The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

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The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by The Loaded Dog on Wed 22 Nov 2017, 9:43 pm

First topic message reminder :

1st Test Brisbane, November 23-27, 2017

Australia:
Bancroft, Warner, Khawaja, Smith *, Handscomb, S Marsh, Paine †, Starc, Cummins, Lyon, Hazelwood

England:
Cook, Stoneman, Vince, Root *, Malan, Ali, Bairstow †, Woakes, Ball, Broad, Anderson


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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:31 am

This pair keep rolling along offering precious little chances. England 116 for 1 and this partnership now bigger than any psrtnership England had in the last Ashes series in Australia.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:36 am

A rare play and miss from Vince off Pat Cummins bowling.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:43 am

Stoneman edges through the slips to bring up his 50 on his Ashes debut. England 120 for 1. Vince 67 and Stoneman 51.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:46 am

Vince outside edge dropped off Lyon's bowling by Paine.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:55 am

Australia desperate for a breakthrough now as tea approaches. England stand firm on 127 for 1 with the partnership now 125.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 5:58 am

Cummins bowls Stoneman. Cracking inswinging delivery. Great knock of 53 for Stoneman on the brink of tea. England 127 for 2. Root comes to the crease.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:00 am

Cummins with reverse swing going here.


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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:03 am

At tea England go in 128 for 2. Vince 72 and Root 1. Another session to England but reverse swing now beginning to take effect so the evening session could be very tricky for England.

Great knock by James Vince supported very well by Mark Stoneman to put England in a good position.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:25 am

A quiet start to the final session. England 130 for 2. Vince 72 Root 3.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:38 am

England continue to build a solid platform. They are 144 for 2. Vince 82 and Root 7
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:40 am

Starc whistles one past Root's outside edge.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:44 am

Cracking run out from Lyon. Vince goes for 83 - a really frustrating way to go. Never a single there.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:44 am

Wonderful fielding, stupid running

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:45 am

England 145 for 3. Time for Malan to deliver at test level.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by alfie on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:46 am

You seem to be doing this on your own , Craig Smile

I guess not many were up early in southern parts ...or they aren't game to risk jinxing England after that promising start...

I only just got home from work and after watching a few nice shots I have had to witness the rather unnecessary run out of Vince : sharp fielding , yes...but the run was not really on.

Well played , by Vince , to most people's surprise : but he's given Australia a bit of a free kick there...

Lot of work for the rest of the bats .

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:50 am

What a ridiculous way to throw away your wicket after all that hard work form Vince - barely looked troubled all day!
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:50 am

alfie wrote:You seem to be doing this on your own , Craig Smile

I guess not many were up early in southern parts ...or they aren't game to risk jinxing England after that promising start...


Well someone else will have to take up the baton tomorrow as I am working on night shiift throughout the whole day's play.

England could do with a 50+ partnership here to re-establish themselves.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:53 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:What a ridiculous way to throw away your wicket after all that hard work form Vince - barely looked troubled all day!

It was a waste. I put it down to fatigue. His concentration had looked less tuned in over the last half hour or so of his innings.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by alfie on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 6:55 am

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Wonderful fielding, stupid running

It was indeed an excellent piece of fielding . But apart from the riskiness of the run , Vince didn't look to be going flat out ...appears to have only realized he was in trouble when it was too late . I may be wrong (looking at replays in slo-mo can be misleading ) but that is the impression I get.

England will be pleased to have got to a reasonable position when many expected them to be 30/3 ; but they will be a bit disappointed to have lost one immediately prior to tea and one to a run out , after all the hard work to blunt the Australian new ball attack during those first two sessions. The day could still go either way...

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:06 am

Australia pressing now.Lyon getting some movement. England need to stick in there. England 156 for 3.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by alfie on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:08 am

I guess while we are all (rightly) critical of Vince for getting out like that when he should have been eyeing one of guildford's big hundreds , we should not neglect to give him a serious helping of praise for playing the innings he did clap

Even if the pitch is fine for batting it is still an achievement to score 83 against this much-vaunted Aussie pace attack in its favourite lair ; especially when you are playing your first game back after a year or so out of the side following an underwhelming first try in the Test arena.
Let us hope he uses this as a springboard to a career - he is certainly elegant enough to watch thumbsup

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by alfie on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:12 am

CaledonianCraig wrote:Australia pressing now.Lyon getting some movement. England need to stick in there. England 156 for 3.

