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Wales squad for Summer Tour

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aucklandlaurie
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international198
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Pete C (Kiwireddevil)
Gooseberry
Winzer
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RiscaGame
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Post by munkian Tue 09 May 2017, 12:26 pm

First topic message reminder :

Forwards: Scott Baldwin (Ospreys), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Adam Beard (Ospreys), Kristian Dacey (Cardiff Blues), Seb Davies (Cardiff Blues), Ryan Elias (Scarlets), Rob Evans (Scarlets), Tomas Francis (Exeter Chiefs), Ollie Griffiths (Newport Gwent Dragons), Cory Hill (Newport Gwent Dragons), Ellis Jenkins (Cardiff Blues), Wyn Jones (Scarlets), James King (Ospreys), Samson Lee (Scarlets), Josh Navidi (Cardiff Blues), Nicky Smith (Ospreys), Rory Thornton (Ospreys), Thomas Young (Wasps).

Backs:Cory Allen (Cardiff Blues), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues), Aled Davies (Scarlets), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Sam Davies (Ospreys), Steff Evans (Scarlets), Keelan Giles (Ospreys), Tyler Morgan (Newport Gwent Dragons), Jamie Roberts (captain, Harlequins), Owen Williams (Leicester Tigers), Rhun Williams (Cardiff Blues), Scott Williams (Scarlets), Tomos Williams (Cardiff Blues).
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Post by RiscaGame Thu 15 Jun 2017, 4:58 pm

Half six is going to be a right lick to wake up for. Hope they perform.

I'm pretty worried that although they're pointing out all these new caps, the system won't have changed at all.

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 15 Jun 2017, 11:07 pm

Now that you mention it, that is a worry. We simply don't have the personnel to play that way, we don't have the personnel to play that way with our first team. The days of Hibbard, Jones, Charteris and a youthful AWJ are over. It looks like the forward pack is selected for mobility and to play at pace, but the backs selection seems to indicate otherwise. I think Roberts is a good choice but he needs to come off and perhaps allow Owen Williams a run at 12. Full-back should have been a more attacking player like Patchell; Anscombe is only there to kick the ball - I think he would have been better selected at 10.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Fri 16 Jun 2017, 6:16 am

Someones going to be happy, Tonga have never beaten Wales and Wales have never won on Eden Park.

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 6:31 am

Weird that Wales have changed strip.

Wasn't the best of anthem attempts. Seemed like she was more interested in rolling her r's than worry about things like pitch and cadence Wink

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 6:50 am

I know it's the law, but in a day when certain things are being geared up for more tries that first Cuthbert try attempt is a bit of a harsh call. Arm in touch the same time as the ball grounding. Personally I'd favour the attacker there.

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 6:58 am

Nice try. Third time lucky.

Sam Davies having a mare goal kicking.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Fri 16 Jun 2017, 7:25 am

Wales the much more dominant team, this should really open up in the second half.

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Post by Gooseberry Fri 16 Jun 2017, 7:51 am

mikey_dragon wrote:Now that you mention it, that is a worry. We simply don't have the personnel to play that way, we don't have the personnel to play that way with our first team. The days of Hibbard, Jones, Charteris and a youthful AWJ are over. It looks like the forward pack is selected for mobility and to play at pace, but the backs selection seems to indicate otherwise. I think Roberts is a good choice but he needs to come off and perhaps allow Owen Williams a run at 12. Full-back should have been a more attacking player like Patchell; Anscombe is only there to kick the ball - I think he would have been better selected at 10.

Have a word with Gatland about the Lions while youre at it.


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Post by Taylorman Fri 16 Jun 2017, 7:56 am

RiscaGame wrote:I know it's the law, but in a day when certain things are being geared up for more tries that first Cuthbert try attempt is a bit of a harsh call. Arm in touch the same time as the ball grounding. Personally I'd favour the attacker there.

Yes I thought the ball actually touched the ground first from one view but the long range Cuthbert try was classy...nice.

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Post by LordDowlais Fri 16 Jun 2017, 8:02 am

Sam Davies cannot just make the step up to international level for my liking. He is a very good Pro12 regional player, he just struggles to make the step up.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Fri 16 Jun 2017, 8:43 am

LordDowlais wrote:Sam Davies cannot just make the step up to international level for my liking. He is a very good Pro12 regional player, he just struggles to make the step up.

Seemed like an assured performance from Wales, Sam is only 23 years old LD. His problem is Biggar being in front of him and he isn't getting as much test match experience. Scotland's talent pool was so unbelievably shallow we had to start playing Finn Russell at 21 years old, now after 3 seasons as being first choice he is a much more all rounded performer.

