Dragons Season Thread - 2019/20 aka Year 1 of the new 5 Year Plan

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Post by Stone Motif on Sun 30 Dec 2018, 11:19 pm

First topic message reminder :

RiscaGame wrote:A good win for Dragons. Wonder if George North might get banned this week for more shethousery. Guy is turning into a dirty get down there.

Wasn’t too convinced by the subs we made, but they turned out to be wise choices. That includes Tovey steadying the ship and kicking the winner and surprisingly Suter being solid in the scrum.
It's an amazing win given the Ospreys dominance. If they'd have made the right calls our luck would have run out I think.
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Post by The Oracle on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 12:24 pm

RiscaGame wrote:
munkian wrote:Why would we loan them Basham to play us when Griffiths and Moriarty are both injured ?


Because he isn’t being used by us still. It doesn’t matter now anyway.

Yeah, I didn’t bother to watch the game back yesterday. Be interesting to see what we can put out on Friday, to rest players etc.


Dig out your boots, Risca. You might be playing!
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Post by RiscaGame on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 12:31 pm

Ha. I’m happy in semi retirement.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 12:37 pm

munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Well what a flat game that was. We had the odd five-minute spell, but that was it. As someone else has said, a better side would have put 40 points on us.

I disagree, our defence and commitment were fantastic - we were just massively outclassed by their front row and our lineout was poor. We had no platform to launch from.


So you're disagreeing that it was a flat game?

To clarify, I mean that the Scarlets didn't seem all that happy to have won. I went to the game, and it was a strange atmosphere. It was close on the scoreboard for a long time, but it didn't feel like the result could go either way.

Our defence was excellent, no question, but it's a long time since I've seen the Scarlets play with so little creativity. (N.B. It's the first I've seen them over the derby period.)

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Post by munkian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 1:05 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Well what a flat game that was. We had the odd five-minute spell, but that was it. As someone else has said, a better side would have put 40 points on us.

I disagree, our defence and commitment were fantastic - we were just massively outclassed by their front row and our lineout was poor. We had no platform to launch from.


So you're disagreeing that it was a flat game?

To clarify, I mean that the Scarlets didn't seem all that happy to have won. I went to the game, and it was a strange atmosphere. It was close on the scoreboard for a long time, but it didn't feel like the result could go either way.

Our defence was excellent, no question, but it's a long time since I've seen the Scarlets play with so little creativity. (N.B. It's the first I've seen them over the derby period.)

I disagree with the latter point of 'a better side would have put 40 points on us' thumbsup
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 2:41 pm

munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Well what a flat game that was. We had the odd five-minute spell, but that was it. As someone else has said, a better side would have put 40 points on us.

I disagree, our defence and commitment were fantastic - we were just massively outclassed by their front row and our lineout was poor. We had no platform to launch from.


So you're disagreeing that it was a flat game?

To clarify, I mean that the Scarlets didn't seem all that happy to have won. I went to the game, and it was a strange atmosphere. It was close on the scoreboard for a long time, but it didn't feel like the result could go either way.

Our defence was excellent, no question, but it's a long time since I've seen the Scarlets play with so little creativity. (N.B. It's the first I've seen them over the derby period.)

I disagree with the latter point of 'a better side would have put 40 points on us' thumbsup

I just thought they made such heavy weather of scoring with all that territory and possession. The low score wasn't just down to our defence, as good as that was.

Aaron Wainwright's won the plaudits over the last three matches, but Cory Hill just doesn't stop and he's so good in the loose. Even with a couple of minutes left he was collaring one Scarlets player or other.

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Post by munkian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 3:04 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Well what a flat game that was. We had the odd five-minute spell, but that was it. As someone else has said, a better side would have put 40 points on us.

I disagree, our defence and commitment were fantastic - we were just massively outclassed by their front row and our lineout was poor. We had no platform to launch from.


So you're disagreeing that it was a flat game?

To clarify, I mean that the Scarlets didn't seem all that happy to have won. I went to the game, and it was a strange atmosphere. It was close on the scoreboard for a long time, but it didn't feel like the result could go either way.

