England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

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England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Tue 03 Jul 2018, 11:09 am

First topic message reminder :

T20s

A three match series between the 2nd (India) and 4th ranked teams in the world https://www.icc-cricket.com/rankings/mens/team-rankings/t20i

Fixtures

Tuesday 3rd July 2018 17:30
Emirates Old Trafford, Manchester

Friday 6th July 2018 17:30
Sophia Gardens Cardiff, Cardiff

Sunday 8th July 2018 14:00
The Brightside Ground, Bristol


Squads

England: Morgan, Ali, Bairstow, Ball, Buttler, Curran S, Curran T, Hales, Jordan, Plunkett, Rashid, Root, Roy, Willey (Malan in as cover for 1st game, Stokes may join for 3rd)

India: Kohli, Chahal, Chahar, Dhawan, Dhoni, Karthik, Kaul, Kuldeep Yadav, Kumar, Pandey, HH Pandya, KH Pandya, Rahul, Raina, Sharma UT Yadav


Key Men

Jos Buttler - move up the order during IPL has given him much more time to have an impact. While only ranked 26 in ICC rankings, this will improve now he opens.
Alex Hales - Formerly top ranked batter in T20s, has dropped a bit (to 7) and finds his place in the England side under threat.
Rashid/Ali - Englands spinners have thrived in the one day format, but will find the Indian batting lineup a tough test.

Virat Kohli - probably the best batsmen in the world across all 3 forms of the game. Some injury issues recently.
Chahal/Kuldeep Yadav - India look like going with two wrist spinners. England often struggle to score quickly against good spin.



ODIs

Fixtures

Another 3 match series between the the top two ranked sides in the world.  Both teams will be wanting to lay down a marker before next year's world cup.


Thursday 12th July 2018 12:30
Trent Bridge, Nottingham

Saturday 14th July 2018 11:00
Lord's, London

Tuesday 17th July 2018 12:30
Emerald Headingley, Leeds


Squads

England - Eoin Morgan (capt), Moeen Ali, Jonny Bairstow, Jake Ball, Jos Buttler, Alex Hales, Liam Plunkett, Adil Rashid, Joe Root, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes, David Willey, Mark Wood.



Test Series

A form of cricket in which the visitors have been much better than the hosts. The series goes deep into September as India seek to avenge the series defeat in 2014. In a manner we have become used to seeing from touring teams around the world, that series India capitulated in the final 3 tests  having won the second test to take a 1-0 lead. India however look strong enough this time out to put pressure on a faltering home test team.


Fixtures

Wednesday 1st August 2018 11:00
Edgbaston, Birmingham

Thursday 9th August 2018 11:00
Lord's, London

Saturday 18th August 2018 11:00
Trent Bridge, Nottingham

Thursday 30th August 2018 11:00
Ageas Bowl, Southampton

Friday 7th September 2018 11:00
Kia Oval, London

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 3:41 pm

http://www.bcci.tv/videos/id/6425/a-positive-result-round-the-corner-virat

Kohli's press conference...some portions in Hindi most of it in English.....
the biggest give-away....he is most likely playing a 2nd spinner
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 3:54 pm

Would second spinner be instead of Pandya, or instead of a front line seamer?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 5:15 pm

Either Pandya or Umesh Yadav would miss out. Cricinfo seem to think it would be the latter, if India opted to play two spinners.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 6:07 pm

It makes sense for India to pick two spinners, they are their best bowlers and england regulalry panic when faced with two.

Cooks conference seemed to suggest that its a straight choice between woakes and moeen based on how dry the pitch looks.
Frankly england with two spinners and just 3 seamers sounds pretty awful.

Forecast has improved a bit though. Vloud and a small amount of rain tomorrow and Monday ...otherwise mostly sunny. So the opening spell could offer some help to the seamers but its likely to be pretty attritional through the weekend.
I can see why England would seriously consider two spinners...but it would help if they had one who really demanded a place in the side on merit.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 6:32 pm

Mixed feelings about Pope batting at 4 in tomorrow's Test rather than his usual number 6 for Surrey.

Playing Test cricket is a big step up from the county game. That's a challenge in itself - and for some players a challenge they can't rise to - without the added difficulty of performing in an unfamiliar role.

