Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

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Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Griff on Tue 20 Jun 2017, 12:25 pm

First topic message reminder :

Too early?!  Never mind.

So, big changes are afoot at Dave Parade.  There's been loads of arguments about the best way forward, the pros and cons of regional v club rugby, and I'm sure there'll be many more to come.  But what's done is done and, for now, we have a pro team at Dave Parade to support next year.  A few weeks ago even that was in jeopardy.  So moving forward...

Ownership:
So the WRU has taken over the reigns.  I'll add updates here as and when we know them, but the formal split from Newport RFC should mean 'cleaner' or more straightforward to understand revenue streams.  

Pitch:
A new one is being laid as we speak.  This original pitch has been part and parcel of the problems at RP for a number of years.  A BBC report showed it to be up there as the most used pitch pro pitch in the UK.  Something had to be done.  A fully synthetic pitch was mooted and preferred by some, a al Blues, Saracens, Glasgow, et al.  However, FA rules state that football clubs cannot play on these surfaces (probably since the AstroTurf days of Luton Town, etc.).  So it looks like a compromise has been agreed with a 4g semi-synthetic pitch, like those used by many football clubs, Swansea City/Ospreys, Millennium Stadium, Aviva Stadium, Twickenham, Murrayfield, Cardiff City stadium, etc.  A weave of synthetic fibres and real grass meaning it's easier to maintain, less prone to weather damage, but still sort of like the real thing.  This will be a real move forward and should improve the product on the field.  A bit.

Personnel:
New coach - Huw Jackman.  Comes with a good reputation for hard work and attacking rugby.  Good stuff.
Gavin Henson - I'm happy with this.  Despite his knockers, so to speak, he is still a classy club player and performed well in the English Prem with Bristol, when not injured.  Which is the crux of the issue.  Hopefully we can keep him fit for an extended run of games.
Zane Kirchner - On paper a quality player but as with a lot of good players, when they are in the twighlight of their careers and join a 'lesser' club more often than not they do not perform as expected.  Let's hope he is an exception to the rule.  Did Jackman and Kirchner play together at Leinster?


Transfers In:

Bernard 'No Pudding' Jackman - coach
Gavin Henson
Zane Kirchner

Transfers Out:
Shaun Knight
Nick Crosswell
Tom Prydie
Geraint Rhys Jones
Darren Harris
Craig Mitchell


New Badge:



Last edited by Griff on Fri 01 Sep 2017, 2:19 pm; edited 4 times in total

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 07 Sep 2017, 4:09 pm

BamBam wrote:Forwards that pass and step?! Blasphemy

Scarlets are the best at doing that at the mo.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Thu 07 Sep 2017, 9:44 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

Perhaps in the context of trying to implement a more expansive game plan, it's not a crush he just wanted to include one of our few forwards that can pass and step?

You can't play expansivley when you get duffed up front. I remember you having a crush on Benjamin now as well actually.

You'd have to be monumentally stupid not to realise we get duffed up front, regardless of who is playing. Being as you also seem to think picking a team is about throwing your best 15 players onto the pitch without any semblance of a game plan, why don't you just change your name to Kingsley and have done with it?
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 9:03 am

Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Looks like some of my proposed changes have come in. Are all of our other 7s injured or does Jackman have a crush on Benjamin?

Perhaps in the context of trying to implement a more expansive game plan, it's not a crush he just wanted to include one of our few forwards that can pass and step?

You can't play expansivley when you get duffed up front. I remember you having a crush on Benjamin now as well actually.

You'd have to be monumentally stupid not to realise we get duffed up front, regardless of who is playing. Being as you also seem to think picking a team is about throwing your best 15 players onto the pitch without any semblance of a game plan, why don't you just change your name to Kingsley and have done with it?

So in other words you're monumentally stupid because you think a flanker who can't cut it at this level will make a difference to our duffed up pack? That's incredible. I haven't seen much passing and stepping from Benjamin, I have seen it and much more from Griffiths. And from Cudd. Yes we should be picking our best team, I don't see why we wouldn't for this fixture? It was actually Kingsley who would never pick our best team so I'm not sure how you're drawing comparison?