Our defence was excellent, no question, but it's a long time since I've seen the Scarlets play with so little creativity. (N.B. It's the first I've seen them over the derby period.)

I disagree with the latter point of 'a better side would have put 40 points on us' thumbsup

I just thought they made such heavy weather of scoring with all that territory and possession. The low score wasn't just down to our defence, as good as that was.

Aaron Wainwright's won the plaudits over the last three matches, but Cory Hill just doesn't stop and he's so good in the loose. Even with a couple of minutes left he was collaring one Scarlets player or other.

It didn't help us that their poor handling led to more scrums Erm

WOL gave Wainwright 6/10 chin
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 3:13 pm

On the subject of scrums, I'm not sure how one of the most poorly-funded professional teams in Europe, if not the most poorly-funded, it supposed to have decent props. If we were sitting on half a dozen seriously good props, first of all we'd have to pay them accordingly, and secondly good props (and more importantly, good props' agents) know what they're worth, and won't be content playing third fiddle in the first place.

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Post by munkian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 3:18 pm

It really annoyed me when the linesman called for a scrum penalty against us 2 phases after the ball was out - its supposed to be a restart of play ffs
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 3:24 pm

Oh that was towards the end, wasn't it? I remember the linesman missing a Scarlets player in touch in front of where we were sitting.

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Post by RiscaGame on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 4:17 pm

It would’ve helped Saturday, if our regular tighthead wasn’t still serving a ban Very Happy

I wonder what front row we have registered for Europe anyway.

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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 9:53 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Well what a flat game that was. We had the odd five-minute spell, but that was it. As someone else has said, a better side would have put 40 points on us.

I disagree, our defence and commitment were fantastic - we were just massively outclassed by their front row and our lineout was poor. We had no platform to launch from.


So you're disagreeing that it was a flat game?

To clarify, I mean that the Scarlets didn't seem all that happy to have won. I went to the game, and it was a strange atmosphere. It was close on the scoreboard for a long time, but it didn't feel like the result could go either way.

Our defence was excellent, no question, but it's a long time since I've seen the Scarlets play with so little creativity. (N.B. It's the first I've seen them over the derby period.)

I disagree with the latter point of 'a better side would have put 40 points on us' thumbsup

I just thought they made such heavy weather of scoring with all that territory and possession. The low score wasn't just down to our defence, as good as that was.

Aaron Wainwright's won the plaudits over the last three matches, but Cory Hill just doesn't stop and he's so good in the loose. Even with a couple of minutes left he was collaring one Scarlets player or other.

Matthew Screech made 25 tackles.

Set piece aside, I think it was our best performance of the derby series in the context of an away game where we've won only once and were out on our backsides in the back five.
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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 9:56 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:On the subject of scrums, I'm not sure how one of the most poorly-funded professional teams in Europe, if not the most poorly-funded, it supposed to have decent props. If we were sitting on half a dozen seriously good props, first of all we'd have to pay them accordingly, and secondly good props (and more importantly, good props' agents) know what they're worth, and won't be content playing third fiddle in the first place.

Don't think props are as well paid as back in the day when the hit made the scrum such a weapon. Tens, fifteens and big carrying locks seem to be in vogue these days. But, yeah, for the Scarlets back row problem see our front row, those two shouldn't be on a pro rugby pitch it's not fair on them.


Last edited by Stone Motif on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 9:57 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : And back rowers, if you're as bit a t7t as David Buttress)
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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 07 Jan 2019, 9:59 pm

So, any takers for a season ticket next year if we're the +1?
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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 6:12 am

Strikes me as odd that we’d change the centres when Loots and Warren have been playing so well; Dixon and Morgan have become very underwhelming.

How did Screech play? He was very good 3-4 seasons ago but then slipped away. He’s been a bit of a regular lately though.

How did Coleman go?

Hill surely has to start at 6 for Wales, if Beards injury isn’t as bad as feared. Lydiate, Shingler, Faletau and Moriarty currently inured and might not make the opening round.

