Scotland Autumn Internationals '16

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AUTUMN INTERNATIONALS 2016

Scotland Squad
Allan Dell (Edinburgh Rugby) – uncapped
Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby) – 58 caps
Zander Fagerson (Glasgow Warriors) – 1 cap
Moray Low (Exeter Chiefs) – 34 caps
Gordon Reid (Glasgow Warriors) – 18 caps

Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby) – 99 caps
Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors) – 17 caps
Stuart McInally (Edinburgh Rugby) – 9 caps

Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh Rugby) – 12 caps
Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) – 25 caps
Richie Gray (Toulouse) – 58 caps
Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors) – 24 caps

John Barclay (Scarlets) – 52 caps
John Hardie (Edinburgh Rugby) – 12 caps
Rob Harley (Glasgow Warriors) – 18 caps
Josh Strauss (Glasgow Warriors) – 9 caps
Hamish Watson (Edinburgh Rugby) – 2 caps
Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors) – 20 caps

Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Gloucester) – 53 caps
Henry Pyrgos (Glasgow Warriors) – 18 caps

Pete Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 20 caps
Finn Russell (Glasgow Warriors) – 19 caps

Mark Bennett (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps
Alex Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors) – 18 caps
Huw Jones (Stormers) – 1 cap
Duncan Taylor (Saracens) – 18 caps

Damien Hoyland (Edinburgh Rugby) – 2 caps
Sean Maitland (Saracens) – 23 caps
Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors) – 29 caps
Tim Visser (Harlequins) – 26 caps

Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors) – 45 caps


Saturday 12 November
Scotland v Australia, BT Murrayfield Edinburgh, kick-off SAT 14:30

Saturday 19 November
Scotland v Argentina, BT Murrayfield Edinburgh, kick-off SAT 17:00

Saturday 26 November
Scotland v Georgia, Rugby Park Kilmarnock, Kick-off SAT 14:30

Recent Head To Head

18 Oct 2015 (RWC) Australia 35 - 34 Scotland
23 Nov 2013 Scotland 15 - 21 Australia

08 Nov 2014 Scotland 41 - 31 Argentina
20 Jun 2014 Argentina 19 - 21 Scotland

14 Sep 2011 (RWC) Scotland 15 - 6 Georgia

Recent 2016 Results

Wallabies
Australia 36 - 20 Argentina
Australia 23 - 17 South Africa
New Zealand 29 - 9 Australia
Australia 8 - 42 New Zealand

Argentina
Australia 36 - 20 Argentina
New Zealand 57 - 22 Argentina
Argentina 26 - 24 South Africa
South Africa 30 - 23 Argentina

Georgia
Fiji 3 - 14 Georgia
Georgia 23 - 20 Tonga
Samoa 19 - 19 Georgia
Georgia 38 - 9 Romania

Well, well, well. Cotter's claiming he was pushed, and it was about keeping Toonie after all.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/37763931

Having read BVC's response to Townsend getting the job, I feel a little bit aggrieved that he's leaving so soon. I think he should have got another season at the very least. It also leaves me a bit skeptical of Toonie. Considering it was similar circumstances that took him into the Glasgow set-up, maybe he's turning into Scotland's Clive Woodward (although not as much of a tw*t), ie what he wants, he gets.

I just hope there's visible continuity.

That was my immediate reaction too. Cotter sounds like he feel's he hasn't had the chance to finish what he started.

Looking at that squad for me there seems to be a few odd omissions of players who are in form. Players either currently injured or not 100% fit being picked ahead of them.

The main omissions for me are Matt Scott who has scored fairly regularly for Gloucester and been one of the form centres in the Aviva. The other is Magnus Bradbury who is young still but this season has proved he is ready with very strong performances every week. He is exactly the type of blindside/8 we have been missing, someone who carries the ball hard, tackles hard and puts in a lot of work at the breakdown and seems to have good passing/offloading skills.

Others who I think have been in good form but probably not expected to be included are Byron McGuigan who has performed well this season for Sale at Full back and wing. Scored a few tries and looks a far better player than when he was at Glasgow. Excellent under the high ball, can kick, strong in attack and can tackle. We don't have many quality options after Hogg but the way McGuigan has been playing he is next in line at full back for me.
Tom Heathcote has been getting good game time at Worcester and playing pretty well, doing the basics well and also seems to be taking the ball to the line more making quite a few breaks for them.

