Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

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Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:36 am

Warning Daily Mail link.... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-4030896/Leicester-Tigers-ready-axe-director-rugby-Richard-Cockerill-humiliating-defeat-Munster.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490#article-4030896

Whilst I can see it being true (the Tigers board is prob the most ruthless in the league, I haven't heard anything about this from any of my sources. (All of which are fairly reliable).

Although not to say isn't the case I didn't know about Hansen till that morning sooooo...........

Sounds like Munster game could be it.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by carpet baboon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 7:07 am

First, my condolences for having to link a daily mail article , second if he goes think Murphy will be promoted?

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Big on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 8:49 am

I'm sorry but I just can't bring myself to click on a Hate Mail link, so haven't read the article. Apologies if that answers any of my queries, but I'm sure you can understand!

It would be sad if he did go, as he is a Tigers man through and through. But, I don't think we are seeing the best rugby from the group of players that we have and it may well be time. He would have no hesitation about dropping players he thought weren't up to scratch, so I don't think that he should get any sentimental protection either. Not sure who would replace him though, and that does need to be considered before seriously considering giving him the boot.

With that in mind, and forgive my ignorance on the possible squad dynamic, but what's the logic in bumping Murphy up? It seems to me that the team needs some of it's uncompromising edge back, and if Murphy isn't doing that now, how will he do it with Cockerill gone (whatever failings he has had, for vast majority of his tenure, despite not having the star studded side of old, we've been able to scrape wins when needed)? Or would the idea be that Murphy takes on more of the management duties, and a more forward oriented coach comes in under him to work with Mauger on the strategy and day to day coaching (which to be fair may add more balance to the actual coaching team)? If the latter who are the candidates as forwards coach?

Also, if he did go - what next for Cockerill? I can imagine if he did go that Bristol might be wishing he was available a few weeks back!

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 8:57 am

No worries hence the warning.

I suspect Tigers have someone lined up.
Reckon Meyer could be someone being brought in really.

About Cockers reckon France is the obvious one he has knowledge of coaching in France and he suits the French management style, can see him getting at least a forwards coach role.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:16 am

All coaches have a sell by date, which we can also see at Saints. Cockers successes between 2009 & 2013 will have bought him time, but things are not working and I am not surprised that the axe is hovering.

Not sure what difference a new coach will make though. We really need to sort out the academy (loss of Dusty Hare to Saints seems in hindsight to have had cataclysmic effects) and promote from within rather than bringing in overpaid S12 journeymen. I love Locky McCaffery to bits but that he has been close to our best player over the last season and a half highlights our shortcomings.

Whoever comes in, or Cockers if he stays, needs to look at who we can build a team around and then recruit real quality to supplement that.

Genge, Cole, Barrow, Williams, Evans, Thacker, Lenny, Harrison, Burns, Toomua, Manu, Thompstone, Veainu, Worth are right now the only guys I would be willing to offer new contracts to.



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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:24 am

Hare was entirely his own fault and doing though.

Would add McCaffrey, JPP and Betham (as a 13 not wing) to that list.


Last edited by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:49 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:35 am

And Dean Richards is slowly putting a stop to the silk route that was the Falcons academy....

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:51 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:And Dean Richards is slowly putting a stop to the silk route that was the Falcons academy....

Nah just letting it develop more.

I expect over the next couple of season to see us bringing in a few lads up.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:08 am

I don't think there'll be many heading down that route now Welly...

You can have Delayney is you want...

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:14 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:I don't think there'll be many heading down that route now Welly...

You can have Delayney is you want...

No deal, unless you chuck in Witty.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 10:23 am

laughing laughing Yahoo Laugh

Witty is going nowhere! We gave you Barrow....what more do you want??

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 11:03 am

I disagree LT I think since we sacked McCarthy as head of the academy  (Troy Thacker with him) the academy seem to be doing better. Since MOC left those players are coming into the first team squad far more readily. That's one of our few positives.

We need an injection of something new up front in the forwards. Blaze has no experience other than as understudy to Cockers and I think sadly Cockers has reached his sell by date. Meyer returning would be good and working with Mauger and the existing staff plus a new defence coach would hopefully reinvigorate us. Meyer knows several of the senior players as he gave some of them their breaks as academy products and speaks well of the club. 

Left field replacement choice, Ben Herring. Defence and breakdown coach (our two big weaknesses) in Japan (working with the national team now). Was a fan favourite at the club and has good experience as well as knowing the existing staff and the club.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 11:14 am

Generally my thoughts are the spine of the team is strong...there is a lot to work with ...it just seems adding the flesh to the "bones" is the issue. But that could be fixed quite quickly I would have thought.

