England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

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England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Tue 03 Jul 2018, 11:09 am

First topic message reminder :

T20s

A three match series between the 2nd (India) and 4th ranked teams in the world https://www.icc-cricket.com/rankings/mens/team-rankings/t20i

Fixtures

Tuesday 3rd July 2018 17:30
Emirates Old Trafford, Manchester

Friday 6th July 2018 17:30
Sophia Gardens Cardiff, Cardiff

Sunday 8th July 2018 14:00
The Brightside Ground, Bristol


Squads

England: Morgan, Ali, Bairstow, Ball, Buttler, Curran S, Curran T, Hales, Jordan, Plunkett, Rashid, Root, Roy, Willey (Malan in as cover for 1st game, Stokes may join for 3rd)

India: Kohli, Chahal, Chahar, Dhawan, Dhoni, Karthik, Kaul, Kuldeep Yadav, Kumar, Pandey, HH Pandya, KH Pandya, Rahul, Raina, Sharma UT Yadav


Key Men

Jos Buttler - move up the order during IPL has given him much more time to have an impact. While only ranked 26 in ICC rankings, this will improve now he opens.
Alex Hales - Formerly top ranked batter in T20s, has dropped a bit (to 7) and finds his place in the England side under threat.
Rashid/Ali - Englands spinners have thrived in the one day format, but will find the Indian batting lineup a tough test.

Virat Kohli - probably the best batsmen in the world across all 3 forms of the game. Some injury issues recently.
Chahal/Kuldeep Yadav - India look like going with two wrist spinners. England often struggle to score quickly against good spin.



ODIs

Fixtures

Another 3 match series between the the top two ranked sides in the world.  Both teams will be wanting to lay down a marker before next year's world cup.


Thursday 12th July 2018 12:30
Trent Bridge, Nottingham

Saturday 14th July 2018 11:00
Lord's, London

Tuesday 17th July 2018 12:30
Emerald Headingley, Leeds


Squads

England - Eoin Morgan (capt), Moeen Ali, Jonny Bairstow, Jake Ball, Jos Buttler, Alex Hales, Liam Plunkett, Adil Rashid, Joe Root, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes, David Willey, Mark Wood.



Test Series

A form of cricket in which the visitors have been much better than the hosts. The series goes deep into September as India seek to avenge the series defeat in 2014. In a manner we have become used to seeing from touring teams around the world, that series India capitulated in the final 3 tests  having won the second test to take a 1-0 lead. India however look strong enough this time out to put pressure on a faltering home test team.


Fixtures

Wednesday 1st August 2018 11:00
Edgbaston, Birmingham

Thursday 9th August 2018 11:00
Lord's, London

Saturday 18th August 2018 11:00
Trent Bridge, Nottingham

Thursday 30th August 2018 11:00
Ageas Bowl, Southampton

Friday 7th September 2018 11:00
Kia Oval, London

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 11:53 am

Forecast has worsened further and it looks like we will get very little if any play today.
Sunday likely a washout too.

One for the traditionalists ...this is how I remember test cricket from my youth

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 12:20 pm

Play to resume at 12:45. Lunch one hour after that. picard

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 12:24 pm

Duty281 wrote:Play to resume at 12:45. Lunch one hour after that. picard

terrible to worry about lunch instead of getting more overs in
at most they could've taken a 15 min break to grab a quick sandwich for those who are really hungry
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 12:27 pm

Sound points there, goose.

Whilst as a couch captain I nearly always opt to back my batsmen, I acknowledge there are more situations (than I usually see them) in which I could instead back my bowlers.

I thought that on winning this toss, Root was banking more on the failings of India's batsmen than the strengths of Anderson & Co. That already seems too narrow a view. Jimmy was excellent and I don't believe KP-f gives enough credit to the preceding balls before dismissing Vijay.

Btw, soon after they do get out in the middle again, I hope Curran gets to bowl at Pujara. The Surrey youngster had him in all sorts of trouble in the Championship match against Yorks at the Oval. For all the support that Pujara has on this forum and elsewhere from India's supporters, he's been having a torrid time here this summer.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 12:35 pm

guildfordbat wrote:. Jimmy was excellent and I don't believe KP-f gives enough credit to the preceding balls before dismissing Vijay.

.
I am not discrediting Anderson
He is an excellent operator in such conditions....often times unplayable like Kumble was in his designer pitch zone
BUT
VIjay didn't help his cause of survival by closing the face of bat
Had he played a full face forward defense his chance of surviving that delivery was much higher
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Afro on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 1:11 pm

[quote="KP_fan"]
Duty281 wrote:
at most they could've taken a 15 min break to grab a quick sandwich for those who are really hungry

Nip down the spar and bring a selection of sarnies out with the drinks and first drinks break
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 1:39 pm

We're playing again.