Ben Toolis is probably the most unlucky, watching both Toolis and Gilchrist play for Edinburgh this season I really don't see what Gilchrist has extra over him, Toolis carries harder, is more destructive at the breakdown, makes a lot of tackles, he'd be ideal as the sub lock to add some explosive power late on in the game and make an impact.

I think Ryan Wilson and Rob Harley are both fairly lucky to make the squad, Wilson still doesn't impress me and gives away far too many penalties and is still getting binned often. I do rate Harley but he just doesn't seem to have hit form this season, he still lacks a ball carrying aspect to his game as well.
Duncan Taylor is lucky to be included over Matt Scott having barely played this season due to injury, he was the form 13 in Europe last season but is going to be struggling for match fitness when the autumn tests start.

There are 4 included to train with the team to gain experience which I think is a good idea, I am surprised though that Nick Grigg is one, hasn't featured for Glasgow much and I wouldn't have thought would be near the top of the pecking order for the future either.

nickj wrote:That was my immediate reaction too. Cotter sounds like he feel's he hasn't had the chance to finish what he started.

An absolute blunder on part of the SRU.

I wonder what Toonie was being offered that had them so worried, and why they didn't just let him do it.

It's the SRU remember!

An organisation that won't sack coaches that are man-sausaging things up for the national team (Matt Williams, Frank Hadden, Scott Johnson) but are happy to let a decent coach who is making progress (Cotter) go wandering off into the sunset!

I'm still on the fence with Toonie! I'm not sure if he is a great coach of if he's riding on the coat tails of the team and structure than Sean Lineen put in at Glasgow!

tigertattie wrote:It's the SRU remember!

An organisation that won't sack coaches that are man-sausaging things up for the national team (Matt Williams, Frank Hadden, Scott Johnson) but are happy to let a decent coach who is making progress (Cotter) go wandering off into the sunset!

I'm still on the fence with Toonie! I'm not sure if he is a great coach of if he's riding on the coat tails of the team and structure than Sean Lineen put in at Glasgow!

See I thought that, though his success with Glasgow has to be credited to him at least in part, but Lineen deserves a lot of credit.

Either way, intrigued. I hope they don't suddenly drop what Cotter instilled in the squad, they've had a lot of gritty performances with a never say die attitude. Let's see what happens next month and 6Ns.

Regarding Cotter, I suspect the SRU realised if he were to be kept on for the time we all would have liked then it may have resulted in a swap at an awkward time in terms of the world cup. Toonie is gonna take hold of the reigns mid 2017 which means 2 years to work towards Japan 2019. However, going by the BBC article, perhaps Cotter would have been willing to stay on until after the next world cup. Who knows. Personally I think SRU have made a slightly hasty decision and should have only made this decision if they were unsure that Cotter was going to stick around until 2019+. Townsend could have taken an offer on a 3 year deal in France and expanded his coaching skill set.. sigh, I hope this works out in the end.

Who knew that VC was a comedian?

When asked about Nel's neck injury he supposed quipped 'it came as a surprise to us all - we didn't think he had a neck'

It will be interesting to see if the fact that there is no longer any pressure on VC, with him leaving at the end of the season and having his next job already lined up, will effect the way he acts and the team performs!

There were a few comments that the mood seemed a lot lighter at the press conference yesterday than it normally would be with him. Someone even managed to catch a photo of him smilling, which is not a common event!

He did mention that they were looking at Kinghorn but wanted him to back up last weeks performance a bit more often and that it was CDP ankle injury that was probably keeping him out of the squad currently but that they were aware what he is capable of.

Expect to see CDP in for the 6N if he gets fit and shows the form he is capable of and for Kinghorn to tour in the summer.

Kinghorn will almost certainly tour this summer if he can be consistent. Hogg is on the Lions tour (only injury will stop that and he would still be unavailable), Maitland could go and beyond that we have a choice of Tonks, Bryce, Kinghorn or McGuigan. Really it is between Kinghorn and Bryce on who goes as the back up to Maitland.