Much like Townsend he is mercurial and capable of the sublime and the suicidal within minutes of each other.

However Sam Davies is still relatively young and I feel he should be given time to make his mark at 10 for Wales.
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Post by LordDowlais Fri 16 Jun 2017, 8:51 am

Yes I agree, he does have time on his side, and he does have the talent. But for me he needs to take things onto the next level now. However, lets not forget, Dan Biggar was playing for Wales at 19 years of age, and he was showing a lot more composure and assurance than Sam is at the moment.

I am sure Sam Davies will get there, well at least I hope he will, he just needs to start taking things up a notch now, he needs to be looking at ousting Dan from the starting berth with team Wales, he is nowhere near that at the minute.

On the game itself, I do not think that the ref who did not have a clue what he was doing helped, and our kicking the ball away game plan played to Tonga's strengths.

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Post by LondonTiger Fri 16 Jun 2017, 9:50 am

How did Thomas Young go?

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Post by wayne Fri 16 Jun 2017, 10:38 am

LondonTiger wrote:How did Thomas Young go?

Tiger, thought he had a pretty good game, the Referee IMO was very pedantic at the breakdown, a number were penalised even though if they were the tackler and released and then went back in, or second in. His interpretation of the scrum wasn't his forte either, their tighthead, should have been penalised at practically every scrum.

Lord I might be biased but I thought Sam apart from his shots at goal (none of which were easy) controlled the game very well, brought runners on. The player that really disappointed me was Scott Williams he had a mare against Waikato last year and was no better this morning. How that F/B wasn't penalised for that no arm hit on Cory Allen was beyond belief. Considering the number that were missing for us I thought we played pretty well.

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Post by No9 Fri 16 Jun 2017, 10:40 am

78 mins in and the All Blacks are only leading Samoa 73 - 0.... On that note, gives a target for Wales against Samoa next week..

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Post by No9 Fri 16 Jun 2017, 10:41 am

Doh Managed to score another Try before I had time to submit my last post...

78-0 at 78mins and a few seconds..

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Post by No9 Fri 16 Jun 2017, 10:45 am

Erm and another on the whistle...

83 - 0... forward pass.. stays at 78-0...

Ok, reckon Wales will have that covered and beat Samoa by more ... Whistle


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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 10:47 am

Scott Williams was disappointing aye. I thought Davies did ok, goal kicking aside too Wayne. Anscombe was worse when he did certain things, like kicking for Cuthbert's second disallowed try when hands were on and a hospital pass at one point.

Was disappointed Ollie Griffiths only got two minutes. Firstly it's a cheap cap and secondly I wouldn't have said that Shingler or Navidi particularly did anything worth keeping them on. It showed when Jenkins came on that Wales actually got some go forward and I think somebody dynamic like Griffiths could've added something similar.

Personally though, I didn't have an issue with the hit on Allen.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Fri 16 Jun 2017, 11:10 am

Between minds on the hit on Allen, think it looked very bad in real time, but that was more to do with the force of the impact rather than the legality of it.

Shingler put in 14 tackles (joint top with Hill and Steff Evans), so I guess that is why he was kept on, and to ensure some experience in the line??

For me Roberts and Scott Williams just doesn't work that way around, maybe if they are wanted in the team together for some experience try them the other way around?

But truth be told unless something special happens over the next week we are going to be man shamed by Samoa.
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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 11:12 am

Just saw the tackles stat. It is pretty good to be fair. I think anybody could've coped defensively mind as Tonga didn't offer much.

Simon Thomas rated Anscombe an 8/10. I wouldn't say anybody was that, but that's crazy anyway. Cory Hill was the only other 8 he gave.

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Post by wayne Fri 16 Jun 2017, 12:31 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Just saw the tackles stat. It is pretty good to be fair. I think anybody could've coped defensively mind as Tonga didn't offer much.

Simon Thomas rated Anscombe an 8/10. I wouldn't say anybody was that, but that's crazy anyway. Cory Hill was the only other 8 he gave.

Rev, could you please put a link up to the stats, I'm crap at that sort of thing, I thought Hill was very good, and to the earlier poster I would also liked to see Griffiths on earlier, really rate that boy.

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Post by wayne Fri 16 Jun 2017, 12:35 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Between minds on the hit on Allen, think it looked very bad in real time, but that was more to do with the force of the impact rather than the legality of it.

