UK General Election 2017 Thread

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:03 am

First topic message reminder :

CONTINUE

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 7:59 pm

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/39829723

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:02 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Alternatively the uneducated seem to vote for Labour based on a Robin Hood manifesto.

There's that love for teachers, nurses, doctors and the police again!

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:05 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:Alternatively the uneducated seem to vote for Labour based on a Robin Hood manifesto.

There's that love for teachers, nurses, doctors and the police again!

Get over it Dolph.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:06 pm

It was tongue in cheek, but good response

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Post by jbeadlesbigrighthand on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:12 pm

Hammersmith Harrier. The same article you quote also says

"But according to ONS data, the less well-off (the poorest fifth) pay a higher slice of their total income (38%) in tax than the most wealthy (top fifth of earners) in Britain."

Surely that supports Trussman's point?

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 8:16 pm

Not really no when they're the ones contributing the bulk of it,.

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Post by JDizzle on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 9:13 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Alternatively the uneducated seem to vote for Labour based on a Robin Hood manifesto.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/professor-stephen-hawking-backs-labour-10564867.amp

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 9:33 pm

May is in Bradford South a place where there is a huge majority for Labour..

Corbyn is in Gateshead a place where there is a huge majority for Labour..

Going to be an absolute bloodbath for Labour on Thursday.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 10:03 pm

Pr4wn wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
Pr4wn wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:So a guy leaves a note as a joke and that's it.

Black Wednesday anyone ??
Headscratch

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Global crash - f*** Labour. Why didn't they tell the Americans too. They must have known it was happening. Snide red b*stards
picard You're better than that. I didn't say it was Labour did I? What I implied was they oversaw the economy for ~12 years, p!ssed away money (like I have no doubt any other party would have done) and didn't take any notice of what I'm sure were enough warnings about property bubbles etc. What I was implying is that the sort of thing Pr4wn's banging on about is not entirely down to the Tories. Still, easier to reduce it to Labour = good; Tories = evil I guess.

I'm not sure what your point is, here. The global economy crashed, nobody saw it coming (but apparently Labour should have seen it coming?), some former minster wrote a note as a joke, then the Tories demolished the disable benefits system but it's not their fault?

Looks like, in accusing me of trying to use a bogeyman, you're trying to find anyone but the Tories to blame. Even going as far as ridiculous dredging up Labour from 2008.
Sorry, did you say something?

Thought so OK clap
Sorry, I missed it. Thought it might have been important, but guess not. Let's end this now OK? We're not setting a good example kiss .
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Post by navyblueshorts on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 10:06 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
Dolphin Ziggler wrote:The police? Not happy with the Conservatives. Doctors and nurses - not happy with the conservatives. Teachers? Three strikes.

That should be a big deal. The muddied waters of a Brexit election and national security issues has detracted from it. A cynic would see a link.
Ha. Groups 2 and 3 have never been happy with the Tories and Group 1 often aren't.

Particularly unhappy though. It is notable what is happening in schools, really is. And I'm not sure there's ever been such an angry outburst from the NHS during an election campaign.

Moreover, isn't it worth noting? I see people laugh at the idealism of leftie luvvies, but nothing fuels the ire of people more than "your concerns? They aren't concerns, dear"
Maybe so, and I do note it. FWIW, I won't be voting Tory (raspberry to you Pr4wn!), but I would like Labour to put an honest cost on all their promises, as I would any other shower that we have to consider. If that's out there and people go for it, so be it. It isn't out there though...
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Post by Pr4wn on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 10:11 pm

Who will you be voting for, Navy?

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 10:13 pm

I presume people are still somewhat bothered by that question, although I'm not sure if that's one of those antiquated British things where it is deemed impolite to ask.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 11:33 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:May is in Bradford South a place where there is a huge majority for Labour..

Corbyn is in Gateshead a place where there is a huge majority for Labour..

Going to be an absolute bloodbath for Labour on Thursday.

He has a very vocal minority backing him.

I live in the middle of Kent and can safely say he has as much support here as Theresa May does in Sunderland. He's probably making the Labour heartland more resolute but making no inroads into seats they don't already hold.

It's perception though he's going for, big crowds in Sunderland give off an impression of making a difference but it ignores that it's a 55% Labour constituency.

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Post by GSC on Mon 05 Jun 2017, 11:43 pm

He's probably not.

Labour MPs think he's toxic and try to cut him out of their local campaigns. He's picking up youth support but my guess is pretty sparsely spread.
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 8:48 am

Survation and Yougov have hung parliaments.

ICM and others have landslides..

Egg on some faces very soon.

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Post by Scottrf on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 8:57 am

My election signage polling has Labour picking up about 95% of the vote and Lib Deb with 5%. Conservative held seat.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 9:02 am

Courtesy of Diane Abbott's personal polls
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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 9:07 am

Speaking of Abbott, someone at Labour HQ has woken up and pulled her from a radio debate with Rudd this am (or taken ill for the non conspiracy theorists among us)
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 9:11 am

Good move she has been awful.

Labour insiders saying safe seats in Manchester may be in play.