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 9:54 am

You're as dumb as Dowlais sometimes Mikey. And just as histrionic. You don't seen things because you don't look, you have your fan boy favourites and everyone else is rubbish, as is demonstrated by the fact you didn't even know who Steve Jones was. Nobody is saying other than Griffiths is head and shoulders our best forward. I'm starting to doubt if you can even read, and if you think Cudd (who is out for the season anyways) is a better option than Benjamin in a team who can only attempt to score more tries than the oppo because they will never win a wrestling match, then you carry on pal. Personally, I don't think we have even 15 players who can be relied on to execute either style consistently and at the level required, so you knock yourself out.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by LordDowlais on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 10:27 am

Stone Motif wrote:You're as dumb as Dowlais

This is why myself, and many other are staying away from this forum.

You are just a keyboard warrior when things are peeled back.

Take some advice. Grow up. Debate properly, without the insults, and once in a while show some humility. You do not know everything.

You must be a hoot to live with. Rolling Eyes

I can honestly say, that if you behave like you do on here in life, then you are the last person I would ever like to meet anywhere.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 10:27 am

Stone Motif wrote:You're as dumb as Dowlais sometimes Mikey. And just as histrionic. You don't seen things because you don't look, you have your fan boy favourites and everyone else is rubbish, as is demonstrated by the fact you didn't even know who Steve Jones was. Nobody is saying other than Griffiths is head and shoulders our best forward. I'm starting to doubt if you can even read, and if you think Cudd (who is out for the season anyways) is a better option than Benjamin in a team who can only attempt to score more tries than the oppo because they will never win a wrestling match, then you carry on pal. Personally, I don't think we have even 15 players who can be relied on to execute either style consistently and at the level required, so you knock yourself out.

Why the f'/k would you mention players skills as part of your argument in the first place when you don't even think we have 15 players who can execute them effectively? Buffoon. The only thing I've pointed out is that we have too many players not capable of coping with this level; Benjamin, AOB and Knoyle for instance. Yep Cudd is far better than Benjamin.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 12:38 pm

I might not think we have fifteen who can execute a high tempo game plan, but we do have some who can, of which Benjamin is clearly one. Go on then, list the ways Nic Cuddle offers more in attack than Benjamin. Or just admit you're as thick as mince and don't really get rugby, which would be a lot easier for you and save you a fair bit of wasted typing.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by munkian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 2:34 pm

David Buttress is the new chairman of the Dragons
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 2:55 pm

“I won’t gloss over things, that’s not my style as an entrepreneur. It’s important to face challenges, talk about them and then agree what we are going to do about it.

“I have one thing underpinning it – I want the Dragons to be the best they can be, that’s it.”

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/dragons/15522668.Former_Just_Eat_boss_appointed_Dragons_chairman/

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by munkian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 3:27 pm

This could be fantastic news for the Dragons and really help professional rugby in Wales. Unless the WRU feic it up...damn
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 3:34 pm

There was / is a theory that the WRU want the Dragons to fail, so that they can sell the ground and make RGC the fourth region. If that's true, then appointing as chairman someone who's been very successful in business is quite an odd way of going about it.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by munkian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 3:56 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:There was / is a theory that the WRU want the Dragons to fail, so that they can sell the ground and make RGC the fourth region. If that's true, then appointing as chairman someone who's been very successful in business is quite an odd way of going about it.

If this theory was a colour would it be Cambridge blue ?
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 4:00 pm

I couldn't possibly comment....

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 6:04 pm

Stone Motif wrote:I might not think we have fifteen who can execute a high tempo game plan, but we do have some who can, of which Benjamin is clearly one. Go on then, list the ways Nic Cuddle offers more in attack than Benjamin. Or just admit you're as thick as mince and don't really get rugby, which would be a lot easier for you and save you a fair bit of wasted typing.

I just don't think Benjamin's capable of that, he just gets smashed. Cudd is better at tackling, defence, and makes a lot of metres in attack - at least he did the one season but he's on the wane now and Griffiths is the future. JB might fit into the Scarlets team better than ours for sure, but he's not better than Cubby either.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 6:07 pm

munkian wrote:This could be fantastic news for the Dragons and really help professional rugby in Wales. Unless the WRU feic it up...damn

If the WRU or someone else ain't giving us more money to entice Wales internationals to our team then it's void. Moriarty and Faletau are just two that are expected to return.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 6:26 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:“I won’t gloss over things, that’s not my style as an entrepreneur. It’s important to face challenges, talk about them and then agree what we are going to do about it.

