Ulster Rugby 2017-18

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Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 05 Jul 2017, 10:42 am

First topic message reminder :

Director of Rugby Les Kiss  
Head Coach Jono Gibbes  
Assistant Coach Dwayne Peel
Scrum Coach Aaron Dundon  
Skills Coach Niall Malone


Players In
John Cooney from Connacht
Schalk van der Merwe from Southern Kings
Jean Deysel from Sharks
David Busby promoted from Academy
Aaron Cairns promoted from Academy
Ross Kane promoted from Academy
Rob Lyttle promoted from Academy
Tommy O'Hagan promoted from Academy
Jack Owens promoted from Academy

Players Out
Franco van der Merwe to Cardiff Blues
Roger Wilson retired
Conor Joyce to Jersey Reds
Mark Best to Jersey Reds
Jonny Murphy to Rotherham Titans
Ruan Pienaar to Montpellier
John Donnan released
Lorcan Dow released
Ricky Lutton released
Stephen Mulholland released

Ulster Rugby 2017/18 Senior Playing Squad

Rodney Ah You (18 ULS, 3 IRE)
John Andrew (27 ULS)
Rory Best (198 ULS, 104 IRE)
Callum Black (128 ULS)
Tommy Bowe (150 ULS, 69 IRE)
Peter Browne (31 ULS)
David Busby (2 ULS)
Aaron Cairns (1 ULS)
Darren Cave (193 ULS, 11 IRE)
Marcell Coetzee (4 ULS, 28 SA)
John Cooney (0 ULS, 1 IRE)
Jean Deysel (0 ULS, 4 SA)
Robbie Diack (193 ULS, 2 IRE)
Craig Gilroy (149 ULS, 10 IRE)
Iain Henderson (74 ULS, 32 IRE)
Chris Henry (165 ULS, 24 IRE)
Wiehahn Herbst (54 ULS)
Rob Herring (120 ULS, 1 IRE)
Brett Herron (7 ULS)
Paddy Jackson (123 ULS, 25 IRE)
Ross Kane (11 ULS)
Louis Ludik (54 ULS)
Robert Lyttle (8 ULS)
Luke Marshall (104 ULS, 11 IRE)
Paul Marshall (195 ULS, 3 IRE)
Kyle McCall (36 ULS)
Stuart McCloskey (58 ULS, 1 IRE)
Johnny McPhillips
Peter Nelson (37 ULS)
Alan O'Connor (39 ULS)
Tommy O'Hagan
Stuart Olding (62 ULS, 4 IRE)
Jack Owens (1 ULS)
Callum Patterson
Jared Payne (78 ULS, 20 IRE)
Charles Piutau (23 ULS, 16 NZ)
Matthew Rea
Sean Reidy (58 ULS, 2 IRE)
Clive Ross (52 ULS)
David Shanahan (13 ULS)
Jonny Simpson (4 ULS)
Jacob Stockdale (24 ULS, 2 IRE)
Kieran Treadwell (21 ULS, 2 IRE)
Andrew Trimble (217 ULS, 70 IRE)
Schalk van der Merwe
Andrew Warwick (74 ULS)

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Mon 02 Oct 2017, 12:20 pm

It's all gone very quiet in here folks, should we not all be venting on here about that result?
I know I'm still hurting and angry in equal measures.
After giving it another watch with a little bit of fast forwarding in places:

I try not to blame refs but that reffing performance was a fantastic example of how not to officiate a game. The scrums were a joke and not one of the players' making. The front rows could have just gotten on with it but it was a complete coin toss as to who would give away the free kick or penalty, I've never seen anything quite like that before. He never stopped Zebre from being offside, any half decent ref at least tells poeple to get back to avoid giving penalties and to let the game flow but not in this case, he just didn't bother giving offside penalties. The game was stop start full of minor infringements being penalised and big ones being missed.
The shoulder charge on Ludik is one I've watched over and over and it's a no arms, leading with the shoulder offence every day of the week. It led of course to a Zebre try.
I could go on, the deliberate holding back of an Ulster defender for the last Zebre try being another gripe but I will bite my tongue as I really do hate ref bashing and LD will love this enough as it is.

