Dragons Season Thread - 2019/20 aka Year 1 of the new 5 Year Plan

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Post by Stone Motif on Sun 30 Dec 2018, 11:19 pm

First topic message reminder :

RiscaGame wrote:A good win for Dragons. Wonder if George North might get banned this week for more shethousery. Guy is turning into a dirty get down there.

Wasn’t too convinced by the subs we made, but they turned out to be wise choices. That includes Tovey steadying the ship and kicking the winner and surprisingly Suter being solid in the scrum.
It's an amazing win given the Ospreys dominance. If they'd have made the right calls our luck would have run out I think.
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Post by RiscaGame on Mon 25 Nov 2019, 2:50 pm

Well yeah, I might give them a like, in celebration of the two wins in a row laughing

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Post by RiscaGame on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 9:14 am

Interesting developments in the SWA, this morning. I haven't seen the reaction yet, but I imagine there will be a few Newport fans unhappy this morning.

I shall go have a read.

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Post by RiscaGame on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 11:32 am

Jordan Williams ruled out for the season. That's a blow, as even though we are a bit more of an attacking force, a lot of what we do is through him. Guess WTD will play 15?

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Post by The Oracle on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 11:36 am

RiscaGame wrote:Interesting developments in the SWA, this morning. I haven't seen the reaction yet, but I imagine there will be a few Newport fans unhappy this morning.

I shall go have a read.

Do you mean the article about the cost for Newport RFC hosting a game jumping from £700 to £2500? This is what PhillBB was having a go at Buttress for on Twitter. Buttress replied to say that it is not as easy as just looking at the figures quoted and then Phill, like he used to do on here, basically wanted Buttress to spill the accounts all across Twitter to 'prove it'! Or something along those lines.

I'm a Newport RFC fan too (historically) so it's sad that it's come to this, but reading the article and the one it links to which quotes Buttress, I can't really see what the problem is. When you think of the operating costs of ground staff, bar staff, kitchen staff, stewards, utlities, etc. then I can easily see it coming to £2500. As Buttress puts it, Newport are essentially a semi-pro side using a professional venue. As much as it pains me to say it - perhaps its not the right venue for them. Or if it is and they have aspirations of staying there then they need to find ways to cover the costs of using a pro venue. As Buttress says, they're not trying to make a profit just cover costs. The costs are £3000 apparently but Newport RFC get to keep ticket and bar sales. If they/we can't generate £2500 in tickets and beers then they've got no hope.

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/18061702.costs-staging-newport-rfc-game-rodney-parade/


https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/18062912.newport-rfc-must-cover-costs-stay-rodney-parade---dragons-chairman-buttress/
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 11:46 am

I went to Newport v Cross Keys last season as my nephew was the mascot, and it's too big for that size crowd. They don't open the Hazell at all. I don't know what the solution is though.

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Post by RiscaGame on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 11:55 am

I don't know where else they can play. I go a fair few times and they only use the Bisley. RP is too big now, no doubt. I would be interested to see the costs for Llanelli and possibly Cardiff, tbh, but it seems a little unlikely that Buttress has just made some figure up, without fairly costing it. I know the players etc get some free tickets for their families, so I wonder how many actual supporters outside of that still attend?

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Post by Stone Motif on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:11 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Interesting developments in the SWA, this morning. I haven't seen the reaction yet, but I imagine there will be a few Newport fans unhappy this morning.

I shall go have a read.

Quite a few Cardiff fans too.
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Post by Stone Motif on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:11 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Jordan Williams ruled out for the season. That's a blow, as even though we are a bit more of an attacking force, a lot of what we do is through him. Guess WTD will play 15?

We should sign Liam Williams immediately.
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Post by RiscaGame on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:12 pm

Good idea. I will tweet Mr Buttress now.

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Post by Stone Motif on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:13 pm

The Oracle wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Interesting developments in the SWA, this morning. I haven't seen the reaction yet, but I imagine there will be a few Newport fans unhappy this morning.

I shall go have a read.

Do you mean the article about the cost for Newport RFC hosting a game jumping from £700 to £2500?  This is what PhillBB was having a go at Buttress for on Twitter.  Buttress replied to say that it is not as easy as just looking at the figures quoted and then Phill, like he used to do on here, basically wanted Buttress to spill the accounts all across Twitter to 'prove it'!  Or something along those lines.

I'm a Newport RFC fan too (historically) so it's sad that it's come to this, but reading the article and the one it links to which quotes Buttress, I can't really see what the problem is.  When you think of the operating costs of ground staff, bar staff, kitchen staff, stewards, utlities, etc. then I can easily see it coming to £2500.  As Buttress puts it, Newport are essentially a semi-pro side using a professional venue.  As much as it pains me to say it - perhaps its not the right venue for them.  Or if it is and they have aspirations of staying there then they need to find ways to cover the costs of using a pro venue.  As Buttress says, they're not trying to make a profit just cover costs.  The costs are £3000 apparently but Newport RFC get to keep ticket and bar sales.  If they/we can't generate £2500 in tickets and beers then they've got no hope.  

