Most overrated current international player.

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Post by Maine man on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 9:50 pm

First topic message reminder :

Just a bit of fun. Who do people think is the most overrated player currently. For me it's Will Skelton. Just don't see what he adds to the aussie team.

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Post by R!skysports on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:11 pm

I would add Halfpenny to the overrated list - even before his injury....

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Post by LordDowlais on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:22 pm

tigertattie wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Grow up ld.

Just so his lordship can see laughing

Cheers for that, I am not going to rise though. angel


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Post by Breadvan on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:25 pm

The Sexton wraparound.

This. As annoying as his own face.. Shocked
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Post by GunsGermsV2 on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:26 pm

The Sexton Wraparound is very annoying alright.

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Post by Guest on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:29 pm

Anders Teigland for Norway. Never rated him. Don't see what all the hype is about personally.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 11 Jan 2017, 4:37 pm

Sexton Wraparound.... annoying but still causes hassles for the opposition if played at the right tempo and Sexton is in top form.

I suppose it's like Wilko's drop goals. "Oh would you stop with the f**king drop goals!"

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Post by beshocked on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 10:45 am

Agree with rugbyfan100 about Hogg and Manu.

Don't get me wrong - I think both are quality players on their day.

Hogg's flaws I feel are ignored much more than someone like Brown for example because of Hogg's superior athleticism.

Manu is constantly picked for the England squad despite doing little of note at international level in 3 years because of injuries. England haven't missed him, it's a shame all the injuries because that performance vs NZ in 2012 was special.

Hartley is obviously overrated. If it wasn't for his captaincy being superior to Robshaw, he would likely been dropped. Captaincy - 8/10, playing form - 6/10 IMO.

He is praised for nailing his lineouts which ignores the work done by Borthwick to make the lineout run smoothly and the work done by others in the England side.

Farrell is pretty overrated too - didn't deserve to be on end of year short list. Only there because of his goalkicking IMO.

As a centre he's been adequate, I still feel he's a placeholder till someone superior usurps him. He's picked because Ford hasn't proven himself to be an international class goal kicker plus no one else putting their hand up at 12.

Jamie Heaslip - didn't deserve to be on the end of year short list either. Forgettable 6 nations performance is ignored because of win over NZ.

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Post by Cyril on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 10:49 am

Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 10:51 am

Cyril wrote:
Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

Totes
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Post by Cyril on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 10:57 am

munkian wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

Totes
I hope you're not appropriating patois there, munk. You know how that can get you in trouble... Laugh

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Post by Guest on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 11:04 am

Cyril wrote:
munkian wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

Totes
I hope you're not appropriating patois there, munk. You know how that can get you in trouble... Laugh

I think he means totes amaze balls, which would be racist against posh people.  Or at least people off Miranda  Smile

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Post by Cyril on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 11:07 am

Griff wrote:
Cyril wrote:
munkian wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

Totes
I hope you're not appropriating patois there, munk. You know how that can get you in trouble... Laugh

I think he means totes amaze balls, which would be racist against posh people.  Or at least people off Miranda  Smile
Or people from Essex/parts of Dublin... The Only Way is Lansdowne... Smile

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Post by R!skysports on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 1:36 pm

beshocked wrote:Agree with rugbyfan100 about Hogg and Manu.



Hogg's flaws I feel are ignored much more than someone like Brown for example because of Hogg's superior athleticism.


See I get this the other way wrong. I think there is MUCH more focus on Hogg's errors with everyone waiting for a mistake to pounce. Much more than others.

At the same time his attacking is sometimes over blown

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Post by GunsGermsV2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 1:37 pm

Riskysports wrote:
beshocked wrote:Agree with rugbyfan100 about Hogg and Manu.



Hogg's flaws I feel are ignored much more than someone like Brown for example because of Hogg's superior athleticism.


See I get this the other way wrong. I think there is MUCH more focus on Hogg's errors with everyone waiting for a mistake to pounce. Much more than others.

At the same time his attacking is sometimes over blown

Yeah I agree re Hogg. For me he is easily the best full back in the NH by a good bit too.

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Post by Exiledinborders on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:05 pm

beshocked wrote:Farrell is pretty overrated too - didn't deserve to be on end of year short list. Only there because of his goalkicking IMO.