Ulster were pathetic and lethargic looking, is it just me or did they all look shattered just before half time. Some of them were gasping for air. I do agree that replacing Cooney was a bad call when we were in dire straights as Lealiifano was the player that was misfiring. Bringing Nelson on would have been the right call at that time, Cooney was playing well and was one of the few that were giving 100%.
Zebre were very good, nothing like they've been in the past but that was very much helped by spending the entire match offside........I know, there I go again but it was so evident. It'll be interesting to see how they go this coming weekend against Edinburgh. Their tails are up and they have both confidence and momentum, something they've not had in a very long time.

There I've had my big rant Sad Sad Sad

In addition to my big rant I should add of course that Ulster players need to learn the most basic rugby skill that is catching a ball and passing a ball. It's something you'd think they'd have picked up by now.


Last edited by Pete330v2 on Mon 02 Oct 2017, 2:50 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon 02 Oct 2017, 2:03 pm

The officiating was a big factor but it wasn't biased. Ulster too could have exploited Mr Adamson's leniency with the offside law if they had played to his interpretation. There were a few too many forward passes allowed for my taste but that's to be expected in an away game.

What killed Ulster was the number of turnovers conceded. 20 to Zebre's 12 - with Trimble (4), Leali'ifano (3) and Henderson (3) being the biggest culprits. This had a lot to do with the pace in the Zebre backrow especially Giammarioli who outpaced Ulster's backline to score his try. Compared to the pedestrian Deysel who completed one tackle and missed two, Zebre had the better of the breakdown.

The other area of inferiority was the tackling - Ulster missing 22 from 98 and Zebre missing 15 from 96. The apparent lethargy again belies a comparative lack of pace between the backlines in particular with too many mismatches leading to defenders grasping air.

The lesson is that Ulster should have started Timoney to reward him for his previous performance, and they should have had Nelson on the bench.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Mon 02 Oct 2017, 2:08 pm

"The officiating was a big factor but it wasn't biased. Ulster too could have exploited Mr Adamson's leniency with the offside law if they had played to his interpretation"

Oh absolutely, I didn't want to imply that he was biased, just tom kite.
The fact that Ulster couldn't see fit to play to his leniency / deficiency in that area shows the distinct lack of 'heads up' rugby and leadership.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Tue 03 Oct 2017, 9:41 am

Now I know t'other forum should at times be taken with a bucket of salt but one or their posters in claiming that Payne is still suffering badly from the headaches, likened to a bad hangover and despite being very eager to play the medical team are saying no.
Also one guy saying that Coetzee had scans on the knee and the news isn't good. I'm not familiar with the poster so he could just be spreading of fake news....I hope.

Anyway, a strong team expected this week, strongest available obviously. It'll be the preparation for the Wasps visit so we should expect some kind of positive reaction this week. There's European places to be won or lost.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Tue 03 Oct 2017, 10:39 am

Looks like Beirne is off to Munster then, can cover lock and back row and Ulster seemingly not even interested makes sense

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue 03 Oct 2017, 12:00 pm

Ulster were interested but the last decade has shown us that no established southern player will come north.

Well Saturday was a total farce wasn't it.
For me only Piatau, Marshall and Henderson made any difference at all.
Ah You, Andrew, Ludik were ok without doing much.

The rest were downright poor - the backrow were appalling all 3 of them
Deysel has aggression but his handling is poor and in defence he has the turning circle of an oil tanker.
Cave was exposed defensively and Trimble was utterly useless both as a player and a captain.
Pity we could not terminate Blacks contract a year early - waste of space - mind you Warwick no better.
Treadwell has been poor this year.
Leali'ifano is a class act but he is increasingly looking what he is - a top 12 playing 10. He has yet to dictate a game.
I even thought Cooney lack his previous fizz, mind you behind that backrow !.
I though the ball was distributed quicker when Shanahan came on.

