Scotland Autumn Internationals

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Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Thu 27 Sep 2018, 8:14 am

First topic message reminder :

Scotland's autumn internationals

Wales v Scotland - Saturday, 3 November (14:45 GMT)

Scotland v Fiji - Saturday, 10 November (14:30 GMT)

Scotland v South Africa - Saturday, 17 November (17:20 GMT)

Scotland v Argentina - Saturday, 24 November (14:30 GMT)

2018 Form

Argentina 14 - 44 Scotland

USA 30 - 29 Scotland

Canada 10 - 48 Scotland

Italy 27 - 29 Scotland

Ireland 28 - 8 Scotland

Scotland 25 - England 13

Scotland 32 - 26 France

Wales 34 - 7 Scotland

Squad

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DpsoE0CXUAA5jID.jpg


Last edited by bsando on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 10:41 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by LordDowlais on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 3:36 pm

bsando wrote:Thinking for Wales maybe something like this..

1. Dell
2. McInally
3. Nel
4. Gilchrist
5. Gray
6. Wilson
7. Watson
8. Thomson (if he gets the call, Wilson otherwise)
9. Price
10. Hastings
11. Jones
12. Scott
13. Jones
14. Fife
15. Kinghorn

16. Brown
17. Sutherland
18. Berghan
19. Toolis
20. Bradbury (If no Thomson call up 6 and Fagerson bench)
21. Horne
22. Horne
23. Jackson

Still a decent side, although you will miss Finn Russell. Wales have a few injuries so I will have to think about our most likely side.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Eejit on Mon 15 Oct 2018, 5:45 pm

I like bsando's side for Wales. Might aswell use the opportunity to experiment a little.

I assume we'll have Russell and Laidlaw back for the games that are actually in the test window. I can't quite believe I'm about to say this but it might be a good idea to play Greeg vs Fiji.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 7:48 am

Cheers Eejit and Neilybroon!

Re: Thomson - I was under the impression it was just the English and French clubs who wouldn't release players, but does that extend to Pro14 as well? Definitely makes sense for Scarlets not to release him early, I think I just assumed because it's a Scotland vs Wales fixture it would be okay.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/45868999

Feel bad for Gray. He's had a bad run of luck lately, hope the surgery goes well. In the article the BBC mention Ollie Atkins who was mentioned earlier in this thread. Does feel as though Townsend may drop a few interesting selection choices this Autumn pre world cup which is exciting.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 12:36 pm

Jack Owlett. Is he an option for a call up? Don’t know much about him apart from he has a dual contract with Exeter and Cornish Pirates and has represented Scotland U20. Perhaps there are options at Glasgow and Edinburgh who currently stand a better chance of filling the holes left by Fagerson, Marfo etc.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 2:54 pm

When does Kebble qualify? Is it still early doors?

Did McCallum not play at loosehead for a while too?
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 3:03 pm

McCallum started at LH but has been TH the last few seasons. He has played the odd game at LH recently though and has actually done very well. He needs to stick as a TH for Edinburgh though as we don't want to mess up his development by moving him around.

I reckon he's a bolter for the 5th prop slot in the WC squad given his ability to cover both sides.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 4:18 pm

bsando wrote:Jack Owlett. Is he an option for a call up? Don’t know much about him apart from he has a  dual contract with Exeter and Cornish Pirates and has represented Scotland U20. Perhaps there are options at Glasgow and Edinburgh who currently stand a better chance of filling the holes left by Fagerson, Marfo etc.

I don't think he has played any senior rugby yet, which really aught to rule him out. We are actually pretty well stocked with LHs so we would have to have some major injury crisis before we are casting the net that far out.

Current order of merit:

Dell

Sutherland/Allen - a toss up this one, AA has had more game time this season and playing well, but RS well regarded prior to injury and looks back to form

McCallam - I agree with RDW that his ability to play both sides may give him an edge in selection, also playing well

Marfo - did a decent job when called up before, maybe will get some game time in the international window and show us if still has it

Reid - lets not forget Gordie, who will do a job if required. Hard to know how well he is playing in the second string unfortunately and likely to count against him

Probably best pool of LHs we have ever had and Kebble and maybe the Shoe to join them in the future!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by reallybored on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 10:01 pm

Squad announced tomorrow, last year he named a 36 man squad.

