World Rugby Player of the Year and V2 poll

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 08 Nov 2016, 10:16 am

First topic message reminder :

The list of nominees sees two players from NZ, three from England, plus one from Ireland. What is surprising to me is that NZ do not have 5/6 players on the list of nominees. I think Heaslip is a good player but if an Irish player is on the list then should it be him? I get the feeling a fair few Irish would be saying no to Heaslip. Also, no idea how Owen Farrell keeps on making the list...

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/story/_/id/17996261/vote-win-world-rugby-player-year

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Post by beshocked on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:17 am

mikey dragon I say Billy is underrated because his influence has been understated. England faltered vs Wales when Billy was injured and fell apart vs Australia without Billy at 8. Of course it wasn't down to just one player but he makes a big difference.

He's arguably the first player on the England team sheet IMO.

Billy also dominated Heaslip in the 6 nations yet he has less votes, sure it's just one game but let's be honest - Heaslip is only on the list because of one game.

I think he's also suffered because he hasn't come up against Read in the last two seasons. He's always seen as a lesser player for that reason IMO.

Sgt Pooly Farrell has been important sure but do you think he's been any more important than numerous other England players? It's only really his goalkicking that's been his biggest strength.

Mediocre 12 but top class goal kicker.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:21 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:It's a poor shortlist, let's face it.

Yea, I agree.

I'd have Heaslip as the 6th best 8 in the NH at the very best, total joke. Farrell also is a very lucky boy although he has been vital to England's rise.

Heaslip has won quite a bit as 6th best 8 in the NH. 11 or 12 years on the go and still at it. What have the other 5 8s in front of him won?

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:23 am

Doesn't matter. It should be based only on international performances in the last 12 months.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:28 am

SecretFly wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:It's a poor shortlist, let's face it.

Yea, I agree.

I'd have Heaslip as the 6th best 8 in the NH at the very best, total joke. Farrell also is a very lucky boy although he has been vital to England's rise.



Heaslip has won quite a bit as 6th best 8 in the NH.  11 or 12 years on the go and still at it.  What have the other 5 8s in front of him won?  

I don't see what relevance what a player has won is to his form over the last 12 months. It's not a career achievement award.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:28 am

I rate Heaslip highly. Over past few seasons I've got the impression that a lot of Irish don't rate him any more. I do rate him is one the best 8s in the world but I don't see how he's on this list.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:30 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Doesn't matter. It should be based only on international performances in the last 12 months.

Well, the 11 and 12 months still gotta run, don't they.

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Post by beshocked on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:31 am

Toby has a GS and another 6 nations title.
Billy has a GS, 2 AP titles and a HC, 3 tour away win vs the Aussies. All of them bar one, this season.
Read.... he's only won 2 RWCs and probably likely a few rugby championships.


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Post by No 7&1/2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:32 am

Nope as it was start of November to start of November, based only on internationals.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:32 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:It's a poor shortlist, let's face it.

Yea, I agree.

I'd have Heaslip as the 6th best 8 in the NH at the very best, total joke. Farrell also is a very lucky boy although he has been vital to England's rise.



Heaslip has won quite a bit as 6th best 8 in the NH.  11 or 12 years on the go and still at it.  What have the other 5 8s in front of him won?  

I don't see what relevance what a player has won is to his form over the last 12 months. It's not a career achievement award.

It was in 2009.

Heaslip shouldn't be on the list. But there you go, he isn't going to win. So talk about the contenders instead of chipping at a player that didn't ask to be included and won't win.

But in 2009, a player who only played half a season and by no means his best one, won.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:33 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Nope as it was start of November to start of November, based only on internationals.

That's a pity, as AI Internationals had already taken place before the list was announced. They should have waited for the end of them Wink

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Post by beshocked on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:38 am

Some people must be supporting Heaslip because he's the 4th highest on the list with an impressive 11%.

