Scotland Autumn Internationals

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Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 8:14 am

Scotland's autumn internationals

Wales v Scotland - Saturday, 3 November (14:45 GMT)

Scotland v Fiji - Saturday, 10 November (14:30 GMT)

Scotland v South Africa - Saturday, 17 November (17:20 GMT)

Scotland v Argentina - Saturday, 24 November (14:30 GMT)

2018 Form

Argentina 14 - 44 Scotland

USA 30 - 29 Scotland

Canada 10 - 48 Scotland

Italy 27 - 29 Scotland

Ireland 28 - 8 Scotland

Scotland 25 - England 13

Scotland 32 - 26 France

Wales 34 - 7 Scotland

Squad

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DpsoE0CXUAA5jID.jpg


Last edited by bsando on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 10:41 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Tramptastic on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 1:38 pm

2/4 wins would be par...

3/4 wins would be a good showing...

4/4 naw bad eh...

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Cyril on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 2:39 pm

Why have Scotland chosen to play Wales in the AIs? Seems very odd considering all the complaining about too much rugby and/or the responsibility to grow the game.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 2:50 pm

Cyril wrote:Why have Scotland chosen to play Wales in the AIs? Seems very odd considering all the complaining about too much rugby and/or the responsibility to grow the game.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/42748131

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BamBam on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 6:54 pm

Is it fund raising for Doddie? Some of the comments are implying that, but this quote ssays different

Welsh Rugby Union chief executive Martyn Phillips said: "We need four international matches in our autumn calendar in order to provide vital funds for the future sustainability of the game in Wales."

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 7:02 pm

I'm off to it anyway. I'm sure my English accent won't stick out like a sore thumb.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by The Oracle on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 7:10 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:I'm off to it anyway.  I'm sure my English accent won't stick out like a sore thumb.

You’ll be alright, 7.5. It’s not exactly rare to get someone from a foreign country visiting Wales you know! I even knew someone who had an English colleague once Wink
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Cyril on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 8:02 pm

I lived in Wales for 15 years. I was probably that English colleague Wink

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Cyril on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 8:05 pm

Good cause anyway. I went to the Falcons/Saints game in March at St James Park when they were fundraising for Doddie. Should have made it the 5th AI then everyone is happy Smile

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 8:47 pm

Should be a cracking match anyway. Disappointed hogg out like.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Sun 14 Oct 2018, 11:27 pm

Scotland squad announced on Wednesday apparently.

The journos are suggesting a few left field picks and it would not be a Toonie squad without some!

Just about everyone thinks Blade Thompson will be in but I have also seen Gary Graham mentioned, if he can swallow his pride! Ben Vellacott as well, still not committed to England and seems to have slipped down the pecking order a little bit.

How about Ollie Atkins, ex Edinburgh and Scotland A cap from a few years back, doing very well at Exeter recently!

Anyone care to throw anyone else into the mix?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 8:32 am

Scotland squad is currently looking in reasonable shape, but there's still some hard games to come up over the next few weeks so that could change quickly if we pick up key injuries. 2nd row is probably the biggest worry if one of the front line locks picks up an injury. Some players are starting to come into form nicely - the Edinburgh props had a slow start to the season but are getting back to their best now. Huw Jones as finally discovered some form for Glasgow too.

I'm almost certain that Thompson will be in it, but I'd be disappointed if Graham is picked over someone like Jamie Ritchie - Graham wasn't even getting a game for Newcastle earlier in the season (he was playing A-team games) and Newcastle have been struggling this season. Ritchie has had a very good season and made huge impact off the bench in recent weeks.

Darcy Graham might be invited to the wider training squad although I can't see him getting any action other than through injuries - I'd actually like him to stay at Edinburgh to get more gametime under his belt, which he desperately needs.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 11:26 am

It is going to have to be a pretty big squad this time, bearing in mind that for the first game will have to all Scotland based players and then the non Scottish based players will come in for the next three games and so there may be a bit of chopping and changing to accommodate that.

For the first game, I think we will be looking at a team something like:

Dell
McInally
Nel
Gray J
Gilchrist
Wilson
Watson
Fagerson
Price
Hastings
Seymour
Dunbar
Jones H
Jones L/Fife/Graham
Kinghorn

Allen
Brown
Berghan
Toolis
Ritchie
Horne G
Horne P
Jones L/Fife/Graham

It is the second wing spot that I can't make up my mind about, Graham is very inexperienced, but all the coaches rate him and he has played well in the last two games.