“I have one thing underpinning it – I want the Dragons to be the best they can be, that’s it.”

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/dragons/15522668.Former_Just_Eat_boss_appointed_Dragons_chairman/

This is an excellent appointment. Unless the leadership is sorted then anything else is window dressing. First time we've had a capable chair in nearly two decades. I fully expect Pinkie to be next out the door.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Fri 08 Sep 2017, 6:31 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:I might not think we have fifteen who can execute a high tempo game plan, but we do have some who can, of which Benjamin is clearly one. Go on then, list the ways Nic Cuddle offers more in attack than Benjamin. Or just admit you're as thick as mince and don't really get rugby, which would be a lot easier for you and save you a fair bit of wasted typing.

I just don't think Benjamin's capable of that, he just gets smashed. Cudd is better at tackling, defence, and makes a lot of metres in attack - at least he did the one season but he's on the wane now and Griffiths is the future. JB might fit into the Scarlets team better than ours for sure, but he's not better than Cubby either.

But - whether we can do it or not - the coaches stated aim is to get us playing like the Scarlets, who will only ever come off second best in a dog fight themselves. Don't agree JB gets smashed at all, he's lightweight sure but I will happily be proved wrong if you can list occasions. Cudd is a better link man than he is given credit for but I struggle to think of a forward with better acceleration and skills in our roster other than Ollie , but the fact he's our best player doesn't mean you only need one seven in the pack, not does it mean Griffiths won't end up covering eight again at some point this season. Once came to mind last Sat but Leinster chewed our pack up and spat them out collectively. Hardly a bench mark.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Cardiff Dave on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 11:15 am

Interesting...

"Buttress, who is currently a member of joint venture capital firm 83North, has invested financially in the Dragons........"

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 3:33 pm

They'll need to invest at least £10M to make a difference! Checking the stats it just confirms what I thought, that Thomas and Benjamin have been especially disappointing in the first two weeks, Keddie made more meters than both combined and beat the No7's tackle count.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 6:12 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:They'll need to invest at least £10M to make a difference! Checking the stats it just confirms what I thought, that Thomas and Benjamin have been especially disappointing in the first two weeks, Keddie made more meters than both combined and beat the No7's tackle count.

You don't understand modern rugby at all.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 7:15 pm

Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:They'll need to invest at least £10M to make a difference! Checking the stats it just confirms what I thought, that Thomas and Benjamin have been especially disappointing in the first two weeks, Keddie made more meters than both combined and beat the No7's tackle count.

You don't understand modern rugby at all.

Why because I point out the stats that back up my argument?

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 8:28 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:They'll need to invest at least £10M to make a difference! Checking the stats it just confirms what I thought, that Thomas and Benjamin have been especially disappointing in the first two weeks, Keddie made more meters than both combined and beat the No7's tackle count.

You don't understand modern rugby at all.

Why because I point out the stats that back up my argument?

What stats? Post them. Although I'm fairly certain it will just prove that picture of a dingbat jumping up and down like a chimp that's just learned how to touch itself, shouting 'I was right! I was right', in the section of my undergraduate stats text book on confirmation bias was you all along.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 9:02 pm

Go to ESPN scrum, fixtures and results, select the match and click the player name. No surprise to see your 'argument' is still null and void. What type of special 7 is he again?

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 10:12 pm

Just had a look. Laugh

So in a game where we won 11 out of 12 of our own scrums, you think the fact that the no8 ran a whopping 13m more than the openside flanker, an indictment of the no7s play. JB made around 1.8m per carry and HK 2.1m per carry. You must take a lot of issue with that half a yard. I note than despite all these extra carries Keddie didn't make one clean break or beat a single defender.

