The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

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The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by Pot Hale on Wed 24 Jan 2018, 12:09 am

First topic message reminder :

Some of the Irish provinces seem to be doing fine.  Munster might be able to pay back a few shillings to Landsdowne HQ this season.  Leinster have finally started sharing. Connacht have survived Mr Grumpy and have managed another Challenge Cup quarter.  Could they make the final?
Ulster need a separate topic to cover all their issues.  Oh - and they have one.  

Italy.  Treviso are now Benetton and improving to the point of it being grudgingly admitted outside of Italy.  Zebre?  See Ulster above.  The FIR continue to fiddle the other unions while Rome burns.  

Scarlets on the other hand continue to see Byrne roam.  And sidestep.  The WRU must be grinning from ear to ear as Scarlets are simply steaming.   Who needs union monies when you can assemble a squad like this?  Top of their conference and finishing top of their pool in front of a packed house to gain a home quarterfinal in the Champions Cup. What more could you ask for?  Possibly a sneaky Welsh cap for Tadgh Beirne but little else to complain about.  If Gatland can harness the Scarlets, a la Leinster and Glasgow, and get Wales moving to the top in the Six Nations, the WRU might need to send a little more love (hard cash) over Llanelli way to encourage them further.  

Dragons got bought by the WRU.  And then hired an Irish coach. And then fixed their pitch.  And then things went so so.  And the jury went out on Jackman.  And then they started losing. A lot.  And then they had lots of announcements about new players for next season. And then they got knocked out of the Challenge Cup.  
And now it’s a wait for another season.  Not sure if the jury has come back in yet but Jackman has a battle on his hands.  

Ospreys continue to plumb new depths and eventually decided to fire their coach after failing in the Champions Cup once again.  Will they be in the Challenge Cup next season?

Cardiff have at least made the knockouts of the Challenge Cup but they’re still batting eyes at the WRU some say.  Will they succumb to the union’s clutches?

All the way down to Port Elizabeth for the new entrants.

The Southern Kings? See Zebre.  X 100.   Massive squad revamp needed and SARU investment.

Cheetahs?   Just when they’d notched another triumph on their league bedpost, came the news that another of their players had been nicked for another SR side. Their top try scorer is leaving too.  They’ve 8 wins in the bag, can they get a few more to make it into the playoffs?  

And finally the Scots.  Cockerill is definitely making inroads and if it doesn’t happen this season, they’ll be making life difficult in 2018/19 for a few of the higher up clubs. Their sassy and classy neighbours look strong prospects for the Championship title with a single loss so far.   Not too long ago, the SRU was making plaintive noises about the costs of running the two clubs and seeking private investors.  Then they went quiet.  Then they announced a profit for the first time in a long while.  And investment in academy is starting to pay off.  And the Test team isn’t doing too shabby either.  SRU CEO, Mark Dodson, says long term objective is to secure external investment to ensure the future of the game.  

We’ve had the first inkling of a change and expected increase in TV revenues for the Championship with EirSport announced as the new broadcaster for games in the Irish territory.  Anayi & Co still have to deliver a substantial increase on previous revenues.  The SARU/SuperSport deal has ensured part of that with a reported 36m six-year agreement.   What will GB deliver?

Private investment and Union control/money.  Will a happy marriage eventually be reached?
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 12:57 pm

marty2086 wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
The war between the Welsh fans and the regions is far more detrimental to the league...Just look at the truly embarrassing attendances the Ospreys have been getting this season. Where has all their fans gone or do they only turn up when the Ospreys Are doing Well?

I assume you also think bringing the Kings into the competition was a backward step that has completely devalued the league then. Given their woeful attendances yes?

You mean attendances that are higher than both Italian teams and are higher than some Scottish and Welsh in some rounds?

No. I mean the average Kings attendance being lower than the average Ospreys attendance.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 12:58 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
The war between the Welsh fans and the regions is far more detrimental to the league...Just look at the truly embarrassing attendances the Ospreys have been getting this season. Where has all their fans gone or do they only turn up when the Ospreys Are doing Well?