CDP could do with being given the time to get right rather than rush back. He has been overplayed for years and he will be needed more for the 6 nations than to play Georgia (who are no slouches but ultimately not a meaningful match). Edinburgh are not going anywhere fast. Fihaki and Ritchie can fill the jersey in the meantime. I assume at least one of Bradbury, Watson and Hardie will be released for the home game vs Ulster. I could see Hardie being told to have an hour to build fitness.

Think that's fair on Kinghorn, he clearly has potential but I would say a year or so away from filling a Scotland jersey. Bradbury I'd say (depending on injuries) sooner.

Cool, for Australia I think the pack should be fairly conservative. Backs I think are fairly easy to choose except at centre.

Dickinson
Ford
Low
Gray
Gray
Strauss
Hardie
Wilson

Laidlaw
Russell
Visser
Dunbar
Taylor
Maitland
Hogg

Brown, Reid, Dell, Gilchrist, Barclay, Pyrgos, Horne, Seymour

Think putting Dell at tighthead is a tad ambitious. Fagerson is more likely. Depending on how much Low has played, I think Fagerson may end up starting.

I would prefer to drop Taylor altogether in favour of Bennett or Jones. Barclay in for Wilson at 6 and Strauss to 8. Wilson can cover from the bench.

I don't know about starting Jones (or even benching him) against Australia - it may be too quick a step up - but having watched him play, he does have that lovely 'ghost' quality you find in good centres, where he accelerates without seeming to be doing anything (Bennett is another), and his support running also seems really good.

When he came off the bench for Scotland against Japan, I really enjoyed him winning a crucial turnover on our line - it was a lovely unexpected surprise, like looking in your desk drawer and finding half a pack of Haribo you'd forgotten about.

I'd start him against Argentina.

Fargerson will start, VC pretty much said so yesterday.

I can't see any way that Tommy Seymour will be left out either, he is our best winger. The other spot is open to any of the other three.

It's No Maits or Tackle boy for the other wing.

Both have been on a bit of form in the Aviva with No Maits even scoring!!!!

I can see Tackle boy starting with No Maits on the bench to cover wing and fullback!

IanBru wrote:I don't know about starting Jones (or even benching him) against Australia - it may be too quick a step up - but having watched him play, he does have that lovely 'ghost' quality you find in good centres, where he accelerates without seeming to be doing anything (Bennett is another), and his support running also seems really good.

When he came off the bench for Scotland against Japan, I really enjoyed him winning a crucial turnover on our line - it was a lovely unexpected surprise, like looking in your desk drawer and finding half a pack of Haribo you'd forgotten about.

I'd start him against Argentina.

... as opposed to Visser's "ghost quality" in defence!

funnyExiledScot wrote:

IanBru wrote:I don't know about starting Jones (or even benching him) against Australia - it may be too quick a step up - but having watched him play, he does have that lovely 'ghost' quality you find in good centres, where he accelerates without seeming to be doing anything (Bennett is another), and his support running also seems really good.

When he came off the bench for Scotland against Japan, I really enjoyed him winning a crucial turnover on our line - it was a lovely unexpected surprise, like looking in your desk drawer and finding half a pack of Haribo you'd forgotten about.

I'd start him against Argentina.

... as opposed to Visser's "ghost quality" in defence!

I never thought I would utter these words but I think Hughes has been playing well and deserves a crack at a game.

cakeordeath wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:

IanBru wrote:I don't know about starting Jones (or even benching him) against Australia - it may be too quick a step up - but having watched him play, he does have that lovely 'ghost' quality you find in good centres, where he accelerates without seeming to be doing anything (Bennett is another), and his support running also seems really good.

When he came off the bench for Scotland against Japan, I really enjoyed him winning a crucial turnover on our line - it was a lovely unexpected surprise, like looking in your desk drawer and finding half a pack of Haribo you'd forgotten about.

I'd start him against Argentina.

... as opposed to Visser's "ghost quality" in defence!

I never thought I would utter these words but I think Hughes has been playing well and deserves a crack at a game.

Hmm he's a bit like a young version of Lamont, a bit of a solid lump. We have better options for sure, I'd sooner see Hoyland involved. What has happened to Farndale? Is he officially full time 7s?