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Post by munkian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 9:16 am

Wainwright for Wales
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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 12:39 pm

Stone Motif wrote:So, any takers for a season ticket next year if we're the +1?

I would be interested to see the price, seeing as we had an increase (in theory), despite the way last season went.

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Post by munkian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 12:50 pm

RiscaGame wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:So, any takers for a season ticket next year if we're the +1?

I would be interested to see the price, seeing as we had an increase (in theory), despite the way last season went.

£90 would still be cheap though I've made it to very few games this season.

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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 1:02 pm

I have contemplated a North Terrace next time. Hazell price looks steep sometimes, when things are doing my head in.

That said, I moaned about buying a half ST and have already bought tickets for two of the games Rolling Eyes

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Post by Stone Motif on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 1:40 pm

If we're downgraded we'd be buying tickets for a comp we cannot be competitive in.
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Post by Stone Motif on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 1:43 pm

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/17342445.dragons-lock-nansen-set-for-two-months-out-after-hamstring-blow/

Big loss. Hope Ceri Jones has the sense to bring Landmark* in from the cold, unless he's injured and I've missed it.


Last edited by Stone Motif on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 1:44 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : *Landman, obviously)
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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 3:24 pm

He’s not injured, but I suspect we won’t be seeing him back soon either.

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Post by munkian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:04 pm

Stone Motif wrote:If we're downgraded we'd be buying tickets for a comp we cannot be competitive in.

We are anyway
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:10 pm

I wonder what Buttress would think about it too. He'd take his money and run, wouldn't he? What investment can a development region hope to attract?

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Post by The Oracle on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:13 pm

Have I missed something about downgrading? Is that something officially on the cards or just a sense that people are getting?
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:16 pm

The impression I get is that it's virtually guaranteed. It's either going to be 3+1 or 2+2.

They're having talks with the WRU today and tomorrow.

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Post by munkian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:19 pm

The Oracle wrote:Have I missed something about downgrading?  Is that something officially on the cards or just a sense that people are getting?

Project Reset

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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:28 pm

I’m not sure we would notice too much difference if we are a +1. Amos is allegedly off already and Moriarty is a bit of an expensive luxury at the minute and would probably have to take a pay cut whatever he does next. Wainwright doesn’t really command big bucks yet (not quite a Wales regular) and I’m sure Hill would command more wages in his next negotiation, but I also think we could do that.

Buttress isn’t really putting in too much anyway, is he? All he seems to add is chatting about pulling together and about a hotel that’ll probably never happen (particularly when there are another two planned, with one literally 100m down Corpa Road).

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Post by Stone Motif on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 4:57 pm

RiscaGame wrote:I’m not sure we would notice too much difference if we are a +1. Amos is allegedly off already and Moriarty is a bit of an expensive luxury at the minute and would probably have to take a pay cut whatever he does next. Wainwright doesn’t really command big bucks yet (not quite a Wales regular) and I’m sure Hill would command more wages in his next negotiation, but I also think we could do that.

Buttress isn’t really putting in too much anyway, is he? All he seems to add is chatting about pulling together and about a hotel that’ll probably never happen (particularly when there are another two planned, with one literally 100m down Corpa Road).

But there is the prospect of improvement - if it's 3+1 that hope is forever gone. Plus it makes a joke of the league.

There's progress on the redevelopment I know plus TJs and the Crown Building will be a hell of a lot more difficult to convert than a new build. Those three together will be a drop in the ocean in terms of the bed spaces required for the type of events the WICC is pitching for.
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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 5:04 pm

Fair enough. It all seems a bit much for me, with a few other hotel plans not happening previously (old Sainsbury’s etc?).

I wouldn’t be happy with it, but I’ll react when something is official. I just think at the moment it wouldn’t be too much of a difference, as there doesn’t seem to be too much movement on the coaching front either (unless people know different) and we’ve always had positions needing addressing that haven’t been. I believe we are improving as we are anyway and it would take a huge influx of cash to take us up to the higher echelons of the league, that I’m not sure we could get no matter what our status is.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 5:19 pm

If it does happen, we can't complain. We've been the worst region for so long now. It's like Stone says though, it'll make it virtually impossible for us to ever climb the table.