I assume you also think bringing the Kings into the competition was a backward step that has completely devalued the league then. Given their woeful attendances yes?
Yes, they have been an epic failure but at least their attendances have always been woeful unlike the Ospreys who; for instance once got a crowd of over 10,000 against Ulster in a regular league game. The league needs a well supported Ospreys team.

To answer your question of why the ospreys attendances are so low - it's a combination of the ospreys playing so awfully, the fixtures being on 6 nations weekend and a number of other things. But I'm going to guess you knew all that and just wanted a cheap dig at a Welsh region's attendance.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:02 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
The war between the Welsh fans and the regions is far more detrimental to the league...Just look at the truly embarrassing attendances the Ospreys have been getting this season. Where has all their fans gone or do they only turn up when the Ospreys Are doing Well?

I assume you also think bringing the Kings into the competition was a backward step that has completely devalued the league then. Given their woeful attendances yes?

You mean attendances that are higher than both Italian teams and are higher than some Scottish and Welsh in some rounds?

No. I mean the average Kings attendance being lower than the average Ospreys attendance.

Erm

What? That's some barometer Rolling Eyes

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:07 pm

marty2086 wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
The war between the Welsh fans and the regions is far more detrimental to the league...Just look at the truly embarrassing attendances the Ospreys have been getting this season. Where has all their fans gone or do they only turn up when the Ospreys Are doing Well?

I assume you also think bringing the Kings into the competition was a backward step that has completely devalued the league then. Given their woeful attendances yes?

You mean attendances that are higher than both Italian teams and are higher than some Scottish and Welsh in some rounds?

No. I mean the average Kings attendance being lower than the average Ospreys attendance.

Erm

What? That's some barometer Rolling Eyes

The Ospreys low attendances are detrimental to the league according to a compatriot of yours. I didn't bring it up.

Logic dictates that other low attenndaces will also devalue the league. Or is it only low Welsh attenndaces that devalue the league?

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:10 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
The war between the Welsh fans and the regions is far more detrimental to the league...Just look at the truly embarrassing attendances the Ospreys have been getting this season. Where has all their fans gone or do they only turn up when the Ospreys Are doing Well?

I assume you also think bringing the Kings into the competition was a backward step that has completely devalued the league then. Given their woeful attendances yes?
Yes, they have been an epic failure but at least their attendances have always been woeful unlike the Ospreys who; for instance once got a crowd of over 10,000 against Ulster in a regular league game. The league needs a well supported Ospreys team.

To answer your question of why the ospreys attendances are so low - it's a combination of the ospreys playing so awfully, the fixtures being on 6 nations weekend and a number of other things. But I'm going to guess you knew all that and just wanted a cheap dig at a Welsh region's attendance.
Well the 6 nations has nothing to do with it as the attendances have been awful all season. You would expect a drop in attendances with the team not performing well but this is excessive. 

What chance do the regions have if the fans dissapear when the clubs go through a bad patch? The likes of Ulster, Bath, Gloucester and Bordeaux have all had terrible seasons in the last few years yet retain a fan base. Even Connacht have been woeful this season but manage to sell out most games. Why is the regions fan base so fickle? This is what damages the leagues image the most.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:13 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:

To answer your question of why the ospreys attendances are so low - it's a combination of the ospreys playing so awfully, the fixtures being on 6 nations weekend and a number of other things. But I'm going to guess you knew all that and just wanted a cheap dig at a Welsh region's attendance.

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

You can't cherry pick all the "bad" Irish bits like Union run sides being relatively successful and having relatively healthy crowds and ignore the "good" bits like the Welsh dimension.  You love to focus all your energy on the Irish bit, hoping to keep the natives on the defensive.  Today you're having to fight a rear-guard action when the focus instead falls on the Welsh dimension of the True Love League.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:16 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
Well the 6 nations has nothing to do with it as the attendances have been awful all season.

