Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

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Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Ineffable on Mon 26 Jun 2017, 1:05 pm

First topic message reminder :


HurricanesBritish & Irish Lions
Venue: Westpac Stadium, Wellington
Date: Tuesday, 27 June.
Kick off: 08:35 BST
Live on: Sky Sports 1, from 8am

Lions



1. Joe Marler (ENG)
2. Rory Best (IRE) (Captain)
3. Dan Cole (ENG)
4. Courtney Lawes (ENG)
5. Iain Henderson (IRE)
6. James Haskell (ENG)
7. Justin Tipuric (WAL)
8. CJ Stander (IRE)
9. Greig Laidlaw (SCO)
10. Dan Biggar (WAL)
11. George North (WAL)
12. Robbie Henshaw (IRE)
13. Jonathan Joseph (ENG)
14. Tommy Seymour (SCO)
15. Jack Nowell  Erm  (ENG)

16. Kristian Dacey (WAL)
17. Allan Dell (SCO)
18. Tomas Francis (WAL)
19. Cory Hill (WAL)
20. George Kruis (ENG)
21. Gareth Davies (WAL)
22. Finn Russell (SCO)
23. Jared Payne (IRE)

Hurricanes



1. Ben May
2. Ricky Riccitelli
3. Jeffery Toomaga-Allen
4. Mark Abbott
5. Mark Lousi
6. Vaea Fifita
7. Callum Gibbins
8. Brad Shields (Captain)
9. Te Toiroa-Tahuriorangi
10. Otere Black
11. Julian Savea
12. Ngani Laumape
13. Vince Aso
14. Nehe Milner-Skudder
15. Jordie Barrett

16. Leni Apisai
17. Chris Eves
18. Mike Kainga
19. Janes Blackwell
20. Reed Prinsep
21. K Hauiti-Parapara
22. Wes Goosen
23. Cory Jane


Last edited by Ineffable on Mon 26 Jun 2017, 1:13 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by LordDowlais on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:19 pm

David-Douglas wrote:Warburton - 2nd worst player on tour, mainly due to carrying an injury. Worse Lions captain ever, but should never have been put in the position this time.

That's a bit harsh isn't it ?

But I better watch what I am saying.....


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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RuggerRadge2611 on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:28 pm

Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by TightHEAD on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:33 pm

Could anyone blame Russell if he did walk off down the tunnel around the 70min mark?
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by robbo277 on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:36 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by BamBam on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:37 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Warburton probably thought he was "hard" enough to cope. After all, he's had that particular bit of smoke blown up his arse since the RWC when he pushed a full back a couple of yards backwards

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:37 pm

robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

Sexton must be close!

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by TJ on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:37 pm

Nope - he has been treated disgracefully as have the rest of the scots ( and a few others)

I really fear this could be the end of the lions. Its certainly no longer the British and Irish lions. Its the english and Welsh lions with a few irishmen

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:42 pm

Impartial from the BBC as always - North gets several paragraphs and apparently could be back in the test team, whereas Seymour barely gets a mention and his tour is now over apparently!

Wingers on form

George North scored his first try of the 2017 Lions tour against the Hurricanes
There were also gains to be made by the likes of George North, perhaps a surprise omission from the first Test squad in Auckland.

The Welshman crossed for a classic winger's try, despite playing much of the game in the centre following an early injury to Robbie Henshaw.

Forced into a partnership at inside centre with Jonathan Joseph outside him, North popped up on Henderson's shoulder in the first half and accelerated away from the cover defence for his first try of the tour.

He could have had two tries, but for a foot in touch. It was a positive audition from a player out of position, whose explosive power and ability to make yards beyond the tackle could be used by Gatland on Saturday.

Scotland winger Seymour, despite not being a real threat to the Test team, also profited in Wellington in what was probably his final game in a Lions shirt in New Zealand.

After a mixed few weeks, his double on Tuesday means he is now the leading try scorer on the 2017 tour.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Griff on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:45 pm

TJ wrote:Nope - he has been treated disgracefully as have the rest of the scots ( and a few others)

I really fear this could be the end of the lions.  Its certainly no longer the British and Irish lions.    Its the english and Welsh lions with a few irishmen

Behave TJ! Ireland had 11 in the squad from the off. In the first test they had 4 players starting, same as Wales! I see what you're doing though, trying to create an 'us v them' by getting the Irish onside. You're being like the trolls you keep telling everyone not to feed!

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by BamBam on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:45 pm

Not a real threat to the Test team picard

Suppose with the management its accurate reporting

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by LordDowlais on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 3:50 pm

robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

I have had this argument down at CAP many a times.

