Wales RWC 2019 Thread

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Post by miaow on Mon Nov 26 2018, 01:41

First topic message reminder :

WALES’ 2019 RWC SQUAD:

Forwards: Jake Ball, Adam Beard, Rhys Carre, James Davies, Elliot Dee, Ryan Elias, Tomas Francis, Cory Hill, Alun Wyn Jones, Wyn Jones, Dillon Lewis, Ross Moriarty, Josh Navidi, Ken Owens, Aaron Shingler, Nicky Smith, Justin Tipuric, Aaron Wainwright.

Backs: Josh Adams, Hallam Amos, Dan Biggar, Aled Davies, Gareth Davies, Jonathan Davies, Leigh Halfpenny, George North, Hadleigh Parkes, Rhys Patchell, Owen Watkin, Liam Williams, Tomos Williams.




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Post by TightHEAD on Mon Aug 12 2019, 14:49

Thats tough on Anscombe, the guy was already a starter form me, why he was left on the field to run it off is beyond me, Welsh medical staff need to look at themselves after that.
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon Aug 12 2019, 14:52

For those who haven't seen much of Jarrod Evans:

https://youtu.be/oUFHD1RWGlw

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon Aug 12 2019, 15:44

Evans is a class player, just remains untested at this level. Whilst Patchell is good he’s also just as likely to throw an interception pass. Biggar is our 10 with the least flaws, if any. Davies and a Biggar to start with the blues pair coming off the bench 50 mins in. OK

I also have the feeling the same team will be named, but that won’t change the fact that the players I mentioned have been struggling with the defensive organisation for a little while (struggling with everything in Aled Davies’ case).

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon Aug 12 2019, 15:57

Do people still report rugby related comments on 606v2?

Maybe instead of reporting a perfectly fair comment you could make a point or have an opinion as to why keeping Anscombe on (when he was clearly injured) was a good idea in a meaningless friendly?
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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon Aug 12 2019, 16:23

It’s a bit rich to say that when you always hit the complain button on people calling you by your true identity.

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon Aug 12 2019, 16:24

Yawn......................................................So is the roof open or closed on Saturday?

serious question btw
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Post by formerly known as Sam on Mon Aug 12 2019, 16:46

tigertattie wrote:Gutted for him.

You can’t wrap Biggar in cotton wool as he’d go into the WC undercooked. The worst thing Biggar can do now is play with avoiding injury in the back of his mind. You need to play how you always do. Worrying about injury and then going into things not fully committed is then increasing the risk of injury.

One start and one sub appearance in the next 3 games. Try and keep total minutes played to 90. You can't not play him but his game time should be limited with intention on making sure he gets to the RWC whilst match fit but also ensuring the back ups have suitable experience and can be comfortably brought in if needed.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 17:29

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Awful news. I did fear the worst, when he went down the second time.

I wonder whether Gatland might look at Evans to start on the weekend now and leave Biggar as the player to come on?

He'll have to, won't he? Evans needs all the game time he can get now.

Awful news for poor Anscombe

I hope Jarrod Evans does get a run he is a very talented player and has proven himself well at the Blues over the last few seasons.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 17:34

TightHEAD wrote:Do people still report rugby related comments on 606v2?

Maybe instead of reporting a perfectly fair comment you could make a point or have an opinion as to why keeping Anscombe on (when he was clearly injured) was a good idea in a meaningless friendly?

He spoke to medical staff three times while on the pitch, obviously he was hoping to be able to run it off.

No medical staff currently have the technology to scan an injury on the pitch. All they have to go on is their excellent medical training and what the player tells them.

To criticise the medical staff of any nation seems very unfair to be honest. They are just doing their job to the best of their ability

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon Aug 12 2019, 18:24

Hmm have to agree to disagree about that, That had ACL written all over it from my limited experience of playing and watching different sports for 50+ years.

but I'll take your comments on board.
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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Mon Aug 12 2019, 18:46

The injury was caused by the initial kick. It’s with hindsight now because we know it’s an ACL injury.

However, at best it would have been a strain of some sort in fact it was a tear. Even so Biggar was on the bench & he should have been hauled off straightaway as Curry was.