Expect more wickets. And rain.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 1:50 pm

What are you doing India!
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 1:57 pm

plays resumes for 5 more minutes
and a RUN OUT in these conditions

God helps us Shocked
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:00 pm

Bizarre passage of play.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:17 pm

I haven't seen the run out but note it being credited to Pope on cricinfo. Good work by him or just daft running?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:27 pm

guildfordbat wrote:I haven't seen the run out but note it being credited to Pope on cricinfo. Good work by him or just daft running?

Pope walks to the wicket and taps the bail off, with Pujara and Kohli racing to get to the other end and be safe.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:31 pm

Actually rewatcing the clip on BBC, Pujara stops running so Kohli can turn round and not be out

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:40 pm

Thanks, Tiger.

Pujara's luck is sure out. If it rains soup in St. John's Wood this afternoon, he'll be the one there with a knife and fork!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 2:45 pm

Just caught up with the run out on the BBC. I'll give a tiny tick to Pope for keeping his head and doing what was required but, blimey, Kohli did his team mate up like a kipper!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 3:16 pm

Aye, could have been easy for a debutant to panic and throw at the stumps.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 4:49 pm

Getting run out in that situation is pretty inexcusable. Its good for Pope to get involved ...all the sitting around must be tough on a debutant.

Whilst India seem to be trying their level best to give England a sniff its increasingly hard to see a result. They will be lucky to get 150 overs in the match looking at the weather.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 4:52 pm

Might squeeze in some more play today.

Even with three very early wickets, however, it's still difficult to see any side forcing a result, bearing in mind the forecast for Sunday/Monday.

EDIT: Two whole hours of cricket coming up.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 5:09 pm

England need the vast majority, or all, of the remaining 7 wickets tonight. India must try and build to somewhere over 200 which would, at least, be competitive.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 5:24 pm

England's slip cordon drops a catch! Shocker.

Tough chance, admittedly.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:06 pm

49/4. It's Kohli who is out.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by JDizzle on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:07 pm

Excellent bowling from Woakes and Kohli is gone! Just held and held that line around off stump with the swinging ball and Kohli was batting with excellent discipline in leaving and not following the ball, but finally played across one and Buttler snaffled the catch.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:16 pm

'Kin hell. Another drop/miss. Should have been taken.

Woakes bowling superbly.

Ah, that one is caught! 61/5.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by JDizzle on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:17 pm

If you give Buttler two chances he will catch it! Both Kohlie and Pandya got one life and then were caught the next ball.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:23 pm

Curran joins in now. 62/6.

Rain or no rain, India are in massive trouble.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:24 pm

Karthik is properly crap
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:25 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Karthik is properly crap

Could have driven a tank through the gap he left.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by compelling and rich on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:25 pm

please stay away rain!

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by JDizzle on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:26 pm

Yeah, picking someone for one Test and then dropping him smacks of desperation... but it is clear Pant plays now.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by subhranshu.kumar.5 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:47 pm

Its final now. 2011 will repeat again.
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:47 pm

Will be interesting to see how England bat on this surface tomorrow. And will Ashwin trouble the English on this pitch?

Might be batting tonight, actually. Seven down.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:49 pm

Crikey Id given up hope of more play and suddenly another 3 wickets down.

No question bowling first was the right choice...if nothing else this will have crished Ondias spirit. The run out in particular must have caused some bad feeling in the camp.

Converting this to a victory will take some aggresive batting and the weather gods smiling on England all the same

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by compelling and rich on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 6:51 pm

compelling and rich wrote:please stay away rain!

actually it can come back in exactly 3 wickets time then bugger off rest of the test please. should be batting tonight in tough conditions

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 7:00 pm

Yeah the forecast for Sunday and Monday does not look good at all
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by compelling and rich on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 7:02 pm

theyll see out tonight, weve brought broad on. the only bowler whos not looked dangerous in these conditions

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 7:19 pm

107 all out.