Shingler put in 14 tackles (joint top with Hill and Steff Evans), so I guess that is why he was kept on, and to ensure some experience in the line??

For me Roberts and Scott Williams just doesn't work that way around, maybe if they are wanted in the team together for some experience try them the other way around?

But truth be told unless something special happens over the next week we are going to be man shamed by Samoa.

SS, had the sound muted (not through choice) so didn't hear the exchange between Ref and TMO, there was no arms used whatsoever, IMO it was worth at least a penalty.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Fri 16 Jun 2017, 3:01 pm

Wayne, there are a load that agree with you on that. Personally I think he was trying to make the tackle, hard with the right shoulder/arm and bringing the left arm around the back to make it legal. But Allen just bounced off too far/fast.
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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 16 Jun 2017, 3:46 pm

Yet again it was absolutely rubbish to put it mildly. Players starting who weren't in form continued in the same vein and were only subbed for more promising talent at 78 minutes, and some weren't even subbed at all. Cuthbert had two try-scoring opportunities and butchered both; no excuses for the first one as she should have done better. I'll have to disagree with some on Sam Davies; he can't kick at goal, can't tackle and can't run in a straight line - it's remarkable that pro players can't even do the basics! The 10 jersey should have went to Anscombe with Patchell at 15, Jenkins at 7, Giles on the wing, Williams (Tomos), Morgan on the bench and Owen Williams to actually get some game time next week are my changes. Also if we're serious about moving forward then underperforming players should be dropped so I would drop Scott Williams who was perhaps the most disappointing. I expect no changes to selection and tactics next week.

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 16 Jun 2017, 4:10 pm

wayne wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Just saw the tackles stat. It is pretty good to be fair. I think anybody could've coped defensively mind as Tonga didn't offer much.

Simon Thomas rated Anscombe an 8/10. I wouldn't say anybody was that, but that's crazy anyway. Cory Hill was the only other 8 he gave.

Rev, could you please put a link up to the stats, I'm crap at that sort of thing, I thought Hill was very good, and to the earlier poster I would also liked to see Griffiths on earlier, really rate that boy.

I only read about it on the Wail's player ratings.

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Post by international198 Sat 17 Jun 2017, 8:34 pm

I would start with Rhys Patchell (at 10), Wyn Jones and Ryan Elias against Samoa.

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 18 Jun 2017, 12:22 pm

The donkey is out, through injuring himself in failing to score that 2nd try on a plate:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/40318954

So, the team I would select, which I feel has a realistic chance of winning;

Patchell, Evans, Morgan, Roberts, Giles, Anscombe, Tomos Williams - Navidi, Jenkins, Shingler, Beard, Davies, Lewis, Elias, Smith.
Bench; Baldwin, Wyn Jones, A prop, Thornton, Griffiths, Davies, Owen Williams, Scott Williams.

Quite a rookie team but a lot of the guys are in good form, besides that who is even left?

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Mon 19 Jun 2017, 8:58 am

The Fail are going for

15. Gareth Anscombe (age 26, 10 caps) Missing : Leigh Halfpenny (Lions), Rhun Williams (injured), Phil Dollman (injured)
14. Cory Allen (age 24, caps 5) Missing : George North (Lions), Alex Cuthbert (injured)
13. Scott Williams (age 26, caps 47) Missing : Jonathan Davies (Lions)
12. Jamie Roberts (age 30, caps 92 & 3 for Lions)
11. Steff Evans (age 22, caps 1) Missing : Liam Williams (Lions), Hallam Amos (injured)
10. Sam Davies (age 23, caps 7) Missing : Dan Biggar (Lions)
9. Aled Davies (age 24, caps 1) Missing : Rhys Webb (Lions), Gareth Davies (Lions)

1. Nicky Smith (age 23, caps 13) Missing : Rob Evans (injured), Gethin Jenkins (injured)
2. Ryan Elias (age 22, caps 1) Missing : Ken Owens (Lions), Kristian Dacey (Lions)
3. Dillon Lewis (age 21, caps 1) Missing : Samson Lee (injured), Tomas Francis (Lions)
4. Seb Davies (age 21, caps 1) Missing : Jake Ball (injured), Bradley Davies (injured), Cory Hill (Lions)
5. Rory Thornton (age 22, caps 0) Missing : Alun Wyn Jones (Lions), Luke Charteris (injured)
6. Aaron Shingler (age 29, caps 9) Missing : Dan Lydiate (injured), James King (injured)
7. Ellis Jenkins (age 24, caps 4) Missing : Sam Warburton (Lions), Justin Tipuric (Lions)
8. Josh Navidi (age 26, caps 2) Missing : Taulupe Faletau (Lions), Ross Moriarty (Lions/injured)
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Post by wayne Mon 19 Jun 2017, 9:58 am