I find it hard to believe that Gatland can be so sure that playing on did not worsen the injury. I suspect he is deflecting any potential criticism of his medical staff.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 18:46

TightHEAD wrote:Hmm have to agree to disagree about that, That had ACL written all over it from my limited experience of playing and watching different sports for 50+ years.

but I'll take your comments on board.

I don’t disagree that looked like an ACL injury, but we were all hoping it wasn’t, I imagine Anscombe was hoping it wasn’t too.

The fact that he could still run on it means hopefully it’s not too severe and his recovery will be swift and successful.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 18:48

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:The injury was caused by the initial kick. It’s with hindsight now because we know it’s an ACL injury.

However, at best it would have been a strain of some sort in fact it was a tear. Even so Biggar was on the bench & he should have been hauled off straightaway as Curry was.

I find it hard to believe that Gatland can be so sure that playing on did not worsen the injury. I suspect he is deflecting any potential criticism of his medical staff.

I don’t think you can be critical of the medical staff or the coaches in these situations, their greatest care is with the players as we all know and they do a magnificent job of looking after these athletes.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon Aug 12 2019, 18:51

Only an experienced surgeon or MRI scan can properly diagnose an ACL tear. The physio’s may have had a rough idea if they did the wobble test, which I didn’t see them doing. It would have been a lesser grade tear given Anscombe wasn’t rolling around in severe pain, even harder for anyone bar a surgeon to diagnose.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 22:30

mikey_dragon wrote:Only an experienced surgeon or MRI scan can properly diagnose an ACL tear. The physio’s may have had a rough idea if they did the wobble test, which I didn’t see them doing. It would have been a lesser grade tear given Anscombe wasn’t rolling around in severe pain, even harder for anyone bar a surgeon to diagnose.

I’m sure one day it will be like Star Trek and the physio will diagnose on sight. Roll on the future.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon Aug 12 2019, 23:00

maestegmafia wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Only an experienced surgeon or MRI scan can properly diagnose an ACL tear. The physio’s may have had a rough idea if they did the wobble test, which I didn’t see them doing. It would have been a lesser grade tear given Anscombe wasn’t rolling around in severe pain, even harder for anyone bar a surgeon to diagnose.

I’m sure one day it will be like Star Trek and the physio will diagnose on sight. Roll on the future.

The future? Apparently Mr x-ray vision commenting in here can already do it Rolling Eyes

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon Aug 12 2019, 23:05

mikey_dragon wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Only an experienced surgeon or MRI scan can properly diagnose an ACL tear. The physio’s may have had a rough idea if they did the wobble test, which I didn’t see them doing. It would have been a lesser grade tear given Anscombe wasn’t rolling around in severe pain, even harder for anyone bar a surgeon to diagnose.

I’m sure one day it will be like Star Trek and the physio will diagnose on sight. Roll on the future.

The future? Apparently Mr x-ray vision commenting in here can already do it Rolling Eyes

I hadn’t noticed the WRU had employed a Clarke Kent as a physio? Though Ben Warburton at the blues does have a slight resemblance to Kent despite his lack of glasses.

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon Aug 12 2019, 23:55

They missed North knocked out too, oh and 1/2p.

Bit of back catalogue of things missed building up.

You have had your say now on this matter. Time to move along.


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Post by Pie on Tue Aug 13 2019, 00:10

TightHEAD wrote:They missed North knocked out too, oh and 1/2p.

Bit of back catalogue of things missed building up.

Just a question for you, and maybe the MODS too, do you have nothing better to do or will we have to contend with your very dull wumming for the next 2 months?

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue Aug 13 2019, 03:43

Pie wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:They missed North knocked out too, oh and 1/2p.

Bit of back catalogue of things missed building up.

Just a question for you, and maybe the MODS too, do you have nothing better to do or will we have to contend with your very dull wumming for the next 2 months?

Like most people I always found HERSH’s WUMs dull and very unfunny. Nothing has changed. I’m not sure how he isn’t bored yet.

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Tue Aug 13 2019, 07:24

maestegmafia wrote:
BigTrevsbigmac wrote:The injury was caused by the initial kick. It’s with hindsight now because we know it’s an ACL injury.

However, at best it would have been a strain of some sort in fact it was a tear. Even so Biggar was on the bench & he should have been hauled off straightaway as Curry was.

I find it hard to believe that Gatland can be so sure that playing on did not worsen the injury. I suspect he is deflecting any potential criticism of his medical staff.