Not great news on Coetzee or Payne.
Ignore the cowpat about next week, next week they have no idea on when either is coming back.
Tests not great on Coetzee - further tests this week.
Payne still getting headaches and cannot be considered.

My team based on form this year so far - ignoring the players who have yet to play and Coetzee i.e. Payne, Gilroy, Kane, de Merwe (another about whom things have gone quite)

McCall, Herring, Herbst, Henderson, Diack (yes Diack), Timoney, Deysel (by default), Henry,
Cooney, Leali'ifano, Piatau, McCloskey, Marshall, Stockdale, Ludik
Bench: Warwick (no one else), Andrew, Ah You, O'Connor, Reidy, Shanahan, Nelson, Bowe

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Tue 03 Oct 2017, 12:21 pm

Afternoon Geoff.

Farce doesn't go far enough to describe that display.
Deysel just didn't turn up for the game and Trimble was as poor as I've seen him. I thought Leali'ifano and Cooney were both under tremendous pressure due to having no pack in front of them. I thought by the time Shanahan came on Nelson should have come on too and the game had started to break up which would have suited that.

It's not nice to hear that the rumours on the other forum have substance. If Coetzee is going to be a weekly sicknote he needs to be cut free. What's the point in having a NIQ berth left effectively empty bar the odd appearance.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue 03 Oct 2017, 12:24 pm

Pete330v2 wrote:
Deysel just didn't turn up for the game and Trimble was as poor as I've seen him. I thought Leali'ifano and Cooney were both under tremendous pressure due to having no pack in front of them. I thought by the time Shanahan came on Nelson should have come on too and the game had started to break up which would have suited that..

Agreed the half backs need to be cut some slack - especially when your entire backrow don't turn up.
I agree re Nelson he should have been on with Shanahan.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 9:42 am

geoff999rugby wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:
Deysel just didn't turn up for the game and Trimble was as poor as I've seen him. I thought Leali'ifano and Cooney were both under tremendous pressure due to having no pack in front of them. I thought by the time Shanahan came on Nelson should have come on too and the game had started to break up which would have suited that..

Agreed the half backs need to be cut some slack - especially when your entire backrow don't turn up.
I agree re Nelson he should have been on with Shanahan.

Sorry but Lealiifano has pretty much been consistent in all his games so far, there are glimpses of class but his passing is a liability as guys are having to constantly adjust to take a pass from him or as we seen on Saturday they are unable to get it under control before contact, the constantly being offside made the problem a lot worse.

His tactical kicking has been awful, he regularly kicks straight to a dangerous opposition back and Ulster don't get the chance to compete and we concede tries off the back of it. In the ERCC against guys like Wade, Daly and Visser we will get ripped apart.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 9:54 am

As I said a class 12 playing 10 and it shows

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 10:11 am

The problem is though geoff is that he is a very good 10 and has been playing there for years for the Brumbies against some of the most dangerous backs in the game, he may just not be the same player he once was

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 11:45 am

marty2086 wrote:The problem is though geoff is that he is a very good 10 and has been playing there for years for the Brumbies against some of the most dangerous backs in the game, he may just not be the same player he once was

I'm starting to feel that way about him although after such a long layoff with that kind of illness perhaps he's finding it hard to get up to speed. Perhaps he'll be up to speed, firing on all cylinders by January.
I am starting to worry about this season already, the Jacko / Olding saga, Coetzee seemingly crocked and now we get bitten by Zebre.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 11:54 am

Pete330v2 wrote: now we get bitten by Zebre.

I suppose that is better than getting bit by a Lion.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Marshes on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 12:07 pm

Don't know if we will have a match thread for the game Friday night, you lot may want to handle it in house!

Just to say I'm expecting a bit of a backlash after the Zebre, and while some of the performances have been positive (last week against Scarlets and against Kings), Connacht are still very much finding their feet under Keane.

Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 12:10 pm

rodders wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote: now we get bitten by Zebre.

I suppose that is better than getting bit by a Lion.

Not in rugby terminology Rodders Smile

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 12:17 pm

Marshes wrote:Don't know if we will have a match thread for the game Friday night, you lot may want to handle it in house!

Just to say I'm expecting a bit of a backlash after the Zebre, and while some of the performances have been positive (last week against Scarlets and against Kings), Connacht are still very much finding their feet under Keane.

Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

We'll have a different match squad, most likely the starting XV that will be facing Wasps which will be our very strongest available so I expect a very different performance but more importantly a different attitude. We too are finding our feet under Gibbes, Peel and Dundon but feet finding has to end with the business part of the season looming.

Notch obviously has decided to leave 606v2 but is still active on Facebook.
I have no clue about Stand but I get the urge to do a Notch myself and bid the forums farewell.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 12:47 pm

Jonathan Bradley in the BelTel saying Payne is back in training but Gibbes saying they are probably being overly cautious.

Bradley also saying that they are cervicogenic headaches

Cervicogenic headache is referred pain (pain perceived as occurring in a part of the body other than its true source) perceived in the head from a source in the neck. Cervicogenic headache is a secondary headache, which means that it is caused by another illness or physical issue. In the case of cervicogenic headache, the cause is a disorder of the cervical spine and its component bony, disc and/or soft tissue elements. Numerous pain sensitive structures exist in the cervical (upper neck) and occipital (back of head) regions. The junction of the skull and cervical vertebrae have regions that are pain generating, including the lining of the cervical spine, the joints, ligaments, cervical nerve roots, and vertebral arteries passing through the cervical vertebral bodies.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Marshes on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 1:03 pm

Pete330v2 wrote:
Marshes wrote:Don't know if we will have a match thread for the game Friday night, you lot may want to handle it in house!

Just to say I'm expecting a bit of a backlash after the Zebre, and while some of the performances have been positive (last week against Scarlets and against Kings), Connacht are still very much finding their feet under Keane.

Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

We'll have a different match squad, most likely the starting XV that will be facing Wasps which will be our very strongest available so I expect a very different performance but more importantly a different attitude. We too are finding our feet under Gibbes, Peel and Dundon but feet finding has to end with the business part of the season looming.

Notch obviously has decided to leave 606v2 but is still active on Facebook.
I have no clue about Stand but I get the urge to do a Notch myself and bid the forums farewell.

Yeah I expect much improved. Connacht I'd be worried about being a bit deflated from getting little compensation for last week's performance.

Pity those two have left, great value. Seems to be very quiet from an Irish poster perspective here to be honest, people heading to other decent forums like boards or reddit maybe.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 1:38 pm

The alleged victim of two Ireland and Ulster rugby stars accused of her r*** may be questioned during a pre-trial hearing, a lawyer has said.

Paddy Jackson, 25, and Stuart Olding, 24, deny all allegations against them following an incident last year.

A legal hitch has thrown plans to test the strength of the prosecution case on October 17 into doubt.

The hearing in Belfast could stretch to several days if the alleged injured party is called to attend, presiding district judge Fiona Bagnall said.

Tony Caher, a lawyer representing another man connected to the case but facing less serious charges, told Belfast Magistrates' Court: "We may require to ask this person questions."

Olding, of Ardenlee Street, Belfast, is charged with two counts of r***. Jackson, from Oakleigh Park, Belfast, is accused of one count of r*** and one of sexual assault.

The offences are alleged to have been committed against the same woman in Belfast in June 2016.

Fly-half Jackson has been capped for Ireland 25 times and centre Olding has played four times. They are established stars for Ulster Rugby.

The Irish Rugby Football Union and Ulster Rugby have said Jackson and Olding will not play again until court proceedings conclude.

Charges against two other men connected with the case have also been lodged with the court.