India utterly destroyed in conditions that they simply don't have a clue in. Can they comeback from this?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by msp83 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:05 pm

Again, despite the rain taking away nearly 2 days out of the game, India trying their best to add a 3 day loss... Pretty poor batting performance...
Yes, the conditions were not easy and quite unlike the roads where they go big or spinning tracks where they any ways tend to struggle but usually less than the opposition. But this performance is just not good enough. Virat Kohli looked a lot more assured than he looked at any stage until he crossed his hundred in the first test, but then he got a good one , edged and was caught for once! And then everything came apart, no recovery from the lows of 15-3.
Ajinkya Rahane looked good for most of his stay but didn't kick on. Ravichandran Ashwin yet again proved he's a better et with the bat in test cricket than Hardik Pandya or Dinesh Karthik. Had it not for him, India would not even have crossed the hundred...
If the skys stay like this, the ball will swing and it wouldn't be very easy fr the English. But the sun might decide to come out tomorrow, and when that happens, The HQ could become an absolute flat road of a track.
India had their moments in the last game and they let it slip. Think now after this, they will just lay down arms and surrender just like they did in 2014 or 2011.
Virat Kohli will most certainly do all in his powers to prevent such an outcome, but it seems a lonely fight from him, just like MS Dhoni in 2014, batting up the order, taking blows and scoring real tough, quality runs that eventually couldn't make a difference as the team as such never turned up.
In 2011 there was Dravid and an innings or 2 from Tendulkar and Praveen Kumar did a lonely fight with the ball. Then it was Dhoni and Vijay, with a bit of help from Rahane and Jadeja in the only test India won in 2014.
Can India escape with a draw here? Will the rain come down and save them? When things go wrong like this, even nature won't be on your side...

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by msp83 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:11 pm

DK, as expected, proving to be a liability. Not safe with the gloves, ordinary and inconsistent with the bat. Parthiv, though he can't even catch a cold, would have had a better chance of reaching double figures more consistently!!
Enough with Karthik, Parthiv and even Saha for that matter. Should invest in Pant, Samson or Ishan Kishan sooner rather than later. Hope Pant gets the next 3 games... At least, the exposure he might gain could end up as the only take away at the end of the day.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:13 pm

I thought it was the day at 15-3
and then 45 min back saw it was 107-a.o

Was shocking but not surprising seeing the way on Chanel 5 highlights how ball was jagging around

Am used to seeing ashwin / Jadeja bowl out sides for 100 odd in absolute home conditions.....and this was an equivalent....except that unlike Indian batsmen being adept on spinning pitches...Eng batsmen will be almost equally vulnerable

That Ind had to stop-start didn't help their cause...and while its only 107 its only about 40 runs short of par

India has to bowl tight...out of their skin...give no lose balls...and while they are one seamer short...if conditions remain same......Eng can be restricted to 150 odd

If I were Kohli I would still open with spin...keep spin from one end and seamer from the other
Sad anti-climax would be if it remains bright, sunny and no cloud cover and conditions drastically different tomm

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by KP_fan on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:25 pm

msp83 wrote:DK, as expected, proving to be a liability. Not safe with the gloves, ordinary and inconsistent with the bat. Parthiv, though he can't even catch a cold, would have had a better chance of reaching double figures more consistently!!
Enough with Karthik, Parthiv and even Saha for that matter. Should invest in Pant, Samson or Ishan Kishan sooner rather than later. Hope Pant gets the next 3 games... At least, the exposure he might gain could end up as the only take away at the end of the day.

we bowled Eng out for 160 in T1 2nd inning and inspite of a 63 rearguard from one of their tailenders
Before we are too harsh....lets wait a bit until tomm.....we might get them for under 140 and still be in the game
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 8:54 pm

KP_fan wrote:I thought it was the day at 15-3
and then 45 min back saw it was 107-a.o

Was shocking but not surprising seeing the way on Chanel 5 highlights how ball was jagging around

Am used to seeing ashwin / Jadeja bowl out sides for 100 odd in absolute home conditions.....and this was an equivalent....except that unlike Indian batsmen being adept on spinning pitches...Eng batsmen will be almost equally vulnerable

That Ind had to stop-start didn't help their cause...and while its only 107 its only about 40 runs short of par

India has to bowl tight...out of their skin...give no lose balls...and while they are one seamer short...if conditions remain same......Eng can be restricted to 150 odd

If I were Kohli I would still open with spin...keep spin from one end and seamer from the other
Sad anti-climax would be if it remains bright, sunny and no cloud cover and conditions drastically different tomm


Its forecast to be sunny for most of the day tomorrow so England really have looked out with the conditions and winning the toss.
India for all their talk of preparation haven't had an opportunity to play in those kinds of classic English conditions, and its no secret how effective their bowlers are with the Dukes ball when the pitch and atmosphere aid them.
As India wont get quite as much assistance and their bowlers arent quite as well skilled at maximising the movement and hitting the right lengths I agree Ashwin could still be a key bowler. It doesnt matter what the pitch is like, he will trouble England....I dont see them batting all day, but if they can bat most of it then India will face similar conditions again for the following days.
India's hope really lies in how much of a gamble England have taken with their batting, only Root is really looking like a genuine test batsman currently ...and hes a place higher than ideal. Still a dashing 50 from Buttler as wickets fall around him could be enough to give England a decent lead, and plenty of time to bowl India out cheaply again in whatever play they can get Sunday Monday. If there is a full days play tomorrow a result is on.


