Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

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Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rugby Fan on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:32 pm

Oops. 21-0 to Clermont already.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Artful_Dodger on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:44 pm

Painful to watch, just not in Clermont's class unfortunately.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Pete330v2 on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:50 pm

So some prick posts a topic in order to take the mick when we're 21 points down and anything said against it gets removed. Class stuff mods

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:52 pm

Is there a need for the aggression and abuse? It's a match thread. The guy just said "oops".

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rugby Fan on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:57 pm

Didn't mean to stir anything.

Match threads tend to get mixed up with club threads, so I thought I'd start one, since I'm watching it and was blown away by Clermont undoing Ulster. I started the Scarlets one late too, since there was no thread for that one either.

Hope Ulster can turn this around.


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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by eirebilly on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 3:58 pm

Very good from Clermont. Expected Ulster to push Clermont but they have been simply blown off the field. Hopefully they will come out after half time and put in a decent shift, thought it was really important they scored before the half time whistle.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:01 pm

eirebilly wrote:Very good from Clermont. Expected Ulster to push Clermont but they have been simply blown off the field. Hopefully they will come out after half time and put in a decent shift, thought it was really important they scored before the half time whistle.

I don't understand why we didn't kick for goal and at least put something on the board. We haven't looked like scoring and our scrum hasn't been good. I just can't understand why we opted for it.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by eirebilly on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:07 pm

I would have kicked the points myself as well Rory, I can understand the decision but its not one I would have made.

Big second half now.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:08 pm

Lol what a joke.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by eirebilly on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:09 pm

Just not Ulster's day.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rugby Fan on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:19 pm

Clermont just look so much more engaged than last week.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by profitius on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:28 pm

Adolf Bowe with the try. Ulster coming into it a bit.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Artful_Dodger on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:40 pm

CMON ULSTER!!!

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by profitius on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:40 pm

Game definitely on now!
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:41 pm

What did they put in the water? Not gatorade anyway.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by profitius on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:56 pm

Unlucky Ulster but they at least put up a performance in the second half.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Rory_Gallagher on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 4:58 pm

And the dream is over.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Artful_Dodger on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 5:00 pm

Valiant effort after being 28-0 down, but too much to do.

We are most likely going to need 10 points from the last two games. Home to Bordeux and away to Exeter, there is a chance 9 would be enough but probably won't be.

Its probably too much of an ask, but we still have some hope.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 5:01 pm

Good fight back but left themselves way to much to do unfortunately.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Munchkin on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 5:17 pm

Good effort in the last 30, but Clermont showed their class and gave us a bit of a lesson. Looked like the bonus point was on, but just fell short.

For all the Ah You haters; he played very well when he came on Cool

We are not without hope in qualifying, but it's going to be very tough.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by theslosty on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 6:10 pm

All is not lost, Ulster played poorly but it's a big ask for any team to come away with anything from Clermont. With Toulon and Montpellier losing today, 9 points from their last two games may well be enough for Ulster to scrape through.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by marty2086 on Sun 18 Dec 2016, 6:17 pm

Clermont were the epitome of the proverbial wounded animal, they came out and were just ruthless and Ulster looked lost and unable to gain any foothold in the game until Clermont stepped of the gas

Can I ask what people thought of Mitreas performance?

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 8:29 am

theslosty wrote:All is not lost, Ulster played poorly but it's a big ask for any team to come away with anything from Clermont. With Toulon and Montpellier losing today, 9 points from their last two games may well be enough for Ulster to scrape through.

They might indeed be able "to scrape through", but what would be the point? It had been proven since the hammerings away to Toulon, Saracens and now Clermont that Ulster don't have the squad to compete with the big boys on their home turf (especially up front). Wasting resources and effort on what is unwinnable at the expense of what is will just perpetuate Ulster's winless streak.
Ulster haven't been good enough to compete in this competition, so they need to be realistic and now refocus on the Pro12 while they still have a chance to be competitive there. Hopefully Glasgow, Munster and Leinster will all be distracted by the later stages of the ERCC and Ulster can close the gap in the League.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by rodders on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 9:50 am

Didn't see the game but was listening on radio. It seems bizarre that Kiss took off Bowe and Pienaar when 2 bonus points were on offer and Ulster seemed to be on top in the second half?

I think we can still qualify but will need bonus points in the last 2 games,
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 10:14 am

The bench actually energised Ulster - Bowe was shot anyway. Still there might have been a bit of protectionism going on with Connacht so close and Ulster with no chance of topping their pool.
The game was never in doubt as Clermont lazily allowed Ulster back in, but when there was any danger of Ulster closing further they stepped on the gas again. They could have made it embarassing for Ulster if they had been ruthless.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Pete330v2 on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 11:15 am

To be honest I'd rather we concentrated on one battlefront and do better in the Pro12 rather than wasting resources on the Franglo cup. A Pro12 trophy would be a great farewell to Ruan ( if he's going Wink ).