ScarletSpiderman wrote:The Fail are going for

15. Gareth Anscombe (age 26, 10 caps) Missing : Leigh Halfpenny (Lions), Rhun Williams (injured), Phil Dollman (injured)
14. Cory Allen (age 24, caps 5) Missing : George North (Lions), Alex Cuthbert (injured)
13. Scott Williams (age 26, caps 47) Missing : Jonathan Davies (Lions)
12. Jamie Roberts (age 30, caps 92 & 3 for Lions)
11. Steff Evans (age 22, caps 1) Missing : Liam Williams (Lions), Hallam Amos (injured)
10. Sam Davies (age 23, caps 7) Missing : Dan Biggar (Lions)
9. Aled Davies (age 24, caps 1) Missing : Rhys Webb (Lions), Gareth Davies (Lions)

1. Nicky Smith (age 23, caps 13) Missing : Rob Evans (injured), Gethin Jenkins (injured)
2. Ryan Elias (age 22, caps 1) Missing : Ken Owens (Lions), Kristian Dacey (Lions)
3. Dillon Lewis (age 21, caps 1) Missing : Samson Lee (injured), Tomas Francis (Lions)
4. Seb Davies (age 21, caps 1) Missing : Jake Ball (injured), Bradley Davies (injured), Cory Hill (Lions)
5. Rory Thornton (age 22, caps 0) Missing : Alun Wyn Jones (Lions), Luke Charteris (injured)
6. Aaron Shingler (age 29, caps 9) Missing : Dan Lydiate (injured), James King (injured)
7. Ellis Jenkins (age 24, caps 4) Missing : Sam Warburton (Lions), Justin Tipuric (Lions)
8. Josh Navidi (age 26, caps 2) Missing : Taulupe Faletau (Lions), Ross Moriarty (Lions/injured)

SS, considering there are definitely 5 starting changes who took to the field against Tonga not available for Samoa, it would surprise me if there were more than 1 unenforced change. Apparently Keelan Giles had a slight niggle, if he's over that could see him in instead of Allen, would have Adam Beard before Thornton, and I wouldn't drop Young for Jenkins, the others yes I agree with.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Mon 19 Jun 2017, 12:28 pm

Wayne, thats the fails side not mine.

Personally I think i would go for
Annscome, Allen/Giles, Sc Williams (c), O Williams, S Evans, Patchell, T Williams;
W Jones, Ellias, Lewis, Beard, Thornton, Shingler, Jenkins, Navidi
(Baldwin, Smith, Rh Jones, S Davies, Griffiths, Young; A Davies, Allen/Giles)
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Post by wayne Mon 19 Jun 2017, 3:43 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Wayne, thats the fails side not mine.

Personally I think i would go for
Annscome, Allen/Giles, Sc Williams (c), O Williams, S Evans, Patchell, T Williams;
W Jones, Ellias, Lewis, Beard, Thornton, Shingler, Jenkins, Navidi
(Baldwin, Smith, Rh Jones, S Davies, Griffiths, Young; A Davies, Allen/Giles)

SS, yes I knew it was the Fails reporter selection, I think we are coming from different angles in our selections, I'm coming from the angle of keeping the changes to a minimum from what McBride selected last week, if this was the first game, I would have been closer to you and Mikey's picks. Let me just say I totally disagree with 3 of your selections, Scott Williams would be the centre dropped after that performance against Tonga and Wyn Jones over Nicky Smith when his carrying was first class and the fact I highlighted the Tongan Tight head should have been penalised in practically every scrum for either buckling under pressure or turning in, and finally Patchell over Sam Davies? So Sam gets one chance and is then discarded, he has to be given a decent shot at the 10 jersey, basically I'm using the same logic over Seb Davies and Thomas Young

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Mon 19 Jun 2017, 8:53 pm

Dont think Young played well. Was 50-50 between moving Sam to fb and ditching Anscomme. Roberts and Williams were both poor, but if we want to try running Roberts is not the answer.

As for Wyn v Nicky, I'm one eyed lol
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Post by mikey_dragon Mon 19 Jun 2017, 9:59 pm

I think the form pick going into this game was Ancombe over Davies btw, and Davies disappointed when he started. I'm not sure if he's ever impressed in his limited opportunities, despite the Japan game. Patchell should be full-back, great attacking player from that position and good kicking out of hand. Owen Williams on the bench to at least come on at 12! McBryde won't do it though. The fail is probably spot on Sad.