Here's what I'm predicting:

6 Props - Dell, Allan, Nel, Bergan, McCallum, Sutherland
3 Hookers - McInally, Brown, Turner
4 Locks - Gray, Gilchrist, Toolis, Cummings (Harley if injured)
7 Backrows - Watson, Wilson, Bradbury, Denton, Thomson, Ritchie, Fagerson

5 Halfbacks - Price, Russell, Horne, Hastings, Pyrgos
5 Centres - Dunbar, Jones, Scott, Horne, Grigg
6 Backthree - Kinghorn, Maitland, Seymour, Jones, McGuigan, Graham

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by 123456789. on Tue 16 Oct 2018, 11:42 pm

It's looking like we've a fair few injuries going into this series, may not be a bad thing come next year. I'd rather drop a few games now than in Japan or the Six Nations. Furthermore it might put some of our 2nd, 3rd and 4th choice players up against the World's top sides and it's best they get that now as opposed to in a year's time, injuries are part of rugby and it's right we're prepared for them.

I'd say Toonie knows minimum 13/15 of his preferred starting XV. I'd say he'll want to whittle his options down to around 35-45 players by the end of this series and the Six Nations.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 9:21 am

Yeah I agree numbers, I think a large training squad will be announced today. Think Reallybored has it pretty spot on plus a few more younger guys and possibly a few surprise picks like Atkins, Velacott or Graham. Just wonder if we'll have any surprise omissions as well?

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 9:51 am

https://twitter.com/Scotlandteam/status/1052480711041662977

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 9:51 am



Squad's up

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 9:52 am

Squads up - no place for Graham or Lang in the backs - still persisting with the Harris project...

Johnson only new face there, no surprises.

Forwards, as expected Thomson is in, would be silly not to. Skinner anyone!?
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Captain_Sensible on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 10:08 am

NeilyBroon wrote:Squads up - no place for Graham or Lang in the backs - still persisting with the Harris project...

Johnson only new face there, no surprises.

Forwards, as expected Thomson is in, would be silly not to. Skinner anyone!?

Very solid performer for Exeter, definitely worth a look.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by NeilyBroon on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 10:24 am

Captain_Sensible wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote:Squads up - no place for Graham or Lang in the backs - still persisting with the Harris project...

Johnson only new face there, no surprises.

Forwards, as expected Thomson is in, would be silly not to. Skinner anyone!?

Very solid performer for Exeter, definitely worth a look.

I'd imagine he'll be a bench player so solid is what we need.

Never know he may be one of those people who excel at international without setting the club scene on fire.

I really don't get the Harris thing. He's just not shown that he's anywhere near up to scratch. I'd rather see Johnstone given a chance if we're looking for a solid defensive lump of an outside centre to cover from the bench.

Against Wales I'd like to see

Dell
McInally
Nel
Gray
Gilchrist
Bradbury
Watson
Blade(?)/Batman if he's not released (I like that we can now choose between Blade or Batman for no 8)

Horne
Hastings

Scott (even before he got injured vs Sarries I don't think Dunbar was setting the world alight - too soon for Johnson)
H Jones

L Jones
Fife (I think he's on better form than Seymour at the moment to be honest)
Kinghorn


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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 10:40 am

Haha, a Toonie curve ball. We were thinking Ollie Atkins and then boom! Skinner instead. Well well..

Decent squad, it would have been nice to see Lang involved again but there’s some great players selected at centre there. Thomson adds a new dimension to the backrow and could help Scotland find a slightly higher gear in terms of attack. Exciting times!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by EWT Spoons on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 11:38 am

Got to love a toonie curve ball, don't think anyone expected Skinner.