I could mention confirmation bias again, but you wouldn't get that any more than you get what's happening on the rugby field. The failure is in the tight five.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 10:27 pm

And then we have the defensive analysis, where in the Edinburgh game both players completed the same amount of tackles, one getting turned over once (or as you like to call it, 'smashed' probably), and the other missing one tackle. I'd say that was a fairly even scorecard. But then I'm not stuck in the last decade's narrative that the no7 is there to tackle and jackal.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sat 09 Sep 2017, 10:40 pm

Did you want to look at the Leinster game stats, where JB and HK ran 14 and 16 metres respectively, and JB made three more tackles than Keddie? Disappointing stuff from the openside when held up against the barnstorming stuff from the no8.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 9:34 am

Stone Motif wrote:Just had a look. Laugh

So in a game where we won 11 out of 12 of our own scrums, you think the fact that the no8 ran a whopping 13m more than the openside flanker, an indictment of the no7s play. JB made around 1.8m per carry and HK 2.1m per carry. You must take a lot of issue with that half a yard.  I note than despite all these extra carries Keddie didn't make one clean break or beat a single defender.

I could mention confirmation bias again, but you wouldn't get that any more than you get what's happening on the rugby field.  The failure is in the tight five.

And No6s play, which I've alluded to already. I've said all along the problem is up front, that includes the tight 5. So not sure who or what you're arguing exactly? I've said for years that Benjamin can't cope at this level and yet again I'm proved correct. Slagging off Keddie doesn't make JB any better, so this crush needs to end now.

I'm not of the narrative that the No7 is there to tackle and jackal, where have I said this??? Although that's how some teams play, for example how Scarlets use James Davies - works very well for them, but you can't tell me I haven't been of the opinion for over 12 months that for this reason he wouldn't fit into the Wales team? I prefer a No7 who can do that and more. It's why Tipuric was the best 7 in Wales last year as he added more to his game. It's why I see Griffiths as superior to Davies. A bit off topic but it's exactly how Shingler plays now, he needs to be starting at 6 for Wales.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 10:04 am

mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:Just had a look. Laugh

So in a game where we won 11 out of 12 of our own scrums, you think the fact that the no8 ran a whopping 13m more than the openside flanker, an indictment of the no7s play. JB made around 1.8m per carry and HK 2.1m per carry. You must take a lot of issue with that half a yard.  I note than despite all these extra carries Keddie didn't make one clean break or beat a single defender.

I could mention confirmation bias again, but you wouldn't get that any more than you get what's happening on the rugby field.  The failure is in the tight five.

And No6s play, which I've alluded to already. I've said all along the problem is up front, that includes the tight 5. So not sure who or what you're arguing exactly? I've said for years that Benjamin can't cope at this level and yet again I'm proved correct. Slagging off Keddie doesn't make JB any better, so this crush needs to end now.

I'm not of the narrative that the No7 is there to tackle and jackal, where have I said this??? Although that's how some teams play, for example how Scarlets use James Davies - works very well for them, but you can't tell me I haven't been of the opinion for over 12 months that for this reason he wouldn't fit into the Wales team? I prefer a No7 who can do that and more. It's why Tipuric was the best 7 in Wales last year as he added more to his game. It's why I see Griffiths as superior to Davies. A bit off topic but it's exactly how Shingler plays now, he needs to be starting at 6 for Wales.

Give it up Mikey, you're out of your depth. Contradicting yourself now and clutching at straws like Dowlais writing an article for the Fail.

How have you proved Benjamin can't cut it at this level? Which stat proves this?

You said he's been disappointing and argued for Cudd (injured) to come back in as he's defensively better, noting the amount of turnovers conceded in the Embra game as some sort of proof you're 'right' - yet JB has made similar yards and out-performed his over back row colleagues defensively over both games so far this season. So why can't he cut it?

Confirmation bias. Look it up.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 10:10 am

Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:Just had a look. Laugh

So in a game where we won 11 out of 12 of our own scrums, you think the fact that the no8 ran a whopping 13m more than the openside flanker, an indictment of the no7s play. JB made around 1.8m per carry and HK 2.1m per carry. You must take a lot of issue with that half a yard.  I note than despite all these extra carries Keddie didn't make one clean break or beat a single defender.

I could mention confirmation bias again, but you wouldn't get that any more than you get what's happening on the rugby field.  The failure is in the tight five.