Plenty of other players will come into the mix for the subsequent games including:

Laidlaw, Russell. Maitland, McGuigan, Gray R, Denton, Lang plus any other left field choices that Toonie has to make.

There are 4 tests to play in 4 weeks and so he is going to have to mix and match a little bit and it also gives him room to experiment and we all know that Toonie likes an experiment!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 11:42 am

Looks like we can rule out big Ritchie Gray for the autumn. The reason he was pulled out of the Toulouse squad on Saturday is that his back trouble has flaired up again, probably going to be out for months now,

Feel really sorry for him, but it does look like the wear and tear of 10 years on the coalface has started to catch up with him. You do wonder if we are ever going to see him really fit and firing again?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 11:45 am

Beegee, ain't no way Bradbury isn't in the squad for the Wales game. He's been immense this season. He'll start at 6, Wilson at 8, Fagerson/Ritche on the bench. Probably.

Yours is a decent team. I'd love to see Wee Darcy given a go.

It'll be a horrorshow for Glasgow and Embra that weekend.


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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 11:53 am

Captain_Sensible wrote:Beegee, ain't no way Bradbury isn't in the squad for the Wales game. He's been immense this season. He'll start at 6, Wilson at 8, Fagerson/Ritche on the bench. Probably.

Yours is a decent team. I'd love to see Wee Darcy given a go.

It'll be a horrorshow for Glasgow and Embra that weekend.


Sorry I overlooked him, he is going to be there or there abouts. We can actually put together a half decent team of Scottish based players now with some genuine selection dilemmas.

You are right about the Pro teams that weekend as well, they will be decimated. Likely the week before as well, as lots of players will require resting after the two heavy euro weekends and Toonies desire to have a functioning team on the pitch!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by IanBru on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 11:57 am

BigGee wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:Beegee, ain't no way Bradbury isn't in the squad for the Wales game. He's been immense this season. He'll start at 6, Wilson at 8, Fagerson/Ritche on the bench. Probably.

Yours is a decent team. I'd love to see Wee Darcy given a go.

It'll be a horrorshow for Glasgow and Embra that weekend.


Sorry I overlooked him, he is going to be there or there abouts. We can actually put together a half decent team of Scottish based players now with some genuine selection dilemmas.

You are right about the Pro teams that weekend as well, they will be decimated. Likely the week before as well, as lots of players will require resting after the two heavy euro weekends and Toonies desire to have a functioning team on the pitch!
Hilariously, the Glasgow match on the Friday night before that is against Ospreys, so at least they'll probably be depleted to, if not the same extent!
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:04 pm

Both Pro teams have welsh opposition that weekend so it looks like a bit of thought has actually gone into it - Edinburgh and Glasgow will be decimated but the O's and Scarlets will be too, although not quite as badly as they have 4 teams to chose from.

Given that both teams have 3 attractional tests after I hope that there is an agreement for them to play this as a development test. I’m not sure what would be gained both teams putting out full strength teams given that we’re so used to each other and the risk of injury.

I’d like to see something like

1 Sutherland
2 Turner
3 McCallum
4 Toolis
5 Charmichael (if he recovers)
6 Hamilton (save Bradbury for the big tests)
7 Ritchie
8 Fagerson

9 Horne
10 Hastings
11 Jones
12 Scott
13 Dean
14 Graham
15 Jackson (save Kinghorn for the big tests)

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:24 pm

Wales v Scotland - Development Test!

Can't see that happening, this will be as full strength as selection allows, bearing in mind that wales will lose a few players as well. Imagine the confidence it would inspire if we were to break our abysmal run down in Cardiff. There will be some rotation throughout the series, but this one will be best available.

I am going and along with the rest of the paying punters am expecting a full bloodied test match!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:33 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Both Pro teams have welsh opposition that weekend so it looks like a bit of thought has actually gone into it - Edinburgh and Glasgow will be decimated but the O's and Scarlets will be too, although not quite as badly as they have 4 teams to chose from.

Given that both teams have 3 attractional tests after I hope that there is an agreement for them to play this as a development test. I’m not sure what would be gained both teams putting out full strength teams given that we’re so used to each other and the risk of injury.