Ireland v Wales 2.15pm

Sco v Eng 4.45pm

Ospreys v Cheetahs 5.30pm

Yes, I'm sure the attendance and that kick off time has nothing to do with the 6 nations. I know about 20 ospreys fans who were in Dublin for a start for goodness sake.

I do worry about posters on here at times.


What chance do the regions have if the fans dissapear when the clubs go through a bad patch? The likes of Ulster, Bath, Gloucester and Bordeaux have all had terrible seasons in the last few years yet retain a fan base. Even Connacht have been woeful this season but manage to sell out most games. Why is the regions fan base so fickle? This is what damages the leagues image the most.

Perhaps the average floating fan hasn't got any interest in playing Irish, Scottish, Italian and African sides. Our traditional rivalry is with the country next door that we share a border with.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:19 pm

SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:26 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
Well the 6 nations has nothing to do with it as the attendances have been awful all season.

Ireland v Wales 2.15pm

Sco v Eng 4.45pm

Ospreys v Cheetahs 5.30pm

Yes, I'm sure the attendance and that kick off time has nothing to do with the 6 nations. I know about 20 ospreys fans who were in Dublin for a start for goodness sake.

I do worry about posters on here at times.


What chance do the regions have if the fans dissapear when the clubs go through a bad patch? The likes of Ulster, Bath, Gloucester and Bordeaux have all had terrible seasons in the last few years yet retain a fan base. Even Connacht have been woeful this season but manage to sell out most games. Why is the regions fan base so fickle? This is what damages the leagues image the most.

Perhaps the average floating fan hasn't got any interest in playing Irish, Scottish, Italian and African sides. Our traditional rivalry is with the country next door that we share a border with.
Oh FFS I'm not talking about this period. Every team takes a hit during the 6 nation's we all know that. You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

What kind of excuse is that?? What traditional rivalry do the other teams in the league have outside of the derbies? Yet Glasgow now have a waiting list for tickets at Scotstun and the provinces continue to be some of the best supported teams around.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:30 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.

Are you Scottish or Welsh?

You're Number 1 Pro14 critic on these threads.  You've taken over that role from another Welsh poster that once frequented these sites.  But we've all told you about him before - haven't we?

So you're a Welsh critic of the League.  It's therefore obvious that people on the opposite side of the debate would concentrate on the Welsh shortcomings in the League as you seem to blame mostly Irish sides, Union and fans for most of the 'problems'.   But as you admitted to just a while ago, it's not about refs or TV rights or Union control at all.... it's about "Where's the English?" That's all it's about. That's all it's ever been about - "Where's the English?"
Well.......................... they have their own League. That's where they are.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 1:32 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.
Once again Edinburgh has always struggled with their attendances and shamefully so. The reason I brought up the Ospreys was because they were probably the best supported team in the league outside of the provinces not so long ago. If they can't retain a decent fan base through a bad period in the club then what hope do they have?

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 2:30 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.
Once again Edinburgh has always struggled with their attendances and shamefully so. The reason I brought up the Ospreys was because they were probably the best supported team in the league outside of the provinces not so long ago. If they can't retain a decent fan base through a bad period in the club then what hope do they have?

Yet Edinburgh have the second single biggest attendance for a match this season

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LordDowlais on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 3:04 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:RugbyFan - there's no need to resort to personal insults when trying to get your point across.

How come others get a free ride on here ?

This place is a joke, and the MODS are not helping whilst behaving like this.

Marty has insulted me numerous times on this thread, yet he gets nothing.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 3:07 pm

marty2086 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.
Once again Edinburgh has always struggled with their attendances and shamefully so. The reason I brought up the Ospreys was because they were probably the best supported team in the league outside of the provinces not so long ago. If they can't retain a decent fan base through a bad period in the club then what hope do they have?

