Frampton v Santa Cruz II - Is anybody going?

First topic message reminder :

My wife and I were already booked up to be in Vegas weekend of 28th and she managed to get us tickets to the fight.

So I am really looking for any tips from people that are seasoned Vegas big fight go-ers and can recommend the best places to go pre/post and best ways to make the most of it.

Just watched it this morning. Can't argue with the decision, a lot of close rounds but on balance the better guy on the night edged it. The slow start really cost him in the end. A credit to both fighters and very refreshing to see frampton (and barry) take his defeat with real dignity.

Lsc and frampton are a credit to the sport in terms of their ability, effort and how they handle themselves.

A rubber match seems a certainty but will it be in Belfast? That would be an indicator of just how good a guy lsc is!

No losers last night..Frampton lost a decision in a quality fight against a quality opponent and acted with class after it...I personally scored it a draw...

1-1...

Only loser in the last week is Degale.....Bragging he beat Jack comfortably..

No class..

Yep have to agree with the general consensus here. Had LSC winning by one. Could have maybe argued the draw but certainly not a win for Carl. First two rounds lost it for him, Cruz boxed brilliantly in the opening rounds which ultimately helped him hold on after the late onslaught.

Very very enjoyable fight yet again, hoping for a rematch in Belfast and I'll do my utmost to get there!!

Both are a credit to the sport. Massively.

Great fight, LSC boxed beautifully and definitely edged it. To outbox Frampton is a serious achievement. Bring on the 3rd fight both men are a credit to the sport and a breath of fresh air from the nonsense and hype we usually have to endure as fans of this sport.

Gutted for Carl. Proper gentleman in defeat as well. Huge respect, let's see the third one please. I had it a draw, close fight but if there had to be a winner it was always LSC.

My card

1. SC 10-9
2. SC 10-9
3. CF 10-9
4. CF 10-9
5. 10-10
6. SC 10-9
7. CF 10-9
8. CF 10-9
9. SC 10-9
10. 10-10
11. SC 10-9
12. CF 10-9

115-115 DRAW

LSC by a round. What a fight!

Not as action packed as the first, but some great boxing on display.

Disappointed Framps lost, but we get to see these two excellent fighters go at it again.

Jack and Degale was a cracking fight and so was this. Not great results for our fighters, but a great start to the year.

I'm actually excited for Aj v Wlad now. You never know what can happen.

I'm also excited for AJ Wlad. Some would day mismatch but I actually think it's a great fight for both men at this stage in both their careers.

That was a damn close fight

Quality vs quantity

Have whoever you like again

I had Leo by 1 but wouldn't argue either way

Mikey looked amazing he is a great addition at light weight

In other news the vargas fight was even better foty contender for sure

Carl should win the decider if it was held in Belfast and I think he deserves home advantage if and when the fight happens

Both men a credit to the sport

It's a 50-50 fight when they do it again. Maybe lean slighty Lsc. There is not much between these guys. Different styles, but a similar level to each other.

I love watching them fight. If its in Belfast, I'll be trying for a ticket.

EX7EY wrote:I'm also excited for AJ Wlad. Some would day mismatch but I actually think it's a great fight for both men at this stage in both their careers.

What stage is 41 year old Wlad going to be at ??

While you watch Josh v Wlad...I'll watch Lewis v Golota..

Same fight for free.

.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

EX7EY wrote:I'm also excited for AJ Wlad. Some would day mismatch but I actually think it's a great fight for both men at this stage in both their careers.

What stage is 41 year old Wlad going to be at ??

While you watch Josh v Wlad...I'll watch Lewis v Golota..

Same fight for free.

.

That 41 year old Wlad is still levels above anybody Joshua has fought. Yes he has been inactive and was poor against fury but its still an interesting fight IMO

He should have been levels above Fury but crapped his load and threw 14 punches a round..

Joshua is more intimidating...100 percent ko ratio....and Wlad hasn't fought for 18 months by fight time.

Don't kid yourself...It's a slaughter.