As a centre he's been adequate, I still feel he's a placeholder till someone superior usurps him. He's picked because Ford hasn't proven himself to be an international class goal kicker plus no one else putting their hand up at 12.
All players are placeholders until someone superior usurps them.

I cannot think of any player in Lions countries who consistently plays better than Farrell at twelve and certainly no one who does that and is a reliable pressure kicker.

I suspect along with Billy V, Farrell's is the first name on the team sheet. The only question is whether he plays ten or twelve.

Whether he plays for Lions is a different matter. Most teams now seem to want player like Farrell at twelve who gives options to kick or pass. I am not sure Gatland does given that he keeps picking Roberts who can do neither.

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:32 pm

Cyril wrote:
munkian wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Breadvan wrote:The Sexton wraparound.
Is this a silk scarf worn by the posh boys from D4?

Totes
I hope you're not appropriating patois there, munk. You know how that can get you in trouble... Laugh

Every day is another struggle to own my racism.
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Post by marty2086 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:34 pm

GunsGermsV2 wrote:
Riskysports wrote:
beshocked wrote:Agree with rugbyfan100 about Hogg and Manu.



Hogg's flaws I feel are ignored much more than someone like Brown for example because of Hogg's superior athleticism.


See I get this the other way wrong. I think there is MUCH more focus on Hogg's errors with everyone waiting for a mistake to pounce. Much more than others.

At the same time his attacking is sometimes over blown

Yeah I agree re Hogg. For me he is easily the best full back in the NH by a good bit too.

That's only because Jared Payne has to play at 13

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Post by GunsGermsV2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:36 pm

Exiledinborders wrote:
beshocked wrote:Farrell is pretty overrated too - didn't deserve to be on end of year short list. Only there because of his goalkicking IMO.

As a centre he's been adequate, I still feel he's a placeholder till someone superior usurps him. He's picked because Ford hasn't proven himself to be an international class goal kicker plus no one else putting their hand up at 12.
All players are placeholders until someone superior usurps them.

I cannot think of any player in Lions countries who consistently plays better than Farrell at twelve and certainly no one who does that and is a reliable pressure kicker.

I suspect along with Billy V, Farrell's is the first name on the team sheet. The only question is whether he plays ten or twelve.

Whether he plays for Lions is a different matter. Most teams now seem to want player like Farrell at twelve who gives options to kick or pass. I am not sure Gatland does given that he keeps picking Roberts who can do neither.

Farrell will definitely be in the squad because he is a good kicker and can cover more than one position but because Sexton is a better 10 and given there are good quality 12s such as Roberts and Henshaw around I would say he is a guaranteed starter at all. There have been rumours however, that Gatland will start him.

Roberts is only 30 and featured prominently on two tours. Gatland may still favour him.

Vunapola would be definitely be a guaranteed starter is he wasn't injured.


Last edited by GunsGermsV2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:40 pm

You could have just held your hands up munkian and moved on.

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:46 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:You could have just held your hands up munkian and moved on.

I held a few fingers up if that helps ?
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:48 pm

Don't understand if you want to make that sort of joke why you run away from it bur there you go. Let's move on and leave it distasteful lying in the past.

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:50 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Don't understand if you want to make that sort of joke why you run away from it bur there you go. Let's move on and leave it distasteful lying in the past.

'irie
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Post by LordDowlais on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:50 pm

munkian wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:You could have just held your hands up munkian and moved on.

I held a few fingers up if that helps ?

Or No 7&1/2 could just let it go. Rolling Eyes

FFS people, stop quoting him, you are giving the troll extra air time.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 2:58 pm

He brought it up ld. Not a troll you just don't like my posts as I point out your mistakes too much.

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Post by Scottrf on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:02 pm

too often*

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:04 pm

Thanks.

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:10 pm

Scottrf wrote:too often*

clap
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:14 pm

Strictly speaking you can use both.

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Post by Scottrf on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:18 pm

Only one conveys a sensible meaning though.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:24 pm

Not really no. Pretty much interchangeable here for instance and you obviously understood in addition . But much appreciated.

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Post by beshocked on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:37 pm

Exiledinborders wrote:
beshocked wrote:Farrell is pretty overrated too - didn't deserve to be on end of year short list. Only there because of his goalkicking IMO.