Yet Edinburgh have the second single biggest attendance for a match this season
The 1872 cup is a great avert for the league... The problem is the low crowds they receive for every other league game, although hopefully that will improve with them performing well atm.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 3:08 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.
Once again Edinburgh has always struggled with their attendances and shamefully so. The reason I brought up the Ospreys was because they were probably the best supported team in the league outside of the provinces not so long ago. If they can't retain a decent fan base through a bad period in the club then what hope do they have?

Yet Edinburgh have the second single biggest attendance for a match this season
The 1872 cup is a great avert for the league... The problem is the low crowds they receive for every other league game, although hopefully that will improve with them performing well atm.

As is Judgement Day which I'm sure you just simply forgot to mention before you are accused of an anti-Welsh bias

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 4:25 pm

SecretFly wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.

Are you Scottish or Welsh?

You're Number 1 Pro14 critic on these threads.  You've taken over that role from another Welsh poster that once frequented these sites.  But we've all told you about him before - haven't we?

So you're a Welsh critic of the League.  It's therefore obvious that people on the opposite side of the debate would concentrate on the Welsh shortcomings in the League as you seem to blame mostly Irish sides, Union and fans for most of the 'problems'.   But as you admitted to just a while ago, it's not about refs or TV rights or Union control at all.... it's about "Where's the English?"  That's all it's about.  That's all it's ever been about - "Where's the English?"  
Well.......................... they have their own League.  That's where they are.

What relevance has another poster got to do with me? What relevance has anything in your post got to do with anything?

I was asked why attendances at 1 welsh region were low. I answered it. You have a problem with the answer. That's your lookout. Not mine.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 4:27 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 4:34 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?


Last edited by LeinsterFan4life on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 5:00 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Wed 28 Feb 2018, 4:40 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:

Another non-emotional, high scientific aspect of why a League fails or succeeds.  Attendance Figures.

.

And yet, there has been no mention of Edinburgh (the capital city of Scotland) getting some of the lowest attendances this season.

How strange.

Are you Scottish or Welsh?

You're Number 1 Pro14 critic on these threads.  You've taken over that role from another Welsh poster that once frequented these sites.  But we've all told you about him before - haven't we?

So you're a Welsh critic of the League.  It's therefore obvious that people on the opposite side of the debate would concentrate on the Welsh shortcomings in the League as you seem to blame mostly Irish sides, Union and fans for most of the 'problems'.   But as you admitted to just a while ago, it's not about refs or TV rights or Union control at all.... it's about "Where's the English?"  That's all it's about.  That's all it's ever been about - "Where's the English?"  
Well.......................... they have their own League.  That's where they are.

What relevance has another poster got to do with me? What relevance has anything in your post got to do with anything?

I was asked why attendances at 1 welsh region were low. I answered it. You have a problem with the answer. That's your lookout. Not mine.

Nothing to do with my post or your response to my post.  

You queried why Edinburgh didn't come up as an example of low attendance figures, I replied 'Why would it?  You're Welsh' - better to use a Welsh example when it's a Welsh man that constantly refers to the Irish problems pertaining to Pro14 - the League you 'Love'.
If you were Scottish, the boys would be mentioning Edinburgh.

Geddih?

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 10:15 am

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 12:53 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 12:57 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

My thoughts exactly, we even survived having Allen Clarke

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 1:01 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

Maybe Ulster fans have got nothing better to do. Many Welsh rugby fans are by and large apathetic, fickle, armchair fans, so they stay at home if their team are losing.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by LeinsterFan4life on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 6:24 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

Maybe Ulster fans have got nothing better to do. Many Welsh rugby fans are by and large apathetic, fickle, armchair fans, so they stay at home if their team are losing.
Very damaging to the league isn't it?

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by Pot Hale on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 9:35 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

Maybe Ulster fans have got nothing better to do. Many Welsh rugby fans are by and large apathetic, fickle, armchair fans, so they stay at home if their team are losing.
Very damaging to the league isn't it?