If he is planing well enough to deserve a chance, he should get the chance. This is what these tours are for

Hughes looked alright and could do with a few games to establish himself. Italy could be a good game to throw him into. If Scotland lose a winger to the Lions, he is in the mix for the summer.

cakeordeath wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:

IanBru wrote:I don't know about starting Jones (or even benching him) against Australia - it may be too quick a step up - but having watched him play, he does have that lovely 'ghost' quality you find in good centres, where he accelerates without seeming to be doing anything (Bennett is another), and his support running also seems really good.

When he came off the bench for Scotland against Japan, I really enjoyed him winning a crucial turnover on our line - it was a lovely unexpected surprise, like looking in your desk drawer and finding half a pack of Haribo you'd forgotten about.

I'd start him against Argentina.

... as opposed to Visser's "ghost quality" in defence!

I never thought I would utter these words but I think Hughes has been playing well and deserves a crack at a game.

I rate Hughes, I really do. He's a powerful and direct winger who forces defences onto the back foot. He's a great option to have and will only improve as he gets more game time. For me he's still behind Seymour, Visser and Maitland (this season), and probably Hoyland as well (based on recent performances), but he's a player who would not let us down. I'd have no concerns whatsoever should Hughes get a game against Georgia.

So the Glasgow / Scotland coaching switcheroo has been confirmed with McFarland and Taylor joining Tooney at Scotland and Humphries and O'Halloran moving to Glasgow next season.

Seen nowhere near enough from Hughes to merit a cap. Very much in the solid camp right now, should have finished that chance against Leicester after Sarto's break.

Bennett's game time may have been limited but confident he's played more than Taylor.

Great to see Hogg, Seymour, Bennett, Dunbar & Russell all starting for Glasgow this weekend.

May be a pipe-dream but I'd love to see Bradbury have a stormer this weekend and force his way into the XV.

Fingers crossed Cotter gives Watson a chance.

Off topic but does anyone know much about this player?

http://www.makos.co.nz/news/meet-finlay-christie

bsando wrote:Off topic but does anyone know much about this player?

http://www.makos.co.nz/news/meet-finlay-christie

He lives in a place called Puke!

tigertattie wrote:

bsando wrote:Off topic but does anyone know much about this player?

http://www.makos.co.nz/news/meet-finlay-christie

He lives in a place called Puke!

bsando wrote:

tigertattie wrote:

bsando wrote:Off topic but does anyone know much about this player?

http://www.makos.co.nz/news/meet-finlay-christie

He lives in a place called Puke!

And is apparently a very nice chap according to his auntie

Bit off topic, anyone following the Scotland RL team take on Oz tonight?

Duncan Taylor isn't even in the Sarries squad this weekend, presumably injured.

If he's going to be involved in the AIs he is going to be desperately short of match fitness.

Matt Scott is starting at 13 for Gloucester.

RDW_Scotland wrote:...he is going to be desperately short of match fitness.

Or to put it another way, he is going to be generously well-rested. Glass half full and all that...

I want to see Watson start. He is in form, Hardie has hardly played. could we have them both in the team?

Manky-Flanker wrote:Bit off topic, anyone following the Scotland RL team take on Oz tonight?

That'll be a cricket score...

If they keep it within 30 points that's a fairly sound game.

Manky-Flanker wrote:Bit off topic, anyone following the Scotland RL team take on Oz tonight?

What channel is it on? I thought it was on the Beeb but I can't find it!!!

Glasgow vs Treviso is on Alba at 7:30 though

NeilyBroon wrote:

nickj wrote:That was my immediate reaction too. Cotter sounds like he feel's he hasn't had the chance to finish what he started.

An absolute blunder on part of the SRU.

I wonder what Toonie was being offered that had them so worried, and why they didn't just let him do it.