What a night..... could have made a case for either but can't argue that LSC deserved the decision. Overall I just felt that he won his rounds cleaner than Frampton did and, for that reason alone, I thought LSC was the only fair winner. Roll on fight 3 !

Fight 3 may not happen just yet - Cruz has now stated Belfast wouldnt be convenient and that its now "up to his manager/promoter"

Amazing how he can lose the first and cry about the rematch - and when he wins - he turns and kind of dismisses it.

Surely he cant not fight Carl again?

Never likely to happen in Belast. I think Frampton will have to go to Vegas or the West Coast if he wants a third fight.

I wouldnt be surprised if they both went for an interim fight or two before a decider.

Surely depends on whether Santa Cruz can get over / under / through the wall on where the fight will take place.

Gutted for Frampton. Just didn't seem to be at the races like last time. Or maybe Santa Cruz was just that bit better this time (probably bit of both). Still, refreshing to hear his attitude to defeat. None of the usual training camp went wrong, im injured, the judges screwed me etc bull you usually get. Just a frank and honest assessment and agreeing the right man won.

If the third fight isn't next on the cards what do people think are the chances of Selby in July assuming Selby has a tune up late February/early March? Would Frampton risk 2 loses on the bounces? Would Selby still be interested or has the shine been taken off slightly? Might insist on Wales now where as before I think Frampton had the stronger negotiating position.

Fantastic fight between two excellent fighters. I could watch these two fight 100 times and still be in awe.

lfc91 wrote:Gutted for Frampton. Just didn't seem to be at the races like last time. Or maybe Santa Cruz was just that bit better this time (probably bit of both). Still, refreshing to hear his attitude to defeat. None of the usual training camp went wrong, im injured, the judges screwed me etc bull you usually get. Just a frank and honest assessment and agreeing the right man won.

If the third fight isn't next on the cards what do people think are the chances of Selby in July assuming Selby has a tune up late February/early March? Would Frampton risk 2 loses on the bounces? Would Selby still be interested or has the shine been taken off slightly? Might insist on Wales now where as before I think Frampton had the stronger negotiating position.

Selby v Frampo isn't really a big fight......l'll be surprised if they fight.....Selby just isn't marketable and he's in the who-needs-him-club....ABC belt or not..

Selby decision.

It's an Intruiging fight Frampton and selby

Selby will look and fancy that he can establish the Jab like LSC did that caused Frampton loads of trouble, and he'd back himself that he's a better natural boxer than Leo

But Frampton will see how much Montiel (who has similar dimensions) managed to get to Lee and Frampton is younger, stronger and better than Montiel

I'd back Frampton, feel he's stepped up as his competition has stepped up and Selby really hasn't been in a big fight yet

Any reason why the WBC diamond belt was awarded to the winner?

It will be a shame if LSC starts playing games over the decider. It's probably never going to be in Ireland but I hope he doesn't start dcking and dodging the rematch entirely. I feel now he has his title back he may make a hastey retreat.

I would have said both guys should have a keep busy fight next, let the interest in the third installment bubble a bit and then let us have it latr on in the year. Now im thinking Frampton should push for an immediate rematch and try and start negotiations immediately.

Great fight again. Really is a pick em for the third fight, they're very evenly matched so whoever is the better man on the night takes the W.

I personally wouldn't mind if they had a break from each other. Even though it's a guaranteed entertaining fight, I wouldn't like to see a boxer fight the same guy 3 times in a row.

Frampton Selby would be great, next.

I would favour Frampton over Selby. Selby is a style over substance kind of fighter for me. Relaxed, loose style, hands low, relies on a lot of upper body movement. I think he would find that hard to pull off over 12 rounds against a fighter like Frampton.

I think a trilogy with LCS is inneviteable at some point but both fighters might fancy taking a step back and cooling off for the time being. There is too much money in a decider for it not to happen I think. It just might not happen immediately. And its highly unlikely to happen in Ireland. Frampton might fancy a rebuilding fight in Belfast to re-group after a series of big fights on the road.