Which? Ulster fans having nothing better to do or Welsh rugby fans being apathetic, stay at home losing ones? Smile

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Mon 05 Mar 2018, 10:05 pm

Pot Hale wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote: You know I'm talking about the rest of the season but once again your trying to deflect the argument. 

.

How am I deflecting the argument?


The ospreys have been awful all season due to a series of systematic errors in their rugby operations and their fickle fans aren't turning up because of this reason and many others.
What kind of errors?

The board have failed the club by continually employing a coach who has done a less than mediocre job.
The board have recruited awfully and their squad strength has seen continual decline as a result.
The coaches have played the wrong tactics with the wrong players continually.

Pretty standard stuff for any team that is at the wrong end of the table.

Sounds like Ulster but our crowds are still healthy

Maybe Ulster fans have got nothing better to do. Many Welsh rugby fans are by and large apathetic, fickle, armchair fans, so they stay at home if their team are losing.
Very damaging to the league isn't it?

Which?   Ulster fans having nothing better to do or Welsh rugby fans being apathetic, stay at home losing ones?  Smile


Hey! We've got the EIHL Challenge Cup Winners too so we do have better things to do Very Happy

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by RugbyFan100 on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 8:58 am

LeinsterFan4life wrote:e]
Very damaging to the league isn't it?

The Ospreys? Not in the grand scheme of things, no. There are many teams with poor crowds in the pro14.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by Pot Hale on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 11:10 pm

PRO14 planning to make an announcement about their TV broadcast tenders shortly.

WalesOnline running with a story along with a statement from BBC who said they put in a joint bid for covering matches in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland and have lost out to Premier Rugby, a pay TV company who charge a tenner a month for access - no annual commitment so subscribers can just pay for Sept-May if they wish and just give 30 days notice to cancel.  

Sky had tendered for all four territories - Wales, Scotland, NI, and Republic of Ireland as a package.  Their were individual lots tendered for each territory for which people could make individual bids or collectively.   Sky apparently lost their bid for Republic of Ireland (and maybe NI) territory to EirSport, so they withdrew their remaining bids for the other three territory lots.  Premier Sports outbid the BBC bid which they said was a substantial increase on their previous price.   EirSport also have broadcasting rights for the NI territory so they may have that as part of their deal as well, with Premier Sports serving Great Britain.  

Premier Sports was set up by Michael O'Rourke, who along with Leonard Ryan  - are the two Irish guys I knew back in the day who first set up the transmission of Irish soccer games in London which eventually became Setanta Sports.  Setanta was bought recently by Eir, and is now called EirSport, and currently hold BT Sport rights in Ireland.  O'Rourke and Ryan remain shareholders in Danu, an investment company involved in a number of ventures including for those who know their New York, the famous Smith & Wollensky steakhouse chain.    

Premier Sports and EirSport have already been involved in broadcasting rugby including Ireland's summer tour last June. This is another step in bringing sports to expat populations and they're obviously willing to pay for it.  


Last edited by Pot Hale on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 11:48 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 11:12 pm


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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by Pot Hale on Tue 06 Mar 2018, 11:29 pm

marty2086 wrote:You think that might be worthy of a new thread Pot? Whistle

http://www.606v2.com/t67282-bbc-wales-out-of-running-to-show-pro-14-next-season

No - I'm keeping it consistent on here. The other thread is full of mistakes and wrong assumptions and misunderstandings about TV territories, rights, etc.
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by Pot Hale on Wed 07 Mar 2018, 12:23 am

EirSport is a subscription pay TV package that is available on Sky Ireland for €27.50 a month - on top of any Sky subscription people may have for Sky Sports, Movies, etc.   The Eirsport package includes EirSport 1 and 2, and also BT Sport (for the present time until end of 2018).

Eir Sport secured the Republic of Ireland rights to the 2019 Rugby World Cup in Japan along with the U-20’s Championship, the Women’s World Cup and Sevens rights. They also have rights for Formula One World Championship Ltd, to show every Formula 1 race live plus practice and qualifying sessions through 2018.

