Big sympathies for Bubba here, but what will Capt Love do now?  
New blood? The punditry seems to think he'll choose a young gun, Berger or Thomas - and one would think Thomas's relationship with LoveIV and cliquey best buds with Fowler and Spieth will help him if he can only help himself in Atlanta.

Or an Old head? Possibly Furyk, but I'd go with Dufner, 6 wins against 2 losses in his Presidents/Ryder Cups career, including 2 - 0 in singles. And a proven partner for Zach Johnson. Not to mention that Dufner would take the situation in his stride,

7).The wTF four-tournament action resumes in Boise, Idaho, where it's just warming up again after some frigid temps.
You know the score: The Top 25 money winners in this series, who have not already earned their Tour card via the web.com regular season, earn Tour cards for the 2016/2017 season. And the more money they earn, the higher their status with the stragglers probably only getting to play two of the first eight events, and likely only 2 of the following 8 also.

8).This is the fourth year for wTF and the 25th man on the past three money-lists has earned no less than $42K and no more than $44.3K.
So let's say $45K should get you a card, which would mean DeChambeau, Gonzales, Lindheim and Etulain already have their cards assured.
European standings after one event:
T11: Norlander
T13: Gonzo
T24: Johnston
etc.

9).Gregory Bourdy is throwing his chapeau into the wTF ring this week, joining Andrew Johnston and Aphibarnrat as potential European Tour defectors. Easily forgotten that highlights of Bourdy's season included T18 finishes in the US Open and PGA Championship. Bon chance.

10).Congrat's to Dustin Johnson on his BMW win and he joins Rory and Tiger as three-time FedEx Cup Play Off winners.
Meanwhile, Bubba Watson must be thrilled he championed the US cause in Rio when the Jordans and Dustins stayed at home. It sounds as if Bubba embraced the whole experience, proud to represent USA on the world's second biggest international stage. But the good old USA is not embracing Bubba, despite his 8th-place finish, and that's a shame which might make potential candidates for the Tokyo golf action think twice about playing in four years' time.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 1:48 am

Plenty of casinos, even those run in the name of bigot presidential candidates, go bankrupt.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 2:08 am

Not a bon tournament for Gregory Bourdy as he misses the cut in Boise.

Andrew Johnston will take a 2-stroke lead into Round 3, and projections for Europeans include:

1st: Beef
T10: Greg Owen
20th: Gonzo
21st: Norlander
T24: Jimmy Gunn

These are hares after 6 rounds of a 16 round race, plenty of time for the tortoises to overtake them, but some promising starts nevertheless.

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Post by robopz on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 2:31 am

GPB wrote:Every major change in the format has been to favorable to the European.

Adding Europe
The current format of 2 sessions of Four ball (4 matches) 2 sessions of Foursome (4 matches) and 12 singles.

I would like to see at least 5 matches in the first four sessions.
probably the changes made have favored Europe, but now that Euro team has more depth than before, not sure it's as much if any factor anymore.  I like the 4 matches for each if the team sessions. I just wish USA would use the opportunity to more aggressively hide players showing up in poor form. I think USA has played in the neighborhood of 6 or 7 players twice in a Cup since 1999.   It probably should have been double that.  I think the Euro's have done it 11 or 12 times in the same span.

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Post by GPB on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 6:42 am

Robo: It may not be a factor, but what could it hurt. Wouldn't be surprised to see some players need an amber alert on Saturday.

Kwini: IMO: Casinos don't go belly-up because of the juice. They go belly-up bad Mgt. because of wrong projections about customer basem bad decisions.

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Post by super_realist on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 12:33 pm

Not sure how every change has favoured Europe.

Did you really want to keep the competition with a population of 60 million (GB&I) to take on one of 300 million?

Yes, it's true that continental Europe has a larger landmass and population than America, but if you actually take the countries from which European golfers have ever come (UK, Ire, France, Italy, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Spain, Belgium), it probably makes it more of a level playing field, in fact, America still probably have a population advantage over Europe.

