Ireland to bid for 2023 World Cup

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Post by No9 on Tue 15 Nov 2016, 1:22 pm

First topic message reminder :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/37988826

I'm actually behind this, think Ireland would be a brilliant place to host a Rugby World Cup..

But is this going to be a bit of an embarrassment to the IRFU, when they'll have to consider playing the final at Croke Park with its 82,300 capacity against the relatively small 51,700 of the Aviva.

I know there's potential to extend the Aviva, but I believe it was held at 52k due to planning constraints in the mainly residential area, with concern about blocking out the light.

So, as I said. Ireland for a RWC is a fantastic prospect, with a final in Dublin, but anyone know if they can/will extend the Aviva on the back of this proposal, or is it likely to move to Croke if the GAA will play ball.

Thoughts.

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Post by Pot Hale on Tue 13 Dec 2016, 9:31 pm

SecretFly wrote:I've lost count Wayne.  It's all a blur.  I think I'm living in a dream...or nightmare.  EuroRugbyGate, BrexitGate, TrumpGate and now 20%Gate.  

It must be a parallel universe I'm in.

No wisecracks! mad

Something tells me that if Ireland were to win the bid, it would quickly become
youcallthatacost!Gate
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Post by Golden on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:25 am

So if we make a loss will WRU give us a dig out? Whistle

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Post by GunsGermsV2 on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:38 am

SecretFly wrote:
Griff wrote:

I've always seen the Irish as being pretty savvy business wise, while the Welsh are... well... pretty shoddy IMO. I cannot for one moment imagine that the Irish bigwigs would not negotiate a good deal for themselves. Or stand for a sh*t deal that would only benefit the Welsh. It doesn't stack up.

Well the numbers do stack up Griff.  1999 is stone being used for writing on...with a chisel.  2016 is mega bucks i-pads.  20% of something in 1999 is a grain of sand to 20% of 2016's something.

The IRFU were officially idiots. Take the kudos when you worked for it.

I dont have that much of an issue with it. We definitely got our moneys worth having games in Dublin in 1991 and 1999. Ireland's bid will be a great success if we do not make a loss. If we make a profit then great but the value of hosting such a tournament is far greater than whatever meagre profit the IFRU makes. There are many intangible profits to be made and this wouldn't put the IRFU off at all even if it is true.

20% isnt that big a cut anyway and its nice to be able to help the Welsh out. 1 more guaranteed vote for Ireland. If the clause is there then it should be honoured.

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Post by marty2086 on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:43 am

GunsGermsV2 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
Griff wrote:

I've always seen the Irish as being pretty savvy business wise, while the Welsh are... well... pretty shoddy IMO. I cannot for one moment imagine that the Irish bigwigs would not negotiate a good deal for themselves. Or stand for a sh*t deal that would only benefit the Welsh. It doesn't stack up.

Well the numbers do stack up Griff.  1999 is stone being used for writing on...with a chisel.  2016 is mega bucks i-pads.  20% of something in 1999 is a grain of sand to 20% of 2016's something.

The IRFU were officially idiots. Take the kudos when you worked for it.

I dont have that much of an issue with it. We definitely got our moneys worth having games in Dublin in 1991 and 1999. Ireland's bid will be a great success if we do not make a loss. If we make a profit then great but the value of hosting such a tournament is far greater than whatever meagre profit the IFRU makes. There are many intangible profits to be made and this wouldn't put the IRFU off at all even if it is true.

20% isnt that big a cut anyway and its nice to be able to help the Welsh out. 1 more guaranteed vote for Ireland. If the clause is there then it should be honoured.

We don't know the exact language of it all, is it gross profits or net profits we are talking? If its gross then it could well be the difference between the IRFU making money of the tournament, if it's net it could still be millions of a difference

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Post by GunsGermsV2 on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:51 am

I'm sure it is net profits. It wouldn't make any sense to give them a cut of gross profits.

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Post by marty2086 on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:53 am

GunsGermsV2 wrote:I'm sure it is net profits. It wouldn't make any sense to give them a cut of gross profits.