Blane McIlroy, 25, from Royal Lodge Road, Ballydollaghan, Belfast, is accused of one count of exposure.

Rory Harrison, also 25, from Manse Road, Belfast, is charged with perverting the course of justice and withholding information. Mr Caher represents Harrison.

The legal issue emerged as lawyers prepare for a preliminary enquiry which will outline the state's case against the accused before they are sent for trial. It is expected to be resolved within days, a solicitor said.

Lawyers for the accused said if the alleged victim was to attend it would change the way they approached the hearing.

District judge Bagnall said: "I think we would possibly lose October 17, we are into that territory.

"It may well take more than a day so the 17th could be redundant in any event."

The case was adjourned until later this month.


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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 1:41 pm

Marshes wrote:
Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

Stand has been gone a long time no?

After Darren Cave lost his starting spot Notch switched allegiance to Munster and spends all his his time debating on new fan forum called MunsterMunch.com which he set up with Sin e and Redstag.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 2:20 pm

rodders wrote:
Marshes wrote:
Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

Stand has been gone a long time no?

After Darren Cave lost his starting spot Notch switched allegiance to Munster and spends all his his time debating on new fan forum called MunsterMunch.com which he set up with Sin e and Redstag.

Typed in but no relevant website came up ?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 2:21 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
rodders wrote:
Marshes wrote:
Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

Stand has been gone a long time no?

After Darren Cave lost his starting spot Notch switched allegiance to Munster and spends all his his time debating on new fan forum called MunsterMunch.com which he set up with Sin e and Redstag.

Typed in but no relevant website came up ?

You're joking me right? Very Happy
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 2:27 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
rodders wrote:
Marshes wrote:
Question I wanted to ask but haven't seen. What has happened to the Ulster mods: Stand and Notch?

Stand has been gone a long time no?

After Darren Cave lost his starting spot Notch switched allegiance to Munster and spends all his his time debating on new fan forum called MunsterMunch.com which he set up with Sin e and Redstag.

Typed in but no relevant website came up ?

It's MunsterMunch.ie

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 2:47 pm

Typed in 'www.MunsterMunch.ie' still no joy.

Can you provide a direct link ?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by munkian on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 3:00 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:Typed in 'www.MunsterMunch.ie' still no joy.

Can you provide a direct link ?

Whistle
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by The Great Aukster on Wed 04 Oct 2017, 5:59 pm

Isn't DOD involved as well - although I though it was Munstermash.ie and only available on the dark web for vetted clientele!

There was another attempt called MunstersInk.ie, but that might have gone down the plughole...

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 9:33 am

Marcell Coetzee suffered a recurrence of left knee pain and swelling in training.

Due to the ongoing problems with this knee, he is travelling back to South Africa to seek the opinion of the surgeon who performed his original ACL repair.

Not looking good, it is sounding just like Ferris


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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 11:02 am

As I mentioned above they had no clue when he was coming back.
To be honest I'd give it to Christmas if no improvement  then its effectively over.
I wouldn't be surprised if we never see him again in an Ulster shirt

Not great on Payne either - even if he does come back we cannot sure it wont happen again

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:00 pm

I'd be surprised if we see him on a rugby field again, not sure why he's going back to the surgeon who carried out the surgery especially if it may be a case of him botching it

As for Payne, it'll depend on what the underlying issue was causing the headaches. If he looks after his neck he should be good to go

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:07 pm

Been on the Website

It is terrible - not as bad as the Pro14 one though which is terrible or indeed Walesonline which bombards you with crap

But can somebody tell me what this is supposed to mean?


// Current Standing                  //Last Time

No previous meeting found

Ulster = 3                                  5 Connacht


Have we resorted to posting total jibberish now steam

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:14 pm

Think someone has failed to adjust the site for the new set up we are 3rd in our conference and Connacht 5th in theirs

Started a match thread though and the teams are out, interesting selection in the forwards and one big omission

Ulster v Connacht

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:43 pm

Get this one of the reliable posters on the other site has posted:

Schalk van der Merwe, most likely to be released as he has failed to recover full fitness within the recommend time frame.