How does 4x 4ball and 4 x foursomes favour Europe

Poor management from America that has contributed most to their personal failure, nothing to do with the format.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 12:35 pm

Paul Broadhurst with a 2-shot lead in the Champions Tour event at Pebble Beach.
Andrew Johnston with a 2-shot lead in the web.com TF event in Idaho.

36 holes to go in each. Good luck chaps.

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Post by GPB on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 1:16 pm

super_realist wrote:Not sure how every change has favoured Europe.

Did you really want to keep the competition with a  population of 60 million (GB&I) to take on one of 300 million?

Yes, it's true that continental Europe has a larger landmass and population than America, but if you actually take the countries from which European golfers have ever come (UK, Ire, France, Italy, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Spain, Belgium), it probably makes it more of a level playing field, in fact, America still probably have a population advantage over Europe.

How does 4x 4ball and 4 x foursomes favour Europe

Poor management from America that has contributed most to their personal failure, nothing to do with the format.

How could not adding countries for your side favored your side.

FWIW...I am not saying the addition of Europe was the wrong thing to do.  Very much the opposite, IMO, it was the right thing to do.

How does 4x4 favor Europe?  Well, circumstantially, I think they are opposed to going 4 sessions of 5 matches and I think the US team would welcome it.  Even I can read between the lines:  Europe thinks 4x5 is disadvantageous to Europe and US thinks it would benefit them.  Overall, I think it has been Europe that "hides" players.  and from a personal stance, I don't see how more matches is not a good thing.

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Post by McLaren on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 4:01 pm

Now seems Tiger is part of a private equity group interested in TM purchase.
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Post by robopz on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 4:35 pm

GPB wrote:Robo:  It may not be a factor, but what could it hurt.  Wouldn't be surprised to see some players need an amber alert on Saturday..
"Back in the day"... I thought having 4 matches favored the Euro's because for a long time there I don't believe they had the depth of the American squad. But I don't think that's the case anymore, and apparently hasn't been for 20+ years now. So I don't think the change would hurt anything... I just don't have a problem with the way it is now. But if they wanted to up it to 5 matches for some or all of the team sessions... fine with me. But I would NOT want to see them go to 6 matches in any session, or have any kind of rule that requires a minimum matches a player must play (beyond the 1 singles he's required to play now).

Things I LIKE about 4 matches in each team session is it allows captains to play more to their perceived strengths in the two different formats. Plus it allows teams to hide players not in good form and/or allows recuperation time for some of the older or not entirely fit players. And by fit, I'm talking nicked up with injury but still able to play, just not 36.

The main thing I'd probably would enjoy about having 5 matches in each session is simply having more matches to watch. But using the Presidents Cup where they do play more matches, I ask myself... do I feel the Presidents Cup is necessarily better with more matches than it would be if had the same as the RC? And my answer is no, not really.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 4:44 pm

Daylight may also become an issue with five matches per session, unless it was spread over four days, which would dilute the intensity of the event, in my view at least.

Underway in Idaho; a bit warmer this morning and "Leicester City's" Greg Eason's early bird gets him into the Top 15. Do any of our East Midlands posters know much about him? Navy?? Dyna???

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 7:37 pm

Nice article about Brooks Koepka and Portrush's Ricky Elliott, who's caddying for BK in the Ryder Cup:

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/doug-ferguson/european-caddie-looping-koepka-ryder-cup

Thanks, as usual, to Doug Ferguson.


Beef treading water (which must be quite exhausting) at the start of the wTF's Round 3. But Eason still going well and Gonzo creeping thru' the field.

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Post by super_realist on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 8:39 pm

GPB wrote:
super_realist wrote:Not sure how every change has favoured Europe.

Did you really want to keep the competition with a  population of 60 million (GB&I) to take on one of 300 million?

Yes, it's true that continental Europe has a larger landmass and population than America, but if you actually take the countries from which European golfers have ever come (UK, Ire, France, Italy, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Spain, Belgium), it probably makes it more of a level playing field, in fact, America still probably have a population advantage over Europe.

How does 4x 4ball and 4 x foursomes favour Europe

Poor management from America that has contributed most to their personal failure, nothing to do with the format.

How could not adding countries for your side favored your side.