The election basically is down to the kids...If a lot turn out it becomes interesting. .If they don't it is a hammering.

Wouldn't want to be reliant on the most unreliable group..Would you ??

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 9:14 am

It's an exciting way to live Truss if nothing else.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 10:16 am

Pr4wn wrote:Who will you be voting for, Navy?
TBH, I don't know yet. I like some of what Corbyn says (philosophically anyway), but I don't like the fact there's a financial black hole and some of the proposed ways to rake in cash are naive in the extreme. Probably go for LibDem in all honesty, but may just close eyes and stick a cross anywhere tomorrow. Our Tory candidate is Anna Soubry - won't get my vote I don't think, but I get the impression she's actually not all that bad.
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 10:30 am

You don't trust Labour or Tories...So you're voting for the party that got wiped out because it was found to be the most dishonest out of all of them.


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Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 11:34 am

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You don't trust Labour or Tories...So you're voting  for the party that got wiped out because it was found to be the most dishonest out of all of them.

picard They're not the most dishonest of any of them, but if that helps you in some way, fire away. I'll vote for who the Hell I like; or not at all. Quite frankly, they're pretty much all a shower of s**t.

I didn't say I distrust the Tories and I didn't specifically say the same about Labour either. I don't like many Tory policies; not a lot to do with trust, although I don't believe them much either. I think I do trust this version of Labour to try to do what they're claiming (at least, I'd give them a chance as they're not the snake oil-selling late Blairite version) and quite a bit of what they say resonates with my own feelings, but I don't like the lack of honest costing and I seriously doubt they'll actually be able to do very much of it.
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Post by jbeadlesbigrighthand on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 11:46 am

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Good move she has been awful.

Labour insiders saying safe seats in Manchester may be in play.

The election basically is down to the kids...If a lot turn out it becomes interesting. .If they don't it is a hammering.

Wouldn't want to be reliant on the most unreliable group..Would you ??

Apparently there's heavy showers predicted for Thursday. That's generally not good for the youth vote. I've always felt that it was likely there would be a strong Conservative majority, and I'm getting firmer in that belief, regardless of Corbyn's recent strong showing.

On a side note, Labour seem to finally have managed to get someone to dress Corbyn properly. It's so superficial, but if he'd looked more like a leader from the outset, I wonder whether perceptions might have been marginally better.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 11:57 am

No evidence that the weather affects elections..- Mike Smithson (Political betting)

A week ago.....Labour vote share odds.

30-35%- 7/5...
35-40% - 2/1..

Latest...

30-35% - 2/1
35-40%- 11/8..

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:03 pm

jbeadlesbigrighthand wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Good move she has been awful.

Labour insiders saying safe seats in Manchester may be in play.

The election basically is down to the kids...If a lot turn out it becomes interesting. .If they don't it is a hammering.

Wouldn't want to be reliant on the most unreliable group..Would you ??

Apparently there's heavy showers predicted for Thursday. That's generally not good for the youth vote. I've always felt that it was likely there would be a strong Conservative majority, and I'm getting firmer in that belief, regardless of Corbyn's recent strong showing.

On a side note, Labour seem to finally have managed to get someone to dress Corbyn properly. It's so superficial, but if he'd looked more like a leader from the outset, I wonder whether perceptions might have been marginally better.

Not something we are ever going to know JB....Big question is does he stay on. ??..No one is going to beat him if he is on the leadership ballot.

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Post by Pal Joey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:10 pm

jbeadlesbigrighthand wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Good move she has been awful.

Labour insiders saying safe seats in Manchester may be in play.

The election basically is down to the kids...If a lot turn out it becomes interesting. .If they don't it is a hammering.

Wouldn't want to be reliant on the most unreliable group..Would you ??

Apparently there's heavy showers predicted for Thursday. That's generally not good for the youth vote. I've always felt that it was likely there would be a strong Conservative majority, and I'm getting firmer in that belief, regardless of Corbyn's recent strong showing.

On a side note, Labour seem to finally have managed to get someone to dress Corbyn properly. It's so superficial, but if he'd looked more like a leader from the outset, I wonder whether perceptions might have been marginally better.

Now all he needs is a damn good shave. That 'beard' looks a bit sick to me. Imagine how unkempt his desk and computer files must be! His image just doesn't stack up properly.

I thought at least Theresa May looked smart yet sombre during the difficult task of speaking outside No. 10. I know some think it was masked as political point scoring... but I thought she came across as more of a leader than JC.

If I was a voter, think I'd give 'Lady Jane Grey' more time to see it through these very difficult times. It's certainly not easy to please everyone's sensitivities 100% in this day and age. There seems to be an abundance of anger, hate, spite, vitriol... nastiness. Need to calm down and act human.

Oddly enough, we have a very similar split on very similar issues (apart from Brexit of course) here in Oz. Health, higher ed, security, housing affordability, a more reasonable cost of living, cleaner environment. A perfect mirror on a different scale. The same relentless extremes too... no quarter asked nor given on/from both sides of the political divide. People are begging for sensible bi-partisan policy decisions (not more ideological dogma) in the most cost effective way and benefiting those who most need it.