I’d like to see something like

1 Sutherland
2 Turner
3 McCallum
4 Toolis
5 Charmichael (if he recovers)
6 Hamilton (save Bradbury for the big tests)
7 Ritchie
8 Fagerson

9 Horne
10 Hastings
11 Jones
12 Scott
13 Dean
14 Graham
15 Jackson (save Kinghorn for the big tests)

Can't see the logic of saving Kinghorn. He's had hardly any caps, he's still learning the international game, he needs as much exposure to it before the RWC as possible, if he's going to be a credible back up to Hogg. I'd start him in all four games.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LondonTiger on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:34 pm

What is the injury list looking like for Scotland?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:35 pm

Jacko is a spent force at this level as well. His performances for Glasgow this season have shown him to be half a yard slow and he is just never making it through the gaps. We may need to look at other FB cover options, Seymour or Maitland for instance.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:39 pm

LondonTiger wrote:What is the injury list looking like for Scotland?

Not too bad at the moment - R Gray, Barclay, Zander Fagerson and Duncan Taylor are the main missing men.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:41 pm

LondonTiger wrote:What is the injury list looking like for Scotland?

We have a few, but fortunately are carrying a bit more depth than we ever used to so won't be quite so badly effected. Still another week of euros to come though and these games are very attricious.

Long term are Duncan Taylor and Zander Fagerson. Taylor out for the whole season, ZF till after the 6N. We can carry those though provided we are not badly stocked with Props and centres.

Hoggy out till probably after the AIs, but this allows the new boy Kinghorn to play in his best position of FB, so maybe not so terrible either.

Ritchie Gray is now apparently crooked with a bad back and out for several months. RG has been struggling with fitness for a few seasons now, the life of a pro second row in France seems to be catching up with him.

Those are the main ones, there are a few other bit players as well, but nothing we can't cope with.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:42 pm

Forgot about JB, now he will be missed, not just for what he brings on the pitch as well.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:52 pm

BigGee wrote:Forgot about JB, now he will be missed, not just for what he brings on the pitch as well.

And, in turn, I forgot Hogg. Age is a terrible thing.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 12:54 pm

I see what everyone's saying about wanting a full test match, but if that's what you want then can you really complain about players playing too much rugby! 3 AIs in a row are brutal enough - 4 in a row with mainly the same players is madness. Also worth remembering that after the AIs there's only 1 Pro 14 game then straight back into Champions Cup rugby.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:08 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I see what everyone's saying about wanting a full test match, but if that's what you want then can you really complain about players playing too much rugby! 3 AIs in a row are brutal enough - 4 in a row with mainly the same players is madness. Also worth remembering that after the AIs there's only 1 Pro 14 game then straight back into Champions Cup rugby.

There will always be a certain amount of rotation through the four games, especially when the exiles come in for the AIs proper. The Wales game should be seen as a chance to bring in a few new/untested players, as well as establishing a core of players who can take us through all four games.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Collapse2005 on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:09 pm

Decent chance of 4 wins for Scotland.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:10 pm

I am not generally in favour of playing 4 AIs, three is sufficient and I hope we do go back to three after this year. Money is a factor though, the sponsorship for the 6N has dropped significantly with RBS moving on and both nations need to balance the books, Scotland are not playing down there for nothing.

In terms of the 4 games, I would be surprised if any players start all four games, we will rotate the squad and tr some things out. Part of the rationale for having the game was to imitate the sort of schedule we will have in the WC next autumn and we will have to use the whole squad then as well.

I also think we will rest a lot of the international players both the week before and after the AIs, we are fortunate in that the union will be able to dictate that should it feel the need. I am sure DR and RC are already aware of what will be required.

Development tests are ok for a tier one nation going up against a tier two, but even they can go amiss, see Scotland v USA this summer. They are never going to happen at tier one level, there is far to much at stake.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:12 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Decent chance of 4 wins for Scotland.

Could just as easily lose three or four of them, none of them are gimmes, even Fiji, who we lost to last time around. South Africa and Argentina have both improved massively, just depends what they may have left in the tank at the end of a long season.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Collapse2005 on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:14 pm

BigGee wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:Decent chance of 4 wins for Scotland.

Could just as easily lose three or four of them, none of them are gimmes, even Fiji, who we lost to last time around. South Africa and Argentina have both improved massively, just depends what they may have left in the tank at the end of a long season.

SA and Argentina don't tour well to the NH.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LordDowlais on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:19 pm

Looking forward to the game against you lot next month, it always means something when we play you lot, even in friendly's.