FWIW...I am not saying the addition of Europe was the wrong thing to do.  Very much the opposite, IMO, it was the right thing to do.

How does 4x4 favor Europe?  Well, circumstantially, I think they are opposed to going 4 sessions of 5 matches and I think the US team would welcome it.  Even I can read between the lines:  Europe thinks 4x5 is disadvantageous to Europe and US thinks it would benefit them.  Overall, I think it has been Europe that "hides" players.  and from a personal stance, I don't see how more matches is not a good thing.

Hardly "favouring" is it, just balancing the sides a bit. If you thought USA v GB and Ire was fair then you don't know what a fair match is.
How do you know that Europe would oppose 4x5 and how do you know USA would favour it? It's just ridiculous projection on your behalf.
Why would America want to have even more players with losing records? You have exactly 2 players in this coming team who have won more matches than they've lost. Why would America want to expose their weak underbelly even more than they already do?

As far as I know, I don't even think there has been any talk of extending it, and even if there was, there's nothing on record about who favours what, but one thing is certain, if that poisonous little cretin charge of the PGA wanted it, don't you think he'd get it?

Perhaps there does need a change needed to make it more competitive, but how about America got their finger out of their arse first before talking about changing things because certain pundits see it as "unfair" Codswallop

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Post by pedro on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 8:48 pm

In stead of comparing populations maybe you should look at # of players in the owgr top 100.

The US is the dominant nation in mens golf but certaintly not in womens golf. Here you could easily have Korea against ROW. But nobody would care. One of the intriguing bits about the RC (and Solheim) is the old vs the new world, cousins vs cousins, etc. Throw in Canada if you like, fine for me.

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Post by robopz on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 10:11 pm

super_realist wrote:
How do you know that Europe would oppose 4x5 and how do you know USA would favour it? It's just ridiculous projection on your behalf.
Why would America want to have even more players with losing records? You have exactly 2 players in this coming team who have won more matches than they've lost. Why would America want to expose their weak underbelly even more than they already do?

As far as I know, I don't even think there has been any talk of extending it, and even if there was, there's nothing on record about who favours what, but one thing is certain, if that poisonous little cretin charge of the PGA wanted it, don't you think he'd get it?

Perhaps there does need a change needed to make it more competitive, but how about America got their finger out of their arse first before talking about changing things because certain pundits see it as "unfair" Codswallop
On a competitive basis, I don't think Europe would necessarily oppose going with more team matches now because IMO we're Waaaay past the point where they would have had any depth deficiency against the USA.  But if the RC format ain't broke in the eyes of Team USA or Europe, then why change it?  This is just discussion among fans.  As far as I'm aware nobody in either organization is pushing for change from the current 28 points.  

And if it's Finchem your referring to with your juvenile "poisonous little cretin" derision... why would the PGA of A give a damn about what he might think about it, if he even cared in the first place?

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Post by pedro on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 11:15 pm

US golfers just can't help themselves talking about religion. Now also DL3.

http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/ryder-cup-2016-captain-davis-love-hazeltine-chance-redemption

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Post by SmithersJones on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 11:44 pm

25 m golfers in the US, 4.1 m in Europe. But we're in a post fact world now so yes, definitely favours Europe.


Last edited by SmithersJones on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 11:48 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : 4.1 not 4.4)
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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 17 Sep 2016, 11:52 pm

25 m plus their respective gods.

Beef had trouble with his distance control today and missed some short putts but still scraped a 1-under par round and is in 4th place after Round 3 of the wTF. Maintain that position and a PGA Tour card is his.

Gonzo and Greg Eason both in with 66's, and both in great shape for Sunday.

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:15 am

Maybe I missed something... is this a golf board or a simply a meeting place for a pathetic gaggle of judgemental Holier Than Thou agnostics and atheists?

I enjoy talking GOLF if that's what this board is supposed to be about, but if about insulting others over their religious and or political beliefs... Then fine... You can stick it where the sun don't shine.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:24 am

Mostly agree robo, but if DLIII and others insist on putting their god in their GOLF interviews, how can a fair counterpoint possibly ignore it?
It's perfectly ridiculous and just panders to conventional sensibilities.