I still feel that keeping Cotter on til 2019 and letting Townsend try his hand in France or England would give us the best of both worlds.
The first reason is that from Townsend's playing days we all know he won't stay anywhere too long, the notion that Scotland will have a coach of Alex Ferguson longevity, loyalty and success is laughable. Toonie is still very, very young for an international coach.
Secondly, following on from the last point literally every other home nations coach has experience coaching in at least three countries, two of which have international experience elsewhere, the French and Italian coaches have significantly more club coaching experience and have both won more than Townsend, I honestly see what we'd have lost by letting Townsend take on a French, English or even Super Rugby side and come back after 2019 or 2023 a more rounded coach. If he failed elsewhere we could have welcomed him back at Glasgow or if he really, really mucked up and maybe got involved in some form of bloodgate esque scandal he could go and attempt to coach Edinburgh before eventually taking the reins of the international side as has been his destiny since the rugby visionaries Frank Hadden and Andy Robinson spotted his undeniable talent. There's no doubt that Toonie is a great coach, arguably the up and coming rugby coach in European, if not world, rugby but let's not forget that he's had two jobs in rugby and one of them was hardly glorious; although not even he could polish the turd that was the Scottish backline of 2005-2013.
Thirdly, the last time Scotland have entered a world cup with the same coach for an entire cycle was 2003, so by the next possible time it will have been 20 years. Scotland have suffered enough instability and with Cotter it seems like we are building game on game, tournament by tournament. It could be that the whole Jim Hamilton story prompted this decision but in reality there was little to no controversy in the grand scheme of things. As I've mentioned there'd be no harm in allowing Cotter to continue at least until 2019 and if Townsend wasn't free to take over Dave Rennie would be in the SRU set up by then before, meanwhile Townsend could travel his heart content learning from other players, coaches and other rugby cultures before returning a more experienced rugby coach.
Whilst I think this SRU regime has been a vast improvement on its predecessor I do think that they frequently forget that they're in charge of a sport and not a business.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-union/vern-cotter-relaxed-ahead-of-final-season-with-scotland-1-4272604

A few key points:

We're fecked in the front row. Dickinson is still doubtful, as is Reid

Hardie will start at 7

A number of the players in the squad aren't match fit (something we've noted here)

Waratahs flanker Jack Dempsey is on Scotland's radar. Does anyone know anything about him?

The decision to remove such a high calibre coach is s huge gamble by Dodson

I had not heard of him, but just had a quick google.

A very highly rated 22 year old just breaking through into the Waratahs team. He had 5 starts last season and a few more runs off the bench. He is contracted to them for another season. He seems a big lad at 6 foot 3 and 110 kg. Plays 6 or 8 normally.

Has played Aus u-20s and is thought of as a likely capped player for them in the future. I could not see any obvious Scottish link and he has some Australian rugby heritage as his uncle was capped by them. I guess it must be a grandparent.

He sounds very promising but if he is contracted, then won't necessarily be easy to get him over here. Maybe he sees a few to many players in the queue in front of him over there. Still now this is out, Checka will probably be looking to cap him!

Aussies have a lot of good loosies, mind you.

If the likes of Dave Dennis, Liam Gill and Scott Higginbotham are peed off with waiting and head off to the Prem, Top 14 and Japan respectively, then it is perfectly feasible that someone like Dempsey could see this as a chance to leapfrog a start to his international career. The likes of Pooper are not very old and just about nailed on in their positions. Add on the likes of Ben McCalman, Sean McMahon and Wycliff Palu - all of whom are established internationals - and it does look quite a long way to the front of the queue.

Let's not forget we've got good depth too - he must look at Ryan Wilson and wonder if he would get a spot for Scotland...

Until we see how Dempsey looks in a crayon outfit with a flock of seagulls haircut and kebab sauce dripping from his outstretched fist, I guess we just won't know if that young man is up to scratch.

NeilyBroon wrote:

bsando wrote:

tigertattie wrote:

bsando wrote:Off topic but does anyone know much about this player?

http://www.makos.co.nz/news/meet-finlay-christie

He lives in a place called Puke!

And is apparently a very nice chap according to his auntie

Scottish qualified. You never know..

George Carlin wrote:Until we see how Dempsey looks in a crayon outfit with a flock of seagulls haircut and kebab sauce dripping from his outstretched fist, I guess we just won't know if that young man is up to scratch.

As long as he plays "above the ground" and collects yellow cards much like a philatelist collects stamps, he should do just fine.