There again, if everything was going swimmingly for England's batsmen, Pope wouldn't have this chance. Malan's been found wanting at 4 and that's where the vacancy is. Rather than further fiddle about with an already disjointed line up, England's management need to back their new man to go in where the need is and he has to make the very best of it.

For all the analysis from professional pundits like Steve James and strictly amateur ones like me, I'm sure Pope will relish the opportunity and just look to get on with it.

Btw, in answer to a slightly tongue in cheek question from Tiger after Malan showed he couldn't catch a cold at Edgbaston - although Pope hasn't totally put away his wicket-keeping gloves at the Oval, he's a fine outfielder. Particularly around the boundary where he's very quick and athletic.


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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Wed 08 Aug 2018, 7:00 pm

LondonTiger wrote:Would second spinner be instead of Pandya, or instead of a front line seamer?

In place of Umesh Yadav most certainly
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 2:08 am

I’d love seeing Mo play as I think he’s been discarded in a way that has forgotten what good he did for England, and also because I think he has the talent with the bat to play instead of someone like Buttler.

With that in mind, it could give him a chance to go out and reclaim a place.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by alfie on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 4:50 am

From a "how to improve the batting" point of view it would make sense for both Woakes and Moeen to play at the expense of Rashid or Buttler...neither of which is likely.
Apart from going back a bit early on Smith "hunches" it would be both a little unfair on Rashid and possibly wrong from a bowling angle (unless the pitch offers practically nothing to spin) as the wrist spinner seems better suited to attack India's right handers.
And with Buttler recently installed as vice-captain one bad Test might be seen as little hasty in causing his removal.

Whatever they do either the batting or bowling looks a little thin ...why couldn't Stokes have been the sort of drunk who just passes out quietly in a corner ?

Sorting out this England order reminds me of the tale of the Irishman asked for directions by a tourist : well if you're after going there , I wouldn't be starting from here...

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 5:32 am

I did not know Buttler was vice captain. That’s quite the vote of confidence for a player who is nowhere near cemented

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 7:36 am

Slips apparently will be Buttler, Jennings and Cook.
Its looking increasingly likely that woakes will start ahead of Moeen.

The weather today looks pretty grim and its likely play wil be sporadic at best. The chances of a draw have increased.




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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LivinginItaly on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 8:31 am

Muddled would seem to be a word that perfectly sums up England's thinking in regards to their batting. Some of it is out of the selectors hands. The players brought in to replace the old guard over the last five years on the whole haven't been up to the required standard. But some of it has been caused by bizarre decisions. Ok decide to take a gamble on Buttler, but then making him vice captain and thus extra hard to drop him later just seems ludicrous.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 9:16 am

LivinginItaly wrote:Muddled would seem to be a word that perfectly sums up England's thinking in regards to their batting. Some of it is out of the selectors hands. The players brought in to replace the old guard over the last five years on the whole haven't been up to the required standard. But some of it has been caused by bizarre decisions. Ok decide to take a gamble on Buttler, but then making him vice captain and thus extra hard to drop him later just seems ludicrous.

Well I think the plan is to not drop him later but for him to play well and cement a spot - and it's clear they rate his cricketing brain, vice captain in the ODIs and T20's as well too I think.

As for today, looks like it's gonna be a on/off type of day with patchy showers across London.
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 9:17 am

https://www.trafficdelays.co.uk/wellington-road-st-johns-wood-road-london-cctv-traffic-camera/

Camera not far from the ground.


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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 9:30 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
LivinginItaly wrote:Muddled would seem to be a word that perfectly sums up England's thinking in regards to their batting. Some of it is out of the selectors hands. The players brought in to replace the old guard over the last five years on the whole haven't been up to the required standard. But some of it has been caused by bizarre decisions. Ok decide to take a gamble on Buttler, but then making him vice captain and thus extra hard to drop him later just seems ludicrous.

Well I think the plan is to not drop him later but for him to play well and cement a spot - and it's clear they rate his cricketing brain, vice captain in the ODIs and T20's as well too I think.

As for today, looks like it's gonna be a on/off type of day with patchy showers across London.

That's a bit of a dumb plan, although it could look genius in hindsight. Should just play safe, Broad or Anderson can clearly be vice captain.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 9:52 am

Small sample size, but the average completed score at Lord's for County Championship games this season is 225.