On a brighter point, am really enjoying the wTF coverage, after being dead against the somewhat contrived operation in its inception.
Can't find a timetable yet for Q-School.
Wish they'd return Craig Perks to Palmerston though - wonder if he'll put his money where his mouth is on the Champers Tour?




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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:37 am

Its seem like the only people that want to discuss religion are the Atheists and Agnostics.

And I agree with Robo, it is from sanctimonious & judgmental posters.

Anything that pings a religious reference is immediately identified and linked in these threads. Except if it comes from Bernhard Langer, then it is largely ignored.


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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:39 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Mostly agree robo, but if DLIII and others insist on putting their god in their GOLF interviews, how can a fair counterpoint possibly ignore it?

I really don't why you people can't ignore it. I guess it something for which you can all rally

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:41 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Mostly agree robo, but if DLIII and others insist on putting their god in their GOLF interviews, how can a fair counterpoint possibly ignore it?
It's perfectly ridiculous and just panders to conventional sensibilities.  
Woosh.... Shocking my comment went right over your head too.... "Ridiculous"? "Conventional sensibilities"? Can you possibly be any more judgemental?  Or is it so ingrained you don't even realize that's what your doing?

Maybe this isn't a good board for an American like me. I'm obviously not nearly practiced enough nor comfortable enough with  looking down my nose with judgemental distain for  others based on their personal beliefs....

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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:55 am

Robo: Ironically, Many of the posters here get their knickers in a twist when an American player names their kid with a non-Biblical (non-traditional) name.

John, James, Andrew are acceptable names

Wyndham is not an acceptable name.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:57 am

Sorry you feel that way, robo.
Of course it's a golf board but cultural "stuff" is part of it as well, whether it's allegations, mostly, or understandably at least, justifiable accusations of "cronyism", or prizing silly faithisms which panders to a certain "base".

GPB's earlier post is somewhat dyslexic so can't possibly respond, but somehow intertwining "religious beliefs" with sport is surely beyond the pale, and pail. And that applies to good guys and bad - won't characterise the bad guys but blokes like Love, Badds and Langer are apparently good guys, but don't try to deny there are other points of view, perfectly defensible, as well.


Projected wTF standings for Europeans includes:
6th: Johnston
8th: Gonzo
T13: Eason

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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:12 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Sorry you feel that way, robo.
Of course it's a golf board but cultural "stuff" is part of it as well, whether it's allegations, mostly, or understandably at least, justifiable accusations of "cronyism", or prizing silly faithisms which panders to a certain "base".

GPB's earlier post is somewhat dyslexic so can't possibly respond, but somehow intertwining "religious beliefs" with sport is surely beyond the pale, and pail. And that applies to good guys and bad - won't characterise the bad guys but blokes like Love, Badds and Langer are apparently good guys, but don't try to deny there are other points of view, perfectly defensible, as well.


Projected wTF standings for Europeans includes:
6th: Johnston
8th: Gonzo
T13: Eason

Who is denying there are not other points of view? I just don't understand why the bloggers here have to be contentious about it. I am not a religious person, haven't regularly attended Church in nearly 50 years. The only time religious talk bothers me is when it is hammered down my throat, over and over again. And no one on the PGATour comes close to that.

FTR, the times have that I attended Church is out of respect for friends and family. A Baptism, a Bar Mitzvah, etc.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:23 am

Quite agree.
Tell that to Davis and no doubt all will move on.

I support a football club whose centre-half used to refuse to play on Christmas Day, and my neighbourhood meeting in October is under fire because it clashes with Yom Kippur, so quite understand religious observances, but sports people shouldn't use their beliefs as a badge of honour. Which, you have to admit, many (especially Americans) do.

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:36 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Sorry you feel that way, robo.
Of course it's a golf board but cultural "stuff" is part of it as well, whether it's allegations, mostly, or understandably at least, justifiable accusations of "cronyism", or prizing silly faithisms which panders to a certain "base".
 Wow... "silly faithisms"... "a certain base".  In the words of Ronald Reagan... "There you go again".  You really don't understand how arrogant and condescending that is to so many people do you?  Incredible to me that in a very decent journalistic read on DL3 that scrolled about 20 screens on my tablet... you pick out that 1/2 screen worth to heap derision on.

