Pro12 refereeing standards-so far

Well, we are a few months into the season, does anybody think that the standard in refereeing has improved on last year ?

I still think that the Pro12 has the weakest collective of referees in world rugby, I just do not think any of them are as consistent as they should be, although, I do like to see the new refs getting involved, Craig Evans, Mike Adamson and Frank Murphy all given their chances this year, yet there are still some seriously poor refs. Dudley Phillips,David Wilkinson, Marius Mitrea, these refs are showing no signs of improvement.

Also, the Pro12 website has only 15 referees on their official page:-

FRANK MURPHY
SEÁN GALLAGHER
CRAIG EVANS
MIKE ADAMSON
DAVID WILKINSON
BEN WHITEHOUSE
DUDLEY PHILLIPS
NIGEL OWENS
MARIUS MITREA
LLOYD LINTON
JOHN LACEY
GEORGE CLANCY
IAN DAVIES
GARY CONWAY
ANDREW BRACE

Now I know there are more than this, Dan Jones reffed Munster V Zebre a few weeks back, also what has happened to Peter Fitzgibbon and Nigel Pearson, are they no longer Pro12 refs ?

Anyway, back on track, I have watched a few Pro12 games this season, and I have been left scratching my head with some of the decisions, last Friday nights game was a car crash in refereeing, and it is not Dudley Phillips first controversial night out. Do you think enough is being done, to at least get consistency between the refs in the Pro12 ? Or do you think everything is OK ?

here are some of the latest headlines the officials are creating:-

http://www.punditarena.com/rugby/adrumm/watch-pro12-refereeing-decision-branded-one-worst-time/

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/pro12-bosses-must-investigate-referee-12268136

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/cardiff-blues-fans-rage-over-11967703

LordDowlais wrote:Dudley Phillips,David Wilkinson, Marius Mitrea, these refs are showing no signs of improvement.

Thats your opinion but for me Mitreas gotten better but still capable of poor games

LordDowlais wrote:Now I know there are more than this, Dan Jones reffed Munster V Zebre a few weeks back, also what has happened to Peter Fitzgibbon and Nigel Pearson, are they no longer Pro12 refs ?

Peter Fitzgibbon was TMO at Twickenham at the weekend was he not?

Nigel Pearson was sacked by Derby a few months ago

LordDowlais wrote:Anyway, back on track, I have watched a few Pro12 games this season, and I have been left scratching my head with some of the decisions, last Friday nights game was a car crash in refereeing, and it is not Dudley Phillips first controversial night out. Do you think enough is being done, to at least get consistency between the refs in the Pro12 ? Or do you think everything is OK ?

here are some of the latest headlines the officials are creating:-

Thats 3 pieces, two from the same source by the way, about one decision one which was reaffirmed by the TMO and one that was correct

marty2086 wrote:Nigel Pearson was sacked by Derby a few months ago

Neil Paterson sorry, damn auto correct.

marty2086 wrote:Peter Fitzgibbon was TMO at Twickenham at the weekend was he not?

Yyyyessss.

But what has that got to do with the Pro12 ? He is not on the official Pro12 website as a Pro12 ref.

LordDowlais wrote:

marty2086 wrote:Peter Fitzgibbon was TMO at Twickenham at the weekend was he not?

Yyyyessss.

But what has that got to do with the Pro12 ? He is not on the official Pro12 website as a Pro12 ref.

Because hes a TMO now not a ref just like Pearson Paterson

Punditarena? Really? The site for those who like to escape the realities of actual sports report?

Anyway, these are the refs we are stuck with. They are full of imperfections and I can assure you I cringe sometimes when I see who's officiating an Ulster match. However, it's a level playing field, both sides have to play to the whistle of whoever is refereeing.
Good refs are extremely rare so where does the Pro12 get better refs from?

LordDowlais wrote:Well, we are a few months into the season, does anybody think that the standard in refereeing has improved on last year ?