Yes I understand there has been a bit there for the spinner today - unusual for Brisbane day one ! Lyon has turned himself into a more than handy bowler ...not just control and relief for the pace men ; he can exert pressure of his own , and England will need to be on guard against him.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:14 am

Indeed alfie.

He only offered ONE chance in that innings where Paine dropped him.on 68. That is real good going considering he isn't an established player in the team. I just think as Boycott has just said he got fatigued.

It is an innings that will boost his confidence surely.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:17 am

alfie wrote:
CaledonianCraig wrote:Australia pressing now.Lyon getting some movement. England need to stick in there. England 156 for 3.

Yes I understand there has been a bit there for the spinner today - unusual for Brisbane day one !  Lyon has turned himself into a more than handy bowler ...not just control and relief for the pace men ; he can exert pressure of his own , and England will need to be on guard against him.

Yes Lyon has bowled good tight lines and got good movement throughout the day. Causing Root concern now.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:25 am

Lyon is bowling lovely and deserves reward

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:36 am

Root out now for 15. Cummins bags his second wicket. England now 163 for 4. Is England's day unravelling?
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:37 am

Cook and Root out cheaply...England never gonna score big when that’s the case
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:39 am

Boycott is woeful on comms absolutely awful
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by alfie on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:40 am

Root falls lbw...that was a pretty obvious review , looked out in real time. Good bowling from Cummins .

Big blow for England . To be honest I wasn't too surprised as Root didn't look himself today...un-characteristically passive , never seemed quite settled. Hope the pressure of leading the team in Australia isn't going to shackle him.

Danger that this could unravel now and undo all that early good work...

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:46 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Cook and Root out cheaply...England never gonna score big when that’s the case

Normally I would agree as others haven't delivered. However, Stoneman and Vince have weighed in with biggish scores so kind of compensates a little for Cook and Root going cheaply.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 7:49 am

England 182 for 4 now. Malan 16 and Ali 11
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by JDizzle on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:11 am

Well, you can certainly see why Mason Crane was being considered for this game. That delivery to Moeen in the last over was an answered lite ripper from Lyon.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:11 am

Australia take the new ball with England 196 for 4.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:16 am

Starc has an lbw appeal turned down which is reviewed but is not out. And bad light brings an end to a tense opening day. England close on 196 for 4. Malan and Ali survive.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:18 am

How Lyon didn’t get a wicket all day is beyond me - bowled wonderfully
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:18 am

Just England's day but Australia ended the day on the up.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by LivinginItaly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:23 am

Bad light stops play for the day. Well although it could have been a bit better, to be honest I am very happy ( and suprised) by our position given the fact that both of our "key players" failed. I will admit I only thought we could post competitive totals if they both went big. The first day at least gives me some mild optimism for the rest of the game and indeed the series.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:34 am

alfie wrote:I guess while we are all (rightly) critical of Vince for getting out like that when he should have been eyeing one of guildford's big hundreds , we should not neglect to give him a serious helping of praise for playing the innings he did clap

Even if the pitch is fine for batting it is still an achievement to score 83 against this much-vaunted Aussie pace attack in its favourite lair ; especially when you are playing your first game back after a year or so out of the side following an underwhelming first try in the Test arena.  
Let us hope he uses this as a springboard to a career - he is certainly elegant enough to watch thumbsup

Mornin' / evenin' all - saw the first hour live and have just been catching up in the last twenty minutes or so. Vince played well in the hour I saw, confident and easy on the eye with his cover driving but not reckless. Well done to him (and probably the selectors for his call up) for then going on beyond his too often bogey score of 30. Disappointing for Vince and England that he didn't get to three figures and beyond but, perhaps surprisingly, I have some sympathy for the way he was out. It was an excellent clean take and then amazingly accurate throw from an off balance position by Lyon. I thought it was understandable - if not right - to go for the run and seek to put pressure on the hosts. As Alfie posted, Vince could and should have been motoring more although I'm not sure that would have altered the result.