I think his "point" was Payne Stewart's death touched him to a point he decided chose a path of enhanced faith as a way to try to transform himself into "a better a better husband, father, son, friend. A stronger Christian".  Now exactly WHAT in the world is wrong with that?  A reason to insult him?  Come on man... seriously?... for real?  

To be honest with you Kwini, in the bigger picture of things... I couldn't care fickin less if DL3 gets his personal inspiration from his God or from inspirational inscriptions tattooed on Miley Cyrus' bare naked twerking @rse.  If it inspires him to try to be a better person, who cares from who or what or how he comes by it?  But I guess the thing that baffles me the most... Why is it that any person of faith appears to be so threatening to those of you with apparent higher level "UN-conventional sensibilities" it's a such lightning rod to you all anytime it's mentioned?

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:53 am

Back to golf.... Beef backed up a bit today which is not all that surprising... The old "hard to backup a great round with another" thingy. But he's still right there in 4th place with a chance for tomorrow. Gonna have to go low in this birdie fest though. I really hope he gets his PGAT card.

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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 2:22 am

Ryo fell back in the third round in Japan, but he is currently 2 shots behind Aussie Brendan Jones early in the final round.

Ryan Ruffels is slumming on the Latino Americas Tour.

Incidentally, an announcement this week of The Aruba Cup Presidents Cup type competition between the Latinos America Tour and the MacKenzie Tour, in Aruba obviously.

http://www.pgatour.com/canada/en_us/news/2016/090/15/aruba-cup-announcement.html

I can think of worse places to be on the week before Christmas.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:14 am

robopz wrote:
super_realist wrote:
How do you know that Europe would oppose 4x5 and how do you know USA would favour it? It's just ridiculous projection on your behalf.
Why would America want to have even more players with losing records? You have exactly 2 players in this coming team who have won more matches than they've lost. Why would America want to expose their weak underbelly even more than they already do?

As far as I know, I don't even think there has been any talk of extending it, and even if there was, there's nothing on record about who favours what, but one thing is certain, if that poisonous little cretin charge of the PGA wanted it, don't you think he'd get it?

Perhaps there does need a change needed to make it more competitive, but how about America got their finger out of their arse first before talking about changing things because certain pundits see it as "unfair" Codswallop
On a competitive basis, I don't think Europe would necessarily oppose going with more team matches now because IMO we're Waaaay past the point where they would have had any depth deficiency against the USA.  But if the RC format ain't broke in the eyes of Team USA or Europe, then why change it?  This is just discussion among fans.  As far as I'm aware nobody in either organization is pushing for change from the current 28 points.  

And if it's Finchem your referring to with your juvenile "poisonous little cretin" derision... why would the PGA of A give a damn about what he might think about it, if he even cared in the first place?

Then what the hell are you on about? There is no appetite for change in the RC, so stop acting like it's skewed in the favour of Europe. If Finchem wanted it to change, then surely he has the influence to do so. As he doesn't seem to want anything, then he hasn't done anything. So, as you say, if it ain't broke, don't change it. Only America's understanding of what a team is is broken, whilst their "task Force" is a laughable collection of Ryder Cup deadbeats. It's like putting Fred West in charge of the Primary School.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:22 am

robopz wrote:Maybe I missed something... is this a golf board or a simply a meeting place for a pathetic gaggle of judgemental Holier Than Thou agnostics and atheists?

I enjoy talking GOLF if that's what this board is supposed to be about, but if about insulting others over their religious and or political beliefs... Then fine... You can stick it where the sun don't shine.

If Golfers (including Langer) didn't arrogantly mention their imaginary jewish sky zombie, there wouldn't be the need to laugh at them for their absurd logic. If they didn't mention it, we wouldn't either. If they praised the Flying Spaghetti Monster, they'd get laughed at, but something indistinguishable like the slave condoning god of the bible gets a free pass. How come?
The point is that believing in god is NO DIFFERENT from believing in the twerking tattoo on Miley Cyrus' arse. That's why it should be ridiculed.