I still think that the Pro12 has the weakest collective of referees in world rugby, I just do not think any of them are as consistent as they should be, although, I do like to see the new refs getting involved, Craig Evans, Mike Adamson and Frank Murphy all given their chances this year, yet there are still some seriously poor refs. Dudley Phillips,David Wilkinson, Marius Mitrea, these refs are showing no signs of improvement.

Also, the Pro12 website has only 15 referees on their official page:-

FRANK MURPHY
SEÁN GALLAGHER
CRAIG EVANS
MIKE ADAMSON
DAVID WILKINSON
BEN WHITEHOUSE
DUDLEY PHILLIPS
NIGEL OWENS
MARIUS MITREA
LLOYD LINTON
JOHN LACEY
GEORGE CLANCY
IAN DAVIES
GARY CONWAY
ANDREW BRACE

Now I know there are more than this, Dan Jones reffed Munster V Zebre a few weeks back, also what has happened to Peter Fitzgibbon and Nigel Pearson, are they no longer Pro12 refs ?

Anyway, back on track, I have watched a few Pro12 games this season, and I have been left scratching my head with some of the decisions, last Friday nights game was a car crash in refereeing, and it is not Dudley Phillips first controversial night out. Do you think enough is being done, to at least get consistency between the refs in the Pro12 ? Or do you think everything is OK ?

here are some of the latest headlines the officials are creating:-

http://www.punditarena.com/rugby/adrumm/watch-pro12-refereeing-decision-branded-one-worst-time/

Don't agree with you on Matrea and Wilk

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/pro12-bosses-must-investigate-referee-12268136  

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/cardiff-blues-fans-rage-over-11967703

Welcome back from your sabbatical. And you're straight into battle

Don't agree with you on Mitrea and Wilkinson. Fair enough on Dudley, but the argument that Dudley shouldn't have awarded Edinburgh the Try isn't as black and white as some suggest. In fact, I think the Try was fine.

As for being the league with the worst refs; well I don't agree at all. I've read enough forums, and enough complaints from supporters of other leagues, to doubt your assertion.

The Cardiff v Ulster game had some strange decisions. The TJ made some very questionable calls.

"The Cardiff v Ulster game had some strange decisions. The TJ made some very questionable calls."

Didn't he just and it's just as well he didn't get his way or our bonus point win would have been a loss.

Does anybody have list of all the match day officials ? Because that list off the official Pro12 site seems wrong. What is the story with Fitzgibbon and Paterson ?

Have they had a promotion/demotion ?

Munchkin wrote:Welcome back from your sabbatical. And you're straight into battle Smile

I'm not looking for a battle, just an opinion. Do you think there has been a raise in refereeing standards on last year ?

Mitrea was very good when he broke onto the scene then he went through a rough patch. I haven't really noticed him recently.

Frank Murphy wouldn't happen to be the former Connacht scrum half would it? Good to see high level players going into refereeing if it is. Is he any good?

What I don't understand is why people think the Aviva or Top 14 have such good referees? This isn't solely a Pro12 problem. Having said that there is always room for improvement.

The Ulster players weren't happy with him at all. I have seen a few really odd calls from TMO's, but rarely from a TJ.

Just as well we won the game.

Munchkin wrote:The Ulster players weren't happy with him at all. I have seen a few really odd calls from TMO's, but rarely from a TJ.

Just as well we won the game.

Wasn't he Welsh as well

It wasn't so much him making decisions rather him not making them and staying quiet. Maybe not brave enough or got enough experience or confidence to feel like he can make big calls

Golden wrote:Frank Murphy wouldn't happen to be the former Connacht scrum half would it? Good to see high level players going into refereeing if it is. Is he any good?