Earlier, Stoneman lived up to his 'Rocky' nickname with a very solid performance. A beauty of a ball from Cummins that got him and horrible timing for us, on the stroke of tea. Australia will be delighted to have both Cook and Root back in the hutch for less than 20 runs.

Anyway, that's it for the day. 196/4. Pretty evenly poised. Maybe Australia narrowly ahead with England having to start again tomorrow. The warning words of Olly's nemesis Sir Geoffrey about the batting side adding 2 more wickets to the scoreboard shouldn't be forgotten.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:39 am

Given how poor our top 5 have been and the concerns around the pitch assisting quicks with the new ball its not a bad start at all. But losing the wickets to the old ball, and getting a run out in particular, has really cost England a great position. Cooks form is starting to be a concern.
Aus coming in off a fairly short day with a new ball in the morning and two batsmen having to start over again gives them a great opportunity to get England out for under 300, and ceratinly Enghland getting to 400 looks a pipe dream now. If as expected this pitch stays strong for batting then that really is short of what England needed.
So whilst this is better than it might have been and not as bad as last time (yet) Im a bit less confident about Englands position than some.

The positives...both Malan and Moeen have played up the order and are not completely hopeless against new ball bowling. Australias bowlers could tire tomorrow, theyve already had to use Lyon more than they might have wanted to on a pitch thats not offering much for him. Every over they can survive against the quicks is a bonus for this game and the series. If they can get at Lyon a bit more then Aus are short on places to turn.
Australias batting looks fragile. So maybe 350 will be enough. At least they are in the game anyway.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by GSC on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:44 am

Looking like Englands day, until a late fight back from Aus leaves in the balance.

Think England will be much happier to get through the first day though, especially with neither of their best 2 batsmen firing.
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by LivinginItaly on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:49 am

I think 400 is still a reasonable target. Obviously it depends on getting through the first session without too much damage.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:49 am

GSC wrote:Looking like Englands day, until a late fight back from Aus leaves in the balance.

Think England will be much happier to get through the first day though, especially with neither of their best 2 batsmen firing.


Im noit sure if thats good or bad ...it certainly is great to see Stoneman continuing his run of scores, and Vince actually making some runsis very good. Malan too has made a start, thats great news and shows they arent overawed. Vince in particular had a lot to prove.
But both Cook and Root failing is a worry ...certainly with Cook whos looked out of sorts for a while. England need these senior guys to step up, if their best bats are failing then that has to be a worry.

And of course no-one got a 160 so they cant win a game Rolling Eyes

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by sirfredperry on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 8:54 am

GSC wrote:Looking like Englands day, until a late fight back from Aus leaves in the balance.

Think England will be much happier to get through the first day though, especially with neither of their best 2 batsmen firing.
Position is similar to the start at Brisbane in 1986. Slow first day then Botham (this time Ali ? Bairstow?) fireworks on the second day.
   As GSC says, nearly 200 for four with little from Cook and Root is good. I must say I was surprised at Vince's call up for the Ashes squad, but he's already gone a long way to justifying his selection.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:03 am

Gooseberry wrote:Given how poor our top 5 have been and the concerns around the pitch assisting quicks with the new ball its not a bad start at all. But losing the wickets to the old ball, and getting a run out in particular, has really cost England a great position. Cooks form is starting to be a concern.
Aus coming in off a fairly short day with a new ball in the morning and two batsmen having to start over again gives them a great opportunity to get England out for under 300, and ceratinly Enghland getting to 400 looks a pipe dream now. If as expected this pitch stays strong for batting then that really is short of what England needed.
So whilst this is better than it might have been and not as bad as last time (yet) Im a bit less confident about Englands position than some.

The positives...both Malan and Moeen have played up the order and are not completely hopeless against new ball bowling. Australias bowlers could tire tomorrow, theyve already had to use Lyon more than they might have wanted to on a pitch thats not offering much for him. Every over they can survive against the quicks is a bonus for this game and the series. If they can get at Lyon a bit more then Aus are short on places to turn.
Australias batting looks fragile. So maybe 350 will be enough. At least they are in the game anyway.