Also slightly surprised Reid is included, he's not playing at a high enough standard currently, I can only assume its so Edinburgh & Glasgow are not massively short of props during the AIs

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Anglobraveheart on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 1:25 pm

It's only the training squad, so there will be a surplus available to return to their clubs.
Gordie Reid was solid and didn't let us down in the 6N, so I wouldn't be surprised if he makes the match day day. He's consistent.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 1:54 pm

Given that Daryl Marfo is yet to play for Edinburgh this season Reid is the only real alternative. Reid is a seasoned pro now so I wouldn't be worried using him as a last resort. Marfo will get his chance during the AIs to show he's still up to it.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 1:56 pm

Actually I've just noticed he's in over Sutherland too - that is a surprise. Still, Sutherland's not had a massive amount of gametime so again he may force himself into contention.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 2:07 pm

Also, I'm amazed Skinner having tartan underpants has flown under the radar given he is a regular for Exeter who are one of the top European teams. At 6ft 5 and almost 18st, able to cover lock and back row, he could be a real asset. He's the lineout caller for Exeter too apparently.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by EWT Spoons on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 2:22 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Actually I've just noticed he's in over Sutherland too - that is a surprise. Still, Sutherland's not had a massive amount of gametime so again he may force himself into contention.

As I say I think this might have something to do with not totally shafting the pro teams. If sutherland was called up Edinburgh would have been left with only marfo who cockers doesn't seem to rate and hasn't been involved this season at all.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Anglobraveheart on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 2:39 pm

Looks like Strauss's ship may have Sale'd too.... sorry for the pun!
Given the likes of Strauss, Lang and Marfo being left out and the list of a dozen or so injured players, it's great to see so many player options being considered. To have over 50 names amongst the squad/injured/left out possibles numbers is a much stronger position to be in, considering where we were 5 years ago.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 3:46 pm

Got to love a Toonie squad, you always know that there will be someone in there you have not thought about at all!

Sam Skinner seems someone who is well worth a punt, especially with our injury currently, Any back 5 player holding down a place for Exeter is going to be a very good player!

Glad to see Sam Johnson in as well, he really could pick up some caps at 12, was one of Glasgow's best players last season, more physical than Pete Horne and almost as good a ball player.

Gordie Reid a bit of a surprise, but as someone else said he is solid and will do a job if required. Alex Allen gets the reward for good form and Bhatti and Sutherland have still got some work to do. He is definitely eyeing up McCallam as the 5th prop for the WC, covering both sides, so surely he will get some game time in the series.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by jimbopip on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 4:33 pm

Sam Skinner's father is from Ayr. Obviously World Class.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by funnyExiledScot on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 4:45 pm

jimbopip wrote:Sam Skinner's father is from Ayr. Obviously World Class.

Shall we skip the formalities and name him World Player of the Year??

A couple of left field calls as always from Toonie, but the core remains in place. Going to the Fiji game and massively looking forward to it.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 6:45 pm

The Scarlets have refused to release Blade for the game, which is a shame, but they have absolutely no obligation to do it so can't overly complain.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 6:48 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/45891435

Skinner is certainly being talked up! The Exeter pack is bloody brutal so I'm looking forward to seeing what he can bring.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Wed 17 Oct 2018, 8:44 pm

He does seem to come highly recommended. He was offered a chance to tour in the summer and turned it down as he did not think he was ready! Seems like a very good attitude as well.

Some of our international second rows are not getting any younger, he may well be part of the future.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Thu 18 Oct 2018, 9:32 am

Without wanting to bring back too many bad memories, today is the anniversary of that World Cup QF against Australia... Sad

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Fri 19 Oct 2018, 3:50 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/45914873

Dave Rennie seriously taking up Sam Johnson, Australia have missed a trick so he believes.

I would have to say over the past couple of seasons he has been a better player than Alex Dunbar and could easily be a serious challenger for the Scotland 12 shirt from here on in. He will surely get capped in the AIs and may push on from there.

