England summer thread - 2018

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England summer thread - 2018

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 12 May 2018, 12:02 am

First topic message reminder :

First test squad is announced next week, and the rumour is Nick Gubbins will be selected to open, and this would be the prospective team...

Cook
Gubbins
Root
Malan
Stokes
Bairstow
Livingstone
Woakes/Wood
Broad
Leach
Anderson

With James Vince as 12th man

What do we reckon?
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Tue 05 Jun 2018, 4:12 pm

Speaking of Jofra Archer, the Times are reporting the ECB is going to change its residency rules to reflect the ICC ones, which means he'd be eligible to play for England by the 2019 World Cup and Ashes
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Jetty on Wed 06 Jun 2018, 2:33 am

Gooseberry

Gooch retired at 41, Stewart 40.
Cook 2017- 47.31. He did get 244* in Melbourne in December. I am more worried about his dropped catches in the slips.
Broad was injured the first time in Australia, in 2013 was the best English bowler (21 wickets) and this time his action needed correction.

Don't think Jennings will last after the India series. Bess looked a better batsman. Smile As a bowler, looking at grounds that are not Taunton, 8 at 13.50 v Essex in the MCC in Bridgetown. Edgbaston 4/111 v J Patel 4/171. Some batsmen he has dismissed Trott, Bell, Chanderpaul, Sangakkara, Foster, Malan, Voges, Finch, Vince, Rossouw, Handscomb...

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 06 Jun 2018, 8:49 am

Bess's performances in first class cricket so far show he might have something about him. While it is felt that Somerset looked to produce turning pitches last season, seven five wicket hauls in 18 matches is still a decent return. I may be wrong but I did have the impression he outbowled Leach last season?

So far his bowling for England has been tidy and no more. It should though be noted that it was most definitely seamer conditions. What pleases me is that Bess has so far shown he has the character to thrive at this level - time will tell if he has the skill.

Hopefully either him or Virdi can really kick on. Heck maybe even provide a healthy competition that pushes them both forward. England really need some of the younger generation to kick on.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 06 Jun 2018, 9:39 am

Apparently Ball has been called up to the ODI squad as cover for Woakes who has a niggle. Must admit Id forgotten about him as a fast(ish) bowling option. Having a good county season again, but always been a bit mediocre for England.
Plunkett I guess would be in the mix too but isnt having a great season. Willeys taken a bunch of wickets after a poor IPL but England look to have moved on from him anyway, even with Woakes injured Id expect Curran to be ahead of him as a left armer.
Billings is also in the squad but really I struggle to see how/why and why he would get another chance. Hes in rank form this season with a pretty awful IPL and scoring 9 runs so far in 4 RLC games.



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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 06 Jun 2018, 10:07 am

LondonTiger wrote:Bess's performances in first class cricket so far show he might have something about him. While it is felt that Somerset looked to produce turning pitches last season, seven five wicket hauls in 18 matches is still a decent return. I may be wrong but I did have the impression he outbowled Leach last season?

So far his bowling for England has been tidy and no more. It should though be noted that it was most definitely seamer conditions. What pleases me is that Bess has so far shown he has the character to thrive at this level - time will tell if he has the skill.

Hopefully either him or Virdi can really kick on. Heck maybe even provide a healthy competition that pushes them both forward. England really need some of the younger generation to kick on.

Yeah this is pretty much in line with what I was saying ... he has a long way to go before getting pencilled in as the long term answer to Englands spin bowling issues.

But dont forget Crane is still alive, and also young. Ditto Leach who is a better bowler currently and although further along in his career is still plenty young enough (and importantly has shown hes coachable after remodelling his action without losing his potency) to improve by playing at international level as well as giving 6+ years service in an England shirt.

Bess, Vidri, Crane, Leach are the current/future test players for England. The concentration at the moment has to be on which of them is the best bowler. For 2/3 spinner pitches Moeen could come back into contention, and Bess' batting becomes more relevant. There right arm, left arm and leg spin options. Its certainly looking less bleak, but wheres the specialist coaching coming from for these guys? None of them are the finished product. Will they get stints playing on Asian pitches alongside players and coaches that understand them?
Interestingly Rashid and Moeen seem to have the limited over spots sewn up for the time being, whilst being out of the picture on tests. Thats not a bad thing really, it gives these young players a single focus on developing as test bowlers initially and hopefuly more time playing long ball cricket. Theres not many cricketers we see taking that route.