Maybe there'll be a clause that says if we were, by some miracle, to outperform one of the other three (or two, if it's 2+2), then they would become the development region. Who knows.

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Post by Stone Motif on Tue 08 Jan 2019, 5:29 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Fair enough. It all seems a bit much for me, with a few other hotel plans not happening previously (old Sainsbury’s etc?).

I wouldn’t be happy with it, but I’ll react when something is official. I just think at the moment it wouldn’t be too much of a difference, as there doesn’t seem to be too much movement on the coaching front either (unless people know different) and we’ve always had positions needing addressing that haven’t been. I believe we are improving as we are anyway and it would take a huge influx of cash to take us up to the higher echelons of the league, that I’m not sure we could get no matter what our status is.

The old Sainsbury site would be developed tomorrow if they didn't want £4m for it.

I get what you're saying but I have the weird feeling,hope I guess, that they can develop the ground and move us in the right direction. We need to be masters of our own destiny to reap the reward of that.
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:15 pm

Amos in midfield Rolling Eyes , Griffiths and Henson on the bench.

Dragons: Jordan Williams; Dafydd Howells, Hallam Amos, Jack Dixon, Will Talbot-Davies; Jason Tovey, Rhodri Davies; Gerard Ellis, Richard Hibbard (capt), Chris Coleman, Joe Davies, Matthew Screech, Ben Fry, Nic Cudd, James Benjamin.

Replacements: Rhys Lawrence, Dan Suter, Nicky Thomas, Huw Taylor, Ollie Griffiths, Rhodri Williams, Gavin Henson, Jarryd Sage.

Timisoara Saracens: TBC

Referee: Ludovic Cayre (France)

Assistant referees: Jonathan Dufort, (Nicolas Datas (France)

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Post by munkian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:19 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Amos in midfield  Rolling Eyes , Griffiths and Henson on the bench.

Dragons: Jordan Williams; Dafydd Howells, Hallam Amos, Jack Dixon, Will Talbot-Davies; Jason Tovey, Rhodri Davies; Gerard Ellis, Richard Hibbard (capt), Chris Coleman, Joe Davies, Matthew Screech, Ben Fry, Nic Cudd, James Benjamin.

Replacements: Rhys Lawrence, Dan Suter, Nicky Thomas, Huw Taylor, Ollie Griffiths, Rhodri Williams, Gavin Henson, Jarryd Sage.

Timisoara Saracens: TBC

Referee: Ludovic Cayre (France)

Assistant referees: Jonathan Dufort, (Nicolas Datas (France)

Amos in midfield isn't awful - I'm guessing WRU may have hinted at it.
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:24 pm

If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

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Post by munkian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:27 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point
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Post by RiscaGame on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:29 pm

No point me quibbling over the team this week, as we should get five points anyway.

Only thing that stands out for me, is I didn’t know Suter or Thomas covered loose had too.

I am very glad to see Howells back in. Think he has been a bit unnecessarily forgotten about recently. Hopefully Tovey gets the 19 points for the 1000.

Edit.

That has been my issue with how we use Amos, to be honest.

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Post by The Oracle on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 12:53 pm

Suter went out to New Zealand last summer (to Waikato) to experience rugby out there along with a few academy boys. I think perhaps he got experience of playing both sides of the scrum, although at probably a lower level. Not sure if the trip has developed him much. I think he's just perhaps not quite up to pro standard.
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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 4:36 pm

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/17349739.dragons-lock-landman-leaves-for-france/

Shambolic. So we'll have Joe Davies stinking up the place or a back rower pretending to be a lock during the six nations, when we really should be trying to mug a point or two.
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Post by munkian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 4:45 pm

Stone Motif wrote:https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/17349739.dragons-lock-landman-leaves-for-france/

Shambolic. So we'll have Joe Davies stinking up the place or a back rower pretending to be a lock during the six nations, when we really should be trying to mug a point or two.