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Post by emack2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:41 am

I don`t know why I bother I give an honest opinion and you twist it,face
facts people remember the kickers.
It doesn't matter how you score as long as you do rugby is a team
game.
14 players get you into the red zone how you score from there doesn't
matter as long as you do.IF you don`t think Farrell`s goalkicking was
THE key factor in beating the Aussies 3-0.Then to quote yourself you
don`t no anything about Rugby.
In a close match you can`t always rely on scoring tries but if your pack
is up to it you can set up drop goals.
Something that went out of the NZ  game with Andrew Merthens I`m
not even sure if Barrett is the best in NZ let alone the world.
Certainly if it came down to a last minute penalty to win the match
Duncan Mackenzie,Sopaga or even brother Jordie would be my preference.
I was bought up in an era called the age of reality first phase try scoring
was rare or considered impossible.Lineouts/Scrums were only lost by one
in a match.
Nine or ten man Rugby was order of the day and Penalties or drops
ruled the day.Don Clarke wasn't the Full back the great Bob Scott was
but was the greatest goalkicker I`ve ever seen.
That has nothing to do with a teams ability to create or score tries but
the practicality of keeping the score board ticking over.


Last edited by emack2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:22 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:46 am

Told you before emack it's the constant digs of 3 points, kicking, getting pens from scrums etc etc. We get it; you support NZ because they win and score loads and loads of tries. You don't need to keep qualifying your disloyalty to your own country.

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Post by GunsGerms on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:57 am

mikey_dragon wrote:I rate Heaslip highly. Over past few seasons I've got the impression that a lot of Irish don't rate him any more. I do rate him is one the best 8s in the world but I don't see how he's on this list.

I agree with that but he isnt the only one that shouldnt be on the list IMO.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 11:58 am

GunsGerms wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:I rate Heaslip highly. Over past few seasons I've got the impression that a lot of Irish don't rate him any more. I do rate him is one the best 8s in the world but I don't see how he's on this list.

I agree with that but he isnt the only one that shouldnt be on the list IMO.

Yeah, the other one being Farrell and that's it.

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Post by GunsGerms on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:05 pm

Agreed. I rate Heaslip very highly and always have but Murray probably should be Ireland's nominee. he did have quite a bad game v Wales this year though.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:07 pm

Murray is more on/off than much criticised Heaslip. It's amazing what one game does to career Wink

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:17 pm

This year? Wasn't Murray MOTM? I've noticed with him that he usually has awesome games against Wales and NZ - talk about raising your game for the world's best Wink.

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Post by emack2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:24 pm

Typical response your usual rubbish furious

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Post by GunsGerms on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:46 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:This year? Wasn't Murray MOTM? I've noticed with him that he usually has awesome games against Wales and NZ - talk about raising your game for the world's best Wink.

Maybe he was. Maybe it was France he had a bad game against. In one game his passing was slow and bad. Was sure it was Wales. Maybe not.

Anyway in general he has a great year for us.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:50 pm

emack2 wrote:Typical response your usual rubbish furious

Usual rubbish to usual rubbish. Just get on with glory supporting.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:50 pm

GunsGerms wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:This year? Wasn't Murray MOTM? I've noticed with him that he usually has awesome games against Wales and NZ - talk about raising your game for the world's best Wink.

Maybe he was. Maybe it was France he had a bad game against. In one game his passing was slow and bad. Was sure it was Wales. Maybe not.

Anyway in general he has a great year for us.

Him and Stander were best players against us, and both have been two of Munster and Ireland's best players this season IMO.

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Post by kingraf on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 12:53 pm

My immediate thought was "Barrett, obviously", and I voted as such, but dear GOD has Dane Coles been immense. Either way, both are deserving. Coles maybe more so because a hooker has no right to possess his skill set, but I can't get the image of Barrett breaking lines with impunity out of my mind
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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 1:38 pm

It's a shame England aren't up against the ABs this year.

I think BB last 2 games have been pretty average. But like Itoje has been a revelation since coming into his national side.
I don't remember Itoje having a bad game & picks up MOTM awards regularly.
Itoje should walk the breakthrough player award & probably edges it for me.
He is the current European Player of the Year, has anybody held both awards? I wouldn't have thought so.