And how best to utilise your quality youngsters like Evans and Thacker!

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 11:59 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Generally my thoughts are the spine of the team is strong...there is a lot to work with ...it just seems adding the flesh to the "bones" is the issue. But that could be fixed quite quickly I would have thought.

And how best to utilise your quality youngsters like Evans and Thacker!

Yeah. I think we're currently recovering from the previous stance of promoting next to no young players and investing heavily in squad filler. We seem to be coming out of that cycle and need to now be a bit savvy on who we sign because there are some areas that need improvement. 

I still think the squad is performing well below where it should be. The systems and tactics don't seem to help us. I mean who's bright idea was it to get into a contestable kicking competition with Munster? The Irish boys love competing under the high ball (GAA sports from an early age does that) and they had two good kickers at 9 and 10. That was obviously a bad call before kick off especially with us only deploying one fullback who is only 20 and playing his first European game (he did alright under the circumstances).

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:32 pm

You can have Jim Mallinder if you want...........................................................please, please!

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:39 pm

Do you think you should have kept hold of that chunky winger who went to Sale? Paulo?

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:40 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Do you think you should have kept hold of that chunky winger who went to Sale? Paulo?
Not the chunky winger that went to Falcons a couple seasons ago? Alex.... Wink

Odogwu and Tigers was a different situation from what I gather.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:45 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Do you think you should have kept hold of that chunky winger who went to Sale? Paulo?

Possibly. Apparently he's wasn't very keen at turning up to training on time. He really should have got some game time last season after looking good in pre season. Lewington was the really moronic loss on our part. Playing well in the LV we ditched him for the final and sent him back out on loan in favour of an increasingly aging Scott Hamilton. Was no surprise when he left for LI.

We seem to be doing better at giving our academy players game time but there's improvement still to be made before we'll be more self sufficient with our talent

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 12:50 pm

Yeh some academy players that are doing really well looked fairly average in the academy teams Purdy and Humphreys both look excellent now but at the time fairly average.

It's hard to judge at times.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 1:04 pm

I thought Humphreys had something we just never gave him a chance. I think Purdy still looks average. The two hookers we released Clare and the one who went to LI I thought could have been perfectly serviceable squad players. We never gave them any game time. Hopefully we're edging in the right direction at the minute.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 1:14 pm

Welly wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Do you think you should have kept hold of that chunky winger who went to Sale? Paulo?
Not the chunky winger that went to Falcons a couple seasons ago? Alex.... Wink

Odogwu and Tigers was a different situation from what I gather.

Yeah, we give you Barrow, McGuigan etc and you give us that has been! However Goneva finally looks like he's fit and got his Mojo back.

Maybe because Hodgson is playing flat attacking rugby at 10, and Socino is playing out of his skin at 12.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by SirBurger on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 1:37 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:I thought Humphreys had something we just never gave him a chance. I think Purdy still looks average. The two hookers we released Clare and the one who went to LI I thought could have been perfectly serviceable squad players. We never gave them any game time. Hopefully we're edging in the right direction at the minute.

If you mean Jimmy Stevens then you made the right choice. Well below Premiership standard.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 4:01 pm

Is there anyone available to replace Cockers? We're all debating what we know is wrong with the performances and the squad buy there's no real options for a like for like replacement outside of Meyer returning.

Not sure any of the current coaches could step up to DOR and none have the experience to take over coaching the forwards.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 4:11 pm

I'm sure the board have either been looking at options or are.

Doubt they would axe him without an reasonable idea what they would do.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Big on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 4:28 pm

Speculative, but there is one Tigers fan I wouldn't mind seeing given a run.  Former player, was on the board until a few years ago, and has a successful coaching track record with several 6 nations and a world cup win to his name...  not to mention him supporting (successfully) a lot of Olympic teams in the build up to 2012.

I know most people aren't fans of Sir Clive, but personally I like a coach that irritates the opposition.  It would be a gamble given his time out of the game, but he would shake things  up and could do a lot of good for the team - especially if his focus was the management rather than the in-game strategy.

Don't think he would mind, and appreciate I may be the only one that would like to see it!