As a centre he's been adequate, I still feel he's a placeholder till someone superior usurps him. He's picked because Ford hasn't proven himself to be an international class goal kicker plus no one else putting their hand up at 12.
All players are placeholders until someone superior usurps them.

I cannot think of any player in Lions countries who consistently plays better than Farrell at twelve and certainly no one who does that and is a reliable pressure kicker.

I suspect along with Billy V, Farrell's is the first name on the team sheet. The only question is whether he plays ten or twelve.

Whether he plays for Lions is a different matter. Most teams now seem to want player like Farrell at twelve who gives options to kick or pass. I am not sure Gatland does given that he keeps picking Roberts who can do neither.

1st name on the team sheet for who? Lions? No. Saracens? No. England? No.

Farrell is 3rd choice 12 at Saracens, luckily he doesn't need to be picked there anymore.

Farrell is a good player primarily because of his goalkicking. He's won many games for club and country because of the boot. Of course it's important but doesn't IMO make him number one on the team sheet.

At Saracens I would say George,Barritt,Itoje,Kruis,both Vunipola bros,Burger,Goode are more vital players.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:38 pm

Most of which are under rated.

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Post by munkian on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:48 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Most of which are under rated.

Erm Which one, exactly ?
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:54 pm

George to an extent especially outside of England. In conversations on here he's been down played due to starting from England's bench. Barritt limited as he may be going forward was extremely useful for England at 12 and even 13 and never let us down. Good generally considered as not good enough internationally by many England.fans though I think he does.have the skill set to.excel but never got a run of games with a settled back line to get a fair crack of the whip. His time is probably passed to make an impact internationally as Watson or even Day looks more in Jones immediate plans. He does get more acknowledgement at club level.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:55 pm

I was thinking old Burger rather than Schalk initially.

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Post by beshocked on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 3:59 pm

Wouldn't call Itoje underrated anymore. Austin Healey rates him more than I do these days.

Don't think Billy has ever been underrated bar by fa0019 though should have won 6 nations player of the tournament.

Mako - I think he's fairly rated, still has issues with scrummaging but excels outside that.

Kruis is perhaps underrated when compared to someone like J.Gray and Itoje but in general he's fairly rated.

Lock is very competitive for England.

Both Burgers have done well. Schalk has slotted in nicely.

Actually all the new signings have.

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Post by R!skysports on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 4:37 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:George to an extent especially outside of England. In conversations on here he's been down played due to starting from England's bench. Barritt limited as he may be going forward was extremely useful for England at 12 and even 13 and never let us down. Good generally considered as not good enough internationally by many England.fans though I think he does.have the skill set to.excel but never got a run of games with a settled back line to get a fair crack of the whip.  His time is probably passed to make an impact internationally as Watson or even Day looks more in Jones immediate plans. He does get more acknowledgement at club level.

I think this is more that he has yet to prove himself Internationally as a starter against fresh opposition. He looks great coming off the bench, but to truly know his ability, there needs to be more time to show it.

He certainly has potential, but it sometimes becomes a little be too early to shout from the roof time - although he could be that good - we shall see :-)

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Post by R!skysports on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 4:39 pm

beshocked wrote:Wouldn't call Itoje underrated anymore. Austin Healey rates him more than I do these days.

Don't think Billy has ever been underrated bar by fa0019 though should have won 6 nations player of the tournament.

Mako - I think he's fairly rated, still has issues with scrummaging but excels outside that.

Kruis is perhaps underrated when compared to someone like J.Gray and Itoje but in general he's fairly rated.

Lock is very competitive for England.

Both Burgers have done well. Schalk has slotted in nicely.

Actually all the new signings have.

That is what we call that the Lobon effect in our household - the commentators always have a Lobon for someone and he is it just now. Getting close to being overrated by them (Not saying he is not very good - just NOONE is as good as the Lobon brigade think :-) )

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Post by beshocked on Thu 12 Jan 2017, 5:03 pm

Riskysports true. Itoje is an excellent but even he has aspects of his game to work on, notably discipline. Still gives away too many penalties. Now perhaps that's because he plays the game on the edge - more turnovers but pinged more. I want to see him keeping the penalty count down but keep doing what he does.

As for George, it's not his fault, he's being overlooked, Hartley is the captain and Jones feels loyalty towards him.

I like to hype up players more when I feel they are being overlooked but once they start picking up plaudits I like too move on to the next player.

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