You say that but the IRFU haven't always been renowned for forward thinking especially back when the agreement was made

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:57 pm

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

I dont have that much of an issue with it. We definitely got our moneys worth having games in Dublin in 1991 and 1999. Ireland's bid will be a great success if we do not make a loss. If we make a profit then great but the value of hosting such a tournament is far greater than whatever meagre profit the IFRU makes. There are many intangible profits to be made and this wouldn't put the IRFU off at all even if it is true.

20% isnt that big a cut anyway and its nice to be able to help the Welsh out. 1 more guaranteed vote for Ireland. If the clause is there then it should be honoured.

I'm not saying don't honour it.  Let them have their slice.  I'm saying it was a dumb agreement based on the points I outlined above.  It was Wales that benefitted from the backing it got from the rest of us for their Hosting and it's they who benefitted by the rest of us giving Stadiums to the event.  They benefitted in ways that you yourself outlined above (highlighted).  Now they are being compensated (if we even succeed in our bid, that is) for being allowed hold an event they wouldn't have been able to hold had they made a totally independent application.
So it was a dumb agreement.

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Post by Cyril on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 1:42 pm

I can't see this being an issue though, so I hope the WRU haven't already spent their cut!

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Post by profitius on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 1:46 pm

SecretFly wrote:
GunsGermsV2 wrote:

I dont have that much of an issue with it. We definitely got our moneys worth having games in Dublin in 1991 and 1999. Ireland's bid will be a great success if we do not make a loss. If we make a profit then great but the value of hosting such a tournament is far greater than whatever meagre profit the IFRU makes. There are many intangible profits to be made and this wouldn't put the IRFU off at all even if it is true.

20% isnt that big a cut anyway and its nice to be able to help the Welsh out. 1 more guaranteed vote for Ireland. If the clause is there then it should be honoured.

I'm not saying don't honour it.  Let them have their slice.  I'm saying it was a dumb agreement based on the points I outlined above.  It was Wales that benefitted from the backing it got from the rest of us for their Hosting and it's they who benefitted by the rest of us giving Stadiums to the event.  They benefitted in ways that you yourself outlined above (highlighted).  Now they are being compensated (if we even succeed in our bid, that is) for being allowed hold an event they wouldn't have been able to hold had they made a totally independent application.
So it was a dumb agreement.


Being compensated for being helped out! You couldn't make it up. lol


But hats off to whoever negotiated that deal for the WRU. clap I'm sure we'll get by with the 80% profits, which will be net profits. OK
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Post by Guest on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 2:34 pm

Could it be that the IRFU did most of the negotiating here? I'm not convinced that the WRU went cap in hand and begged the IRFU to let us use their stadia (just 1). It would have been easier for the tournament and for the fans if we'd just used the many stadia in England, much closer to tournament central. The RFU/FA probably would have preferred that too if it meant they got an even bigger cut. So maybe the IRFU approached the WRU and said "if you give us some games we'll vote for you AND we'll reciprocate in future if we put in a bid".

I just can't believe for one minute think the WRU successfully negotiated something! It's the WRU FFS! Wink

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Post by Pot Hale on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 3:44 pm

Well the WRU must have cleaned up with 20% or its equivalent of RWC 2015.

Still, 20% of the IRFU's World Cup is not a lot anyway. Can't see them selling many tickets for Dublin and Belfast. UCD is pretty small capacity.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 8:21 pm

Griff wrote:Could it be that the IRFU did most of the negotiating here?  I'm not convinced that the WRU went cap in hand and begged the IRFU to let us use their stadia (just 1).  It would have been easier for the tournament and for the fans if we'd just used the many stadia in England, much closer to tournament central.  The RFU/FA probably would have preferred that too if it meant they got an even bigger cut.  So maybe the IRFU approached the WRU and said "if you give us some games we'll vote for you AND we'll reciprocate in future if we put in a bid".  

I just can't believe for one minute think the WRU successfully negotiated something!  It's the WRU FFS! Wink

Correct. I think Scotland was used more than us. I might be wrong there but if they were used more often for WC games in 1999..................... what will the percentage be from them if they ever win a WC bid in the future? 40%?

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