I don’t think you can be critical of the medical staff or the coaches in these situations, their greatest care is with the players as we all know and they do a magnificent job of looking after these athletes.

I’m sure they do but it’s context here. This was only a warm up game. Any slight issues the player has to come off no question. As Matt Dawson said at the time.
I could understand staying on & trying to ‘ run off’ a possible slight injury in a proper competition.
However,  this was an avoidable risk which was not worth taking.

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Post by LondonTiger on Tue Aug 13 2019, 07:34

In a way, Anscombe was his own worst enemy. He continued to play on without seeking any treatment. We cannot be sure how bad the initial injury was, but playing on with an injury like that never makes it better. 

It is such a shame for the lad, especially as this was probably his only chance to play at a world cup.

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Post by robbo277 on Tue Aug 13 2019, 08:54

LondonTiger wrote:In a way, Anscombe was his own worst enemy. He continued to play on without seeking any treatment. We cannot be sure how bad the initial injury was, but playing on with an injury like that never makes it better. 

It is such a shame for the lad, especially as this was probably his only chance to play at a world cup.

I've seen players at an amateur level try and play through pain. I've done it myself. It is seen as a commendable trait, but sometimes the best thing you can do is say "I'm not right". Very hard for players to do and is often seen as weakness, but to my mind that's the braver decision.

Anscombe is a Grand Slam winning fly half 6 weeks from a World Cup, he had nothing to prove. He probably thought it was just a knock and he'd be fine. It's easy to say from the touchline that he should have brought himself off even with a knock, but it's harder to do as a player.

Anyway, it's done. I don't think there's blame to be apportioned and I don't think the blame game helps. Good luck to him in his recovery.

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Post by TightHEAD on Tue Aug 13 2019, 09:42

mikey_dragon wrote:
Pie wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:They missed North knocked out too, oh and 1/2p.

Bit of back catalogue of things missed building up.

Just a question for you, and maybe the MODS too, do you have nothing better to do or will we have to contend with your very dull wumming for the next 2 months?

Like most people I always found HERSH’s WUMs dull and very unfunny. Nothing has changed. I’m not sure how he isn’t bored yet.

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Post by TightHEAD on Tue Aug 13 2019, 09:53

robbo277 wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:In a way, Anscombe was his own worst enemy. He continued to play on without seeking any treatment. We cannot be sure how bad the initial injury was, but playing on with an injury like that never makes it better. 

It is such a shame for the lad, especially as this was probably his only chance to play at a world cup.

I've seen players at an amateur level try and play through pain. I've done it myself. It is seen as a commendable trait, but sometimes the best thing you can do is say "I'm not right". Very hard for players to do and is often seen as weakness, but to my mind that's the braver decision.

Anscombe is a Grand Slam winning fly half 6 weeks from a World Cup, he had nothing to prove. He probably thought it was just a knock and he'd be fine. It's easy to say from the touchline that he should have brought himself off even with a knock, but it's harder to do as a player.

Anyway, it's done. I don't think there's blame to be apportioned and I don't think the blame game helps. Good luck to him in his recovery.

That is why the Medics are there. He had nothing to prove and up to that point he was playing a blinder and looked very dangerous with ball in hand.
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Post by robbo277 on Tue Aug 13 2019, 10:34

TightHEAD wrote:
robbo277 wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:In a way, Anscombe was his own worst enemy. He continued to play on without seeking any treatment. We cannot be sure how bad the initial injury was, but playing on with an injury like that never makes it better. 

It is such a shame for the lad, especially as this was probably his only chance to play at a world cup.

I've seen players at an amateur level try and play through pain. I've done it myself. It is seen as a commendable trait, but sometimes the best thing you can do is say "I'm not right". Very hard for players to do and is often seen as weakness, but to my mind that's the braver decision.

Anscombe is a Grand Slam winning fly half 6 weeks from a World Cup, he had nothing to prove. He probably thought it was just a knock and he'd be fine. It's easy to say from the touchline that he should have brought himself off even with a knock, but it's harder to do as a player.

Anyway, it's done. I don't think there's blame to be apportioned and I don't think the blame game helps. Good luck to him in his recovery.

That is why the Medics are there. He had nothing to prove and up to that point he was playing a blinder and looked very dangerous with ball in hand.