The service is currently free to Eir broadband subscribers in Ireland similar to BT Sport being free to broadband subscribers in the UK.

If you're not a Eir broadband customer (like me) then it's gonna cost €27.50 per month based on current package prices.    This price may well change if, for example, BT Sport renew Irish license deal with EirSport but seek to charge more, or they switch to another provider.    

A similar package arrangement will likely be put in place in the UK.   UK residents can simply pay a monthly fee (£10) for Premier Pay online service with no rolling contract, or add it as a subscription on your Sky Box or Virgin box.

Premier Sports may well have big for England territory rights as well where they already have a good expat Irish subscribers for their content.   They also have subscribers in the US and Canada, and that may prove attractive to PRO14 execs as well.
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Wed 07 Mar 2018, 9:23 am

Pot Hale wrote:
marty2086 wrote:You think that might be worthy of a new thread Pot? Whistle

http://www.606v2.com/t67282-bbc-wales-out-of-running-to-show-pro-14-next-season

No - I'm keeping it consistent on here.  The other thread is full of mistakes and wrong assumptions and misunderstandings about TV territories, rights, etc.

There have been a few here too by the same people but I did read this morning that RTE, TG4 and TV3 are looking to bring the ERCC to FTA

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 12:56 pm

Scarlets: Tom Williams; Ioan Nicholas, Paul Asquith, Steff Hughes (capt), Ryan Conbeer; Dan Jones, Jonathan Evans; Phil Price, Ryan Elias, Werner Kruger, Steve Cummins, David Bulbring, Tadhg Beirne, Josh Macleod, Will Boyde

Replacements: Emyr Phillips, Rhys Fawcett, Simon Gardiner, Josh Helps, Lewis Rawlins, Declan Smith, Ioan Hughes, Tom Varndell

Leinster: Dave Kearney; Barry Daly, Rory O'Loughlin, Noel Reid, James Lowe; Ross Byrne, Nick McCarthy; Ed Byrne, Bryan Byrne, Michael Bent, Ross Molony, Scott Fardy, Josh Murphy, Seán O'Brien (capt), Jack Conan.

Replacements: James Tracy, Peter Dooley, Adam Coyle, Mick Kearney, Max Deegan, Charlie Rock, Ciarán Frawley, Adam Byrne

MATCH OFFICIALS

Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU).

Assistant referees: : Ben Whitehouse and Simon Rees (both WRU).

TMO: Neil Hennessey (WRU).


Sorry that really is a farce.  The ref is the cousin of the Scarlets wing!!!!  How the feck can that be allowed?!?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/referee-nigel-owens-pride-cousin-12484197.amp


Last edited by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 12:58 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Said Uncle, but meant cousin)
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by St John The Enforcer on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:01 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Sorry that really is a farce.  The ref is the cousin of the Scarlets wing!!!!  How the feck can that be allowed?!?

It's obviously not ideal. But as a Leinster fan it doesn't bother me unduly. He is a top pro ref. Some love him some hate him. But he is a serious pro.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:07 pm

St. John, probably right. However, it really isn’t how a process outfit should run. Especially after some of his decisions have been questioned publicly recently due to perceived bias. (Also, it’s only fair to highlight it here seeing as the all Irish officials for the reverse fixture caused complaints here a few weeks back)
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:11 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:St. John, probably right.  However, it really isn’t how a process outfit should run.  Especially after some of his decisions have been questioned publicly recently due to perceived bias.  (Also, it’s only fair to highlight it here seeing as the all Irish officials for the reverse fixture caused complaints here a few weeks back)

The league want the best officials doing the job, he's the best official. It doesn't look great but I like many Irish posters have said we'd take him over some of the Irish officials any day.