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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Aug 2018, 9:22 pm

KP_fan wrote:That Ind had to stop-start didn't help their cause...and while its only 107 its only about 40 runs short of par

India has to bowl tight...out of their skin...give no lose balls...and while they are one seamer short...if conditions remain same......Eng can be restricted to 150 odd

If I were Kohli I would still open with spin...keep spin from one end and seamer from the other

Agree with this. India struggled, but I don't envisage England doing a hell of a lot better.

Root will want his side to get 200, anything else is a bonus. Ashwin should come on early, too.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by alfie on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 2:01 am

The only totally unpredictable thing was that they managed to get 36 overs in amidst the sort of weather that inspired Noah to go into boat building...

Once Root won the toss he had to insert India. I am from similar Jurassic roots as guildford , but even I would have done so in a four day game in those conditions. (I would also have left out Rashid for Moeen as I doubt they will need much spin in this match and could have done with more batting )

Anderson and Woakes in particular were excellent...as you'd expect on a day like this. The rain delays served to keep the bowlers fresh. Certainly India didn't help themselves ; but apart from the truly daft run out it was more a case of can't play the conditions than bad choices.  They can thank Ashwin for reaching even 100.

Can they get back in the match ?  Well we always say wait until both teams have batted...and Warne always says if it seams it spins...And the English batting order is , to say the least , unpredictable...

Weather changes Saturday , I am told ?  So Englandought to secure a solid lead...indeed they'll be aiming for a massive one.  But given the fragility of their lineup I think that relies on at least two or three players getting set and going on ; I won't be counting any chickens just yet.  Or ducks , I hope.

Also hear weather later on won't be too flash so no guarantees of a result whatever happens.  But for now , thanks be to the Lord's ground staff and the modern covering and drying equipment thumbsup

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 8:54 am

Lovely post, Alfie. Very Happy Particularly liked the ''Jurassic roots'' reference.

Today looks much better weather wise. I'm twenty five miles or so south of the ground and it's sunny and bright here already. Maybe a full day's play? Apologies if that produces the inevitable jinx.

One howler I made was to overlook how bad the weather would be yesterday. After the day one washout, I was looking forward to a four day Test which was unrealistic given the forecast. Something which has changed in this country over the years is the accuracy of weather forecasting. It's still not perfect but it's vastly improved over the years. Accordingly, a captain shouldn't be totally geared by it but does need to take it into account a fair bit more than he did in the past. That applies even more to me!

So if we defy goose's expectations and bat competently, how long do we bat for? Given the forecast for the remainder of this Test, do we consider declaring tonight and give India a few overs before stumps? Or do we look to grind them further down, make it entirely safe and bat into day 4? Or is that totally getting ahead of ourselves and we can expect England to be all out by tea? I'll leave you folks to answer.

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 9:42 am

Looking at the weather forecast I would say (at best) there are about two days left to get a result - today and a day spread over tomorrow and Monday. England have to look to score quickly. Their batting is brittle at present so even if they are bowled out for 200 in the final session of today they will be in a position where defeat would be impossible in this test. They could then use the remaining day to bowl India out cheaply again and go 2-0 up. India must find a way to bowl England out for around the score they posted by around mid-afternoon and then bat themselves into a lead of around 100 by close. They may then have a chance of forcing a win if time allows.
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by CaledonianCraig on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 9:57 am

One thing I am really surprised about is that there isn't a 10.30am start today considering how much time has been lost over the last two days? I say this as the BBC website is saying play starts at 11am.
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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by Duty281 on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 10:59 am

India really have drawn the short straw. Sunny, blue skies as England come out to bat.

Monday's forecast looking a lot brighter, so perhaps not too optimistic that this test has another 200 overs left in it?

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by alfie on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 11:40 am

Well that nice little opening stand came to a sudden end...why on earth Cook consented to Jennings reviewing that is beyond me ! Always looked out. Good bowling from Shami.

Ishant looks much more dangerous around the wicket to the left handers.

Certainly different weather this morning !

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by alfie on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 11:42 am

And indeed Ishant has snared Cook now...little edge to the keeper. He will be annoyed as he had looked rather good this morning - but wanted a lot more than 21.

Pope in for debut...

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

Post by alfie on Sat 11 Aug 2018, 11:49 am

After a peaceful half hour the two wickets have transformed the game...now every ball seems to carry menace.

Pope away with a boundary second ball might calm his nerves ; but Root looks very uncertain.

India on top ...

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Re: England's Indian Summer - T20s, ODIs & Tests

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