Rubbish isn;t it ? Something must have been going on behind the scenes with him.
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 4:47 pm

I'm pleased for him that he'll be getting some game time - that's the only thing I like about it. He's not the type to grumble but what a shoddy way for us to have treated a player who turned down a move to the Scarlets to stay here.

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Post by RiscaGame on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 5:53 pm

There probably is something behind the scenes. Similar to Carl Meyer, by the looks.

But it would seem, it was always in Dragons’ plans to discard him at the end of the season anyway, so good luck to him playing and earning a contract somewhere.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 10 Jan 2019, 11:42 pm

If team Wales want another 13 then why not look at Warren? In good form, playing well, and hardly injured. With Landman gone then I can only hope we’re replacing him with another overseas lock next season, preferably someone over 6’7 and over 120kg. I’d probably invest in good overseas signings on each side of the scrum too and a fly-half who isn’t flakey (ruling out Priestland), but I think I’m dreaming.

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Post by munkian on Sat 12 Jan 2019, 10:01 am

munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy
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Post by maestegmafia on Sat 12 Jan 2019, 11:44 am

munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

maestegmafia
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Post by munkian on Sat 12 Jan 2019, 11:52 am

maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

Just this so far

https://www.epcrugby.com/report/nine-try-dragons-thrash-timisoara-in-newport/#report
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Post by RiscaGame on Sun 13 Jan 2019, 1:26 am

It’s weird to make loads of mistakes, yet win that comfortably.

Tovey, you tease. Just as well he missed two conversions, as it would be gutting to miss the grand by a point, knowing that Dragons should’ve scored more tries. I suspect Josh Lewis will be one of the players brought back in next week, but it would be great for Tovey to reach the milestone next week, especially seeing as I miss Munster home Wink

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Post by maestegmafia on Sun 13 Jan 2019, 8:36 am

munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

Just this so far

https://www.epcrugby.com/report/nine-try-dragons-thrash-timisoara-in-newport/#report

Cheers pretty appalling lack of coverage, the promises made by the new euro league organisers regarding coverage fell pretty short as predicted

maestegmafia
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Post by munkian on Sun 13 Jan 2019, 1:41 pm

maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

Just this so far

https://www.epcrugby.com/report/nine-try-dragons-thrash-timisoara-in-newport/#report

Cheers pretty appalling lack of coverage, the promises made by the new euro league organisers regarding coverage fell pretty short as predicted

It's dog dirt isn't it ? They could at least stream it. It's Ok though as the English and French teams are now competa.... ah.
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Post by maestegmafia on Sun 13 Jan 2019, 11:54 pm

munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

Just this so far

https://www.epcrugby.com/report/nine-try-dragons-thrash-timisoara-in-newport/#report

Cheers pretty appalling lack of coverage, the promises made by the new euro league organisers regarding coverage fell pretty short as predicted

It's dog dirt isn't it ? They could at least stream it. It's Ok though as the English and French teams are now competa.... ah.

Not like the wealthy parts of English culture to dupe the country into something they have no idea what they are talking about is it.

maestegmafia
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Post by munkian on Mon 14 Jan 2019, 8:42 am

maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
munkian wrote:
munkian wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:If it was me, and I had a Test player whose contract was up at the end of the season, I'd be playing him in his preferred and best position every time. He's got plenty of reasons to leave without us giving him another.

Fair point

He did Ok Very Happy

I read the reports and it sounded like he played well before and after he was moved positionally.

Is there any highlights or coverage online?

Just this so far

https://www.epcrugby.com/report/nine-try-dragons-thrash-timisoara-in-newport/#report

Cheers pretty appalling lack of coverage, the promises made by the new euro league organisers regarding coverage fell pretty short as predicted

It's dog dirt isn't it ? They could at least stream it. It's Ok though as the English and French teams are now competa.... ah.

Not like the wealthy parts of English culture to dupe the country into something they have no idea what they are talking about is it.

clap
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