If Scarlets win, let me add, it's a shambles and a clear fix by the Welsh Whistle

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by St John The Enforcer on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:14 pm

Not easy running a league including 5 territories. Loads of issues from Refs to separate TV deals, to Loads of internationals disappearing at the same time to being constantly compared to 2 other leagues that have none of these issues.

Them's the breaks

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:21 pm

Nigel will be fine. He'll ref with dignity and the Scarlet's wing cousin better watch out as I'm sure if he does anything wrong Nigel will only be too pleased to do the public dressing down of him on the mike Wink

Anyway, looks like it's a holding exercise from Leinster. Keep the score respectable and keep it there to the end - maybe even steal a win.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by geoff999rugby on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:48 pm

No problem with Owens reffing

The top matches should get the top referees regardless of nationality
The quality of the ref is what really matters

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 4:30 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:No problem with Owens reffing

The top matches should get the top referees regardless of nationality
The quality of the ref is what really matters

But officiating a games with a family member on the pitch is definitely a clash of interest.
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 4:37 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:No problem with Owens reffing

The top matches should get the top referees regardless of nationality
The quality of the ref is what really matters

But officiating a games with a family member on the pitch is definitely a clash of interest.  

Why? Do you know all your cousins all that well? Do they even get on?


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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 9:32 pm

marty2086 wrote:
ScarletSpiderman wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:No problem with Owens reffing

The top matches should get the top referees regardless of nationality
The quality of the ref is what really matters

But officiating a games with a family member on the pitch is definitely a clash of interest.  

Why? Do you know all your cousins all that well? Do they even get on?


Hell I wouldn’t know mine walking down the street. It still seems really wrong to me that Nige will ref the game, but I guess both teams agree to it etc.
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by BigGee on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 9:43 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Scarlets: Tom Williams; Ioan Nicholas, Paul Asquith, Steff Hughes (capt), Ryan Conbeer; Dan Jones, Jonathan Evans; Phil Price, Ryan Elias, Werner Kruger, Steve Cummins, David Bulbring, Tadhg Beirne, Josh Macleod, Will Boyde

Replacements: Emyr Phillips, Rhys Fawcett, Simon Gardiner, Josh Helps, Lewis Rawlins, Declan Smith, Ioan Hughes, Tom Varndell

Leinster: Dave Kearney; Barry Daly, Rory O'Loughlin, Noel Reid, James Lowe; Ross Byrne, Nick McCarthy; Ed Byrne, Bryan Byrne, Michael Bent, Ross Molony, Scott Fardy, Josh Murphy, Seán O'Brien (capt), Jack Conan.

Replacements: James Tracy, Peter Dooley, Adam Coyle, Mick Kearney, Max Deegan, Charlie Rock, Ciarán Frawley, Adam Byrne

MATCH OFFICIALS

Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU).

Assistant referees: : Ben Whitehouse and Simon Rees (both WRU).

TMO: Neil Hennessey (WRU).


Sorry that really is a farce.  The ref is the cousin of the Scarlets wing!!!!  How the feck can that be allowed?!?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/referee-nigel-owens-pride-cousin-12484197.amp

I know we always used to joke about a whole Welsh pack all called Jones, but their are 4 Byrne's in that Leinster squad. Are they related?

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 9:51 pm

BigGee wrote:
ScarletSpiderman wrote:Scarlets: Tom Williams; Ioan Nicholas, Paul Asquith, Steff Hughes (capt), Ryan Conbeer; Dan Jones, Jonathan Evans; Phil Price, Ryan Elias, Werner Kruger, Steve Cummins, David Bulbring, Tadhg Beirne, Josh Macleod, Will Boyde

Replacements: Emyr Phillips, Rhys Fawcett, Simon Gardiner, Josh Helps, Lewis Rawlins, Declan Smith, Ioan Hughes, Tom Varndell

Leinster: Dave Kearney; Barry Daly, Rory O'Loughlin, Noel Reid, James Lowe; Ross Byrne, Nick McCarthy; Ed Byrne, Bryan Byrne, Michael Bent, Ross Molony, Scott Fardy, Josh Murphy, Seán O'Brien (capt), Jack Conan.