Look, for me Warburton is not even the best 7 in Wales, never mind the whole of the British Isles. There are at least 4 players in Wales I would say are more deserving than he is. Heck, I do not think Warburton is the best in his position for Cardiff Blues anymore.

I just do not think he is as committed to the Cardiff Blues jersey than he is to the Welsh jersey, he always declares himself fit for Wales, yet he is never fit for Cardiff Blues, I cannot remember the last time he played a full game for Cardiff Blues.

But to say he is the worst Lions captain ever is over the top.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by robbo277 on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 4:02 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

Sexton must be close!

Quick glance at the numbers and I've got 175 club appearances and 70 International appearances. 40 of those games were up to 2008-09, when he made his international debut, so since his debut he's played 70 Internatioanl games and 135 club games, or just over 1 International every 2 club games.

Looking at someone like Robshaw, he's got 56 caps and 207 club games. Despite making his international debut in 2009, 55 of those caps have come since 2012. In that time, he's played 113 club games - so just under 1 international game for every 2 club games.

1 against 2 easily scans to 10 tests and 20 club games, which sounds about right for an International player. That Warburton has played so many internationals with so little club rugby is a serious anomaly.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by TJ on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 4:02 pm

sorry Griff. Not meant as a troll just how it appears from here

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 4:06 pm

robbo277 wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

Sexton must be close!

Quick glance at the numbers and I've got 175 club appearances and 70 International appearances. 40 of those games were up to 2008-09, when he made his international debut, so since his debut he's played 70 Internatioanl games and 135 club games, or just over 1 International every 2 club games.

Looking at someone like Robshaw, he's got 56 caps and 207 club games. Despite making his international debut in 2009, 55 of those caps have come since 2012. In that time, he's played 113 club games - so just under 1 international game for every 2 club games.

1 against 2 easily scans to 10 tests and 20 club games, which sounds about right for an International player. That Warburton has played so many internationals with so little club rugby is a serious anomaly.

I'm surprised at that, although I suspect if you looked over the last 3-4 years his ratio would be much more skewed towards internationals. Certainly the last season or two he only seems to play big games for Leinster or games to give him a warmup for Ireland.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by TightHEAD on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 4:11 pm

Every game we play is making the 2005 tour look better and better.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RuggerRadge2611 on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 4:33 pm

TightHEAD wrote:Could anyone blame Russell if he did walk off down the tunnel around the 70min mark?

Nope, probably checked his phone and he had 2 unread messages.

Message 1
From : Broonie
Message : Told you so lol!

Message 2
From : Johnny Jr
Message : Told you so!!! Sare darts man!
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Cyril on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:23 pm

Dis Russell actually storm off before the end?

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:25 pm

Cyril wrote:Dis Russell actually storm off before the end?

I don't know if it was on TV but someone at the game apparently noticed him go speak to the coaches on 70 minutes then walk up the tunnel afterwards. No more information than that so hard to tell what actually happen.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:27 pm

Sorry Luckless - i know you were joking but couldn't leave that here! OK

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:28 pm

No problem Smile

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Cyril on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:32 pm

Cheers RDW. Seems a shame for Russell to be lumped in with the 'mystery' selections.

Normally that type of behaviour (if it happened like that) would be pretty bad, but I think I'd sympathise with the lad.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by David-Douglas on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:45 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Impartial from the BBC as always - North gets several paragraphs and apparently could be back in the test team, whereas Seymour barely gets a mention and his tour is now over apparently!

Wingers on form

George North scored his first try of the 2017 Lions tour against the Hurricanes
There were also gains to be made by the likes of George North, perhaps a surprise omission from the first Test squad in Auckland.

The Welshman crossed for a classic winger's try, despite playing much of the game in the centre following an early injury to Robbie Henshaw.

Forced into a partnership at inside centre with Jonathan Joseph outside him, North popped up on Henderson's shoulder in the first half and accelerated away from the cover defence for his first try of the tour.

He could have had two tries, but for a foot in touch. It was a positive audition from a player out of position, whose explosive power and ability to make yards beyond the tackle could be used by Gatland on Saturday.

Scotland winger Seymour, despite not being a real threat to the Test team, also profited in Wellington in what was probably his final game in a Lions shirt in New Zealand.

After a mixed few weeks, his double on Tuesday means he is now the leading try scorer on the 2017 tour.

Who wrote that rubbish? Laughable, really. North has been terrible. He was better today than he has been but not much and certainly nowhere near as good a game or tour as Seymour.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Cyril on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 5:50 pm

Perhaps Howley ghostwrites for the Beeb?