Yes that's him:-

Frank Murphy (IRFU) – Newport-Gwent Dragons v Edinburgh Rugby
Will become the second former PRO12 player to referee a game having appeared in his 94th and final PRO12 game in May 2014, which capped a career spanning a decade with Munster and Connacht. He also had a spell with Leicester Tigers in the Premiership.
Refereed Germany v Portugal test match in the second tier Six Nations last February, and took charge of Wales v Italy in U20 Six Nations the following month.
Officiated at 7 games in the British & Irish Cup over the last two seasons.

Represented Ireland at U21 level and at A level in the Churchill Cup
Appeared for Ireland senior team in an uncapped game v Barbarians at Gloucester in 2008
Spent two seasons with Leicester Tigers, appearing in three finals with them in April/May 2007, scoring a try in their Premiership Final victory over Gloucester, playing in Heineken Cup final defeat to Wasps a week later, also in Tigers team that won Anglo-Welsh Cup against Ospreys at Twickenham

Read more at http://www.pro12rugby.com/2016/11/23/former-pro12-players-make-referee-debuts/#4yCY4qBQGAbH0eVx.99

I watched that game, and he was OK, he was the right referee, as in, you did not notice much of him, you noticed the game more.

marty2086 wrote:It wasn't so much him making decisions rather him not making them and staying quiet. Maybe not brave enough or got enough experience or confidence to feel like he can make big calls

That is an issue you can throw at most of the officials in the Pro12.

Golden wrote:Frank Murphy wouldn't happen to be the former Connacht scrum half would it? Good to see high level players going into refereeing if it is. Is he any good?

One in the same, he went straight to reffing when he retired and accelerated through the program apparently

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/33853.php#.WEgjwPmLTIV

Golden wrote:What I don't understand is why people think the Aviva or Top 14 have such good referees? This isn't solely a Pro12 problem. Having said that there is always room for improvement.

Raynal is a frustrating ref for me, not always his decisions but his positioning despite having his leg broken in a game he still stands in bad positions at times and can get in a 9s way but he still gets big games

LordDowlais wrote:Does anybody have list of all the match day officials ? Because that list off the official Pro12 site seems wrong. What is the story with Fitzgibbon and Paterson ?

Have they had a promotion/demotion ?

Munchkin wrote:Welcome back from your sabbatical. And you're straight into battle Smile

I'm not looking for a battle, just an opinion. Do you think there has been a raise in refereeing standards on last year ?

I can't honestly say I've noticed one way or the other, LD. The only real gripe's I've heard has been that of Dudley awarding a Try to Edinburgh at the weekend, and I do think he got it right, even if it was by a fine margin. The other one would be the TJ at the Cardiff v Ulster game, and he obviously did get his calls wrong.

I think the pro12 ref's can be poor for their position during games. I don't like it when a ref stands in the defensive line as it is an opportunity to exploit by the offence and he will have his back to half the defensive line at the ruck (which takes the opportunity to step up offside.

I think their use of TMO is shockingly poor. The refs and tmo's need to watch 5-6 rugby league games to see how to properly replay incidents and interact. They have refined it quite well. In Union half the time it sounds like the ref gives a question (which sounds like a statement!) to the TMO who doesn't want to contradict his ref so agrees back with the ref..... even though the ref wasn't making a statement! In fact, when it goes to the tmo, it should be the tmo that adjudicates on the images, a ref shouldn't be squinting at a small screen at the other end of the ground trying to make stuff out.



The ref should give the tmo a question/task (and there should be detail there... did the centre knock on one phases ago, was he in touch, check for offside, foulplay, grounding) and his initial assessment on the field. So for example, the ref says "tmo the try seems okay for me, please check I didn't miss a forward pass back on the 22".

At that point the ref has handed over responsibility to the TMO who should review the tape in a logical and methodical fashion. Part of what I like from league is that the TMO will comment and conclude on each clip he is shown and ask for other angles (side-on, behind the goal, opposite angle). And the TMO should state for the TV what he is looking at in the clip and if it is alright. Once he has gone through the footage, he should give his comprehensive findings to the ref.

Ref can then make the final decision.