Now I have concerns given what I been told but not as bad as that.
We may have another Rhuardi Murphy on our hands - a project who never plays

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:45 pm

We had injuries in the past and went for medical jokers. Remember Tim Boys? Also the South African lock that came injured as a medical joker who's name I cannot remember, tip of my tongue though. This season it continues. We had Arno Botha ready for action until we found out, luckily enough he'd have seen more of GG than any team mates. We have Schalk VDM who's yet to play receiving some lovely rehab. Then of course we have Marcel Coetzee who we may as well say has yet to play for all the time he's been on the pitch. The guy is obviously crocked and needs cast adrift.
Where's Bryn getting his lists of candidates to sign? From South African A&E wards?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:46 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:Get this one of the reliable posters on the other site has posted:

Schalk van der Merwe, most likely to be released as he has failed to recover full fitness within the recommend time frame.

Now I have concerns given what I been told but not as bad as that.
We may have another Rhuardi Murphy on our hands - a project who never plays

Murphy was born in Dublin though

Seems someone in S. Africa has found a good way to save a few quid on medical expenses, send injured players to Ulster


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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 12:47 pm

We must have been typing at the same time Geoff, I'd not seen your previous post Re: VDM.
Flippin heck, it's beyond a joke.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 1:28 pm

marty2086 wrote:I'd be surprised if we see him on a rugby field again, not sure why he's going back to the surgeon who carried out the surgery especially if it may be a case of him botching it

As for Payne, it'll depend on what the underlying issue was causing the headaches. If he looks after his neck he should be good to go

Read elsewhere its for a second medical opinion, that Ulster have already decided he's crocked.

I think serious questions need to be raised about the Ulster medical team and in Byrn Cunningham.

I've said before the Cornerflag/Esperitiff connection with the club and in particular Bryn does not sit well with me. I don't want to make allegations of actual wrongdoing but to me there is a conflict of interest, even if he's no longer involved officially, there is too close a connection with some of our current and ex players for my liking and I do wonder if the correct judgement is there with some of these signings.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 1:50 pm

Sorry rodders but Im not sure what the problem with Esportif is, they can't be blamed for injuries in rugby. Coetzee picked up his first injury after signing with Ulster, the second while with Ulster. vDM got injured after signing.

The only one you can take issue with is Botha who Ulster cancelled the contract of when he got injured after he signed

Injuries are part of the game and it seems we are having some pretty crappy luck on that front when it comes to signings

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 2:22 pm

So back to Coetzee and VDM. Do we just do without or do we get ourselves injury jokers for the remainder of the season. We'll be short 2 more players one of which we know looked liked being a key player. We'll not find anyone like that but those spots could do with being filled not forgetting Leali'ifano leaves in January too.
This season is a bit like Marcel's knee.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 2:33 pm

We would not get a prop but a backrower would be possible.

The reality is we are, probably, going into next year with the crowd pleasing but limited Deysel the only NIQ on the books.

Marty makes a good point re when Coetzee and vDM got injured.
Having said that I have always had big reservation re vDM as a prop in terms of technique - may have something to do with his injuries

Some of the cover players have been pretty ropey though.
Other than Boyes they have been a pretty useless bunch (since Terblanche), at least from what I saw.
Smacks of desperation

Point taken re Murphy, not a Project, but you get my drift a Prop from over the equator with a bit of hype and no delivery.
Also remember the days of projects with 3 year residency finish in the New Year

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 3:16 pm

Murphy was probably unlucky with his timing, he came in with the new scrums laws and had Clarke teaching it to him

Given that it looks like we won't be cancelling Coetzees contract just yet, I doubt there's much room in the budget to spend too much on injury replacements. Would tapping Bristol for someone like Jack Lam, Jordan Crane or Luatua on loan be a bad idea?

