Brand new idea for underdog test teams

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Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Flintoff01 on Fri 24 Nov 2017, 1:04 am

I've come up with a way to revolutionise test match cricket.
Test cricket has reached a stage whereby the touring team loses every single time.
I'm suggesting a way to never lose ever again. It's all based on a very simple albeit negative playing style.
From now on the touring team fields 11 batsmen. The plan isn't to win but to draw.
Fielding 11 batsmen would enable the following to occur
1. bowlers for the home team would fatigue due to the lack of easy free wickets and better technique of the batsmen
2. Batsmen themselves would have less pressure knowing that they wouldn't need to rotate the strike carefully when playing with a traditional tailender
3. When visiting teams- let's say India comes to England they lack the specialist bowlers to take advantage of the pitch. Often the wickets are due to poor concentration rather than outright skill. Having 'piechuckers' wouldn't be as much of a disadvantage as one would think. Have a look at the 2011 tour of England vs India, the specialist bowlers were as bad as some first time bowlers ( tendulkar, dhoni all chipped in with some wickets)
4. Having a mammoth batting line up would increase the chances of a score of around 400 which itself would waste many days and increase the chances of a draw

This would ultimately result in draws away from home And wins at home
Both would ensure you become the best ranked test match team
Also worth mentioning that fielding positions would be very negative, with many men on the boundary. Running between the wickets would take quite a toll on the batsmen.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by It Must Be Love on Fri 24 Nov 2017, 2:22 am

Wouldn’t work, the opposition would get 600 within a day and cruise to a win.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by wisden on Fri 24 Nov 2017, 12:25 pm

bloody silly idea!

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Flintoff01 on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 3:57 am

Do you want to substantiate your argument wisden?
This is the batting unit India should field when they tour England. I fully expect a mammoth score with this lineup:
Rahul (WK)
Vijay
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Dhawan
Rohit
Nair
Pandya
Jadeja
Ashwin

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Pal Joey on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 7:48 am

Shouldn't there be 12 batsmen... for 11 wickets?

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 8:09 am

Not sure why it would result in wins at home?

Wouldn’t it make sense to field 11 all rounders?

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by alfie on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 8:41 am

What a load of rubbish. Any team gets bowled out eventually and if you have no bowlers proper batsmen will score six per over (at least !) without a risk in the world.

Suspect the OP is having a laugh.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Pal Joey on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 9:07 am

Yes indeed.

Also the fundamental premise is wrong as we both know, alfie.
The really good teams do win away. Maybe they should only field 10 players in those situations? Wink

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by wisden on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 3:22 pm

clearly a wum

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Flintoff01 on Sat 25 Nov 2017, 11:58 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Not sure why it would result in wins at home?

Wouldn’t it make sense to field 11 all rounders?

Should have made it slightly clearer, when playing at home the 'traditional' team template should be followed as for teams like India, its only away from the subcontinent that they're considered underdogs.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Flintoff01 on Sun 26 Nov 2017, 12:02 am

alfie wrote:What a load of rubbish.  Any team gets bowled out eventually and if you have no bowlers proper batsmen will score six per over (at least !) without a risk in the world.

Suspect the OP is having a laugh.

If you look at the team I suggested, I've been somewhat flexible by fielding 3 all rounders (all with very respectable batting averages) in ashwin, jadeja and pandya. Two of those are the top 4 test bowlers according to the ICC rankings, so I think the suggestion of 6rpo is unlikely.


Last edited by Flintoff01 on Sun 26 Nov 2017, 12:07 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Flintoff01 on Sun 26 Nov 2017, 12:06 am

The Loaded Dog wrote:Yes indeed.