What is wrong with "faith" you ask. Well faith is indistinguishable from credulity. It is the excuse people give for believing when they haven't got a reason to, ergo, it's bloody stupid, regardless of whether someone thinks they are a better person for it. You can believe you are an onion on faith if you like, but it doesn't make it true. Hence why citing it makes you a better person makes it ridiculous. If you want to be a better person, just bloody be one, don't credit some imaginary deity with it. Grow up and take credit for your own personal development, it's worse than a kid with an imaginary friend.

No one gets their knickers in a twist because many American names are non biblical, most people  don't have biblical names, I personally think names like Wyndham and Tiger just sound completely ridiculous.

There are no such things as "biblical names" either, they are just names in the bible, they didn't originate there. Those names existed BEFORE the bloody bible.

You might say "just ignore it", but you could say the same for homophobia, racism, sexism etc, yet we don't do we? So no, if someone is retarded enough to credit their success to an immoral god, then yes, they're going to get laughed at for it, it's not a threat, it's just credulity and commands ridicule.

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Post by pedro on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:57 am

Fact is religion divides and has done so for 1000 years, so keep it to yourself. A true 'leader' should know that by now. Had DLIII praised Allah he'd be counting his threesticks in Gizmo by now.

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 11:00 am

pedro wrote:Fact is religion divides and has done so for 1000 years, so keep it to yourself....
Winner, winner, chicken dinner... That's exactly the point I've been trying to make from the beginning.  And that's why it's got NO place on a golf discussion board. Can anyone here even grasp that concept?  Apparently not.


Last edited by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 11:07 am

super_realist wrote:
You might say "just ignore it", but you could say the same for homophobia, racism, sexism etc, yet we don't do we? So no, if someone is retarded enough to credit their success to an immoral god, then yes, they're going to get laughed at for it, it's not a threat, it's just credulity and commands ridicule.
   you left religiophobia off your list of things maybe we shouldn't ignore.

religiophobia. Noun. An irrational or obsessive fear or anxiety of religion, religious faith, religious people or religious organisations.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 12:40 pm

robo,
All I was trying to say is that it is only relevant because Love brought it up. And it highly unlikely that he would have done if he knew that it might not attract favour with his audience.
Sure there are plenty of personal pecadilloes that he could have chosen that he might know would not be seen in such favourable light.

No idea who Miley Cyrus might be (well I think I do) but what the hell as she done to get into the discussion?

Beef was having big problems with his wedges from the fairway yesterday - altitude, mis-clubbing, adrenaline or what, he's got to see 100 - 150 yd shots as an opportunity not a liability. Fingers crossed for Gonzo today too, and looking foeward to seeing what "Leicester City's" own does in the heat of the moment.



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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:01 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:robo,
All I was trying to say is that it is only relevant because Love brought it up. And it highly unlikely that he would have done if he knew that it might not attract favour with his audience.
 I guess the thing I don't understand is WHY religion is such a fixation and lightning rod on this board?  It took me scrolling through about 20 screens to read the article at the link you posted... and his faith was mentioned in about two sentences... Yet THAT is what you was fixated on out of that entire article.  

Look, I get it... I like to keep religion and sport separate as well, but if someone who plays sport is religious... SO THE FRICK WHAT?   Unless DL3 publicly invokes his God to slay the evil Euro Ryder Cup Team or has Team USA led into the opening ceremonies with cross bearing acolytes... then why should anybody give a rats arse about his personal beliefs?   Unless they're religiophobes... they shouldn't.

That's my last word on this topic...   back to golf


Last edited by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:23 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : It wasn't kwini that posted the link)

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:08 pm

I didn't post it, I didn't find it.


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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:18 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:I didn't post it, I didn't find it.

Oops... My bad. That was Pedro who posted the original link...

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Post by GPB on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:24 pm

1st, T2 and solo 3rd in his last three starts for Ryo Ishikawa. He is getting close to crashing the Top 100 again.

Brendan Jones won the tournmament.

