Scotland v South Africa Saturday 17th November

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Post by BigGee on Mon 12 Nov - 21:23

First topic message reminder :

Scotland v South Africa
BT Murrayfield Stadium
Edinburgh

Saturday 17th November
KO 17.00


Well another interesting game coming up between two old rivals.

Scotland found their form with a vengeance this Saturday, putting a much fancied Fiji side to the sword very emphatically. They are a team who have very good home form now and they will see this as their biggest test of the autumn.

South Africa are also on the up and playing much better under Erasmus, with a noticeable scalp of the All Blacks this season and beating England in a series over the summer. Recent form is a bit mixed, they lost a game they should have won against England and won a game they should have lost against France, so hard to know just what to read into that. It has been a long hard season for them and it is not going to be easy stringing together 4 hard tests in 4 weekends.

Scotland will have the advantage of having been able to rest and rotate a few of their players. The question remains though will Toonie go all out with his strongest team for this one (does he even know what his strongest team is?) or will he continue with some gentle tinkering, as is his want and maybe even introduce a few new players into the mix. Will we see Gary Graham capped for instance in his first appearance in a Scotland squad after a road to Damascus moment sometime over breakfast (humble pie on the menu) this weekend.

My stab at the Scotland team before we get a few clues with media interviews during the week:

Nel
McInally
Dell
Gray
Skinner
Wilson
Strauss
Watson
Laidlaw
Russell
Seymour
Dunbar
Jones H
Maitland
Hogg

Allen
Brown
Berghan
Gilchrist
Graham
Horne G
Hastings
Kinghorn



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Post by EWT Spoons on Fri 16 Nov - 22:01

Just on the whole Reid thing. He's not played a game since the beginning of October. LI have had games during that time, he's just not been involved. I don't know if it was due to injury etc, but hell of a jump from 2nd division rugby, to no rugby, to playing South Africa in a test.

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Post by Biltong on Fri 16 Nov - 22:14

bsando wrote:Embrose Papier seems to be getting talked up a lot by Boks fans, first start for him so will be interesting to see how he does. I wish Horne was playing tomorrow, that would have been a great battle of the 9's. I'm not sure how Price will fair when he comes on but I hope he can add something like last Autumn.

Sure we're in for an entertaining game!

I think it is more in hope than anything else, we have a shortage of quality halfbacks at the moment. Nothing like a Joost or Fourie du Preez lurking in the shadows.
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Post by RDW on Fri 16 Nov - 22:56

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/46222258

Really good interview with Nel - I'm sure there'll be plenty banter in Afrikaans tomorrow!

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Post by reallybored on Fri 16 Nov - 23:15

EWT Spoons wrote:Just on the whole Reid thing.  He's not played a game since the beginning of October.  LI have had games during that time, he's just not been involved.  I don't know if it was due to injury etc, but hell of a jump from 2nd division rugby, to no rugby, to playing South Africa in a test.
Watched the Townsend interview and it looks like Reid was pencilled in for this game months ago.

May not be playing at the top level right now but he's got plenty of test experience, started against England and France.  

He's there to hold the scrum up for the first 50/60 minutes.


Looking at the team selection, it's almost like he's picked a defensive pack to attack the SA set-piece and break-down, whereas the backs are probably as attacking as we get.

Reid over Dell is about the scrum
Skinner & Toolis suggests we're going to try target their line-out
Wilson over Strauss suggests we want to spoil their clean ball at the expense of ball-carrying

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Post by jimbopip on Sat 17 Nov - 2:42

A good breakdown reallybored.

You've got to believe that Shrek can't have been struggling in training or he wouldn't have been selected. Also, even in this super-duper hi-tech age of macro-biotic diets and doctorate level individualised fitness regimens, when it comes down to props Angelo Dundee's maxim about heavyweights holds as true as ever, "People talk abput fitness; but these big guys, as long as they're on their feet and sober they'll be alright."

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Post by Eejit on Sat 17 Nov - 3:51

Saffas seem confident about a comfortable win on Saturday and the Scotland of yesteryear would probably have already rolled over.

Nowadays I’m not so sure. There’s been typical Toony results since he’s been coach but there is a mental strength in this Scotland squad that they believe they can win these big games. Scotland to win by a score in my opinion. Anything less isn’t good enough.

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Post by TJ on Sat 17 Nov - 5:15

I am happy with shrek playng.  Ok he won't do much but hold up the scrum but he has never been found wanting in a Scotland shirt has he?

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Post by Anglobraveheart on Sat 17 Nov - 6:43

Gordy will meet them off the bus.
We'll mess them up with our variety.
Eejit is right, the steeliness is there, and they have got it coming. Fiji was going to be a banana skin. They were tough first half, and then got blown away. Comfortably.
Different game and opposition tomorrow, but the boys led by Toonie will sort them out and send them away with their tail between their legs.
And then we'll do the same to them again in the WC quarter in 12 months.

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Post by Eejit on Sat 17 Nov - 10:14

Anglobraveheart wrote:Gordy will meet them off the bus.
We'll mess them up with our variety.
Eejit is right, the steeliness is there, and they have got it coming. Fiji was going to be a banana skin. They were tough first half, and then got blown away. Comfortably.
Different game and opposition tomorrow, but the boys led by Toonie will sort them out and send them away with their tail between their legs.
And then we'll do the same to them again in the WC quarter in 12 months.

Leaked teamtalk. Very Happy

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Post by 123456789. on Sat 17 Nov - 10:59

I don't think it'll be a close game. I think one of the teams will click and win it by at least two scores. Hogg's due one of his big, big games and I think tomorrow might be it.