Also the fundamental premise is wrong as we both know, alfie.
The really good teams do win away. Maybe they should only field 10 players in those situations? Wink

India has won 3 test series in England in the last 70 years, the thought process behind this tactic is to create an exciting narrative about a team that is invincible due to winning at home and drawing away from home.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by It Must Be Love on Sun 26 Nov 2017, 2:24 am

Flintoff01 wrote:Do you want to substantiate your argument wisden?
This is the batting unit India should field when they tour England. I fully expect a mammoth score with this lineup:
Rahul (WK)
Vijay
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Dhawan
Rohit
Nair
Pandya
Jadeja
Ashwin
India already played many all rounders, so that's pretty similar to their normal XI with the exception of one of Dhawan/Vijay, Rohit, and Nair. 
Given past history of how Indian batsman have fared in England, I think an average of 30 for all 3 of them is optimistic. Even if they get that- it's 90 runs per innings, probably around 60 more than they would have got anyway. 
Those 60 runs in each innings, and the time it takes up, will be easily outnumbered by the extra runs England will get- that bowling attack would be pretty toothless in english conditions (without Shami, Yadav, Kumar). England will probably cross 400 every time and with a higher run rate, against that bowling line up. Would be an absolute crushing.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by No name Bertie on Thu 28 Dec 2017, 4:33 am

Flintoff - the key idea is to play for a draw if you feel certain that you cannot beat the opposition team.   But I have never heard any team captain say before a test match that they would play for a draw, instead they say they would play to win.  

Having good bowlers and good fielders can also help to draw a match by restricting the run rate and not giving away "extras".   If you think about it you need to have a balanced team to prevent a loss within 5 days of play.  

It is more to do with accuracy and control in the bowling and not taking on risky shots in the batting if a side wishes to try to avoid a defeat by extending the game - hoping either for a draw or a win.  Also each player has to maintain their concentration throughout, and have an unflagging mental determination - especially the batsmen.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 28 Dec 2017, 8:31 am

You're also going to be asking batsmen, who've barely bowled more than 2/3 over spells in their life, to suddenly be throwing down 150+ overs in an innings between them - which will either result in fatigue/injury and you're going to be chasing the ball forever in the field as well, again fatiguing your team further.

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by eirebilly on Thu 28 Dec 2017, 8:38 am

Part of test match cricket is setting up a track to favour your own team. I much prefer to see results than draws myself.

What could be an idea is that the home side set the track up as they wish (already happens) but the opposition get to select the ball the teams use.

Just say now in the Ashes, the Aussie track but instead of the kookaburra ball, they use the Duke ball which the English are more used too.

Not sure if it would make a difference but it may be a psychological advantage...
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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Pal Joey on Thu 28 Dec 2017, 9:16 am

Your point being? Smile

We don't need to give England a leg up after today's performance.

How would you feel if they forced England to wear an extra jumper and snow shoes when Australia toured?

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by eirebilly on Thu 28 Dec 2017, 9:17 am

I have no point LD, surprised you even read my ramblings these days Very Happy
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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 29 Nov 2018, 1:33 pm

I now see this for what it is, Ed Smith’s first idea of how to get runs across the England team.

He’s now finally settling for all players being all rounders. Once he phases out Jimmy, he can play:

Jennings (whose fielding/catching is so good it counts)
Bairstow (who cares if he’s not an opener, we have 11 batsmen - qualifies as wkt keeper/batsman)
Buttler (wkt keeper/ bat)
Root (all the spin/bat)
Pope (wkt/bat)
Stokes (all rounder)
Foakes (wkt/bat)
Ali (all rounder)
Woakes (AR)
Curran (AR)
Archer (AR)


Great to see you used the forum for brainstorming, Ed. Welcome aboard

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Re: Brand new idea for underdog test teams

Post by subhranshu.kumar.5 on Fri 30 Nov 2018, 4:37 am

One of the worst idea to listen to.

If the world follows as you say, the charm of the tussle that we enjoy between bat and ball will fade away. For example in the first test against England Kohli batted with the tail and took the score to level. If you are real test cricket follower that inning was a gem and it would be lost in your idea.

Rather than this today, every country should allow some foreign players to be a part of their domestic circuit as is being done in county. It will help a lot. For example if likes of Root, ABD, Williamson share dressing room with young Ranji players, the later will groom better. Also lesser known players from foreign country will get accustomed Indian condition.

We can still make the game competitive and that too by maintaining the same format. We just have to tweak some rules. Also there is a need to increase the frequency of test matches for big countries. Also touring team should play a game as a practise with the near by low ranked team. It will boost the newbie a lot like Pakistan played Ireland before England tour. Similarly every touring team should play a test match against Afghanistan before the full fledged test series against India.

However at last cheers for your idea mate but was not impressive.
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