I got Santa Cruz up 2-0 already. No need for a rematch, but that was probably the plan right from day one.

I know many question comoubox accuracy, but apparently LSC landed 79 more.

Dylan1979 wrote:I got Santa Cruz up 2-0 already. No need for a rematch, but that was probably the plan right from day one.

It's all been a stitch up just to set up a trilogy? Fanciful thinking really.

Can they not fight someone else, then have the rubber match later in the year, or early next year??

Is Carl still in people's top ten or does he drop out of that list now?

Herman Jaeger wrote:Is Carl still in people's top ten or does he drop out of that list now?

Depends where Santa Cruz is ranked.....if I beat you fair and square...You aren't staying above me..

Beating Frampton doesn't get Santa Cruz in the top ten for me. Beat Selby and Russell on top then he might

Go on to beat Rigondeaux if the latter moves up and you can then maybe talk top five

But Santa's always going to struggle with slicksters is he not but then again he knows how to box smart when he needs to

Some people putting Frampton in their top five just for beating two divisional rivals. Plain wrong that

Carl Froch beat four or five divisional rivals on the spin never got anywhere near top five

Herman Jaeger wrote:Beating Frampton doesn't get Santa Cruz in the top ten for me. Beat Selby and Russell on top then he might

Go on to beat Rigondeaux if the latter moves up and you can then maybe talk top five

But Santa's always going to struggle with slicksters is he not but then again he knows how to box smart when he needs to

Some people putting Frampton in their top five just for beating two divisional rivals. Plain wrong that

Carl Froch beat four or five divisional rivals on the spin never got anywhere near top five

Depends on the quality of the Top 10 ??

In the early 80s......Pryor only sneaked in.......Sanchez, Hagler, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Holmes, Gomez, Spinks, Pintor etc.....

These days there is less strength in depth..

Fully agreed on that there's far less strength in depth these days

And you're absolutely right it does indeed very much depend on the quality of the division

But Santa Cruz had only beaten Mares so how come the Santa win for Frampton elevated Carl into the top 5 for some. I just can't see it. Neither of them are yet to face Selby or Russell

AdamT wrote:Can they not fight someone else, then have the rubber match later in the year, or early next year??

Why not go after Mares as I think Santa Cruz knows how to beat Carl now and the next fight will probably be a repeat of the same?  Russell might be a bit too clever for the Jackal so why not just go straight for Selby in an outdoor arena in the summer? Lose again to Santa and the Selby fight loses most of it's value

Why not have a nice easy defence like everybody else......

Joshua v Breazeale
Joshua v Molina....Get my drift ??

Don't see why Frampo, LSC, Ward types should have to do all the fighting..

Coz he said he wants nothing but big fights now I can dig out the interview for you two or three more years then get out

But it's nothing to do with me he must do what he thinks best for his career

For what it's worth I make Selby favourite to beat him

I see Santa Cruz has ruled out a trip to Belfast because his dad fears he will lose even if he wins thanks to the judges and fans.

Thoughts?

I think he is a joke. The end.

mobilemaster8 wrote:I see Santa Cruz has ruled out a trip to Belfast because his dad fears he will lose even if he wins thanks to the judges and fans.

Thoughts?

I think he is a joke. The end.

It was never going to happen, a fight in Belfast does not suit the American market

Lost all manner of respect for Santa Cruz; he can try and spin it whichever way he likes but the fact is Frampton travelled twice for the fight and truth be told after the first win he could have legally found a way out of the rematch...especially in this day and age...

Some will say more fool McGuigan and his team for not guaranteeing a rematch in Ireland in the contract which is true enough but Santa Cruz always gave the impression he is a fighting man and an honest man to boot..

If I was Carl...move onto Selby or Mares or Rigondeux (personally would look to Mares) look to freeze Santa Cruz out of the picture. If Carl can pick up another strap then Leo will soon come crawling because frankly it's only Carl and Mares who are big money fights for him... When Leo does come crawling back then stick two fingers up at him and take the Selby fight instead.