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by nathan on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 5:34 pm

Would Martin Johnson fit in anywhere? Not really a coaching type though, more of a dor

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 8:45 pm

SCW and Tigers are not on the best of terms of late since he join the bath board I believe.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Wed 14 Dec 2016, 9:03 pm

nathan wrote:Would Martin Johnson fit in anywhere? Not really a coaching type though, more of a dor

He could be worth a shot. Bring him and work with the forwards. Inject some aggression. Might be worth a go on a contract until the end of the season. Sir Clive as a consultant.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Big on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 8:50 am

Welly wrote:SCW and Tigers are not on the best of terms of late since he join the bath board I believe.

I didn't realise he had joined the Bath board (show's how up to date I am).  I just remember his comments when he left ours...

"Leicester has always been my club and will always be my club and I'll just be working on other projects to try and help,"

From the BBC article.

On Jonno - I think he's also quite analytical as well, would be very happy to see him involved.  Whether or not it will happen is a different matter though. I wouldn't be surprised if the England job put him off rugby coaching/management.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 10:02 am

Big wrote:
Welly wrote:SCW and Tigers are not on the best of terms of late since he join the bath board I believe.

I didn't realise he had joined the Bath board (show's how up to date I am).  I just remember his comments when he left ours...

"Leicester has always been my club and will always be my club and I'll just be working on other projects to try and help,"

From the BBC article.

On Jonno - I think he's also quite analytical as well, would be very happy to see him involved.  Whether or not it will happen is a different matter though. I wouldn't be surprised if the England job put him off rugby coaching/management.

Sir Clive or Johnno would be good figure heads to rally the players around. Neither is an experienced forwards coach like Cockers though so we might be a little light in that department unless Boris returns or Brett Deacon is deemed ready to take a first team role.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 10:37 am

Is Louis Deacon doing any coaching badges at the moment?

He was a real tough competitor at lock...an old schooler.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Welly on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:08 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Is Louis Deacon doing any coaching badges at the moment?

He was a real tough competitor at lock...an old schooler.

Eng U20 work ATM and Mosley I think.


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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:13 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Is Louis Deacon doing any coaching badges at the moment?

He was a real tough competitor at lock...an old schooler.

Something with the Spanish Rugby Union but I don't know if that's continuing. Deacon was never much of a talker and made Johnno look expressive and emotive.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Hazel Sapling on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:21 am

If you are after a forwards coach, Andy Robinson is excellent. It is when he becomes the head coach you need to worry.

Finding good head coaches who fit the ethos of a club is hard especially a forward thinking one. Most coaches who are available are coming off poor performances. Lancaster may be a reasonable bet though.

If Cotter had stayed as Scotland coach, Townsend would have been an interesting appointment but that can go in the what if section.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:29 am

Andy Robinson would be about the least popular possible appointment. He's managed to fumble through several jobs with mediocre results and he's a former Bath man.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by Hazel Sapling on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:34 am

Again purely as a forwards coach. His packs at Edinburgh were excellent. It is when you promote him to head coach that he is not worthy.

How did Back get on when he had the chance? He went away and got experience elsewhere in Yorkshire and Edinburgh. Would he be a reasonable appointment for the forwards? I am working on the basis you need a forward coach and a head coach at the moment.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by GeordieFalcon on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 11:37 am

John Wells? Whistle

Actually to be fair the Falcons forwards (bar the scrum) are very good at the moment.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by formerly known as Sam on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 12:12 pm

Back left under quite a cloud. Apparently he didn't take it very well when Cockers got the head job ahead of him. Not sure he'd return, he's probably more abrasive than Cockers as well so wouldn't necessarily help the alleged splits in coaching staff.

Wells I can't imagine returning. He's been Deano's right hand man for a number of years now. I'd imagine we'd be looking at someone more innovative to work with Mauger.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by SecretFly on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 6:14 pm

C-ock Culled for Christmas! - Walesonline

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

Post by king_carlos on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 6:43 pm

With how results have gone it would be no surprise if Cockers were moved on. Given his cut throat attitude to coaching he can't really complain either.

I do feel for him from the perspective that money constraints have taken some things out of his control. The club needing to buy the Granby Hills site on short notice has left cash very tight elsewhere. The S & C budget has been cut and development projects for improving training facilities (which are miles behind the top 3) have been put on hold or stalled.

That combined with injuries and lacking the money to sign the injury replacements that other top clubs would - no Toomua replacement is especially showing - has put pressure on the coaching staff who now seem split.

A change is needed but it's a shame that a guy who's given what he has to Tigers will seemingly be pushed out midseason under a cloud. I hope that whoever the board has lined up is a suitable replacement who can bring a defence coach with him and unite what is otherwise a talented young group of coaches that Cockers has put together.

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Re: Leicester Tigers ready to Axe Cockerill

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