Itll be a controversial point selecting for the India test series if Bess Leach and Crane are all fit and bowling well.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Jetty on Wed 06 Jun 2018, 11:52 am

LondonTiger wrote:Bess's performances in first class cricket so far show he might have something about him. While it is felt that Somerset looked to produce turning pitches last season, seven five wicket hauls in 18 matches is still a decent return. I may be wrong but I did have the impression he outbowled Leach last season?

So far his bowling for England has been tidy and no more. It should though be noted that it was most definitely seamer conditions. What pleases me is that Bess has so far shown he has the character to thrive at this level - time will tell if he has the skill.

Hopefully either him or Virdi can really kick on. Heck maybe even provide a healthy competition that pushes them both forward. England really need some of the younger generation to kick on.

http://cricviz.com/2018/06/cricviz-analysis-dom-bess-at-headingley/

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by James100 on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 11:28 am

A lot of talk on here about Wood not being quick enough, but this from CricViz suggests he's been the eleventh quickest in the world this decade (one below Steyn) - https://twitter.com/CricProf/status/1005011647797350400


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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:04 pm

Interesting stats, but being average speed largely meaningless. While slower balls are used much less in tests, they are still used.

Mark Wood seems to be not quite as quick now as he was, and certainly rarely bowls at the speeds needed to beat people for pace. Therefore he needs to do something with the ball. Listening to Vaughan and Trescothick the other day they seemed to suggest that Wood would be much better trying to bowl like Gough used to - a little fuller with skiddy pace and occasional bouncer, rather than as an enforcer.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:24 pm

I’d agree with that. He’s not getting much as just being a faster Anderson without the swing and skill.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:57 pm

Woods figures might also mislead when compared to someone like Riaz or Shami in that only 2 of his tests have been played on Asian pitches which youd assume to be slower.
Strange thing is its the only time hes actually been any good.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by robbo277 on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 6:56 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
CaledonianCraig wrote:England have a firm grip on this test. A lead of 100+ would be decent but 150+ puts them in total control you'd think. Bess showing he knows how to handle a bat but can he make an impact with the ball? That remains to be seen. Buttler settling back into test cricket pretty well and Malan still striving for a big score and the pressure must be growing on him.

I mentioned to my mate at our cricket club that Malan needs a score, and I was shot down - but despite having a good Ashes (averaging 42.56), his test average in his 23 test innings so far is only 29.00, and averaging only 21.36 in England with a high score of 65. Today he got a genuinely good ball which would have got most if not all out, but its something to watch over the coming games...the media have been quiet on him because of other issues but surely they'll pick up on it soon?


Olly - JDizzle and I were saying similar to you at the very start of April on the ''New Zealand v England Test Series'' thread. The axing of Vince, continued poor form of Stoneman and then his axing have taken the recent spotlight off Malan but his time will surely be gone before too long if he doesn't start to up that average.

PS  I wouldn't make too much of this but I know one Middlesex member who has doubted Malan's place in the Test side from the very start, lambasting his technique and temperament.




There were questions over 2, 3 and 5 going into the Ashes, with Stoneman, Vince and Malan the incumbents. Malan had by far the best Ashes of the 3, and as you say the focus was on others. But with Stoneman and Vince gone Malan won't be as protected from criticism. And with Root up to 3 and Malan up to 4, we'll definitely need to start seeing more meaningful contributions from him.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:18 am

Scotland V England ODI underway. England won the toss and elected to bowl. Scotland 28 for 0 after 4 overs.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:36 am

Scotland 56 for 0 after 8 overs. Cross 32 and Coetzer 23.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:41 am

Runs flowing early on. Strange decision by Morgan to field first on this tiny ground.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by guildfordbat on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:42 am

Scotland continuing to go at a good lick. 64/0 off 9 now. Small boundaries probably flatter the score slightly but, that said, they haven't lost a wicket which keeps them well set.

Change of pace as Rashid comes on. Good move, I reckon ....

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by guildfordbat on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:43 am

Oooh and a review first ball!