It will be good to see how his partnership with Shuggie goes on sunday.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Fri 19 Oct 2018, 3:54 pm

I just hope he's recovered properly from his head knock - he's been a long time out recovering.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Fri 19 Oct 2018, 4:36 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I just hope he's recovered properly from his head knock - he's been a long time out recovering.

It's not the head injury that has been keeping him out, even though he was knocked out cold, I was at that match!

He managed to injure his knee at the same time and that is way he has not played so far. For a smallish guy he is quite a physical player and does get banged about a bit, managed to break his jaw as well last year. He tackles big guys very low.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Sat 20 Oct 2018, 7:39 pm

I didn't see the game but Finn Russell was running riot tonight apparently.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Sat 20 Oct 2018, 8:32 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I didn't see the game but Finn Russell was running riot tonight apparently.

A bit of typical sublime brilliance for the Racing bonus point try and generally looks very comfortable there. Racing will consider it money well spent on what they have seen so far, much better value than Carter!

From our point of view he comes into the AIs bang on form!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by bsando on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 10:06 am

BigGee wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:I didn't see the game but Finn Russell was running riot tonight apparently.

A bit of typical sublime brilliance for the Racing bonus point try and generally looks very comfortable there. Racing will consider it money well spent on what they have seen so far, much better value than Carter!

From our point of view he comes into the AIs bang on form!

His delayed pass to Thomas after feigning to pass left was superb! Really good awareness as usual.

Nice to have arguably three in form Scottish fly halves!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 11:50 am

There's been a lot of talk about team selection for the Wales game, but what are people's thoughts on the team for the SA game which on paper will be the toughest one?

Here's my team, assuming Bradbury is injured (hopefully not)

1 Dell
2 McInally
3 Nel
4 Gilchrist
5 Gray
6 Thomson
7 Watson
8 Wilson

9 Laidlaw
10 Russell
11 Maitland
12 Dunbar
13 Jones
14 Seymour
15 Kinghorn

Subs - Allan, Brown, Berghan, Skinner, Denton, Price, Hastings, Scott

Main spots up for debate IMO is 8 and 9. Maitland is probably a shoe-in but Seymour hasn't been on great form this season - there's no one else really putting their hand up just now though (apart from Graham!). I've deliberately picked a meaty bench to come on and up the physicality - this isn't something we have been able to do for a while, and is something I think we'll need against the saffer beasts. Scott on the bench due to the high likelihood of Dunbar breaking himself.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by IanBru on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 12:18 pm

Are we going to get Maitland for the Wales game? I assumed Saracens would be Saracen...ey and keep their hold of their players like Jimbo holds onto a joke.
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 12:23 pm

IanBru wrote:Are we going to get Maitland for the Wales game? I assumed Saracens would be Saracen...ey and keep their hold of their players like Jimbo holds onto a joke.

No, only Scottish resident players for the Wales game

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 12:28 pm

Not sure if you were making a separate point Bru, but if you read my post it said the team for the SA game. We wouldn't have a lot of that team if it was the Wales game!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by IanBru on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 12:45 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Not sure if you were making a separate point Bru, but if you read my post it said the team for the SA game. We wouldn't have a lot of that team if it was the Wales game!
Ah, you're absolutely right bud! I'll crawl back into my hole and reflect on this lesson in proofreading.
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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 1:31 pm

Not looking good for Bradbury.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/45942178

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 1:37 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Not looking good for Bradbury.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/45942178

Not good, it looked like that at the time.

If he needs surgery and they usually do, it is usually nearer 6 months. Once the shoulder is weakened like that, it is rarely stable enough for a professional contact sport like rugby without being fixed properly.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Mon 22 Oct 2018, 1:39 pm

I have to say that the way matt Fagerson has been playing the past two games, he is surely going to come into contention for the full international match day squad.

He did not really look ready this summer, but he seems to have added a bit of explosiveness to his game now, he really gets quickly off the mark and makes yards that way. He has also got good hands and a rugby brain, which is more than some of our other options at No.8.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by RDW_Scotland on Wed 24 Oct 2018, 12:15 pm

That's the Fiji game sold out, which is remarkable given even just a few years ago we had to move these games to Kilmarnock and even then they didn't sell out.