I read earlier in the week that Dan Tuohy had gone on loan to Leicester from there, they loaned Palamo to the Dragons and Olly Robinson to Cardiff and given that they'll likely run away with the Championship they could maybe spare one of those guys for a few months at least

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 3:54 pm

marty2086 wrote:Sorry rodders but Im not sure what the problem with Esportif is,

The issue is there is questionable judgement around our recruitment of players when there is so involvement from club officials and people associated or formally associated with the agency representing so many of our players.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 4:17 pm

rodders wrote:
marty2086 wrote:Sorry rodders but Im not sure what the problem with Esportif is,

The issue is there is questionable judgement around our recruitment of players when there is so involvement from club officials and people associated or formally associated with the agency representing so many of our players.

No one complained when one Cornerflags founders was in charge of the recruitment though

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Standulstermen on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 10:11 pm

I still lurk a bit lads. Busy with work mostly which has curtailed my posting.

I said at the time we signed Deysel you could literally go a random spot in NZ throw a rock and hit a better backrower. Not that Deysel is bad but the depth of talent in Nz is ludicrous. Look at the Gibbens fella in Glasgow. He's doing very well and he was a backup at the Hurricanes. There's a lot of guys like Elliot Dixon, Jordan Taufua and Brad Shields who a probably not going to wear the black shirt and might be open. Of course there are others but those three would be bloody good

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Redman on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 10:44 pm

Comments from Rodders and Marty rings true. I was trying to rationalise the story of Coetzee being sent back to South Africa to see the original surgeon. I can't see any reason to do that other than break the bad news.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Redman on Thu 05 Oct 2017, 11:28 pm

Team looks like they're going with experience. Each player on their day are pretty top drawer but we need to pull it all together for 80+ minutes.

Huge, huge fan of Treadwell but think he needs a run of games to get upto form. On paper that's a good 2nd row and Henderson at 6 I'm never going to complain about but I hope the balance works. Shame we can't get a combo of Deysel at 6 and a proper 8.

Bowe at 13 is certainly where they see him.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Fri 06 Oct 2017, 8:31 am

Bowe at 13 is where Schmidt sees him as bench cover for the autumn Internationals.
Tommy likes the idea

Ulster do not share that view

Payne, Marshall and Cave are all 13s higher up the Ulster ladder

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Fri 06 Oct 2017, 9:36 am

Given our luck with injuries and the recent and current injuries of some of the 13s available to us it's not a bad idea to use Bowe on occasion and keep Joe happy at the same time, need to keep our options open and have some depth in positions

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Fri 06 Oct 2017, 10:19 am

Spot on - for the games Bowe played 13 non of the 3 options were available so we were able to keep Joe happy without playing Bowe in front of our preferred players.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by rodders on Fri 06 Oct 2017, 11:05 am

geoff999rugby wrote:Bowe at 13 is where Schmidt sees him as bench cover for the autumn Internationals.
Tommy likes the idea

Ulster do not share that view

Payne, Marshall and Cave are all 13s higher up the Ulster ladder

Well I'd agree with Schmidt on this. Payne's future is in question, even if he recovers his injury record has been pretty bad.

Cave is a average player who's probably better at 12 anyway - where we need more options with Olding out of picture.

Marshall offers a bit more all round but is inconsistent with form and error prone at times in big games.

Bowe arguably produced his best form at 13 for the Ospreys a few years back and with his age and the depth we have on the wings then it makes sense that to get him to cover a few positions now in the twilight of his career.

Ulster have more to gain than Ireland from Bowe getting games there imo, as you'd imagine Ringrose is nailed on to start at 13 in the Autumn and Bundee Aki available soon.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Fri 06 Oct 2017, 11:16 am

But Bowe has looked poor defensively this year and his passing isn't the greatest.
In fact that has been the weakest part of our performances so far

Remind me again who our defence coach is ?

You are being very harsh on Cave who is far more than average (poor on Saturday though) and still a good defence organiser.
Marshall remains a better 12 but needs must and McCloskey is playing well

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

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