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 11:32 am

Pete330v2 wrote:To be honest I'd rather we concentrated on one battlefront and do better in the Pro12 rather than wasting resources on the Franglo cup. A Pro12 trophy would be a great farewell to Ruan ( if he's going Wink ).

Agree 100%. Jeopardising the Pro12 again for the very slim chance of some quarter final prize money would be foolhardy.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by rodders on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 11:43 am

Saracens, Clermont and Wasps excepted the Franglo's look done for so this is a great opportunity to win the champion cup.

I can see 4-5 pro12 sides in the KO stages so it is ludicrous for us to give up the ghost when we have one of the strongest squads in the competition.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by marty2086 on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 1:21 pm

rodders wrote:Saracens, Clermont and Wasps excepted the Franglo's look done for so this is a great opportunity to win the champion cup.

I can see 4-5 pro12 sides in the KO stages so it is ludicrous for us to give up the ghost when we have one of the strongest squads in the competition.

Spot on and considering we know Ulster can do the big one off performances and not the back to back ones the knockouts could be the perfect platform for it

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 3:42 pm

rodders wrote:Saracens, Clermont and Wasps excepted the Franglo's look done for so this is a great opportunity to win the champion cup.

I can see 4-5 pro12 sides in the KO stages so it is ludicrous for us to give up the ghost when we have one of the strongest squads in the competition.

Ulster haven't been too successful turning over Glasgow, Munster or Leinster either especially in away knockout games. Pool 5 is also the least likely pool to produce a qualifier from the best runner-up route. Even if Ulster did scrape through they are more than likely to be facing Saracens or Clermont away with a depleted squad held together with blu-tack and sticking plaster.
I disagree that Ulster have a strong squad - they have strong backs but weak forwards and what is ludicrous is that Ulster are ignoring this deficiency.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by rodders on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 4:40 pm

The Great Aukster wrote:
I disagree that Ulster have a strong squad - they have strong backs but weak forwards and what is ludicrous is that Ulster are ignoring this deficiency.

Depth isn't great in some forward positions (which is why letting Stevenson and now Touhy leave is odd) but I don't agree we have a weak pack per se. There are still 6 or 7 international caliber forwards.

I think the squad is good enough to compete in both competitions but the coaching set up is not good enough to get the most out of what we do have.

Almost 80 points conceded over 2 legs is not acceptable no matter who the opposition are. The only thing we are lacking from the other 3 provinces is a decent game plan, with and without the ball. We are too reliant on individual brilliance, of Pienaar in particular, to score points.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 6:44 pm

rodders wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:
I disagree that Ulster have a strong squad - they have strong backs but weak forwards and what is ludicrous is that Ulster are ignoring this deficiency.

Depth isn't great in some forward positions (which is why letting Stevenson and now Touhy leave is odd) but I don't agree we have a weak pack per se. There are still 6 or 7 international caliber forwards.

I think the squad is good enough to compete in both competitions but the coaching set up is not good enough to get the most out of what we do have.

Almost 80 points conceded over 2 legs is not acceptable no matter who the opposition are. The only thing we are lacking from the other 3 provinces is a decent game plan, with and without the ball. We are too reliant on individual brilliance, of Pienaar in particular, to score points.

Rory Best and Ian Henderson are the only two forwards that are in the running for Ireland if everyone else is fit and available, therefore it could be argued they are the only two of international calibre. However of those already capped Chris Henry and Rob Herring are close to being Test class, but the rest of Ah You, Franco, Diack, Reidy and Wilson aren't and very unlikely to be capped again. Of those not yet proven at Test level, Peter Browne was on standby for the SA tour and Herbst might still reach that level, but it is still a stretch for them or McCall, Warwick, Kane and O'Connor to be judged as International calibre.

The players in the sides Ulster face have multiple caps - not the occasional cap to tie a player to Ireland or beat the NIQ quota. These teams also have the same on the bench, and in the wider squad so that there is real pressure on places and depth when it is needed. They have three or four times the number of quality forwards Ulster have, and until that is addressed Ulster will continue to struggle.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 11:20 pm

Agree only Best and Henderson are good enough for International Rugby

Henry is a decent player but not good enough to make either the Munster or Leinster bench
McCall and Herbst are players of high promise but not there yet
Herring is solid but nothing more than that

The likes of Ah You, Warwick, de Merwe, Browne, AOC, Diack, Reidy, Wilson, Ross etc etc all come up well short
Coetzee should be a big bonus but lets see him in action first.

Net effect is an inadequate pack.