And No6s play, which I've alluded to already. I've said all along the problem is up front, that includes the tight 5. So not sure who or what you're arguing exactly? I've said for years that Benjamin can't cope at this level and yet again I'm proved correct. Slagging off Keddie doesn't make JB any better, so this crush needs to end now.

I'm not of the narrative that the No7 is there to tackle and jackal, where have I said this??? Although that's how some teams play, for example how Scarlets use James Davies - works very well for them, but you can't tell me I haven't been of the opinion for over 12 months that for this reason he wouldn't fit into the Wales team? I prefer a No7 who can do that and more. It's why Tipuric was the best 7 in Wales last year as he added more to his game. It's why I see Griffiths as superior to Davies. A bit off topic but it's exactly how Shingler plays now, he needs to be starting at 6 for Wales.

Give it up Mikey, you're out of your depth. Contradicting yourself now and clutching at straws like Dowlais writing an article for the Fail.

How have you proved Benjamin can't cut it at this level? Which stat proves this?

You said he's been disappointing and argued for Cudd (injured) to come back in as he's defensively better, noting the amount of turnovers conceded in the Embra game as some sort of proof you're 'right' - yet JB has made similar yards and out-performed his over back row colleagues defensively over both games so far this season. So why can't he cut it?

Confirmation bias. Look it up.

I don't usually rely on stats I prefer to use my own eyes - I thought Benjamin was average at U20 level as was AOB and neither have got better. In this case however (JB) then stats back it up.

I haven't argued for Cudd to come back as I knew he was injured, I said that he was a better 7 despite being a bit slight. Again I've alluded to the pack, the back-row, JBs back-row colleagues; what part don't you understand? I'm not sure about James Thomas but like Keddie he's big and physical enough to cope in the back-row, but I can't be certain if either will improve and Thomas seems to have gone backwards.

If your crush isn't good at tackling and jackling then what is he good at exactly? Nothing.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 10:13 am

mikey_dragon wrote:
Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

Well, apart from your own stats, which earlier backed up what you were saying but now don't mean anything because, well, your eyes tell you different, telling a completely different story, the post above is a bit awkward now, isn't it?
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 10:24 am

So that's the best you've got Stone? You're getting desperate now laughing. You're clueless. For days you've been arguing against things I haven't even said. I proved you wrong about the tackling and jackling and now it's confirmed I was right about JB all along. You've got stones for brains! And with this crush you're giving Dowlais' big ginger crush a run for his money.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 11:34 am

mikey_dragon wrote:So that's the best you've got Stone? You're getting desperate now laughing. You're clueless. For days you've been arguing against things I haven't even said. I proved you wrong about the tackling and jackling and now it's confirmed I was right about JB all along. You've got stones for brains! And with this crush you're giving Dowlais' big ginger crush a run for his money.

Rightio, how have you proved either exactly? Your stats prove that across two league games a) JB has been our best back row defender, b) he's achieved as many metres per carry pretty much as.a no8 who is now allowed to pick up and go as soon as the ball is in the scrum, and c) you haven't got a sodding clue about anything. Show me with evidence how I'm wrong?
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 11:41 am

quote="mikey_dragon"]
Benjamin was anonymous and part of the reason we got a tuning at the breakdown. [/quote]

Ouch. That's not you misreading the statistical evidence in favour of your own bias and mistakenly attributing the role of the modern seven as to pile in and ensure ball retention at the breakdown, oh no.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 11:46 am

Just re-read the stats or re-watch the game, you'll see Benjamin is one of the ones not capable of coping at this level. I pointed this out before and you went off on one. I've also previously pointed out that Dixon had stagnated and needed to work on his defensive alignment to which you also went off on one. Looks like I was right about the latter as well, right?

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Sun 10 Sep 2017, 12:34 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Just re-read the stats or re-watch the game, you'll see Benjamin is one of the ones not capable of coping at this level. I pointed this out before and you went off on one. I've also previously pointed out that Dixon had stagnated and needed to work on his defensive alignment to which you also went off on one. Looks like I was right about the latter as well, right?

Which stats Mikey? Which exact ones?
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Griff on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 10:07 am

Jackman pulling no punches about our fringe/bench players. Ouch!