Replacements: James Tracy, Peter Dooley, Adam Coyle, Mick Kearney, Max Deegan, Charlie Rock, Ciarán Frawley, Adam Byrne

MATCH OFFICIALS

Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU).

Assistant referees: : Ben Whitehouse and Simon Rees (both WRU).

TMO: Neil Hennessey (WRU).


Sorry that really is a farce.  The ref is the cousin of the Scarlets wing!!!!  How the feck can that be allowed?!?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/referee-nigel-owens-pride-cousin-12484197.amp

I know we always used to joke about a whole Welsh pack all called Jones, but their are 4 Byrne's in that Leinster squad. Are they related?

Think yourself lucky that they aren't O'Byrnes. Anyway, Scarlets have one too - the f**king copycats.

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:14 pm

Fly - isn’t Ed Byrne too small to be a prop? When I’ve seen him doing stand up he didn’t seem that big a bloke.
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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by SecretFly on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:27 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Fly - isn’t Ed Byrne too small to be a prop?  When I’ve seen him doing stand up he didn’t seem that big a bloke.

*cough* it's the juice what does it..... Whistle Say no more. Say no more....

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:35 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Hell I wouldn’t know mine walking down the street.  It still seems really wrong to me that Nige will ref the game, but I guess both teams agree to it etc.

The image might not be the best but I think anyone who knows a jot about the game doesn't question Owens integrity

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by ScarletSpiderman on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:49 pm

marty2086 wrote:
ScarletSpiderman wrote:Hell I wouldn’t know mine walking down the street.  It still seems really wrong to me that Nige will ref the game, but I guess both teams agree to it etc.

The image might not be the best but I think anyone who knows a jot about the game doesn't question Owens integrity

Are you saying Nick Knoyles doesn’t know a jot about Rugby Wink .

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by marty2086 on Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:50 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
ScarletSpiderman wrote:Hell I wouldn’t know mine walking down the street.  It still seems really wrong to me that Nige will ref the game, but I guess both teams agree to it etc.

The image might not be the best but I think anyone who knows a jot about the game doesn't question Owens integrity

Are you saying Nick Knoyles doesn’t know a jot about Rugby Wink .  


I was going to flat out say it and about a few other whinging Englishmen but didn't but what the hell....they know feck all

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Re: The Future for the PRO14 - Part 5 - How are the Unions doing?

Post by thebandwagonsociety on Thu 22 Mar 2018, 3:07 pm

Two interesting items this week.

SRU have been working on entering the PRL for the past 3 years according to the various press clippings this week. Were there side deals done back when Europe was being renegotiated/replanned.

Professional leagues have a mutual objective (not their only objective) to have clubs gain more control over calendars and players from the Test stage and Unions. This aligns (on certain topics) the LNR and PRL. The PRL appoints the former head of the RFU to a cushy, well paid board position. Does the PRL control the voting block of the English Union through this and similar arrangements? Does the LNR control the French Union in a similar way? Now will there be tacid influence of the PRL on the SRU. And the PRL have already courted the welsh regions. How much of a voting block do their tenticles reach? Who did the SRU vote for the rwc?

Control of the global calendar would allow the LNR and PRL to give themselves more weekends of the year (more weekends means more fixtures, therefore expanded leagues). There are already english championship sides that aren't in position to play in the PRL even if they win promotion. It's expansion comes through acquisition. The PRL could end up as franchises? Merge Newcastle with Edinburgh (which location they keep is debatable, bring Glasgow into the PRL. PRL would be at 13 teams then, take 3 of the regions (sorry dragons) brings it to 16 teams that gets ringfenced with no relegation. You'd need 8 more weekends to force it through, which makes sense for the 10 month season they've been whispering.

Wow, that was a strong cup of jo this morning, has me hallucinating in all directions.

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