3 sellouts on the cards.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Wed 24 Oct 2018, 12:23 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:That's the Fiji game sold out, which is remarkable given even just a few years ago we had to move these games to Kilmarnock and even then they didn't sell out.

3 sellouts on the cards.

Have a decent team, play good rugby and they will come!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by Hazel Sapling on Wed 24 Oct 2018, 9:04 pm

Losing Bradbury is going to be a pain for the Wales match. We lacked many good ball carriers in our back-row without Barclay, Denton and Strauss. We really only had him, Wilson and Fagerson...and the other two are smaller, faster types. Looking on the bright side M Fagerson, Thomson and potentially Skinner are going to have plenty of opportunity to compete for a 6/8 spot.

For the Wales game

Dell - McInally - Nel (Allan - Brown - Berghan)
Gray - Gilchrist (C) (Toolis)
M Fagerson - Wilson - Watson (Harley)

Price - Hastings (G Horne - P Horne)
Dunbar - H Jones (Scott)
L Jones - Kinghorn - Seymour

Harley has been good at 2nd row and is finally carrying to some effect. Has made a huge difference to his game. Have not seen enough of Ritchie to tell much of his form.
L Jones is ahead of Fife just
Dunbar gets in ahead of Scott because of H Jones at outside centre and a decent start to the season
P Horne has to pray he gets an opportunity to prove himself soon or Weir may get in ahead of him in the 6 nations
In two minds on G Horne vs Pyrgos, but G Horne is probably the better option at present.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Wed 24 Oct 2018, 9:40 pm

I don't think that team will be to far away Hazel.

I think the front 5 picks itself and without Bradbury, so does the back row for this game with Scottish based players. Apparently Ashe and Hamilton have both been with the squad in place of Bradbury, but I don't think either will play. I would have same back row as you but with Fagerson at No.8, where he has been playing very well in the Euros for Glasgow. I would go for Ritchie for the bench as well, adds more versatility than Harley, who is probably primarily a second row now.

In the backs the only question would be at 12, Matt Scott and Johnson have both got a case, both played well at the weekend, but maybe Johnson lack of match fitness might count against him.

If Horne P benches to cover 10, then surely he will cover the centres as well, so we can expect a back three sub, which by default would be Fife.

I guess we will know a bit more when we see who gets released back to play for the clubs this weekend.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by jimbopip on Wed 24 Oct 2018, 9:58 pm

I think Gee is spot on inasmuchas The Middle Fagerson will be 8 ahead of Batman.
I expect Toonie to use the AI's to give the Tombola a bit of a twirl but lack of options and the fact that we can't allow anyone else to win The Doddie Weir Goblet Of Firewater, means the strongest 23 available.

Dell - McInally - Nel (Allan - Brown - Berghan)
Gray-Toolis (GG)
Harley-Fagerson-Hamish frae the Glen (Batman) The only argument for starting GG in the second row is his bulk but I'd rather have the more athletic Toolis with BBB at 6 to bring some more grunt. Batman plays 6 for Glasgow buts that's because his Other Half plays 7 with added nastiness, which means Batman can run around in the wide open spaces like the seven he is. Also Batman covers all three positions better than BBB.

Price - Hastings (G Horne - P Horne)
Dunbar - H Jones (Scott)
L Jones - Kinghorn - Seymour   I think Sam J needs some more game time before making his debut.

I do hope that Scotland turn out in the one-off Goblet Of Firewater flame red jerseys without telling the Welsh RFU what we intend to do: after all we are playing in Cardiff and they love that sort of thing.
Apparently there are moves afoot for Glasgow fans to turn up wearing Hi-Viz vests when the Blues next come to Scotstoun, just so they can tell which team we are.

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

Post by BigGee on Thu 25 Oct 2018, 4:03 pm

Fife and Henry P picked for the Burgh, I don't think they will be playing in Wales next week.

Lets see who comes back for Glasgow to add to that list!

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Re: Scotland Autumn Internationals

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