Hope you bring a good crowd down with you, the Jocks always make a good atmosphere. How do you all reckon this one will go ?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:34 pm

Don't imagine there will be too many surprises, as already discussed Blade Thomson is well within the crosshairs. I reckon Lang will get another run out at 12 which given our record of injuries at centre is np bad thing,

Only outlier perhaps would be a call up for one of the younger forwards for some training camp experience. Or maybe a NZer with a scottish cousin twice removed who we've not heard of yet. Heres hoping Ken Nga Huruhuru McDougall can solve our problems at 8.
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:34 pm

I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:39 pm

On a sidenote, I'd be interested to see if weir gets plonked back in at 4th choice after a good start to the season with worcester
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:51 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LordDowlais on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:53 pm

Captain_Sensible wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

I wouldn't worry.

Yes they have big athletes, but Scotland are far more structured, and organised. Just don't fall into their trap of playing an open game. Scotland should be fine.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:55 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

I wouldn't worry.

Yes they have big athletes, but Scotland are far more structured, and organised. Just don't fall into their trap of playing an open game. Scotland should be fine.

We always fall into that trap vs Samoa, and they've given us a hell of a fright that couple of times we've played them. Fiji are a lot better than Samoa. Not sure we can avoid an open game with Russell or Hastings at the helm.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:55 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:On a sidenote, I'd be interested to see if weir gets plonked back in at 4th choice after a good start to the season with worcester

I'd say he's defintely 3rd choice on current form - Horne has been baws this season.

There could also be an argument to have him on the bench to close out games / when we need a drop goal to win (because Finn certainly won't be kicking it!).

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LordDowlais on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:56 pm

Captain_Sensible wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

I wouldn't worry.

Yes they have big athletes, but Scotland are far more structured, and organised. Just don't fall into their trap of playing an open game. Scotland should be fine.

We always fall into that trap vs Samoa, and they've given us a hell of a fright that couple of times we've played them. Fiji are a lot better than Samoa. Not sure we can avoid an open game with Russell or Hastings at the helm.

What side do you reckon will go to Cardiff ? Will Scotland play their strongest team ?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:58 pm

5ft wide, 5ft tall but boy can he score a drop goal
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BamBam on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 1:59 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

I wouldn't worry.

Yes they have big athletes, but Scotland are far more structured, and organised. Just don't fall into their trap of playing an open game. Scotland should be fine.

The Welsh are definitely the best to take advice from on how to avoid an open game against the Islanders angel

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:00 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:5ft wide, 5ft tall but boy can he score a drop goal

Laugh

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:12 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Captain_Sensible wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm terrified of the Fiji game - they've got so many incredible athletes and I'm sure they'll have all their big guns available.

Big Bill Mata, Uncle NakNak, Niko, Volavola...

Bloody hell.

I wouldn't worry.

Yes they have big athletes, but Scotland are far more structured, and organised. Just don't fall into their trap of playing an open game. Scotland should be fine.

We always fall into that trap vs Samoa, and they've given us a hell of a fright that couple of times we've played them. Fiji are a lot better than Samoa. Not sure we can avoid an open game with Russell or Hastings at the helm.

What side do you reckon will go to Cardiff ? Will Scotland play their strongest team ?

I put my team up back up the thread.

Yes, strongest available, bearing in mind we will only have Scotland based players.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:27 pm

Thinking for Wales maybe something like this..

1. Dell
2. McInally
3. Nel
4. Gilchrist
5. Gray
6. Wilson
7. Watson
8. Thomson (if he gets the call, Wilson otherwise)
9. Price
10. Hastings
11. Jones
12. Scott
13. Jones
14. Fife
15. Kinghorn

16. Brown
17. Sutherland
18. Berghan
19. Toolis
20. Bradbury (If no Thomson call up 6 and Fagerson bench)
21. Horne
22. Horne
23. Jackson

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:33 pm

Doesn't look too shabby, though after seeing jackson play yesterday i really don't like the idea of him at fullback anymore. King of the pointless kicks.

Ideally would have maitland cover fb instead but obviously not an option for wales. Do we really have no other viable options at FB? Has paddy dewhirst not got a pro contract?
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:34 pm

Can't imagine the Scarlets will allow Thompson to be released outside an international window

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:38 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Can't imagine the Scarlets will allow Thompson to be released outside an international window

I have no idea what the protocol is. Play him vs Fiji if Scarlets don't play ball.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 2:45 pm

The protocal is it is outside the international window so Scarlets would have to agree to it (which usually involves getting some money!). There's no incentive for the Scarlets to let him play, especially given they will be without their welsh internationals.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

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