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Post by GunsGerms on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 2:47 pm

kingraf wrote:My immediate thought was "Barrett, obviously", and I voted as such, but dear GOD has Dane Coles been immense. Either way, both are deserving. Coles maybe more so because a hooker has no right to possess his skill set, but I can't get the image of Barrett breaking lines with impunity out of my mind

In fairness defence in the rugby championship is optional. He hasnt looked as good under pressure.

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Post by TJ on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 3:58 pm

Billy V is an interesting one for me. He is completely predictable but that doesn't stop him being effective.

Of those listed Dane Coles for me.

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Post by Pot Hale on Wed 09 Nov 2016, 8:05 pm

World Rugby Men’s Player of the Year
Two panel members are assigned to vote on every international match in 2016. Panellists award three points for the person who played the best during the year in their eyes and then two points and one point. Points are collated and a shortlisted is determined in November. The panel then convene to determine a winner based on points and form.
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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:15 pm

Winner; Beauden Barrett.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:20 pm

NZ on a roll with this award. Hopefully goes to an English player next!

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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:24 pm


Officially Barrett wins and on here Coles wins;

auden Barrett [New Zealand]27% 27% [ 14 ]
Dane Coles [New Zealand]29% 29% [ 15 ]
Owen Farrell [England]4% 4% [ 2 ]
Maro Itoje [England]27% 27% [ 14 ]
Jamie Heaslip [Ireland]10% 10% [ 5 ]
Billy Vunipola [England]3% 3% [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 52

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Post by GunsGerms on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:27 pm

Jamie Heaslip was awarded try of he year for his try v Italy.

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Post by doctor_grey on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:27 pm

aucklandlaurie wrote:Winner; Beauden Barrett.
There is a new rule I just inserted in the list of award requirements:  No one who has, or has ever worn, a mullet can win this award.  Feck all, we are a tolerant bunch, but that is a bridge too far.

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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:30 pm


Spoke too soon Barrett has now caught up to Coles:

Beauden Barrett [New Zealand]28% 28% [ 15 ]
Dane Coles [New Zealand]28% 28% [ 15 ]
Owen Farrell [England]4% 4% [ 2 ]
Maro Itoje [England]26% 26% [ 14 ]
Jamie Heaslip [Ireland]9% 9% [ 5 ]
Billy Vunipola [England]5% 5% [ 3 ]

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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:35 pm


Spoke too soon, Barrett has now passed coles. Who keeps voting on these polls after thw winner has been announced?

Beauden Barrett [New Zealand]29% 29% [ 16 ]
Dane Coles [New Zealand]27% 27% [ 15 ]
Owen Farrell [England]5% 5% [ 3 ]
Maro Itoje [England]25% 25% [ 14 ]
Jamie Heaslip [Ireland]9% 9% [ 5 ]
Billy Vunipola [England]5% 5% [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 56

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Post by SecretFly on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 1:56 pm

Oh quit please. If there is anything worse than too many percentage and number lists, it's too many percentage and numbers lists when they've become obsolete.

I gave Jamie Heaslip 212.3% of my votes - but he still didn't win (a f**king fix!).

Move on. Kill this thread. Wait till next year before 'Sexiest Player' forecasting again.

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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 2:01 pm


Right thats it Fly, Im not going to help you any more, Your just going to have to scroll up to the top of the page by yourself, I will though mention that Coles has just received another vote and draws level with Barrett.

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Post by SecretFly on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 2:04 pm

You see! F**king fixed! I'd say that Bannon basterde was involved in the voting methodology!

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Post by aucklandlaurie on Mon 14 Nov 2016, 2:23 pm

SecretFly wrote:You see!  F**king fixed!  I'd say that Bannon basterde was involved in the voting methodology!

Dont believe everything that Hilary says in her emails.

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Post by Rugby Fan on Tue 15 Nov 2016, 2:23 pm

http://www.planetrugby.com/news/fiji-upset-at-world-rugby-awards-snub/

Fiji not happy. I think they've every right to feel snubbed.

There's a good case Ben Ryan should be coach of the year or Fiji Sevens as team of the year. Even if you have reservations on those two fronts, a Fijian should have been named Sevens player of the year.

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