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Post by RDW on Sat 17 Nov - 23:46

Off to Murrayfield for the first time in ages - can't wait!

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Post by Biltong on Sat 17 Nov - 23:49

Enjoy
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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:16

You know, I was thinking earlier and we still struggle with depth due to such a small player pool to choose from.

To illustrate, here’s a possible team to play in the 6ns

Dell, McInally, Fagerson
Gray, Gray
Fagerson, Strauss, Watson

Horne, Hastings

Seymour, Horne, Jones, Maitland, Hogg

That’s an entirely possible team but what strikes me is we’ve 3 pairs of brothers. As a nation we seem to rely on family/genetics to carry us. You could even argue that Hastings is a genetic pick due to his fathers genes.

When you discount the brothers/sons, we’re then looking at having to look afield for Dell, Strauss, Watson, Seymour, Jones and Maitland. This leaves us with McInally and Hogg as the only non family related home grown talent.

Now I’m not casting aspersions on the likes of Watson or any SQ players not brought up in Scotland, but should we be worried that our player pool looks sooooo small? Unless your mum and dad are firing out genetically impressive specimens like the Grays, god love em, then we’re looking fragile.
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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:27

Try cane from a pointless kick from Russell. Why do we keep kicking the ball away to hand it to the opposition???
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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:29

That was a good try

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Post by Artful_Dodger on Sun 18 Nov - 4:30

Maitland's defense was terrible in the run up to that South Africa try, half heartedly chasing around and not committing to a tackle.

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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:34

I hope that Finn is not going to be having one of those days!

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Post by Pie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:35

Finn Russell having a great game for the Boks

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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:35

Nearly another try from a poor kick. Is this a coach tactic to kick or are the players (Russell) just being silly?
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Post by RDW on Sun 18 Nov - 4:37

Pretty brainless so far

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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:38

Wow!!!!

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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:39

Great work by Jones there. Just great
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Post by The Oracle on Sun 18 Nov - 4:39

Great try!
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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:39

and that is why Huw Jones needs to be in the team

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 18 Nov - 4:39

Get the subs off the pitch though. A pet hate of mine.


Last edited by The Oracle on Sun 18 Nov - 4:40; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Pie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:40

What a score!!

I appreciate Russell is a percentages player but the basis of that is judgment and he seems to play risk for the sake of it

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 18 Nov - 4:40

Try of the weekend (probably).

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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:42

Scotland still celebrating the try!!

Concentration!!!

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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:44

Looks like Russell is having one of those games
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Post by RDW on Sun 18 Nov - 4:54

We're really lacking go forward

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Post by Pie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:57

Hogg is pure class and that was a superb try

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 18 Nov - 4:58

Hogg was stupendous and that line out was brilliantly worked. Now for Scotland to improve the luke-warm intensity at the ruck and in the tackle.

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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 4:59

Hogg is thankfully making the difference today. I’d honestly hook Russell at half time.
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Post by BigGee on Sun 18 Nov - 4:59

This is a cracking game

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Post by Biltong on Sun 18 Nov - 5:04

Good half for both teams, the mistakes are being exploited well.
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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 5:05

We just need to tighten up a bit. Stop kicking the ball to SA or trying to run from our 5m line.

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Post by Heaf on Sun 18 Nov - 5:05

Thankfully the officials in this game understand the 'clear and obvious' requirement to overrule a try ...

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Post by Biltong on Sun 18 Nov - 5:06

I can't stand Poite, but he is having a good game
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Post by Heaf on Sun 18 Nov - 5:06

Nice move for the line-out try ...

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Post by No9 on Sun 18 Nov - 5:09

Hogg is the most overrated player since.....the English first XV.... Run

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Post by Biltong on Sun 18 Nov - 5:11

Heaf wrote:Nice move for the line-out try ...

I first thought that was illegal, not sure the law about moving out the line out to have space for building momentum.
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Post by Brendan on Sun 18 Nov - 5:12

Good game but looks like Scotland struggling up front still their weakness

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Post by Biltong on Sun 18 Nov - 5:13

They don't look that weak to me, scrum has parity, line out is functioning, maybe the breakdown is struggling a little, but SA is committing enough fouls at the breakdown to keep things even
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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 5:18

Biltong wrote:
Heaf wrote:Nice move for the line-out try ...

I  first thought that was illegal, not sure the law about moving out the line out to have space for building momentum.

As a self proclaimed libeout expert (use to call them when I played) you can come out like that to your hearts content. We called it a peel.
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Post by Heaf on Sun 18 Nov - 5:21

Biltong wrote:
Heaf wrote:Nice move for the line-out try ...

I  first thought that was illegal, not sure the law about moving out the line out to have space for building momentum.

I think he was the receiver wasn't he so didn't leave the line out?

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Post by Heaf on Sun 18 Nov - 5:23

tigertattie wrote:
Biltong wrote:
Heaf wrote:Nice move for the line-out try ...

I  first thought that was illegal, not sure the law about moving out the line out to have space for building momentum.

As a self proclaimed libeout expert (use to call them when I played) you can come out like that to your hearts content. We called it a peel.


Actually I don't think you can unless you're swapping places with another player in the line out?

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 18 Nov - 5:25

If that’s given as a deliberate knock on then the game is dead. He was blatantly going for the intercept.
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Post by Biltong on Sun 18 Nov - 5:26

That is just a pathetic call
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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Sun 18 Nov - 5:26

No way man that was never a yellow!

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Post by tigertattie on Sun 18 Nov - 5:26

Never a yellow. Penalty maybe. Jeez
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