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/18061702.costs-staging-newport-rfc-game-rodney-parade/


https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/18062912.newport-rfc-must-cover-costs-stay-rodney-parade---dragons-chairman-buttress/
This.
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Post by Stone Motif on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:19 pm

The WRU agreement made it clear, and it's been made clear to the Ospreys, the Scarlets and the Blues in relation to Bridgend, Llanelli and Cardiff, that as a regional franchise we are not able to subsidise our Premiership teams," he said.
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Post by miaow on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 12:33 pm

A non story about the ground. Clubs need to be playing at their proper level for the good of the game in the medium to long term. It's a vanity project throwing money to appease history and a sense of tradition among fans.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 1:41 pm

Interesting thought. I see we have Wainwright packing down at 8 again, I think that is his second start there for Wales? I was thinking if we manage to keep Moriarty then we potentially lose 4 back-row forwards to team Wales; Wainwright, Griffiths, Basham, Moriarty; and someone who can play 6, Cory Hill, along with the perennially injured Samoan (I really can't think of his name right now). Basham will probably be with the U20s if he doesn't make the senior 6N squad. Letting Moriarty move on might make sense after all. We need a lock and then possibly a flanker, or two locks and hope that the Samoan is okay for a while.

I'd look to get a decent replacement for Harris too, Bevington doesn't cut it at first team rugby for me.

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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 3:04 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Interesting thought. I see we have Wainwright packing down at 8 again, I think that is his second start there for Wales? I was thinking if we manage to keep Moriarty then we potentially lose 4 back-row forwards to team Wales; Wainwright, Griffiths, Basham, Moriarty; and someone who can play 6, Cory Hill, along with the perennially injured Samoan (I really can't think of his name right now). Basham will probably be with the U20s if he doesn't make the senior 6N squad. Letting Moriarty move on might make sense after all. We need a lock and then possibly a flanker, or two locks and hope that the Samoan is okay for a while.

I'd look to get a decent replacement for Harris too, Bevington doesn't cut it at first team rugby for me.

If we lost Basham and Griffiths to the senior squad one of whom would just be holding tackle bags, it'd be criminal. I'd hate to see either career Knoyled.

Writing may be on the wall for Moriarty with this selection. Not sure he offers the all court game Pivac wants from a back row. We should ship him out sharpish.

Wouldn't buy a flanker blindside or open, must be the most replaceable positions in Welsh Ruby.

Edit: RM is laid up with a chest infection. I'd still let him go end of season though.
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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 4:16 pm

I think he could do another two seasons elsewhere, probably Cardiff or Ospreys, before going overseas because there is no sign of Wales scrapping the 60 cap rule yet. Griffiths and Basham look like they have all the minerals to be Wales regulars like Wainwright has gone on to do, but if it a position of strength for us. I wouldn't buy another back-row forward either unless it's an 8 who can carry like Billy Vunipola. I would prefer two locks first, preferably 6'7 and 120kg locks.

I also think you're right in Pivac might not be a huge fan of him and would sooner bring Faletau back into the team. I'd also like to see Faletau back with us so long as we can also get decent cover for him, marquee player and all that except a real one this time.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 4:36 pm

I remember his name now, it's Brandon Nansen!

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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 5:23 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:I think he could do another two seasons elsewhere, probably Cardiff or Ospreys, before going overseas because there is no sign of Wales scrapping the 60 cap rule yet. Griffiths and Basham look like they have all the minerals to be Wales regulars like Wainwright has gone on to do, but if it a position of strength for us. I wouldn't buy another back-row forward either unless it's an 8 who can carry like Billy Vunipola. I would prefer two locks first, preferably 6'7 and 120kg locks.

I also think you're right in Pivac might not be a huge fan of him and would sooner bring Faletau back into the team. I'd also like to see Faletau back with us so long as we can also get decent cover for him, marquee player and all that except a real one this time.