That, and the weather, plus the fact that Lord's is usually better to bat on during days 2 + 3, means field first?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:17 am

Duty281 wrote:Small sample size, but the average completed score at Lord's for County Championship games this season is 225.

That, and the weather, plus the fact that Lord's is usually better to bat on during days 2 + 3, means field first?

Don't overlook how poorly Middlesex are playing (home and away).

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:18 am

LondonTiger wrote:https://www.trafficdelays.co.uk/wellington-road-st-johns-wood-road-london-cctv-traffic-camera/

Camera not far from the ground.


Looks like I'll have to think about it before I choose to bat. Wink

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:36 am

If India pick two spinners and England chose to bowl first Id have QUESTIONS

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:36 am

Toss delayed by light drizzle

(Looking slightly heavier than that on the Traffic Camera)

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:46 am



Forecast not great for much play today

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 10:57 am

LondonTiger wrote:

Forecast not great for much play today

Yeah, there's a t20 game due to be played a couple of miles away at the Oval tonight and many Senior Dons of the Surrey mafia are already worried that'll be called off.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 12:47 pm

At least Englands slips have a good chance of going a whole day without dropping anything

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 12:48 pm

How many matches is this series?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 1:15 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:How many matches is this series?

5.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 1:26 pm

Looks like today will be a washout.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 1:35 pm

I hope they will have make-up overs on all remaining days
Sun sets late in UK ( compared to India) and so they should start early and play late to get 110 over daily

but for some reason there is reluctance to start early at say 10 am ( whihc is not really early)
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 2:42 pm

KP_fan wrote:I hope they will have make-up overs on all remaining days
Sun sets late in UK ( compared to India) and so they should start early and play late to get 110 over daily

but for some reason there is reluctance to start early at say 10 am ( whihc is not really early)

Little chance of that. Theres more rain forecast on Monday , so theres a fair chance that even if wickets do fall qucikly the game will be cut short just when its getting interesting. Theres going to be some cloud around and possibly some rain over the other 3 days too, and the possibility of light disruptions if as they push toward 7pm. So even with fiddling the finish times they arent going to get close to the full 450 overs.

A draw is looking increasingly on the cards even given how weak both teams are batting wise. Its just unfortunate, this test is right in the prime weather window and Londons been dry for months.

I dont really know what the reasons are for not starting earlier, unless its to do with early moisture on green wickets.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 2:44 pm

Might actually squeeze a bit of play in today. Rain is forecast to stop within the next hour; it looks dry-ish from then on.

A proper test of the Lord's drainage system.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 3:07 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
KP_fan wrote:I hope they will have make-up overs on all remaining days
Sun sets late in UK ( compared to India) and so they should start early and play late to get 110 over daily

but for some reason there is reluctance to start early at say 10 am ( whihc is not really early)

Little chance of that. Theres more rain forecast  on Monday , so theres a fair chance that even if wickets do fall qucikly the game will be cut short just when its getting interesting. Theres going to be some cloud around and possibly some rain over the other 3 days too, and the possibility of light disruptions if as they push toward 7pm. So even with fiddling the finish times they arent going to get close to the full 450 overs.

A draw is looking increasingly on the cards even given how weak both teams are batting wise. Its just unfortunate, this test is right in the prime weather window and Londons been dry for months.

I dont really know what the reasons are for not starting earlier, unless its to do with early moisture on green wickets.

I'm pretty sure as well that play isn't extended on the last day. Don't ask me why and certainly don't ask me to defend it!

It is very annoying in these circumstances that play can't start at 10 am. For Championship matches, the players are normally on the outfield playing football at this time!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 4:52 pm

Play abandoned.

Four-day test it is.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 6:00 pm

Duty281 wrote:Play abandoned.

Four-day test it is.

Righty ho. Win the toss, bat 4 sessions and then consider further. Simples.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by sirfredperry on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 6:20 pm

Was at Lord's for the washout today. Was also at Lord's for the Saturday of the Windies Test in that other scorcher of a summer - 1976. The number of balls bowled that day? None.
Tough on those with tickets just for today. Luckily, I'm due to go tomorrow and Saturday as well. Doubt in current conditions that England will want to play two spinners.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Thu 09 Aug 2018, 9:48 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Play abandoned.