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 6:00 pm

David-Douglas wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Impartial from the BBC as always - North gets several paragraphs and apparently could be back in the test team, whereas Seymour barely gets a mention and his tour is now over apparently!

Wingers on form

George North scored his first try of the 2017 Lions tour against the Hurricanes
There were also gains to be made by the likes of George North, perhaps a surprise omission from the first Test squad in Auckland.

The Welshman crossed for a classic winger's try, despite playing much of the game in the centre following an early injury to Robbie Henshaw.

Forced into a partnership at inside centre with Jonathan Joseph outside him, North popped up on Henderson's shoulder in the first half and accelerated away from the cover defence for his first try of the tour.

He could have had two tries, but for a foot in touch. It was a positive audition from a player out of position, whose explosive power and ability to make yards beyond the tackle could be used by Gatland on Saturday.

Scotland winger Seymour, despite not being a real threat to the Test team, also profited in Wellington in what was probably his final game in a Lions shirt in New Zealand.

After a mixed few weeks, his double on Tuesday means he is now the leading try scorer on the 2017 tour.

Who wrote that rubbish?

Her name is Louise Gwilliam.

(I think I'm allowed to say that!)

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by George Carlin on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 7:53 am

Cyril wrote:Perhaps Howley ghostwrites for the Beeb?
Probably. He has a lot of time on his hands, given that it only takes half an hour, two beers and six Powerpoint slides to impart what he knows about attacking play.
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 8:01 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:
robbo277 wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

Sexton must be close!

Quick glance at the numbers and I've got 175 club appearances and 70 International appearances. 40 of those games were up to 2008-09, when he made his international debut, so since his debut he's played 70 Internatioanl games and 135 club games, or just over 1 International every 2 club games.

Looking at someone like Robshaw, he's got 56 caps and 207 club games. Despite making his international debut in 2009, 55 of those caps have come since 2012. In that time, he's played 113 club games - so just under 1 international game for every 2 club games.

1 against 2 easily scans to 10 tests and 20 club games, which sounds about right for an International player. That Warburton has played so many internationals with so little club rugby is a serious anomaly.

I'm surprised at that, although I suspect if you looked over the last 3-4 years his ratio would be much more skewed towards internationals.  Certainly the last season or two he only seems to play big games for Leinster or games to give him a warmup for Ireland.


Sextons missed about half of Irelands test over the last 12 months. If you take the 12 months prior to that, which includes the world cup and associated resting from the club game after... youd have a very different ratio, but not one I can be bothered to actually calculate.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by BamBam on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 10:42 am

George Carlin wrote:
Cyril wrote:Perhaps Howley ghostwrites for the Beeb?
Probably. He has a lot of time on his hands, given that it only takes half an hour, two beers and six Powerpoint slides to impart what he knows about attacking play.

It stretches to 6 slides? Must be size 48 font

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by IanBru on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 1:44 pm

Every good Howley PowerPoint has a title page, content page, bibliography, acknowledgements and a wacky 'the end' slide.
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 2:16 pm

IanBru wrote:Every good Howley PowerPoint has a title page, content page, bibliography, acknowledgements and a wacky 'the end' slide.

And Warren Gatland emerging from a birthday cake.

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 2:23 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
IanBru wrote:Every good Howley PowerPoint has a title page, content page, bibliography, acknowledgements and a wacky 'the end' slide.

And Warren Gatland emerging from a birthday cake.
Laugh
Thanks Lucky/Bru. I now have to clean coffee off my keyboard.
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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 2:28 pm

Always a pleasure Smile

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by Engine#4 on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 9:17 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
IanBru wrote:Every good Howley PowerPoint has a title page, content page, bibliography, acknowledgements and a wacky 'the end' slide.

And Warren Gatland emerging from a birthday cake.

clap Laugh

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

Post by wayne on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 9:39 pm

robbo277 wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Warburton is an amazing player and an amazing captain, but perhaps he should have done a Billy V, and decided, I'm not fit for this tour.

He gambled on finding fitness and form on tour and it hasn't paid off, it's a shame because I really like him as a player and a person.

Saying that; after this he has 4 months to get himself right for the November series. It interested me, so I ran the numbers.

He has 105 club appearances and 77 International appearances. This is also somewhat distorted by 24 club appearances and 6 International appearances before the end of the 2009/10 season.

Since 1 June 2010, he's played 81 club games and 71 International games. Is there anyone else with such a low club:international ratio?

Just for clarity Justin has played 138 Club, 51 Welsh and 1 B&I appearances since June 2010

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Re: Hurricanes vs Lions, 27th June 2017

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