I'm sure most of us do agree on what needs to be done or what is important right now... it's just the ways and means of getting there seems to distract us from making significant improvements... or even small steps towards a better and fairer deal for most of us.
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:32 pm

I'm not sure I'd even compare our lot to the mess Australia has been the past few years. Hectic is a good word

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:43 pm

They got rid of Abbott so it must be improving.

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Post by Pal Joey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:44 pm

Not really hectic. Just 3 internal challenges within the 2 major parties in a relatively short space of time. We are more used to the opposite in fact. Only 6 changes of Government in 61 years since 1949.

The 26 years of continuous economic growth is pretty much unparalleled and even more remarkable considering the 2010-2015 period of internal back-stabbing amongst both parties.
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:47 pm

The Abbott run and the leader changes in power have been hectic, whilst I know there has been despair in the country about equality. It's been a messy affair at the top is all I'm saying.

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Post by Pal Joey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:47 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:They got rid of Abbott so it must be improving.

He committed political hari-kiri.

Now my old mate Malcolm runs the show. And Lucy runs him. Laugh
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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:50 pm

Must be a thing about Abbott's in politics
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Post by Pal Joey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 12:57 pm

Yeah... Abbott's and Bishop's and types of fish.
Rudd, Sturgeon, Salmon(d). Heck, we even had a Fisher as PM.


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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:19 pm

Abbott pulled again for Thornbury. Wonder if they'll get formally swapped
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:27 pm

Apparently according to the F/T backbenchers are going to launch a leadership assault on Corbyn on Friday.

Not sure unless they keep him off the ballot how they win.

Thornberry is Corbyn's heir apparent...She is a character...I will give her that.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:31 pm

Seems destined for a split to me.

Corbyns leadership more about establishing his ideals in Labour.

Labour MPs more interested in winning elections.

Why I suspect he won't voluntarily go even if he gets demolished
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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:35 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Apparently according to the F/T backbenchers are going to launch a leadership assault on Corbyn on Friday.

Not sure unless they keep him off the ballot how they win.

Thornberry is Corbyn's heir apparent...She is a character...I will give her that.

I think that would be very ill-timed. Corbyn's popularity is probably at it's peak right now and a coup wouldn't exactly make those supporters be very supportive of those backbenchers which orchestrated it. Not to mention they would then likely have a lurch towards the centre which right now isn't a very popular space to be in amongst the populace it seems. 

I just feel pretty depressed about the whole thing to be honest. If I was any good at learning another language and I didn't do a degree which limits my opportunities in other countries I'm pretty certain I'd be considering moving abroad right now. I am completely disconnected from the majority who support Brexit and Conservatives and even a lot of Labour are just power hungry rather than principled unfortunately.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:37 pm

Corbyn had 24 percent at his lowest ebb...If the Libs don't join this new party what is the point..

Kendall got 4 percent against Corbyn. ....Mps are not suicidal.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:43 pm

Theyve tried to chuck him, tried to wait for him to hang himself, what's left? Libs may well embrace it at this point, Brexit hasn't stuck, what else do they have?

Diane Abbott on sky news last night really is worth a watch for pure cringiness. Meanwhile Andrew Mitchell doesn't even know the minimum wage. Who vets these people's media appearances.
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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:44 pm

Gamble will be how much of those 24% were behind Corbyn or the Labour name. Also how well they can brand their new party as "New Labour" (giggle)
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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:45 pm

Also Boris was wheeled out for the first and last time today.

He might be quietly retired from cabinet of May retains a majority.
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Post by Pr4wn on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:48 pm

Now there's a man that's a true embarrassment.

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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:51 pm

I was watching old interviews with Tony Blair recently and think it's crazy just how posh he comes across. Do people think Blair would still be elected today? I feel like Cameron even as a Conservative leader made a really conscious effort to come across as less posh.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 2:54 pm

Compared to May or Corbyn.

It'd be a massacre especially if Blair has some of his old team
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 3:03 pm

1997 Blair wins a landslide...

2017 anything for a few bucks Blair loses like Corbyn.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 3:04 pm

Pr4wn wrote:Now there's a man that's a true embarrassment.

What an embarrassment being Mayor of London for 8 years.

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Post by Galted on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 3:08 pm

GSC wrote:Also Boris was wheeled out for the first and last time today.

He might be quietly retired from cabinet of May retains a majority.

Was pretty funny how he was bleating about the possibility of the loony left being in charge of Brexit, seemingly forgetting the loony planless f*ckwits who helped bring Brexit on us in the first place.
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Post by Samo on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 3:09 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:
Pr4wn wrote:Now there's a man that's a true embarrassment.

What an embarrassment being Mayor of London for 8 years.

Doesnt stop him being any less of an embarrassment.

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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 Jun 2017, 3:09 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:
Pr4wn wrote:Now there's a man that's a true embarrassment.

What an embarrassment being Mayor of London for 8 years.

He's basically Mr Bean, except underneath his stupid, bumbling persona is a nasty liar. Nobody should respect him as a serious politician.

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