I've just looked at the fixtures, Scotland are playing at the same time as England vs SA!? How the hell am I going to find a pub that will be showing Scotland vs Australia? Do any fellow Scottish London based 606v2'ers know of any good Scottish pubs in London that might be showing that game? Not keen on going to a massive walkabout styled bar with a million TV's and little to no soul. Also, is it BT who are broadcasting the Scotland game?

I suspect the Scotland game will be on BBC - the England game is on Sky.

I have been living in London for 10 weeks now and am yet to find a Scottish pub!

My brother's friend owns the 6 Yard Box in Elephant and Castle and they should be showing it - the bar is in an old shipping container and the walls and roof are covered in football stickers! He does show Scottish rugby though as a lot of his regulars are Scottish.

The place next door does a great breakfast chapati too...

Always a good bet to head to the London Scottish ground...

RDW_Scotland wrote:I suspect the Scotland game will be on BBC - the England game is on Sky.

I have been living in London for 10 weeks now and am yet to find a Scottish pub!

My brother's friend owns the 6 Yard Box in Elephant and Castle and they should be showing it - the bar is in an old shipping container and the walls and roof are covered in football stickers! He does show Scottish rugby though as a lot of his regulars are Scottish.

The place next door does a great breakfast chapati too...

Listen to you Mr Cosmopolitan!

I used to commute through Elephant and Castle. I keep hoping they just knock it down and start again.

I don't have many ideas on Scottish pubs. I often found myself watching Scotland games at home and then joining friends who had watched the England game afterwards!

funnyExiledScot wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I suspect the Scotland game will be on BBC - the England game is on Sky.

I have been living in London for 10 weeks now and am yet to find a Scottish pub!

My brother's friend owns the 6 Yard Box in Elephant and Castle and they should be showing it - the bar is in an old shipping container and the walls and roof are covered in football stickers! He does show Scottish rugby though as a lot of his regulars are Scottish.

The place next door does a great breakfast chapati too...

Listen to you Mr Cosmopolitan!

I used to commute through Elephant and Castle. I keep hoping they just knock it down and start again.

I don't have many ideas on Scottish pubs. I often found myself watching Scotland games at home and then joining friends who had watched the England game afterwards!

All jokes aside that is basically what they are doing - they have demolished a lot of buildings and are building massive residential areas. it is almost civilised now!

it is also now known for the huge office building that has wind turbines at the top - turbines which have never actually worked despite a lot of money being spent on them and the politicians making a song and dance about how amazing it is. I'm surprised the SNP didn't come up with that idea...

RDW_Scotland wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I suspect the Scotland game will be on BBC - the England game is on Sky.

I have been living in London for 10 weeks now and am yet to find a Scottish pub!

My brother's friend owns the 6 Yard Box in Elephant and Castle and they should be showing it - the bar is in an old shipping container and the walls and roof are covered in football stickers! He does show Scottish rugby though as a lot of his regulars are Scottish.

The place next door does a great breakfast chapati too...

Listen to you Mr Cosmopolitan!

I used to commute through Elephant and Castle. I keep hoping they just knock it down and start again.

I don't have many ideas on Scottish pubs. I often found myself watching Scotland games at home and then joining friends who had watched the England game afterwards!

All jokes aside that is basically what they are doing - they have demolished a lot of buildings and are building massive residential areas. it is almost civilised now!

it is also now known for the huge office building that has wind turbines at the top - turbines which have never actually worked despite a lot of money being spent on them and the politicians making a song and dance about how amazing it is. I'm surprised the SNP didn't come up with that idea...

Boris actually convinced Bill Clinton to visit Elephant & Castle to view the "ground breaking" building you describe, until it was discovered not to work, and Bill pulled out.

The best thing about E&C is The Dragon Castle Chinese restaurant. Outstanding.

The best thing about the E&C is that if you shut your eyes whilst in your cab, it's over very soon.

It's just a nothing place. It's not as fun as Hoxton, it's not close enough to the Old Vic or the Menier Chocolate Factory to have any 'sarth of the river' 'going out' chops and it's not close enough to the lovely young ladies who frequent Borough Market. It's just the armpit of the South Bank.

It is also where I stayed on my stag do, so I don't remember it very well!