I think Mitrea has improved from his earlier seasons, he used to miss a call, then 'make up for it' with the next call, which he would then make up for with the next, and eventually he would loose control of a game.

How does 15 refs compare to the other leagues in England and France?

marty2086 wrote:

Munchkin wrote:The Ulster players weren't happy with him at all. I have seen a few really odd calls from TMO's, but rarely from a TJ.

Just as well we won the game.

Wasn't he Welsh as well

It wasn't so much him making decisions rather him not making them and staying quiet. Maybe not brave enough or got enough experience or confidence to feel like he can make big calls

He called a knock-on against Ulster when it was caused by an early tackle on Henry. He also called another knock-on against Ulster when it was clearly a Cardiff player. He also tried to claim Cardiff didn't drop the ball forward in their maul that would have given them the try. Maybe he's just cr@p.

Munchkin wrote:I can't honestly say I've noticed one way or the other, LD. The only real gripe's I've heard has been that of Dudley awarding a Try to Edinburgh at the weekend, and I do think he got it right, even if it was by a fine margin. The other one would be the TJ at the Cardiff v Ulster game, and he obviously did get his calls wrong.

There have been a few for me, Lloyd Linton down at Llanelli a few weeks ago, although he was not the reason Scarlets lost that day, Marius Matrea had a bad few, but as I said, I am not blaming the refs for teams losing. I watched Leinster and Munster a few weeks ago, and David Wilkinson had a very poor game.

On the other side of the coin though, John Lacey and Ben Whitehouse seem to be getting it together.

Munchkin wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Munchkin wrote:The Ulster players weren't happy with him at all. I have seen a few really odd calls from TMO's, but rarely from a TJ.

Just as well we won the game.

Wasn't he Welsh as well

It wasn't so much him making decisions rather him not making them and staying quiet. Maybe not brave enough or got enough experience or confidence to feel like he can make big calls

He called a knock-on against Ulster when it was caused by an early tackle on Henry. He also called another knock-on against Ulster when it was clearly a Cardiff player. He also tried to claim Cardiff didn't drop the ball forward in their maul that would have given them the try. Maybe he's just cr@p.

Forgot about the double knock on, for balance though he missed/didn't call Henry kicking the ball from a ruck while offside and neither did the TMO

LordDowlais wrote:

Munchkin wrote:I can't honestly say I've noticed one way or the other, LD. The only real gripe's I've heard has been that of Dudley awarding a Try to Edinburgh at the weekend, and I do think he got it right, even if it was by a fine margin. The other one would be the TJ at the Cardiff v Ulster game, and he obviously did get his calls wrong.

There have been a few for me, Lloyd Linton down at Llanelli a few weeks ago, although he was not the reason Scarlets lost that day, Marius Matrea had a bad few, but as I said, I am not blaming the refs for teams losing. I watched Leinster and Munster a few weeks ago, and David Wilkinson had a very poor game.

On the other side of the coin though, John Lacey and Ben Whitehouse seem to be getting it together.

Lacey gets a lot of bad press, but I think he's actually a decent ref. Wilkinson can be a bit up and down. I did watch the Leinster v Munster game, but can't remember how Wilkinson performed.

Refs will always make mistakes. Owens said, a while back, that refs will make mistakes in every game, but they shouldn't be mistakes that decides who wins. Maybe a bit of hyperbole, but it's a fair point. It such a complex game with so many moving parts all at once, mistakes will happen. And then some close calls can be interpreted differently, and fans will usually go with the interpretation that favours their side.

The standard could certainly improve, I don't think anyone will dispute that, but for that to happen we need to encourage many others to train as refs. For the PRO12 that would be especially true of the Scots and Italians.

marty2086 wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Munchkin wrote:The Ulster players weren't happy with him at all. I have seen a few really odd calls from TMO's, but rarely from a TJ.

Just as well we won the game.