But a medic is only as good as the information they're given. You can't do a full assessment on the pitch and ultimately if the player says it doesn't feel too bad what can the medic do?

Head issues the medic should overrule 100%. But anything else then it's got to be more of a discussion.

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Post by Gooseberry on Tue Aug 13 2019, 10:47

Poorfour wrote:It's certainly set up an interesting clash next week. Factors in Wales's favour:
+ It's in Cardiff
+ They will be strongly motivated after Sunday's performance
+ They have got Gatland's traditional "ropey first game of a series" out of the way and are likely to be stronger
+ England's defence in open play looked very suspect
+ Eddie may not risk Billy again
+ Elliot Daly is not a fullback

Factors in England's favour:
- England have a lot of major players still to have a run out: Mako, Marler, George, Itoje, Wilson, Underhill, Slade, Farrell, May
- Wales don't
- A pack that ended with a third string loosehead and hooker, a second string tighthead and two locks playing on the flanks still had the upper hand at the end of the game

Factors that are anyone's guess:
? What Eddie and Gatland are actually aiming to get out of these warm-ups
? What tactics they have in reserve and aren't going to disclose at this point
? Where the players actually are in their training and whether they've started their taper
? How much each team wants to fight for the #1 spot


Its a given that Wales will pick more of their fringe players for this fixture, whereas England now having decided their core squad will be more focused on building toward a matchday side and heavily featuring the front runners for that. As we saw from this weekends game though that doenst automatically translate into dominance and a well oiled confident machine vs disorganised scratch team. 

In terms of tactical changes I cant see anything fundamentally different. neither side is going to mess with its basic approach to the game this close out, but there could be some targeted opponent specific plans put in place. The focus though shouldn't be on worrying too much about the specific opposition, but building on the core parts of the game they want to take forward as plan A for the world cup. The focus shouldn't be on how do we win this game. 

Both sides will have a fair bit of fight in them, perhaps evident by the decision to not be cautious with Anscombe (risks opening that can of worms again), not just for bragging rights but also momentum. Individual performances absolutely will matter to individual players, doubly those still fighting for a spot in the final Wales squad. Even with a mixed up team Wales are capable of being better than they were at Twickenham. 

It wont exactly have the same intensity as the last time England were in Cardiff but it still should be a hard fought contest. Hoping I can actually get to watch this one live.

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Tue Aug 13 2019, 15:16

I can see Wales keeping it tight and using pick and go tactics as they did successfully in the 6Ns against England. This makes particular sense without Anscombe.
I think Gatland intimated after the game his tactics will change this weekend...of course this could all be mind games.

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Post by chris_501 on Tue Aug 13 2019, 17:20

It's interesting that nobody has mentioned about Patchell stepping up. If this were 12 months ago, he would have been one of the reasons we would have a chance of winning a WC, but after a poor season, blighted by his concussion(s) it seems he has dropped down the pecking order.

If he can bring his best game to a WC, in my opinion he could be better than any of the fly halves in the squad.

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Post by RiscaGame on Tue Aug 13 2019, 18:19

I just think Evans has shown more club form, albeit Patchell has more international experience etc.

Whoever it is, should start the next two games at least still. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Evans or Patchell start this week and whoever doesn’t start or play will start against Ireland before the cut.

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Post by LondonTiger on Wed Aug 14 2019, 08:41

Less talk on who should come in at 10 please. Let's move on to more serious matters. Should AWJ get a haircut and stop trying to copy the Bobby Charlton sweep over?

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Post by TightHEAD on Wed Aug 14 2019, 09:45

LondonTiger wrote:Less talk on who should come in at 10 please. Let's move on to more serious matters. Should AWJ get a haircut and stop trying to copy the Bobby Charlton sweep over?

Glad you said it!
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Post by LondonTiger on Wed Aug 14 2019, 09:51

Tbf it did not stop Bobby winning a world cup and nor would it stop AWJ.

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Post by TightHEAD on Wed Aug 14 2019, 10:05

Times have changed, its all about the image these days.

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Post by Pie on Wed Aug 14 2019, 15:54

The, ahem, bigger question is Biggar and is he really the guy we back for RWC. If so it can only be on experience and remembering Priestland in 2011 I am inclined to back Evans now, give him 3 or 4 starts before Aus game and see what he's made off. All bets are off without Anscombe so something radical is required.