In a confusing interview soon after play, Pietersen suggested we should have looked to score more today against Lyon. That's not entirely daft although easier said than done. However where I didn't follow him was his apparent suggestion that England would have been in a better place if he had ended up with a return of 3/70 or 3/80. He apparently bowled very well (I didn't see much of him) but he went wicketless - ok, probably some luck going our way there but his actual return of 0/40 is preferable to England than him picking up a day one threefer at cost and our batters should get credit for that.

If anyone is to get after Lyon tomorrow, Moeen would be my bet.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by GSC on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:24 am

As much as anything today was about playing yourself into the series, Aus are near invincible here. Can't win the game today but can certainly lose it
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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by dummy_half on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:26 am

Virtually 200-4 at the end of day 1 is clearly a 'not bad' position, although obviously would be better with our normal batting depth including Stokes rather than a tail ender. Very much a position that can go either way - England bat well tomorrow and 400 + is reasonable, but alternatively getting skittled for 275 is still equally possible.

At least unlike the last tour, we haven't lost the Ashes on day 1...

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:34 am

Dummy - 400 seems a long way off to me atm although that may just be the pessimism of an England supporter coming out. Wink

I do agree about it being a 'not bad' position. Feel that applies to the two sides. Maybe 6.5/10 for both England and Australia today with the hosts a touch closer to 7.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:49 am

guildfordbat wrote:
Gooseberry wrote:Given how poor our top 5 have been and the concerns around the pitch assisting quicks with the new ball its not a bad start at all. But losing the wickets to the old ball, and getting a run out in particular, has really cost England a great position. Cooks form is starting to be a concern.
Aus coming in off a fairly short day with a new ball in the morning and two batsmen having to start over again gives them a great opportunity to get England out for under 300, and ceratinly Enghland getting to 400 looks a pipe dream now. If as expected this pitch stays strong for batting then that really is short of what England needed.
So whilst this is better than it might have been and not as bad as last time (yet) Im a bit less confident about Englands position than some.

The positives...both Malan and Moeen have played up the order and are not completely hopeless against new ball bowling. Australias bowlers could tire tomorrow, theyve already had to use Lyon more than they might have wanted to on a pitch thats not offering much for him. Every over they can survive against the quicks is a bonus for this game and the series. If they can get at Lyon a bit more then Aus are short on places to turn.
Australias batting looks fragile. So maybe 350 will be enough. At least they are in the game anyway.

In a confusing interview soon after play, Pietersen suggested we should have looked to score more today against Lyon. That's not entirely daft although easier said than done. However where I didn't follow him was his apparent suggestion that England would have been in a better place if he had ended up with a return of 3/70 or 3/80.  He apparently bowled very well (I didn't see much of him) but he went wicketless - ok, probably some luck going our way there but his actual return of 0/40 is preferable to England than him picking up a day one threefer at cost and our batters should get credit for that.

If anyone is to get after Lyon tomorrow, Moeen would be my bet.

Similar thing on cricinfo ... I think the point is that Aus were able to freely rotate and not overwork their very limited seamers by having a settled Lyon tieing an end down and creating pressure. Scoring runs off him might have forced him out of the attack, and put more pressure on the seamers.
As you say though they could easily have left themselves in a real mess by trying to get at him. This is both what made Pietersen great and eternally short of legendary (and drew the rage from the likes of Boycott). Sometimes he would gamble a bit too much.
England under Bayliss are suppossed to be playing without fear, at least thats been where theyve found succes in limited overs. Im not sure they are (or have the ability to) taking that to tests.

And yes if they get through the new ball without a collapse then Moeen and Woakes could plunder some good runs form Lyon ... theres a strong chance they wont get the chance though.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 9:55 am

Cheers, Goose. I suspect Lyon deserves more praise for tying down an end than the England batters warrant criticism for it happening. As I said, I didn't see that much of his bowling.

Going out now but I'll look at cricinfo later.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

Post by Duty281 on Thu 23 Nov 2017, 10:00 am

Decent, but not great, day for England.

Very nicely placed now. The middle and lower order might be blown away by the new ball, or they could propel England past 400.

Intriguing day 2 in place.

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Re: The Ashes: 1st Test, Brisbane

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