"DRAGONS boss Bernard Jackman has warned his fringe players that he will turn his starters into 80-minute men if they don't provide him with some bench impact.

The Rodney Parade region have suffered a pair of defeats to start their Guinness PRO14 campaign, losing 39-16 to Leinster in Newport on opening weekend and 35-18 to Edinburgh in Scotland last Friday.

A worrying trend from the summer friendly defeats to Montpellier, Northampton, Exeter and Glasgow has carried into the season with the Dragons falling away as games progress.

Head coach Jackman pledged when he took the helm that everybody in the squad was starting with a clean slate but the Irishman is now starting to make judgements and has demanded more from those outside his XV.

"The bench gave us a negative impact in Edinburgh and that's what we saw in pre-season, where we were competitive for 60 minutes and then fell away," lamented Jackman.

"I tried to keep the bench until 70 minutes then they scored and we were out of bonus-point range so I decided to give the boys another crack. Our starting pack was very good, we just need finishers.

"The reality is that at the moment I probably will have to look at playing my starting team for 80 minutes until I get more depth.

"You've got guys like Leon Brown, who is in just his second PRO14 start at tighthead, and it's a big ask for him to go 80 minutes but if leaving him on in the 'red zone' is better than what you've got to bring on….

"I've said to the bench that people are looking for game time but when they get it they don't do well enough. That's something we need to fix.

"People we are bringing on aren't adding to it and giving impact. It's either status quo or negative.

"Our job is to fix that and try and get the maximum out of everybody because we could have had a bonus point if we had a bit more efficiency in Edinburgh."

The Dragons are without experienced duo Sam Hobbs (knee) and Lewis Evans (Achilles) at loosehead and the back row respectively but are set to be boosted for Friday's home clash with Connacht (kick-off 7.30pm) by the return of scrum-half Sarel Pretorius (calf) and last season's player of the year Ollie Griffiths in the back row.

Jackman was frustrated by a controversial decision by Scottish TMO Charles Samson to chalk off a Harri Keddie try at Myreside when he felt Hallam Amos' left boot was millimetres over the touchline.

However, the head coach knows that his side need to find a cutting edge after scoring just one try in two games, and that a penalty try against Leinster because of a high tackle on wing Ashton Hewitt.

"First 10 minutes we played with a lot of width but what is frustrating is that we are very loose with the ball when we get to the 22," said Jackman in Edinburgh.

"We make breaks and then it's all-or-nothing rather than being patient, so that's something we need to work on.

"The good thing is that we are creating opportunities but the big disappointment was that defensively we had seven or eight really bad reads or systems errors.

"But we will fix that and it's individuals having bad habits that haven't been worked out of their games yet."

Connacht go on their travels for the first time this season after a 18-12 loss to Glasgow on opening weekend and 32-10 success against Southern Kings on Saturday."

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 10:15 am

I love his honesty! This isn't the first time he's mentioned getting more depth or bringing in some players.. Are we secretly waiting for ITM, Currie cup, etc to end before bringing in recruits? Those players on the bench aren't going to get better!

I would start Pretorious and Griffiths against Connacht. BTW Griff, do we happen to share the same first name (Mikey)? Smile

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Griff on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 10:17 am

mikey_dragon wrote:I love his honesty! This isn't the first time he's mentioned getting more depth or bringing in some players.. Are we secretly waiting for ITM, Currie cup, etc to end before bringing in recruits? Those players on the bench aren't going to get better!

I would start Pretorious and Griffiths against Connacht. BTW Griff, do we happen to share the same first name (Mikey)? Smile


No Mikey we do not! I have a different first name.


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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 10:36 am

Ah right, seen a twitter handle Mikey Griff is all!

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Griff on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 11:22 am

I'm not a twitter user. Never got the hang of it! It's like Facebook but with updates from people you don't really know!!! Got frustrated once as I was restricted on the number of characters I could use. Haven't used it since!

