Useless club pros

I'm sure some of you must have some tales? I'll begin.
Our former pro bought a load of footjoy seconds and was selling them full price. When asked why both shoes had a left facing heel, he replied that they were to help with the back swing! Needless to say I had the last laugh...

I once heard a pro saying the goods were on a container ship somewhere in the South China Sea, the item arrived the next day.

A pal of mine went to see the pro asking where the ecco shoes he ordered were, he'd been waiting 6 weeks. The pro rang the supplier and vigorously harangued them down the line. He shuffled some papers while doing so and inadvertently pressed the loud speaker button to reveal he was talking to the dial tone...

I routinely don't support my pro unless I'm forced to with credit I've won in medals.
He's simply too unreliable, always moaning about making no money off the gear (yet is always on holiday and over-working his assistants) and too slow.

I can order something online from a few trusted suppliers and have pretty much anything I want within 24 hours.

They don't really help themselves in my experience.

how long have you got. Legalized slavery for the assistants . smoke and mirrors for the rest.
Some good lads but a load of chancers

Reminded of this guy last weekend.
Lets call him Mike cos that's his name.Used to be a club pro in the Sheffield area and managed to get a sponsor for a lowish level event.Walked off on the 4th hole.We were unfortunate enough to have him as a now amateur club member-by far the worst behaved player I have ever played with.They call him the drunken pro as he carries cans in the bag and calls in the bar halfway round.Spent the entire round moaning and kept moving before other players had completed their shotAfter this happened to me I slapped my driver on the floor and snapped the shaft.At half way he talked about walking off and I suggested no one would mind if he did but he felt that would not be correct .Back nine he was walking in front and even hit several shots into the group of ladies in front.We didn't shake hands and I said after that I would withdraw if drawn to play with him again.He lived in the same village as me and one day I heard him telling the local shopkeeper how he missed playing in the big money events,etc.etc.Irony was he was pretty good payer but no head for the game.Gave the game a bad name

Dyna, That sounds like a carbon copy of a player we had at my club. There is a lot of players who have been very good but had their careers blighted by drink.

Our club cleaner found a dozen empty bottles of vodka stashed in the ceiling area of the bathroom after this guy had been banned from buying drink at the club.

numerous examples of club pros getting into drink/financial /gambling mess.we had local pro just disappeared after some irregularities were noticed in club finances.members fees paid into his own account and even a donation from a will went missing.He was found some weeks later living like a tramp in a doorway in London.Family quite well known in golf and paid of the 30k debts to keep face.the mighty fallen.
I do know some good guys with a great reputation

I guess I've been lucky then. My home club is a bit of an anomaly in that we no longer have a pro shop since the council leased out the golf complex to a private operator. Yes we still have 2 pros who now concentrate on coaching and junior development (and do it incredibly well).
When I had membership at a 2nd club, the head pro there was really good and I would always go to him for club fittings & purchases. That paid off (eventually) when my Ping irons started falling apart. He ended up negotiating a free replacement set when Ping were very reluctant. Had I bought those clubs online or an AG type outlet, I very much doubt I'd have got the same service and result.

Ive been a bit harsh some good examples who look after the members and sort the gear out .
Always good to see a local lad having a good run in the open or pga.
Lets be honest they have given it a go where many of us would have loved it.I have always like to see some of the seniors doing well when they were not that standard at a younger age.HOPE

Most of them become pretty useless in the end. Once it's clear to them that there won't be Open Championships and Ryder Cups in their future, there's a realisation for the rest of their career they'll be selling sweets and giving lessons to people who can't play. Some of them make a few quid playing in local pro events, and a lot of them become part of the social scene at the club. But the realisation that next year will be like this one, and the year after will be like next year soon hits home.

There's no obvious progression path for club pros and clubs are cutting retainers as well, so there's no easy career switch. I know quite a lot who are working outside of golf now, and gradually becoming amateurs again. Some are training up as General Managers for golf clubs, but then they are competing with guys a lot younger who have been to university to do the same thing.

Club pro is not a career with much future unfortunately.

George1507 wrote:There's no obvious progression path for club pros and clubs are cutting retainers as well, so there's no easy career switch. I know quite a lot who are working outside of golf now, and gradually becoming amateurs again.

Agree with that George
One guy who used to be the assistant pro at my club, good player too, gave that up to go and work for one of these golf holiday agencies, and says he's making a lot more money from that

It must be a pretty soul-less job to do. Same old chat every day in the pro shop, same old complaints about the course.

I think if I was a club pro, I'd fall out of love with the game pretty quickly. So many club pro's just don't play for fun anymore. My local one teaches and perhaps plays about 10 times a year.

I think the only way to make money at it is to go to abroad. Must be horrible to be in UK when weather is rotten for six months a year.

Very insightful post George. In particular the lack of career progression, which is something I've never considered.

I think the majority of young pro's are pretty realistic about their ambitions, they are aware that only a tiny minority make it on tour and so teaching and competing in local events is the likely route.

But where do you go with that? I suppose some people develop into David Leadbetter etc and run academies and teach elite pros. But there is probably no clear proven development path for that.