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by guildfordbat on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:44 am

Yeah, thought it was going to be missing or umpire's call. Technology showed the former.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:46 am

A review for lbw lost by England. With ten overs played Scotland are 70 for 0. Cross 37 Coetzer 32.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:58 am

Fifty up for the skipper Coetzer and Scotland are 97 for 0 after 13 overs.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 11:59 am

Century partnership comes up. Scotland 103 for 0.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:01 pm

Adil Rashid finally strikes with Coetzer caught behind. Scotland 103 for 1.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:08 pm

And Cross edges one to Billings and Scotland are 107 for 2. Scotland's batting is all about the top four so they need another big partnership now or they may fail to reach 200.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:23 pm

After 20 overs Scotland are 126 for 2.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:40 pm

McLeod and Berrington just building here and 50 partnership is up. At the halfway mark of 25 overs, Scotland are 160 for 2.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 12:54 pm

Should make 350 from here. 400 a possibility.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 1:01 pm

Berrington goes aerial and is caught in the deep. Scotland 200 for 3.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 1:13 pm

Scotland move onto 218 for 3 after 33 overs. McLeod 59 not out.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 1:30 pm

Scotland 244 for 3 now with 13 overs left.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 1:47 pm

This pair working really well together. Scotland 281 for 3 with 9 overs left.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:01 pm

Calum McLeod take a bow. He becomes the first Scot to score a century against England. Scotland 309 for 4. Superb.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:02 pm

Great century for MacLeod. Easily the best of his lot.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:10 pm

Scotland 327 for 4. McLeod 115 not out Budge 2 not out.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:18 pm

That is Scotland's highest score in ODI's. Scotland now 342 for 4 with two overs left.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:24 pm

The penultimate over goes for 18 runs. Scotland 360 for 4.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:25 pm

Budge bowled by Wood and Scotland 360 for 5. Five balls left to be bowled.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:29 pm

Scotland post a score of 371 for 5. Brilliant effort. Calum McLeod leaves the field to a standing ovation on 140 not out.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 2:32 pm

Great innings from Scotland.

England probably still favourites, with short boundaries and a pancake for a wicket, but early dismissals would put the home side comfortably ahead.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Gooseberry on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 3:16 pm

Jeez just seen the score....ground aside thats a mighty effort by scotland and has to seriously concern england. Doesnt take many wickets to put them in trouble but they cant coast early.

Resting players and giving a chance to fringe ones is fine in these games, but Billings? Just how many chances is he going to get?

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 3:49 pm

Bairstow has just elegantly taken fourteen off the first three deliveries of an over.

England, currently, cruising at 83/0 after 8.3 overs.

Bairstow 61 off 29.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 3:54 pm

If England had batted first, they would have been the first side to make 500 in an ODI.

107/0 after 10.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by guildfordbat on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 4:04 pm

Duty281 wrote:If England had batted first, they would have been the first side to make 500 in an ODI.

107/0 after 10.

Maybe but England could still be 180/3 and that gives everything a very different look.

Anyway, as you and others have said, great effort by Scotland to get 370+. Particularly impressed that they did so after losing both openers around the same time following a fine start and then had to effectively begin again with two new batters.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 4:26 pm

165/2, as Bairstow is out for 105.

Sight opening for Scotland, but the RRR is nearly down to 6.

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Gooseberry on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 4:58 pm

Remember when Bairstow couldn't event get in the side

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by wisden on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:01 pm

166 needed from 24 overs with 8 wickets in hand

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:05 pm

Crazy from Hales. Running out the skipper Joe Root. England 220 for 3.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by wisden on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:06 pm

sucidial running from Hales,

p.s. Root isn't captain

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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:08 pm

wisden wrote:sucidial running from Hales,

p.s. Root isn't captain

Of course not. However, suicidal running it was.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:23 pm

Now THE skipper has definitely gone. Morgan gets a leading edge and is caught. England 245 for 4.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:25 pm

And the next ball Hales flashing at a wide Berrington delivery and is caught at backward point. England 245 for 5.
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Re: England summer thread - 2018

Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 5:25 pm

Five down. This constitutes a dangerous wobble.

Hales has to go back to the pavilion, where Root is going to chin him.

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