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 12:57 pm

I thought we played some really good stuff against Edinburgh - for the first time, you could see the kind of rugby Jackman wants us playing, and the players looked fairly comfortable with it. The forwards all looked comfortable ball in hand. It's that it's not all going to click overnight, but there were reasons for optimism, I thought. But defence is something that needs fixing sharpish, new coach or not. Soft tries undid good work against Edinburgh.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by RiscaGame on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 1:35 pm

Be interested to see his bench for this week. I assume Griffiths will start over James Thomas, so I wonder if JT will drop to the bench instead of whichever lock (seeing Max Williams made some impact in the Leinster game at least). Clearly Sarel will probably start too, which is maybe harsh on Davies and particularly Leonard.

Guess as Jackman said, they just need to be a bit calmer once they hit the opposition 22. At least we are having a go with ball in hand now. It will take a while until we are used to handling again, rather than aimless kick chasing Wink

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 2:07 pm

These things take time. Ask Frank de Boer....

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by RiscaGame on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 2:26 pm

Very true.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:48 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Be interested to see his bench for this week. I assume Griffiths will start over James Thomas, so I wonder if JT will drop to the bench instead of whichever lock (seeing Max Williams made some impact in the Leinster game at least). Clearly Sarel will probably start too, which is maybe harsh on Davies and particularly Leonard.

Guess as Jackman said, they just need to be a bit calmer once they hit the opposition 22. At least we are having a go with ball in hand now. It will take a while until we are used to handling again, rather than aimless kick chasing Wink

We're in the bizarre situation whereby if Bernard wants impact from the bench, he will have to sit our best forward on it. There aren't any options for the bench in the tight five I can see - I'd start Evans over James Thomas when fit and see where Ollie fancies playing from half time. Scrum half definitely Pretorious if Henson's starts again, if we're gonna play off ten and twelve may as well let him do his headless chicken dance and see if Amos or Hewitt can get on his shoulder.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Stone Motif on Mon 11 Sep 2017, 8:51 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I thought we played some really good stuff against Edinburgh - for the first time, you could see the kind of rugby Jackman wants us playing, and the players looked fairly comfortable with it. The forwards all looked comfortable ball in hand. It's that it's not all going to click overnight, but there were reasons for optimism, I thought. But defence is something that needs fixing sharpish, new coach or not. Soft tries undid good work against Edinburgh.

Hobson's choice - we have no power in the front five to smash players back in the tackle or offer a carrying threat so we either flood the breakdown and let the opposition fan out and get organised ready for whatever the backs try and do, or don't flood he breakdown and get turned over.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by RiscaGame on Tue 12 Sep 2017, 9:46 pm

Stone Motif wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Be interested to see his bench for this week. I assume Griffiths will start over James Thomas, so I wonder if JT will drop to the bench instead of whichever lock (seeing Max Williams made some impact in the Leinster game at least). Clearly Sarel will probably start too, which is maybe harsh on Davies and particularly Leonard.

Guess as Jackman said, they just need to be a bit calmer once they hit the opposition 22. At least we are having a go with ball in hand now. It will take a while until we are used to handling again, rather than aimless kick chasing Wink

We're in the bizarre situation whereby if Bernard wants impact from the bench, he will have to sit our best forward on it. There aren't any options for the bench in the tight five I can see - I'd start Evans over James Thomas when fit and see where Ollie fancies playing from half time. Scrum half definitely Pretorious if Henson's starts again, if we're gonna play off ten and twelve may as well let him do his headless chicken dance and see if Amos or Hewitt can get on his shoulder.

I see your point on Griffiths. I agree that Evans is likely to start too.

To be honest, I'm not overly a fan of Pretorious, but he does have a knack of scoring which we definitely need at the moment.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Wed 13 Sep 2017, 11:04 am

Jackman was talking about keeping our composure when we're in the opposition 22. Pretorius isn't the most composed of players, but at least he's likely to make the breaks that get us into the opposition 22. He does make things happen.

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 13 Sep 2017, 11:20 am

Sarel is the best No.9 at the region without a doubt. A bit greedy yes, but he scores tries. Is Warren due back soon?

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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

Post by munkian on Wed 13 Sep 2017, 12:27 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Sarel is the best No.9 at the region without a doubt. A bit greedy yes, but he scores tries. Is Warren due back soon?

Charlie Davies is tidy too.

Not sure on Warren. Really really hope Griffiths is back.
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Re: Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

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