Meanwhile, back in the real world where our playing budget is about £4m...
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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 6:59 pm

Suspected someone might have been in beast mode in training: https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/ shame they felt they needed to Knoyle Hewitt, should be a dry pitch Saturday v Zebre.
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Post by The Oracle on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 9:35 pm

Christ, twitter is awash with bile tonight about the Rodney Parade match costs thing for Newport RFC. There’s an AGM on at the moment and some NRFC fans are tweeting live. Everyone else, mainly Cardiff fans and especially PhillBB, piling in. People talking of ‘boycotting any business that has any ties to the Dragons’! Pathetic stuff. I get the emotion around it and would dearly love for Newport to be able to stay there. But christ, I cant believe the level of abuse this is generating. Especially from Cardiff fans whose club has had its own wrangling recently with CAC, etc. Maybe they’re trying to deflect attention away!
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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 10:24 pm

The Oracle wrote:Christ, twitter is awash with bile tonight about the Rodney Parade match costs thing for Newport RFC. There’s an AGM on at the moment and some NRFC fans are tweeting live. Everyone else, mainly Cardiff fans and especially PhillBB, piling in. People talking of ‘boycotting any business that has any ties to the Dragons’! Pathetic stuff. I get the emotion around it and would dearly love for Newport to be able to stay there. But christ, I cant believe the level of abuse this is generating. Especially from Cardiff fans whose club has had its own wrangling recently with CAC, etc. Maybe they’re trying to deflect attention away!

Sure his vendetta will shift to the Os tomorrow after their shameful handling of the Allen Clark situation. Him being the sole anointed guardian of integrity for Welsh rugby and all.
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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 10:36 pm

It's surprising how many people follow Phil around and agree with everything he says, they all seem to be Cardiff fans too though, if that's the reason for it.

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Post by Stone Motif on Thu 28 Nov 2019, 10:46 pm

Sure I've known him be apoplectic with rage about pro rugby money propping up the lower tiers below on the odd occasion. But not if the WRU instruct pro teams to stop doing it, obviously.
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Post by The Oracle on Fri 29 Nov 2019, 8:30 am

Stone Motif wrote:Sure I've known him be apoplectic with rage about pro rugby money propping up the lower tiers below on the odd occasion. But not if the WRU instruct pro teams to stop doing it, obviously.


Definitely, he used to go ape at teams paying non-professionals and was a big advocate for completely separating the pro and amateur game.
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Post by RiscaGame on Fri 29 Nov 2019, 12:08 pm

Bring your fire kit

https://shop.dragonsrugby.wales/Rugby-Shirts/VX3/Dragons-2019-or-20-3rd-S-or-S-Replica-Rugby-Shirt/66318

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Post by RiscaGame on Fri 29 Nov 2019, 12:11 pm

Dragons Starters

W Talbot-Davies, D Howells, A Warren, J Dixon, O Jenkins, A Robson, T Knoyle.

B Harris, R Hibbard (captain), L Fairbrother, J Davies, M Screech, H Taylor, T Basham, H Keddie.

Replacements:

E Shipp, J Reynolds, A Jarvis, M Williams, B Fry, R Williams, J Botica, T Morgan.

Not too sure why Knoyle has the nod. I guess pretty much as expected otherwise. Hopefully we don't miss our internationals too much, as this would've been a very winnable game. I know Fairbrother has said that there aren't excuses, but it's a lot of quality to miss for a chuck about.

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Post by Stone Motif on Fri 29 Nov 2019, 2:56 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Dragons Starters

W Talbot-Davies, D Howells, A Warren, J Dixon, O Jenkins, A Robson, T Knoyle.

B Harris, R Hibbard (captain), L Fairbrother, J Davies, M Screech, H Taylor, T Basham, H Keddie.

Replacements:

E Shipp, J Reynolds, A Jarvis, M Williams, B Fry, R Williams, J Botica, T Morgan.

Not too sure why Knoyle has the nod. I guess pretty much as expected otherwise. Hopefully we don't miss our internationals too much, as this would've been a very winnable game. I know Fairbrother has said that there aren't excuses, but it's a lot of quality to miss for a chuck about.
Yeah very odd unless Rhodri has a knock or bug or something
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Post by miaow on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 1:42 pm

Pretty shambolic result for the Dragons to get hammered by Zebre at home.

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Post by Stone Motif on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 3:51 pm

miaow wrote:Pretty shambolic result for the Dragons to get hammered by Zebre at home.

Pretty shambolic trolling today too.
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Post by miaow on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 4:34 pm

Nope, you're the troll.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 8:13 pm

Yeah I agree it was a shambolic result. Certain people are still giving the shambolic Ospreys a free ticket though, you could always comment on how they’ve lost, again. 

Hoping Dean can get something out of the first team, which looks pretty good on paper at least. Credit to Zebre, they sniffed an opportunity and got a good away win.

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 8:26 pm

I find it’s a very Welsh rugby fan thing to do to put the boot in to sides when they lose (particularly sides they don’t follow), but then be strangely absent when the team wins, regardless of whether those wins are frequent or sparse. You just never seen those fans on those club/region threads when the going is good. Only when there's something to complain about or something to criticise. Don’t seem to see it on the English, Irish or Scottish club threads. Typical small minded parochialism that we’re unfortunately (in)famous for here in Wales. Really holds us back. Almost Neanderthal, but expected now within Wales. Shame.
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Post by Cyril on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 8:56 pm

It’s mainly Miaow though, isn’t it? After trolling Irish, English, NZ, SA, Scottish etc threads he’s now changing his attention to Welsh club rugby. Ignore the silly beggar.