On the plus side should Leo not take the rematch then Carl stays 1-1 with one of his biggest divisional rivals and after coming off a loss actually comes out of it looking better..win win.

You have to say that McGuigan has dropped the ball here. Why on earth would LSC come over to Belfast? He was out of his element in New York and so Belfast would have his head up his backside.

I'm a huge fan of McGuigan but the decision to rematch LSC in Vegas (which is almost home turf for him) was a strange one. If you want the fight in Belfast, make it from a position of strength rather than relying on a handshake.

I think we'll see Selby or Mares next in Ireland this summer (probably the former bearing in mind Cyclone's connection with Sanigar.

I'm sure the rubber match will happen down the road - but don't ever imagine it will be Belfast.

The problem is its not all on McGuigan these days, they are signed up to Al Haymon sure so they have lost some say and control of things

I dont know if there is an element of kiddology going on but you would have to think that everyone concerned knew Belfast was not going to happen.

Financially would Frampton even want it in Belfast? They gambled on Vegas for the re-match because of the cash being stumped up. So they left lighter on titles but with heavier wallets. The McGuigans have always wanted to crack the States with Frampton.

Frampton has had a pretty intense schedule and might benefit from a Belfast fight against a lower profile opponent

catchweight wrote:I dont know if there is an element of kiddology going on but you would have to think that everyone concerned knew Belfast was not going to happen.

Financially would Frampton even want it in Belfast? They gambled on Vegas for the re-match because of the cash being stumped up. So they left lighter on titles but with heavier wallets. The McGuigans have always wanted to crack the States with Frampton.

Frampton has had a pretty intense schedule and might benefit from a Belfast fight against a lower profile opponent

Quigg remains the money fight for Frampton - as bizarre as that sounds. He probably made more in that fight that both Cruz fights combined.

Selby will knockout Frampton

Steffan wrote:Selby will knockout Frampton

Selby hits like a girl

Well the first Quigg fight with ppv Im sure was more lucrative than the Santa Cruz fights. Im not sure by how much. Frampton might have earned up to 3mil for that one. That was a highly anticipated ppv fight though. A rematch I think would fall well short of the initial fight as things stand now.

I read Frampton made 500k base purse for the 1st LSC fight plus whatever additional money boxnation stumped up to broadcast the rights. He got 1mil for the rematch plus whatever Sky bid. Not bad going.

I still think LSC trilogy would net him the most as things stand now. The appetite for a Quigg rematch would have to intensify to get the kind of ppv sales needed to top that as things are now I feel. Even notwithstanding the Brit market seem happy to buy any old sh1t thrown on ppv.

I dont think Matchroom did themselves any favours with the Frampton team in how they built up that fight though which might hinder a rematch. Frampton and Quigg are two nice lads. The anticipation was already there. They could have just let them box. But Hearn and Joe Gallagher had to turn it into another phoney grudge match.

I don't think McGuigan/Cyclone would touch Hearn/Gallagher with a bargepole unless they had to. I's a tricky one, though, as Frampton wants to make as much money as he can over the next few years (before he jacks in) and Quigg is still the money fight for him. Quigg would need a decent win before they could sell it - ideally, they'd get him in with LSC (beating Kiko more comprehensively than Frampton managed to was key to setting up the first fight).

Selby in Belfast (stadium fight) would be ideal. Mares would also sell over there.

I have no idea what they're aiming Quigg towards. He seems to have drifted (as all Hearn fighters tend to with the limited dates he has).

Josh Warrington is fighting Kiko in May. At this rate, even he'll steal a march on Quigg in terms of landing one of the top four (LSC, Frampton, Russell and Selby).

Why would frampton lower himself to face a nobody like Quigg again? Quigg brings nothing to the table. At 122lbs he pretended he was a champion(he wasn't he was just walking around with a watered down WBA belt). At featherweight he still offers nothing. No belt and frampton already outclassed him.

Quigg is still arguably Frampton's biggest payday (should he reestablish himself at feather). All of the grudge match nonsense sells well on Sky (look at Bellew vs Cleverly 2).