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Post by wayne Tue 20 Jun 2017, 8:03 pm

So only 2 unenforced changes Tyler Morgan for Scott Williams and Ellis Jenkins for Thomas Young both of the drop outs onto the bench, agree with the former not the latter. Young IMO deserves another chance, also surprised Thornton edges out Adam Beard, Adam is more aggressive.  Disaster has struck with the player who cannot scrummage at Pro12 level on the bench, Surely we have somebody better than Rhodri Jones.

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Post by international198 Tue 20 Jun 2017, 8:12 pm

That's a good team, IMO. Samoa have just lost 78-0 against the All Blacks so they seem wounded and easy to prey on.

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Post by RiscaGame Tue 20 Jun 2017, 8:49 pm

Pretty disappointed for Ollie Griffiths, who deserves more than a brief two minute appearance and then bombed out of the squad all together.

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Post by mikey_dragon Tue 20 Jun 2017, 9:59 pm

Can't see is doing much with those halfbacks.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Wed 21 Jun 2017, 9:26 am

Wales team

Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues); Cory Allen (Ospreys), Tyler Morgan (Dragons), Jamie Roberts (Harlequins, capt), Steffan Evans (Scarlets); Sam Davies (Ospreys), Aled Davies (Scarlets); Nicky Smith (Ospreys), Ryan Elias (Scarlets), Dillon Lewis (Blues), Seb Davies (Blues), Rory Thornton (Ospreys), Aaron Shingler (Scarlets), Ellis Jenkins (Blues), Josh Navidi (Blues).

Replacements: Scott Baldwin (Ospreys), Wyn Jones (Scarlets), Rhodri Jones (Ospreys), Adam Beard (Ospreys), Thomas Young (Wasps), Tomos Williams (Blues), Owen Williams (Gloucester), Scott Williams (Scarlets).

Samoa team

D'Angelo Leuila; Alapati Leiua, Kieron Fonotia, Reynold Lee-Lo, David Lemi (capt); Tusi Pisi, Kahn Fotualii; Viliamu Afatia, Maatulimanu Leiataua, Paul Alo-Emile, Chris Vui, Faatiga Lemalu, Piula Faasalele, Galu Taufale, Fata Alafoti Faosiliva.

Replacements: Seilala Lam, Nephi Leatigaga, Bronson Fotualii-Tauakipulu, Faifili Levave, Vavae Tuilagi, Dwayne Polataivao, Henry Taefu, Tila Mealoi.


So Rey Lee-Lo and Fonotia in the centre then Laugh Laugh (yes I know they are not the Blues and Ospreys ones).
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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 21 Jun 2017, 9:45 am

ScarletSpiderman wrote:
So Rey Lee-Lo and Fonotia in the centre then Laugh Laugh (yes I know they are not the Blues and Ospreys ones).

I thought they were? I didn't even know Fonotia was Samoan.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:10 am

I might be wrong, I thought both were New Zealanders.
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Post by Fluxy Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:12 am

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kieron_Fonotia

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Post by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:12 am

ScarletSpiderman wrote:I might be wrong, I thought both were New Zealanders.

They were both holding out for a crack at the ABs but made themselves available for Samoa once they moved to the NH
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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:20 am

Must be another two schooled in NZ then, with Samoan grandparents... The poaching goes both ways Wink. That's a good backline Samoa have put out, be even worse for us if Nanai-Williams was playing. Not sure why he made himself unavailable.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:45 am

Well that made my observational skills look pretty damn poor. It is Rey Lee-lo and Fonotia after all then. In which case I think Wales can expect both their centres to be made to look like Grade-A clowns by those two.
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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 21 Jun 2017, 10:48 am

We're going to really have to take it to them up front, look to attack in the corners. They're probably going to run it from everywhere, just wonder if our coaches have the team ready to counter that.

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 23 Jun 2017, 7:48 am

The backs look pathetic - Anscombe didn't wanna know.

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 23 Jun 2017, 8:03 am

Another atrocious SH ref. Some of our youngsters look clueless in spite of him though.

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Post by TightHEAD Fri 23 Jun 2017, 9:16 am

Oh this isn't going well. No shame in losing to a team that got smashed 78-0 by NZ. Wink
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Post by TightHEAD Fri 23 Jun 2017, 9:19 am

That's better.
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Post by TightHEAD Fri 23 Jun 2017, 9:26 am

Grandstand finish.
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