Wasn't he Welsh as well

It wasn't so much him making decisions rather him not making them and staying quiet. Maybe not brave enough or got enough experience or confidence to feel like he can make big calls

He called a knock-on against Ulster when it was caused by an early tackle on Henry. He also called another knock-on against Ulster when it was clearly a Cardiff player. He also tried to claim Cardiff didn't drop the ball forward in their maul that would have given them the try. Maybe he's just cr@p.

Forgot about the double knock on, for balance though he missed/didn't call Henry kicking the ball from a ruck while offside and neither did the TMO

True, and the ref also missed Herring playing the ball on the ground at one of the breakdowns. That's the ref though and not the TJ. I prefer to think it's just a bad performance by a green TJ, but will be keeping my eye on him should he officiate another Ulster game o0

Mitrea's one of the most notably improved referees in Pro12 rugby for me. Thought he was very shaky when I first started recognising him, so after he was established a bit, but now is a good international referee. Seems to be a "fair" referee, where- to perhaps muddy the waters- others typically aren't, swaying according to the crowd etc.

I think the standard of refereeing must have improved. This is the first time this season that anyone has raised an issue.

I am curious though as to why Cardiff's attendances are increasing in contrast to the other Welsh regions. Is it linked to the standard of refereeing in their home games?

Can I just add the reffing in the aviva premium has been just as inconsistent as the pro 12. And I would guess the top 14 is similar.

Pot Hale wrote:I think the standard of refereeing must have improved.   This is the first time this season that anyone has raised an issue.

I am curious though as to why Cardiff's attendances are increasing in contrast to the other Welsh regions.  Is it linked to the standard of refereeing in their home games?

Ebb and flow.

The reffing across the board this year in both league and international has been average to poor. The autumn internationals had many reffereeing complaints pretty much every weekend, so little to do with Pro12 refs. The issue is that the complexity of the game and the understandable gamesmanship of highly tuned pros mean its incredibly difficult for any ref in the modern game.

I am not promoting it as a very good idea but maybe more officials are needed. Note that NFL has 7 officials, Aussie rules has 6, GAA has 7 while rugby only has 4 while being arguably the most complex game of all.

Griff wrote:

Pot Hale wrote:I think the standard of refereeing must have improved.   This is the first time this season that anyone has raised an issue.

I am curious though as to why Cardiff's attendances are increasing in contrast to the other Welsh regions.  Is it linked to the standard of refereeing in their home games?

Ebb and flow.

They sound very Welsh - are they refs or TMOs?

The standards up to now have been great. The Pro12 is really settling down now and on its way to becoming the best rugby in Europe!


No, I'm not getting paid by Pro12................................ directly.................

SecretFly wrote:The standards up to now have been great.  The Pro12 is really settling down now and on its way to becoming the best rugby in Europe!


No, I'm not getting paid by Pro12................................ directly.................

Your like Lloyd George.

You do not like the establishment, the establishment doesn't really like you either, because you stand up to them. But you will take their money and sleep with their wives none the less.

Sean Gallagher (IRFU) refereed the Scarlets v Leinster game a few weeks ago. I think it's the first time I've seen him ref a game but I thought he was excellent.

That got me to thinking.  There was a guy called RedStag a good while ago on 606.  Don't know how many now recall him.  Seemed to be an upwardly mobile young man who said he'd been involved in reffing.  He might have drifted away from 606 or returned under a different name.  I sometimes wonder about the current selection of refs.  Is he out there in Pro12? - losing piece by piece his once high reputation in these 606 parts

Nah, he's not that high yet. Don't know if he's still at it either.

Very knowledgeable man. Just don't tell him I said that.

It's Murray Kinsella, ain't it!

Close, but no cigar.

In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

316 tries???


That is appalling! That's what's wrong. Refs can't keep up. Less tries and more refs would be in the right place to do their job.

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

More try's are good.

The standard of the Refs is fine, its the standard of the rugby on offer which is a let down.