I'd be interested to know how much a club pro makes, obviously they get a retainer, but they've got assistants to pay and other costs like the utility bills and business rates for the shop, clearly they can do quite lot of lessons without informing the taxman, but once you reach a certain level, as George says, there's nowhere else to go.

I played with a kid a couple of weeks ago who told me he wants to be on tour in 5 years. He's finished school and working in the pro shop and behind the bar and then playing lots of golf. His dad drives him up to Woburn for coaching sessions.

However, he's 19 years old and still off 6. There are kids 5 years younger than him already off scratch. I scored better than him and I only play once a fortnight, if I had the opportunity to play golf as often as him, and have regular lessons with a top level coach I would be a damn sight better than that.

His parents are the problem. Sounds like they are being really supportive of him but in reality they are just funding a pipe dream that is not going to materialise. Classic example of someone who will be lucky to become a mars bar salesman.

I don't want to laugh Ray, actually I do, he's got absolutely no chance.
To put things in perspective, my first handicap as an adult was 7. If he's only 6 playing all the time and getting coached and he's still only off 6, what makes him think he can be pro?

Wasn't Poulter a club pro at Woburn? Sounds like his story over.

Yeah he was, he was a 4 handicap when he turned pro, but he didn't play club medals because they made him pay the full green fee in order to play, so he didn't.

I think Paul Lawrie and YE Yang also turned pro of 3-4 but you'll always get a few instances of people bucking the trend.

There is a massive difference between someone off 6 and one off 3. Being 19 and off 6 when you are practicing all the time is not good of you want to be on tour in 5 years.

raycastleunited wrote:

However, he's 19 years old and still off 6.

I think it's a tall order, but if he's only been playing for a year then he's got a chance. If he's been playing for 6 years and he's off 6, then he needs some career advice.

Not a club pro, and hopefully things won't get this bad for Eddie Pepp, but I found this quite interesting:

https://eddiepepperell.wordpress.com/2016/11/06/the-tapestry-of-life/

Sounds like he needs a good woman and an excuse to thing about something other than golf for a few months.

George1507 wrote:

raycastleunited wrote:

However, he's 19 years old and still off 6.

I think it's a tall order, but if he's only been playing for a year then he's got a chance. If he's been playing for 6 years and he's off 6, then he needs some career advice.

No he's been playing longer. The sad thing is he is a member at a local club which is fairly short and easy, which is where he has his handicap, and his parents have stumped up for him to have a second membership at my place, which is longer and tougher, so he's probably an 8 or 9 handicap at my course.

I know junior memberships are cheaper, but it's extravagant to have 2 memberships when you're a teenager with a part time job.

Poor deluded boy.

Ray

Are you sure his handicap isn't a bit lower than you think it is? If not then he is properly deluded and possibly needs some advice quickly.

McLaren wrote:Ray

Are you sure his handicap isn't a bit lower than you think it is?  If not then he is properly deluded and possibly needs some advice quickly.

Well we were playing in a medal and I was marking his card, so yes I know what his handicap is. And also that it is based on an easy course, so it will shoot up if he starts playing more comps at my course. And don't start the CSS / SSS debate, because we all know that doesn't reflect the difficulty of golf course for a handicap golfer!

I'm guessing that his "coach" (yes he used this word) probably fills him with guff about how much promise he has to keep him coming back for more and more lessons.

It's rather tragic that someone would fill his head with that nonsense. I'm all for encouraging youngsters, but being off 6 when you're 19 isn't really anything remotely special. I mean, he wouldn't even get close to his club scratch team off that.

On the contrary it is special.

Anyone with aspirations of turning pro whilst having a handicap at least 10 shots away from where it needs to be despite playing for years and having frequent lessons/coaching etc is special.

However, If his parents are happy to throw time and money at it and he's happy to try, who are we to sit in our cocoons of rightness and just slag him off? Let him try to reach his aspirations. At least he's trying. Better to regret something you have done than something you haven't*.

*except in US elections!

I'm not slagging him off for having ambitions, it's great he's got that confidence, but beig off 6 at 19 is not very good at all, especially if you are already practicing all the time and getting numerous lessons. 6 is not a great handicap if you are hoping to get to tour level.

It's completely unrealistic, (though not impossible) that his guy is going to turn from 6 to the +5 standard you need.

If he was 19 and +2 or something, then yes, I would say great, but if he's being battered in a club medal by one of us on this forum, then it's incredibly unlikely as it doesn't sound as if he's remotely talented enough.

Ray

This is 19 and off a 6 hcp. How long did it take him to get to 6? In other words, how long has he been playing the game?

navyblueshorts wrote:Ray

This is 19 and off a 6 hcp. How long did it take him to get to 6? In other words, how long has he been playing the game?

It's a fair point, if he's been playing 6 months, very good, if he's been at it a few years he's got no chance.
There's hundreds of golfers who have been off +4 or +5 who can't even compete on a rotten tour like the Alps or Europro.

His ambition is admirable, his handicap and age are not.