In addition with only one set of half backs close to be going enough that means we are very vulnerable.
Bear in mind we are not even sure of a top 10, let alone a top 9, yet for next year.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon 19 Dec 2016, 11:23 pm

Have to agree on the subs though - taking Best, Bowe and Pienaer off was giving up the ghost just as we were rattling them.

They were the 3 players Clermont couldn't handle

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Cyril on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 6:02 am

Pienaar looked like he was already in the latter stages of buying his French residence.

Like Bowe, he's been a good servant for Ulster. He deserves his big payday, a chance for top silverware and then back to SA for the climate and lifestyle.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by clivemcl on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 8:08 am

Cyril wrote:Pienaar looked like he was already in the latter stages of buying his French residence.

Like Bowe, he's been a good servant for Ulster. He deserves his big payday, a chance for top silverware and then back to SA for the climate and lifestyle.

Cyril, you've not been keeping up! Pienaar ain't going back home. The atrocity if him leaving is the fact that Belfast is his home now. He's not shy about the fact he wants to live out his days in NI. In fact, the chat is that whatever club he signs for, his family will remain in Belfast and he will fly back and forth.
Yes, silverware would be nice and very deserved for him, but his biggest ambition this year is to find a way for him and his family not to be uprooted and forced to leave their new home and community.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 10:32 am

Cyril wrote:Pienaar looked like he was already in the latter stages of buying his French residence.

Like Bowe, he's been a good servant for Ulster. He deserves his big payday, a chance for top silverware and then back to SA for the climate and lifestyle.

As Clive has said Pienaer regards Ulster as his home and is planning on staying here

I was unfair on Warwick above.
He is only 25 he should be with McCall and Herbst in the promising props category not in the 'not quite good enough category'


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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 12:07 pm

Yes Warwick is still a prospect. He needs to work on his handling skills though to be a loosehead. McCall originally played centre at Wallace before gravitating to the backrow and then prop but he still seems to have good handling skills and ruck technique.
Ross Kane has also been impressive when called upon and you wonder how Michael Lagan would have done if he'd similar opportunity or will he just disappear ala Finlay Bealham?

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 2:24 pm

And Simpson, Cooper and Trenier - we have some decent props coming through - just need them to be well coached now Whistle  Whistle  Whistle


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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by profitius on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 2:30 pm

Warwick is a bit meh. Yourselves and Connacht should be looking to sign Peter Dooley. He is a good scrummager and a very good athlete for a prop. He is being wasted at Leinster and McGrath and Healy are nowhere near the finishing line of their careers yet.
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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by marty2086 on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 7:16 pm

profitius wrote:Warwick is a bit meh. Yourselves and Connacht should be looking to sign Peter Dooley. He is a good scrummager and a very good athlete for a prop. He is being wasted at Leinster and McGrath and Healy are nowhere near the finishing line of their careers yet.

To be honest I think we'd rather have Porter Whistle

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 7:58 pm

Agreed from what I know of the talent we have coming through Dooley is no better, Porter on the other hand

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Munchkin on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 8:00 pm

Clermont player cited:

"Clermont Auvergne's Etienne Falgoux has been cited for allegedly making contact with the eye area of Ulster's Luke Marshall in Sunday's European game.

The citing has been made after Ireland centre Marshall was left clutching his face late in the first half at the Stade Marcel Michelin.

Welsh citing commissioner Jeff Mark made the citing against the prop, 23.

Sanctions for making contact with the eye area range from 12 weeks at the low end to above 24 weeks at the high end."

Don't remember any real incidents........ Actually I do! Didn't know what it was about, but Marshall wasn't happy.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Tue 20 Dec 2016, 10:46 pm

Rory wasn't too happy either about fingers making contact with his 'eye area' - led to the handbags.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Munchkin on Wed 21 Dec 2016, 1:02 pm

Was that the incident that the TMO said something about contact with the heads? I noticed a hand on Rory's face, but not fingers in the eyes.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by The Great Aukster on Wed 21 Dec 2016, 4:31 pm

The same incident - and that was pretty much how I saw it too.

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 22 Dec 2016, 10:09 am

7 week ban - what is it with Frenchmen and Ulster eyes

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 22 Dec 2016, 10:53 am

So we should really have been playing against 14 men. Damn it, robbed again Wink

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by marty2086 on Thu 22 Dec 2016, 11:07 am

Still would have been playing against 15 sure if he went off Whistle

He was actually one guy we could have done with being off the field too

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 22 Dec 2016, 11:30 am

marty2086 wrote:Still would have been playing against 15 sure if he went off Whistle

He was actually one guy we could have done with being off the field too

I missed the incident altogether. Is there any footage anywhere?

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Re: Clermont vs Ulster 18th December

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