Fact is I agree with JJ. We aren't going to win RWC with Bigs starting at 10. Patchell offers gainline attacking rugby whereas Biggar offers a strategic kicking game. Worryingly I think Biggar fits more with the percentage style Gatland prefers whereas I think playing at a higher tempo is/was in Welsh DNA.

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Post by RiscaGame on Thu Aug 15 2019, 11:06

Wales: Liam Williams; George North, Jonathan Davies, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Dan Biggar, Gareth Davies; Nicky Smith, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis; Jake Ball, Alun Wyn Jones (C); Aaron Wainwright, James Davies, Ross Moriarty.

Subs: Elliot Dee, Wyn Jones, Dillon Lewis, Aaron Shingler, Josh Navidi, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Owen Watkin.

Would've liked to have seen Navidi start, if available. Also, wouldn't have started Biggar as discussed.

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Post by maestegmafia on Thu Aug 15 2019, 11:08

I’m excited about that team

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Post by RiscaGame on Thu Aug 15 2019, 11:51

It's not bad. Be interesting to see how James Davies goes. I get why he has gone with the same team still, where he could. I would still have given an opportunity to Evans at ten and Lane. I think Navidi could've come in at 6 too, or maybe even Shingler to get him longer game time. After Lewis had a bit of a tough time, I would probably have had a look at Brown or Carre too.

I guess Beard isn't being risked after his knock and Hill isn't fit. Ball warranted a start after his impact though.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu Aug 15 2019, 14:15

I'd be happier if JD2 and Alun Wyn weren't starting. We don't need them to play. This isn't a must-win game.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:15

Fair enough. I think we’re starting to see the make-up of the squad for Ireland which I think will have Evans, Lee, Shingler and Navidi starting. Is Tomos Williams carrying that bad a knock that the passenger needs to be on the bench?

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:16

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'd be happier if JD2 and Alun Wyn weren't starting. We don't need them to play. This isn't a must-win game.

It is a must-win game.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:18

I'd rather we lost this game and took those two to the World Cup than won it and went to the World Cup without them.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:25

Well that’s your POV, but every game is still a must-win. Especially this one after last week.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:27

RiscaGame wrote:Wales: Liam Williams; George North, Jonathan Davies, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Dan Biggar, Gareth Davies; Nicky Smith, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis; Jake Ball, Alun Wyn Jones (C); Aaron Wainwright, James Davies, Ross Moriarty.

Subs: Elliot Dee, Wyn Jones, Dillon Lewis, Aaron Shingler, Josh Navidi, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Owen Watkin.

Would've liked to have seen Navidi start, if available. Also, wouldn't have started Biggar as discussed.

Shingler as lock cover isn’t a great idea when considering England can play with 3-4 locks at once.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Aug 15 2019, 15:41

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'd be happier if JD2 and Alun Wyn weren't starting. We don't need them to play. This isn't a must-win game.

It is in Gatlands head.
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Post by Pie on Thu Aug 15 2019, 17:34

TightHEAD wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'd be happier if JD2 and Alun Wyn weren't starting. We don't need them to play. This isn't a must-win game.

It is in Gatlands head.

And having picked your RWC squad it is even more in Eddie's...a loss would be mean crisis hence why he has all his guns out on bench.

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Post by Pie on Thu Aug 15 2019, 18:04

And if you want evidence of how much Welsh injuries get into the heads of England I give you RWC 2015.

Bomber bottled it by taking off Burgess and we lost 3 quality backs in 10 minutes. We had a 3rd choice 9 on the wing and a decidedly shaky 10 playing full back. Still managed to do the business.

Lets hope Eddie is more composed though his insurance policy bench suggests he fears a loss this week.

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Post by BamBam on Thu Aug 15 2019, 18:11

Pie trying awfully hard not to sound psychologically weakened

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu Aug 15 2019, 19:22

Some fans might be concerned but it seems Gatland isn’t in the slightest. It would be surprising if there wasn’t a response this weekend. When you consider the players to come back in against a Sexton-less Ireland things will be going well, but I think that’s reliant on a win this weekend.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Thu Aug 15 2019, 19:23

Even if its an Ancome-less Wales?

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