Four-day test it is.

Righty ho. Win the toss, bat 4 sessions and then consider further. Simples.

Trying to imagine this England batting for four consecutive sessions....nope, can't quite manage it.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 7:48 am

Looks like today will be another rain-affected day.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:35 am

Just a few spots on and off by the looks of it, mightbe a delayed start but we should see play before lunch.
Forecast for Sunday and Monday isnt great either though so the chances of a result in anything other than the toss are slim.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 9:38 am

Well in the 1st test, we only needed three days and an hour's worth of play to get a result, so perhaps all is not lost yet!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 9:54 am

Bright sunshine reports CI and the game already not started

they should have started 10 am and cut the Lunch and tea down by 20 & 10 Min respectively to make another half an hour

Its such bureaucratic inflexibility that makes it hard for millennial generation to accept test cricket
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 10:34 am

England win the toss and will field first. Good call, I think. Two spinners for India, Woakes in for England.

300+ will be a good score for India.

About to rain, though...

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 10:44 am

India gets the perfect team as I wanted......Pujara replaces Dhawan and Yadav for Yadav...India bats first so spinners will have a 4th inning bowl

wish kohli had gottent eh combo right in the first test esp Pujara......he screwed the first test in SA also leaving Pujara and Rahane out

BUt
better late than never
and he better wins some tosses too
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 10:51 am

Both captains would've bowled first, which is understandable given the conditions. Actually agree with Duty and Root on bowling first - the Indian batting is fragile - get them back in in bowling conditions and see if they can make inroads again
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:03 am

BOOM

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:03 am

Ohhh, an absolute peach. 0/1 in the first over.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:05 am

That is quite a handy delivery from Anderson.
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:15 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Both captains would've bowled first, which is understandable given the conditions. Actually agree with Duty and Root on bowling first - the Indian batting is fragile - get them back in in bowling conditions and see if they can make inroads again

Not what a dinosaur like me would've done but I certainly understand the decision and it's clearly working well so far with no runs on the board after 3 overs and one already back in the hutch. Peach from Jimmy as Duty said.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:17 am

25 miles south of Lord's here and now raining - sorry, folks!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:24 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:That is quite a handy delivery from Anderson.

The dismissal looked spectacular but Vijay made the cardinal spin of trying to flick across the line and closed the bat face
Had he presented a straight bat, there was ore chance of covering it
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:30 am

Fantastic start for Jimmy and England.


Note to slips - DO NOT DROP KOHLI

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:30 am

10/2. Winning the toss was momentous. Anderson and Broad bowling expertly in these conditions.

Rain falling now.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:34 am

Rain takes them off with England (Jimmy) excelling. India do not look like a team you'd bet your mortgage on, they lost the test with the best weather for them, cos this summer is gonna have more cloudy spells from now on, and could really struggle.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:42 am

guildfordbat wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Both captains would've bowled first, which is understandable given the conditions. Actually agree with Duty and Root on bowling first - the Indian batting is fragile - get them back in in bowling conditions and see if they can make inroads again

Not what a dinosaur like me would've done but I certainly understand the decision and it's clearly working well so far with no runs on the board after 3 overs and one already back in the hutch. Peach from Jimmy as Duty said.

Guilford I suspect that the shortened game played a part here.
So far its working out for England and gives them a small chance of forcing a result out of a game that had draw written all over it. As theres rain forecast through the weekend the concerns of batting on a 5 day pitch have gone out the window, and the spinners threat reduced too. The only real opportunity for taking wickets is the new ball with some cloud around. If England luck out with the way the innings fall they could get all of the best bowling conditions in the game.
If India do weather this initial storm (pun intended) and bat 100 overs that will probably take us beyond lunch on day 3. With more rain to come its highly unlikley theyd bowl England out twice even with their rubbish batting line up.
Had England batted first there was a risk of the shoe being on the other foot, and relaisticaly the best they woudlve been batting for was to garuntee the draw.

In a full length test the possible scenarios would be very different, and concerns about batting last very real on a ground thats traidtionaly offered very little assistance till the 4th innings.

All the same I still fancy draw as the favourite

Gooseberry

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

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