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

1. I didn't say it was superior to anything. Its a pro12 record which means its being compared to the pro12 of the past.
2. More tries generally mean the league IS more exciting.
3. Do some of the worlds best players play in the vanarama national league south? Can we see Mesi or Ronaldo playing in that league?

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

1. I didn't say it was superior to anything. Its a pro12 record which means its being compared to the pro12 of the past.
2. More tries generally mean the league IS more exciting.
3. Do some of the worlds best players play in the vanarama national league south? Can we see Mesi or Ronaldo playing in that league?

I'm not sure the pro12 is the home of some of the worlds best rugby players either. UK and Ireland's best? Yes. But I can't think of 1 that would get into a World XV.

As another poster said - refs will make mistakes. Actually I thik the overall standard in the pro12 has been better this year and Mitrea has improved greatly. I like him reffing my teams games.

All leagues fans complain about refs. I think the game is almost impossible to ref and for top level games I'd like to see two more officials -

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

1. I didn't say it was superior to anything. Its a pro12 record which means its being compared to the pro12 of the past.
2. More tries generally mean the league IS more exciting.
3. Do some of the worlds best players play in the vanarama national league south? Can we see Mesi or Ronaldo playing in that league?

I'm not sure the pro12 is the home of some of the worlds best rugby players either. UK and Ireland's best?  Yes. But I can't think of 1 that would get into a World XV.

If you have 4 world class players of a similar standard for one position, only 1 can make a 15. There are 3 others of a similar standard.

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

1. I didn't say it was superior to anything. Its a pro12 record which means its being compared to the pro12 of the past.
2. More tries generally mean the league IS more exciting.
3. Do some of the worlds best players play in the vanarama national league south? Can we see Mesi or Ronaldo playing in that league?

I'm not sure the pro12 is the home of some of the worlds best rugby players either. UK and Ireland's best?  Yes. But I can't think of 1 that would get into a World XV.

If you have 4 world class players of a similar standard for one position, only 1 can make a 15. There are 3 others of a similar standard.

Hes done this before elsewhere, apparently to be world class you have to fit into his XV ignoring the fact that my own time Ulster could boast at a number of World Class players

[quote="marty2086"]

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

profitius wrote:In other news, Pro12 breaking it's try scoring record so far this year.
316 tries in 58 games so far.

An interesting stat. I don't think that necessarily means the league is better quality or more exciting.

In soccer, Hemel Hempstead beat Weston Supermare 5-3 on the weekend, I doubt many people think the Vanarama National League South is better than La Liga though.

1. I didn't say it was superior to anything. Its a pro12 record which means its being compared to the pro12 of the past.
2. More tries generally mean the league IS more exciting.
3. Do some of the worlds best players play in the vanarama national league south? Can we see Mesi or Ronaldo playing in that league?

I'm not sure the pro12 is the home of some of the worlds best rugby players either. UK and Ireland's best?  Yes. But I can't think of 1 that would get into a World XV.

On that definition, are there world class players in UK League? (there are some in top14 but arguably not many by that every limited definition).

TJ wrote:As another poster said - refs will make mistakes.  Actually I thik the overall standard in the pro12 has been better this year and Mitrea has improved greatly.  I like him reffing my teams games.

All leagues fans complain about refs.  I think the game is almost impossible to ref and for top level games I'd like to see two more officials -

Theres mistakes and then theres absolute howlers like Dudley's last Fridays. Having referees like him undermines the whole league

True Raven wrote:

TJ wrote:As another poster said - refs will make mistakes.  Actually I thik the overall standard in the pro12 has been better this year and Mitrea has improved greatly.  I like him reffing my teams games.

All leagues fans complain about refs.  I think the game is almost impossible to ref and for top level games I'd like to see two more officials -

Theres mistakes and then theres absolute howlers like Dudley's last Fridays.  Having referees like him undermines the whole league

Dudley's wasn't a howler by any stretch. You can argue it was the wrong interpretation though. Personally, I think he got it right.

Referring is definitely on the up this year and some changes in personnel have been instrumental in that