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 8:59 pm

Cyril wrote:It’s mainly Miaow though, isn’t it? After trolling Irish, English, NZ, SA, Scottish etc threads he’s now changing his attention to Welsh club rugby. Ignore the silly beggar.

Yeah, mostly. It’s tough though. He’s everywhere!
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Post by miaow on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:04 pm

I'm not going to respond, I'm just going to let the mods clean this up tomorrow.

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:08 pm

How would you explain your posting them Miaow? Why come on this thread
and antagonise? What is your motive? What do you get back? Kicks?
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Post by miaow on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:11 pm

I've responded on the other thread Oracle. Don't feel it needs repeating again. Not antagonism, though. It's defence of standards.

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Post by The Oracle on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:33 pm

“Pretty shambolic result for the Dragons to get hammered by Zebre at home.“ That’s it. Nothing else to offer.

How is that not antagonism? If that was posted on an Ospreys thread, with Dragons changed for Ospreys obviously, then you’d be up in arms. Double standards I feel. Not unexpected though.
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Post by BigGee on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:39 pm

Some not very pleasant posting going on here guys, can I suggest that everyone takes a breather!

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Post by mikey_dragon on Sun 01 Dec 2019, 9:45 pm

Yeah I'm also pretty quick to criticise and that seems to be the natural reaction, but at least I also criticise my own team. I will always congratulate the others if I think they've done well. There does seem to be a bit of the typical small minded parochialism though, perhaps it's ingrained. I also don't see much of it from the other nationalities.

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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 1:28 pm

Dean Ryan wrote: if you can't handle collisions and can't get over the gain line then you will have a tough night

If only we'd have had the gain line monster that is Lloyd Ashley in our ranks or the destructive tackling of Dan Lydiate, then that Zebre esult might have been so different.
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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 2:07 pm

Dean Ryan wrote: The director of rugby says there are no quick fixes with the Dragons' budget denying him the opportunity to solve the problem with recruitment.

"It was a tough physically but it just highlights what we have got to do, and we are not solving that in a short amount of time," he said.

"It's something we've got to do over the long-term. Regional rugby is a Welsh development growth model, it's not open recruitment where we go out and get 10 or 11 players.
Brilliant. Good job I hadn't made a point of running down the management of the regions and banged on about how the WRU would do a far better job or I'd look a right chump.
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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 2:55 pm

That's a shame, because we probably do with another 10 or 11 players.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 3:03 pm

Is there something else that's happened to Cory Hill that I'm unaware of? We're expected to have our guys back for Wuss, apart from Hill obviously. Not sure about Moriarty but I doubt it.

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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 7:07 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:That's a shame, because we probably do with another 10 or 11 players.

Luke Price and Scott Otten top of the list apparently - they'd make all the difference and banish results like Saturday's to the history books.
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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 8:31 pm

Stone Motif wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:That's a shame, because we probably do with another 10 or 11 players.

Luke Price and Scott Otten top of the list apparently - they'd make all the difference and banish results like Saturday's to the history books.

Are you serious, or did the Ospreys brigade on here tell you?

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Post by RiscaGame on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 8:38 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Is there something else that's happened to Cory Hill that I'm unaware of? We're expected to have our guys back for Wuss, apart from Hill obviously. Not sure about Moriarty but I doubt it.

Just the stress fracture. I suspect he won’t be pushed too much before the Six Nations now, aside from the derbies. Depending on what happens this weekend, maybe give him twenty against Worcester in the return game.

It’ll be interesting to see the backrow, assuming everybody is available.

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Post by Stone Motif on Mon 02 Dec 2019, 8:49 pm

RiscaGame wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Is there something else that's happened to Cory Hill that I'm unaware of? We're expected to have our guys back for Wuss, apart from Hill obviously. Not sure about Moriarty but I doubt it.

Just the stress fracture. I suspect he won’t be pushed too much before the Six Nations now, aside from the derbies. Depending on what happens this weekend, maybe give him twenty against Worcester in the return game.

It’ll be interesting to see the backrow, assuming everybody is available.

Whoever we put out, we can only wish we had a flanker of the calibre of Ollie Cracknell to call on
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Post by LordDowlais on Tue 03 Dec 2019, 9:51 am

I see that Dragons are burning bridges:-

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/newport-rfc-dragons-rodney-parade-17349029

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Post by RiscaGame on Tue 03 Dec 2019, 10:13 am

You see a week late too, unsurprisingly.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 03 Dec 2019, 10:30 am

Even so, how does one surmise that as Dragons burning bridges?

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