Molinari could get to #43 should he win. Willett gets to #9 if he wins, into the Top 10 with a Solo 6th or better.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 1:34 pm

I DID post the DF article about Portrush's Ricky Elliott caddying in the RC for Brooks Koepka - thought that piece was very interesting.


Horses for courses on the Champions Tour with Kevin Sutherland taking the lead at Pebble Beach - he's been in contention there before down the decades. Paul Broadhurst one back, and Van der Velde playing well.

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Post by robopz on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 2:12 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:I DID post the DF article about Portrush's Ricky Elliott caddying in the RC for Brooks Koepka - thought that piece was very interesting.
Yeah... I'd never thought about it from the caddies perspective. I am so NON-nationalistic when it comes to golf 51 weeks a year... but when it comes to RC's, PC's or the Olympics... then it's rah-rah USA all the way for me. But if I were caddie on the "wrong team", I'm still sure I could do everything in my power to help my player be successful in such matches. But I'm also pretty sure I couldn't do it without at least some mixed feelings....

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 2:19 pm

I think Bones was born in Britain; that's something that's never spoken about. Sounds like he's a good guy.

Also think Jimmy Johnson is Zimbabwean, caddying for Stricker in Presidents Cups past. High %age, relatively speaking, of GB&I, Southern African and Antipodean caddies on the PGA Tour.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 7:27 pm

A big two or three hours of golf for Beef and Gonzo; both will secure Tour cards for 16/17 if they maintain their current positions. But that could change before I click SEND.

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Post by pedro on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:01 pm

robopz wrote:
pedro wrote:Fact is religion divides and has done so for 1000 years, so keep it to yourself....
Winner, winner, chicken dinner... That's exactly the point I've been trying to make from the beginning.  And that's why it's got NO place on a golf discussion board. Can anyone here even grasp that concept?  Apparently not.
Tell Davis. Don't kill the messenger.
We debate/comment EVERYTHING the golfers say and do, from religion and politics to hairdo and outfit. I don't invent it.

PS. Is it fried chicken?

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Post by McLaren on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:49 pm

Robo/gpb

It is very unusual to hear sports people in the UK talk about god in post match interviews. Occasionally an African footballer will mention being blessed or something, but we just don't come across overt declarations of religiousness in any form of media. It might seem odd to you but hearing someone openly profess that their religion has had material impact on reality, for example changing a sportmans performance, is genuinely comment worthy.

I am not condoning dragging a golf thread into a discussion about religion but I hope I can give you an understanding of why commenting on golfers when they speak about their religion is probably inevitable on a UK golf forum. I am sure there is loads of stuff about brits that seem normal to us but would attract attention on a US forum.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 8:56 pm

You mean like pro golfers declaring they're going to "get hammered" following a Tour win, Mac? That sort of thing??

Trouble is, Johnston is hammering his wedges this weekend.

Gonzo needing at least another two birdies coming in, Beef needing at least one more to secure his card.

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Post by SmithersJones on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 9:15 pm

Can criticism of religion or indeed fear of religious people be in any way irrational given the huge amount of conflict it engenders? And it's not as if anyone thanking Allah would be calmly accepted as normal on the PGA Tour is it?
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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 11:16 pm

Where's the Beef?
On the PGA Tour and, if he follows his statements during the Boise tournament, the European Tour as well.
Never really seen much more than highlights of his play before, but his ball-striking looks well up to Tour standard, but not wedge game. Got to get that sorted Andy, or there'll be a few weekends off.

Gonzo probably one made cut away from returning to his rightful place, Owen and Norlander on pace to retrieve their cards.

Terrible (75) final round for Greg Eason and it's difficult to make a case for him being anything much more than a web.com lifer.

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Post by pedro on Sun 18 Sep 2016, 11:52 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:. Got to get that sorted Andy, or there'll be a few weekends off.
.... to get hammered.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 19 Sep 2016, 2:44 am

Nice to hear a good Birmingham accent in the Pebble Beach winners enclosure as Paul Broadhurst squeaks out a win by one stroke on the Champers Tour - apparently just the third Pro to win at Carnoustie and Pebble. After Hogan & Watson.
Broadhurst will win a ton of $money on courses where par-ish is a good score.

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